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Thread: Legacy (522)

  1. #1
    Site Admin GateWorld's Avatar
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    Post Legacy (522)

    Visit the Episode GuideTHE FLASH - SEASON FIVE
    LEGACY
    EPISODE NUMBER - 522
    After Ralph sacrifices himself to stop the destruction of Cicada’s dagger, Team Flash discovers the weapon’s connection to Barry’s oldest foe — the Reverse Flash. But they must locate Grace before she travels even further back in time.

    VISIT THE EPISODE GUIDE >>
    Last edited by GateWorld; May 15th, 2019 at 09:44 PM.

  2. #2
    Captain tomstone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Legacy (522)

    Such a sad end to the Season, this had to happen, though I ask myself why Nora is not disconnected from the Timeline like Barry is. I thought thats the reason timeline changes dont affect him or that Savitar could even exist. I was actually expecting Nora to be immune, since she jumped through time alot already too.

    So, was it Thawne all along? I mean the one that causes Barrys disappearance? The Headline did not change, but the date did. Could also be just Thawne now, simply speeding up the process by sending Flash´s future enemy to the present.
    Fuzzy Wuzzy wasnt old,
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  3. #3
    Captain Kilgharrah's Avatar
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    Default Re: Legacy (522)

    I'm not really surprised that Nora is gone. It had to happen. That's what happens to all time travelers in any show. So I didn't really find it so emotional. I'm also positive we're going to see another version of Nora further down the line.

    Before I watched it, I got spoiled. Some headline saying one of the main characters is gonna get killed off. After what happened at the beginning of the episode, I feared we're going to lose more than Nora. I'm glad Ralph didn't get killed off.

    Such a sweet exit for Cisco.

    It's nice that they wanna keep their biggest Villain ever. I'm sure we're going to see him in Crisis on infinite earths. I mean he teased it to Barry.

    I also expected them to make the reveal for Singh during that meeting at the end. I never expected him to be the one to point it out.

    So that change in the time-line shown through the change in the date of the Flash vanishing, that's just the writers changing their minds after originally planning to adapt Crisis on infinite earth's.

    So I know time language is immune to time-line changes, but is the journal itself immune? Are the photos in there immune too? Time is so weird on Arrowverse.

    @tomstone It has always been Thawne that caused Barry's disappearance and I thought that was obvious.

  4. #4
    First Lieutenant
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    Default Re: Legacy (522)

    Quote Originally Posted by Kilgharrah View Post
    So that change in the time-line shown through the change in the date of the Flash vanishing, that's just the writers changing their minds after originally planning to adapt Crisis on infinite earth's.
    I don't think the writers had a plan, otherwise we wouldn't have had TWO moments where Thawne was wiped from history or killed by the Black Racer.

    I think they had the headline as a reference to the comic's history and maybe had it on a bucket list, but not a plan. It just strikes me that each The Flash season while impacted by the previous wasn't really thought out compared to other shows like Supernatural whose first 5 seasons was mapped out. If it ended after 5 seasons you would clearly see progression of the mythology and the arc of the characters.

  5. #5
    Major Infinite-Possibilities's Avatar
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    Default Re: Legacy (522)

    Time travel does whatever the writers want on the Arrowverse. They don't even try to pretend there is any consistency. Keep in the mind that the canonical explanation for why Thawne is even alive at all is "Time Travel is confusing."

    Here's a question, why didn't they just kill adult Grace? Then they could have gotten what they wanted. They were perfectly fine with erasing her from existence. Is that supposed to be more merciful somehow?
    "First Weir, then Samantha Carter, and now, you! It's a pity you humans die or get reassigned so easily, or I might have a sense of satisfaction now!"

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  6. #6
    Captain tomstone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Legacy (522)

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite-Possibilities View Post
    Time travel does whatever the writers want on the Arrowverse. They don't even try to pretend there is any consistency. Keep in the mind that the canonical explanation for why Thawne is even alive at all is "Time Travel is confusing."

