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  1. #321
    Colonel P-90_177's Avatar
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    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by EricG View Post
    I posted "Seven of Nine is in 6 of 10 episodes" 9 days ago, but Imdb now states only #4&5! Nepenthe is TNG reunion episode:

    A Plethora Of Photos From “Nepenthe,” The 7th Episode Of ‘Star Trek: Picard’
    Yeah I noticed that myself. Likely some miscommunication along the line. Assuming she doesn't have a surprise appearance in the finale then I'm guessing she'll be back in Season 2.

  2. #322
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    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    The PR photos all seem to be people shots while the teasers have the action.

    Ten Photos From “Broken Pieces”

  3. #323

    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by VampyreWraith View Post
    Blake00, hey, I'm not sure if you know, but we have individual episode discussion threads.
    No I didnt sorry haha.. this place is so huge lol..

    oh well the show is nearly over and I kinda wanna cover all the new eps since my last post in one post so i may as well stay here and wrap this thing up lol..

    Probably noticed I haven't posted here since I blew up a bit over Ep5 haha. I have kept watching the show though but was less invested in it to continue posting my episode round ups. I said after ep 5 that they'd really need some good eps to undo the damage that did, so...

    Here's my thoughts on eps 6-9..
    Spoiler:
    They sort of did as Ep6 was really good. I love any story line that deals with Picard's trauma from the Borg, eg some my favourite powerful moments in classic Trek include Picard braking down in front of his brother at the chateau after Best of Both Worlds and Picard loosing it and smashing the ship glass case in First Contact. THE LINE MUST BE DRAWN HERE! So that moment when he saw his own face as locutus and his reaction was cool. Seeing him on the cube and the way the ex-Bs reacted to him was interesting too. I'm glad Soji got activated as I was getting a bit over the innocent girl on the cube with her cool badass lying boyfriend storyline. The queens chamber was cool and I liked the nod of the head to Voyagers Sikarians and the Borg using their teleporter tech after assimilation.

    Ep7 was enjoyable due to us getting some nice fan service and seeing some beloved characters again, but some of those annoying things started to creep back in again. Troy & Riker lost a child due to a reason that just seems so silly.. a disease that is only cured by taking stuff from an android brain.. give me a break.. and once again WHY DOES EVERY SINGLE FRIGGIN PERSON IN THIS SHOW HAVE TO BE MESSED UP FROM TRAUMA??? why can't anyone at all be okay lol. I'm sick to death of it. People loved Star Trek because it painted a picture of this near perfect Utopian human future where greed, money, racism, poverty, addiction and all the other nasty stuff was either eliminated or barely there and therefore was usually projected onto the alien races, this giving people hope for the future and some nice escapism from all the news that tell us we're gonna destroy ourselves. However these writers seem to be intent on bringing the misery of their own lives into Star Trek making it not really escapism at all, now its just what we see on the news and todays flawed humans but with spaceships lol. Don't get me wrong, I love my dystopian dark future shows too but as for Star Trek unless its an alternate universe than I dont like them screwing up the prime timeline and characters we know and love. and don't even get me started on the smoking addiction BS.. I'll just leave this here:


    Also clearly Kurtzman seems to have forgot Inner Light where Picard raised an entire family but oh now apparently now he knows nothing about teenagers so he gets schooled by Riker & Troi for it.. Urgh..


    Oh and surprise surprise another old character has bought it.. but that's okay.. we've got these great new ones to replace them so who cares lol. The fact I just struggle to remember the names of the new characters really does show how great they are lol. RIP Hugh. Also wtf.. she's a evil lady pretty much killing everyone but she won't touch Hugh because he's a federation citizen. He helped Picard escape but she still has to hear him say that he's not on her side before she can kill him.. ugh come on..

    Anyway on to episode 8 and its okay I guess.. but still some annoying stuff.. our Vulcan commodore is apparently half Romulan which I guess explain the sunglasses gaffe a few episodes back as vulcans don't need them, although clearly she has retained her Vulcan ability to mind meld as I've never seen a Romulan do that. The mind meld is what made Dr Death kill her lover and act all weird for ages.. but now she's fine and won't hurt anyone cause she and Soji talked about mucus lol. We see the source of the vision is from an alien artifact and we get further explanation on the main plot. Action Jackson 7 of 9 returns and kicks some more ass. She takes control of the cube which was kind of cool although apparently she doesn't have control of the airlocks and the Romulans do lol, plus apparently the Romulans can just stand there on a balcony and watch just fine (It'd like Pike watching the torpedo explode 2 meters away via a glass window all over again, or Spock watching Vulcan go into a black hole on a another planet with a thick cloudy sky lol). And somehow Borg are useless in a vacuum despite us seeing them operate in space just fine in First Contact although I guess it was more the venting that got them as Voyager vented a few Borg into space back in the day too. Anyway not much else to say about this ep as it was mostly plot moving and setup for final eps.

    So I've just done Ep9.. yeah hmm.. I feel like I should have felt more and connected more with this episode but just didn't.. back in my first comments I predicted that there was someone else behind these androids and it wasn't just Bruce Maddox and I was right. I was just wrong about who it was lol. I predicted Lore, but it turns out there's another generation of Soong, another brother of sorts to Data. When Dr Soong Jr Jr Jr Jr Jr whatever (remember there was the one in the eugenics wars ep of Enterpise too haha) walked out the music didn't seem to change much, it was very fast, and he just took off into dialogue straight away.. the whole delivery felt wrong.. I should have been like WOOOOOWWW.. but instead I was like.. oh.. okay.. cool I guess.. as it was nice to see Brent back.

    Then something really really stupid happened.. Soji's mum or whatever you wanna call her, an earlier android model and seemingly some sort of leader there has somehow taught herself to do Vulcan mind melds.. because you know she likes Vulcans n stuff. Yes I kid you not.. an android that just magically learned telepathy because she likes the aliens that can do them. Are you freakin kidding me???.. stupid f****** bloody writers.. omg!! I mean Data did a vulcan neck pinch in TNG but that was a nerve pinch that presumably just requires a lot of strength hence why no one else ever did it. But android learning an alien races telepathy as a hobby???.. arrggghhhhh

    Anyway she melds and sees the vision.. now she's corrupted by it too.. possibly kills that chick and frees (all sexually lol) Nerek or whatever the hell his name is and is gonna 'ET call home' and bring an android alien invasion exterminate everyone thing to stop the massive Romulan warbird extermination fleet that is somehow just out there despite the fact that most of the romulan survivors seem to be refugees living in squalor camps and no one knew about the Zhat Vash. But hey maybe its the surviving romulan fleet being manipulated by the Zhat Vash. I don't know.. we see the commodore has apparently left her rather important Federation position and is now commanding an entire romulan fleet.. bit of a jump but yeah sure.. whatever..

    Oh and how could I forget that they somehow grew giant flowers that can fly through space and drag down spaceships and borg cubes.. giant flowers bigger than cities and that fly into space.. grown by maddox in his lab.. while one of his android daughters was busy taking up Vulcan telepathy as a hobby..

    It really is just like the new star wars films.. why do writers these days treat us with no respect and think that we're so stupid that we'll follow anything.. sometimes its so dark you think it's not suitable for children (eg Icheb eyeball rip) then other times like this where we're expected to take giant leaps of faith over plot holes like a child would..

    Thanks to covid-19 the Melbourne Formula 1 race was cancelled and in the giant slots that were allocated to what would have been the tv race coverage they filled with old episodes of TNG, VOY and even some TOS.. so I thought why not and sat there watching them.. and my god.. the universe.. and the writing.. there's just so much more intelligence behind them..

    We live in an age where people that grew up watching these scifi shows and films is now old enough to get into hollywood and create their own spin offs, remakes and sequels to these great old shows. All they had to do was bring back the same quality of writing and acting and we'd be living in a golden age. However instead of feeling like I'm watching actual sequels I just feel like I'm just watching fanboy films/eps that are filmed on hollywood sets with big budgets instead of Dad's shed with some toilet paper rolls, mops and bed sheets for props lol.

    Anyway.. I seemed to be more relieved that there's one episode to go in Picard than I am excited to see what happens next with the story. Sort of just want it to be over so I can move on again. I didn't even feel that way about Disco (well maybe a bit in season 1 lol but not season 2). To feel that way about a Star Trek show really sucks.. especially as normally I'm the super tolerant scifi obsessed guy defending stuff like this to the haters.. yet here I am becoming one.. but a couple of threads keep my interest still to see this thing out and probably watch future seasons too lol.