    Here's a question, why didn't they just kill adult Grace? Then they could have gotten what they wanted. They were perfectly fine with erasing her from existence. Is that supposed to be more merciful somehow?
    Well, technically they saved her this way and did not have to kill in order to do it. So yeah.
    Fuzzy Wuzzy wasnt old,
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  7. #7
    Major Infinite-Possibilities's Avatar
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    Default Re: Legacy (522)

    But isn't being erased from existence the same as being killed? Or worse actually? Everyone basically acts like everyone else who was erased from time was killed.
    "First Weir, then Samantha Carter, and now, you! It's a pity you humans die or get reassigned so easily, or I might have a sense of satisfaction now!"

    *You got the touch! You got the poweeeeer!*

    "Arise, Woolseyus Prime."

    "Elizabeth..."

  8. #8
    Captain tomstone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Legacy (522)

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite-Possibilities View Post
    But isn't being erased from existence the same as being killed? Or worse actually? Everyone basically acts like everyone else who was erased from time was killed.
    It always depends on how you look at it. Usually when this happens to an ally, they are mourned for they will never meet that version of their friend again. When it comes to an enemy however it is looked at, as having saved them. They undid the bad that was done to the enemy therefor doing something good.
    Fuzzy Wuzzy wasnt old,
    Fuzzy Wuzzy gotten bald
    There was Fuzzy no more Wuzzy

  9. #9
    First Lieutenant
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    Default Re: Legacy (522)

    Really packed a lot in there.

    I much preferred the version we had of Thawne in the first season. He was a Thawne that had gone through all the battles with The Flash and was finally beaten after having previously beaten The Flash in previous encounters.

    Then the second season gave us a Thawne who was just starting out, so they had to withhold information from him (or try).

    As I understand it, Season 1 Thawne was erased from the timeline when Barry chose not to save his mother.

    Then Barry created Flashpoint by stopping a 15 years younger Thawne from killing his mother. He let him go when he needed to reverse Flashpoint.

    In Legends of Tomorrow:
    Spoiler:
    The team deals with the same Thawne Barry freed, but he wanted to avoid his fate until the Black Racer came for him to correct the timeline
    .

    So the loop seemed to be closed now.

    The team encountered a young Thawne in order for there to be a Thawne to later go back and kill Barry's mom thus preserving the timeline.

    So the loop seemed to be established. A Thawne still exists in an alternate universe, so he can go back and kill Barry's mom cause in his history, Barry's mom didn't die. He gets stuck in the past and plans to create The Flash years sooner so he can go back to his timeline, but dies when his ancestor dies.

    However, in Crisis on Earth-X, we see our Thawne still running around. The Thawne that was wiped away at end of season one. How? It's not explained here.

    In Season 5 of The Flash episode Godspeed, Thawne tells Nora he has become a constant in the timeline. Meaning that while the timeline is malleable, he is not. That runs counter to the whole loop they established with the season 2 episode where we meet a younger Thawne who just found his way to the The Flash's time period.

    So yeah, I agree The Flash writers don't have a good grasp of their long term goals or how to handle the previous logic they laid out.

  10. #10
    Captain tomstone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Legacy (522)

    Quote Originally Posted by Mrja84 View Post

    In Season 5 of The Flash episode Godspeed, Thawne tells Nora he has become a constant in the timeline. Meaning that while the timeline is malleable, he is not. That runs counter to the whole loop they established with the season 2 episode where we meet a younger Thawne who just found his way to the The Flash's time period.

    So yeah, I agree The Flash writers don't have a good grasp of their long term goals or how to handle the previous logic they laid out.
    That he has become a constant only means, that you can change his past all you want, but that wont change this old version of him. There can still be a younger version of him coming from the past.
    Fuzzy Wuzzy wasnt old,
    Fuzzy Wuzzy gotten bald
    There was Fuzzy no more Wuzzy

  11. #11
    First Lieutenant
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    Default Re: Legacy (522)

    Quote Originally Posted by tomstone View Post
    That he has become a constant only means, that you can change his past all you want, but that wont change this old version of him. There can still be a younger version of him coming from the past.
    I understand that he is needed to keep the timeline stable. But this is him after the end of season 1, which should have been the end of his story. I would be friend if the other actor popped up to "continue" the rivalry between the season 2 episode where he showed up and when Thawne went back to kill Nora.

    But the way the writers are twisting the story in order to have TC play Thawne is making the timeline confusing. If the dagger was destroyed, then they never would have captured or imprison him in the first place. So if you think about it, there's Thawne from Nora's future who is now free. And there's the Thawne of the new timeline that was never captured.

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