    Dr death is helping Dr Soong Jr Jr Jr Jr Jr whatever with that Golum so maybe it will be Data. I just hope I.. feel something.. when he appears cause that's meant to be the pay off for all this surely lol.. Apparently this neuron thread thing stuff talked about back in ep2 means some of data's memories can be restored but some memories would not really be him would it. So it makes me think how on earth can these writers really bring him (the full Data we know and love) back and can they do it in a way that isn't stupid lol. Which then makes me think maybe they won't bring him back and this is as good as it gets lol.. but hey todays writers love recycling old stories and rearranging them (ST Into Darkness lol) so if Soji's evil mum can mind meld then why not just do a Star Trek 3 and mind meld Data backed up memories out of B4 and into a new body.. I might even tolerate that nonsense if it leads to datas return lol.. but plugging in a usb cable like Data did in Nemesis seems like a better way haha.. hell maybe that's what they're gonna do haha.. i dunno lol..

    Will also be interesting to see how Picards brain disorder is dealt with too.

    Oh and one of my mates is convinced that Picard is an android because you see him being 'put together' in the show's intro, so he's counting down to the 'big reveal' lol. We all laughed at him but hell with this show any crazy cr*p is possible haha. So I dunno about that theory but the convo between Dr death and Dr Soong Jr Jr Jr Jr Jr whatever about transferring human consciousness across into androids (like the actual Dr Soong already did with Data's mother, although the writers probably don't remember that lol) being close plants an interesting seed on this subject that I wonder what it will lead to (otherwise why did that scene happen?). Eg Picard is prob not an (failing) android now but maybe they'll stick him into one before his poor human brain gives out haha.

    Either way.. weeks ago I was telling you guys that I liked the show but that I was still needing to see more to really decide. Well now I've seen like 90% of the show and I can say I don't love it, I don't hate it, it has bits I like, it has bits that annoy me, so I'm just somewhere in between all that sticking with it to see what happens with Data and & Picard.

  4. #324
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    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Blake00 View Post
    No I didnt sorry haha.. this place is so huge lol..

    oh well the show is nearly over and I kinda wanna cover all the new eps since my last post in one post so i may as well stay here and wrap this thing up lol..

    Probably noticed I haven't posted here since I blew up a bit over Ep5 haha. I have kept watching the show though but was less invested in it to continue posting my episode round ups. I said after ep 5 that they'd really need some good eps to undo the damage that did, so...

    Here's my thoughts on eps 6-9..
    You know, I actually have been watching through TNG, DS9 and Voyager lately as I'm showing it to my partner lately. They started watching Discovery cos I was and then they wanted to start over and watch everything and naturally we're watching Picard too. And honestly, Discovery and Picard are actually just as silly and in fact are more cohesively written than the old shows. Oh don't get me wrong, they make it easy on themselves. Ditching things like stardates and stating exactly what warp speed you're travelling at and how far you're going actually removes a lot of the need for forethought as so many continuity errors across the old shows were down to speed. But honestly for the rest. The silly plots? The obvious cartoonish villains? The science that doesn't make sense? It is all classic Berman (and Roddenberry) Trek. The only real difference is that Disco and Picard seem to just show stuff and allow you to fill in the blanks, hence no "Take a sensor scan of those orchids. What are they made out of?". We pretty much already know how they're made. Dahj pretty much gave us a hint in the pilot when she first starts to realise she's an android.

    "I was born in Seattle. My dad was a xenobotanist, and our house was full of orchids. He spliced two genuses and he named the offspring after me: Orchidaceae Dahj oncidium. Yellow and pink."
    "That's a beautiful memory, and it's yours. No one can touch it or take it away. But you must look inside deeply and honestly. Have you ever considered the possibility-"
    "That I'm a soulless murder machine?"
    "That you are something lovingly and deliberately created, like Dahj oncidium."

    Basically, if that memory is a hint of a truth, much like in Soji's vision of her home that Narek made her see. The Orchids are made via the same technology that made Dahj and Soji. How exactly? Does it matter? Did the Genesis device not making any sense ever matter? How Changelings can shapeshift into anything regardless of mass? How the Universal translator can still work with races it's never encountered before? It's all silly. Awesome. But silly all the same.

    As for the matter of the characters and escapism. I really truly appreciate seeing imperfect characters in Star Trek. As someone who suffers with mental health problems like depression, anxiety and low self-esteem, seeing an entire host of characters that are dealing with those same problems is really refreshing for me. Because it is still escapism for me. These people suffer but they still fight and try and keep going. And that is very Star Trek. By all appearances Earth is the same paradise we've always known it to be but even in paradise there are misfits and outliers that just don't fit. And that's who Rios, Raffi and now Agnes are. Trek is ultimately about cooperation and working for a greater whole, but what we almost always see are people who are working within a system, and some of us just don't do very well with the kind of restrictions that Starfleet would have in place no matter how much we'd like to. the Crew of the La Sirena however still shows that cooperation and that drive for betterment but without that rigid military-like structure with broken people and I for one really appreciate that. I'm by all means not saying you're not entitled to your view point. Star Trek is different things to different people. But What I'm saying is there is still value it what they're depicting here and it by far doesn't betray the core values of the franchise.
    Please do me a huge favour and help me be with the love of my life.

  5. #325
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    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    Finale promo and sneek peek.

    Last edited by EricG; March 23rd, 2020 at 11:52 PM.

  6. #326
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    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers



    Signs by Scifan and me. | My Forum - Planet TV Role Play | My Fan Fiction | My Mini City - Rygel City

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    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers


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  9. #329
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    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    Really interesting stuff in there. Chabon definitely has a strong appreciation for Trek.
    Please do me a huge favour and help me be with the love of my life.

  10. #330
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    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    Star Trek: Picard's Michael Chabon and Akiva Goldsman reveal some of the show's greatest secrets and easter eggs. Akiva and Michael break down the return of the Captain Picard Day sign, the numerous references to The Gorn, and the newest implementation of Vasquez Rocks.


  11. #331

    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by P-90_177 View Post
    I'm by all means not saying you're not entitled to your view point. Star Trek is different things to different people. But What I'm saying is there is still value it what they're depicting here and it by far doesn't betray the core values of the franchise.
    You make good points but yeah as you say its different things to different people. Picard feels very different to classicTrek and while we were told to expect that this is really not the kind of different I enjoy. A lot of it feels more like lazy writing than them letting us guess what the science is or how things came to be.

    Of course there are so many episodes in classic Trek that are so bad haha. However they were usually surrounded by a lot of good episodes and overall a much better show.

    Picard being only 10 episodes long means their stinkers need to be really few and far between and sadly that's not been the case IMO. 3 episodes I thought were garbage, 4 were so so leaving 3 that were pretty good.

    Anyway time for my final Episode 10 old man rant lol..

    Spoiler:

    Kinda glad its all over as in these last few weeks it felt like I was just waiting for them to find new ways to disappoint me lol. Now that it's done I don't have to worry about it lol.

    So.. that last episode.. once again we've got some good things but mostly things that annoyed me lol..

    I enjoyed the Picard noble sacrifice to save Soji (from her fears) scene.. tugged on the old heart strings a bit so well done there. Was also nice to see Picard flying a ship and being himself a bit more instead of the usual helpless old man in the back seat stuff. Liked the Picard maneuver (the ship one not the shirt one lol) reference too..

    Sure enough my prediction of Picard becoming an android, or more accurately an organic synthetic came true. Felt a bit weird though as lets face it, it's kinda like cloning in that they made an electronic copy of his mind meaning the Picard we know and love has just actually died lol. Not really sure how to feel about that other than it sucks a bit.

    People who may remember my earlier posts here will know that my hope was that this series was all about resurrecting Data and undoing the damage Nemesis did. I was almost willing to accept all the other BS that had happened if that was the target. So I really hoped the golum would be for him and not a quick Picard resurrection. So when Picard bought it I knew what was coming...

    But then he woke up in the simulation and there was data saying exactly what I had posted in previous posts that I'd hoped would happen. They combined those residual Data memories Maddox had generated for his synths with B4's backup of Data's brain to make a pretty much complete resurrected Data (from the moment he did the transfer a day or so before his death in Nemesis). I was so excited! The moment I'd been waiting for! But of course this is a Michael Chabon show and he wants to make Star Trek and its fans as miserable as possible lol so naturally a matter of seconds later this amazing resurrection that so many of us had dreamed of happening for almost 20 damn years was shown to be nothing more than a tease because Data asks to die. Picard then mercy kills him just like 7 of 9 mercy killed Icheb. Michael watched his father suffer & die slowly on life support while writing these new shows which is a horrible thing to go through (I dread having to go through something like that with my mother) and unfortunately all this stuff is probably him creatively dealing with that pain but unfortunately he's dealing with it using the Star Trek universe and characters loved by millions people. I get it, they wanted to give a data 'beautiful death' instead of the cheap one he got in Nemesis hence why I've seen people out there touched and happy with it. But as someone who pretty much was dying (pun not intended lol) to watch this series believing it was all gonna be about Data's resurrection I feel cheated. To tease him being back like that only to take him away just makes me wanna hop over to Michael's twitter and throw some 4 letter words his way (I won't though cause I don't wanna be a d*ck lol). Judging by this article he wouldn't care anyway and for those excited that he's not the main guy behind season 2 well guess what, that article confirms he's written 2 eps and also brainstormed the other 8 for season 2.. so yeah expect more attempts to make us miserable (if we watch) in the future lol.

    character limit...

  12. #332

    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    Continued...

    Spoiler:
    I wish they could have brought Data back.. yes I'm not stupid.. I know Brent doesn't exactly look like Data anymore hence the mountain of makeup and weird camera angles of him sitting or standing to hide his belly making it half impossible to have him around all the time. However they could have brought him back and then have him go back to starfleet or earth or go on his own ventures or something. You know just send him off into the galaxy with happy "All Good Things" like moment to finish his ark. Let us fans think of him living on forever going on adventures and continuing his question to evolve. Let that be the last thing we see of him.. not him dying AGAIN. The face growing old (doesn't make any sense unless they programmed the event) and a virtual duplicate Picard in the red uniform standing over him, even though Picard had been extracted already (another copy lol??) all painted to give a beautiful death triggering an emotional response that makes some forget the weirdness and lack of science and sense behind it lol. However there's nothing stopping them from resurrecting Data again so screw you Michael I'm going to choose to believe that Dr Soon Jr Jr Jr Jr being the sneaky guy he is backed up another copy of Data's mind, waited for Picard to leave then stuck Data in another golum and now he's out there living happily every after lol. Picard's "my gain is your loss line" implies Soong Jr Jr Jr Jr can't make another golum but get stuffed.. Maddox did the brains and Soong Jr Jr Jr Jr did the bodies, nothing stopping him from making more lol.

    Anyway back to Picard's death and resurrection wtf was with them rush skipping over most of the casts reaction to him being back again. Once again Michael's story telling has us in pain watching everyone cry for like 10 damn minutes and then doesn't bother to cover everyone seeing him alive again except for Dr Death, Soong Jr Jr Jr Jr and Soji. Literally straight back on the ship like nothing happened lol.

    Speaking of that final ship scene I've seen some people confusingly posting "are Raffi and 7 of 9 lovers?" well that 2nd article I linked I linked to above has Michael confirming it.. action jackson 7 of 9 had a thing with that crime lord chick she vaporized and she's got a thing with Raffi or whatever her name is (I just cannot remember these new cast member names haha), so expect more of the stuff we've seen from Discovery in Picard season 2 (poor Chakotay haha). I'll leave that for others to debate the merits of all that as it doesn't really bother me, other than to say I find their 'all or nothing' approach a bit weird as does this mean the other shows coming (ST Section 31, ST Pike, ST Lower Decks) will do the same?

    Oh and speaking of 7 of 9.. how did the Romulan evil chick get back on the cube to fight 7 of 9??? she left the cube with the fleet several eps ago didn't she???

    I saw some article a few days ago which I can't seem to find now sorry but it talked about plans for a crossover series that would involve casts members from all the different new trek shows.. pretty much the marvel avengers of new star trek lol. I really don't know how to feel about that lol. I mean if this had been 30 years ago and we had Kirk, Picard, Sisko, Janeway and Archer and other cast members all in one big crossover event series that would have been epic (hell I think there's a popular Novel series out there that sort of did that isn't here?) but massive crossover series with new trek people.. I'm a bit meh.. but hey ya never know lol.

    Anyway back to the Picard finale.. the whole fleet stand off didn't really excite me much at all (other than Picards noble sacrifice I mentioned earlier).. we saw those damn space flowers you saw me moaning about last time again haha, then they used that 'magical plot hole device' to generate duplicate Dr death faces and then the ships all with warp core illusions. Come on man this a advanced Romulan fleet, not those idiot half primitive Kazon in the Delta quadrant that fell for voyagers holograms but anyway.. this all lead to a rather amazing sequence where the evil commodore half Vulcan chick just kept preparing to fire and retargeting.. I think after the 5th or 6th time I actually yelled out (no BS I kid you not) at the TV "STOP PREPARING AND JUST FIRE THE F******** WEAPONS AT SOMETHING ALREADY!!!" hahahaha.

    Then Riker shows up to give us some fan service. Kinda cool but once again just like with Soong Jr Jr Jr Jr 's reveal in the prev episode the delivery just.. felt.. wrong! Urgh. I mean I know he said he's on the active service list still but he's been retired for years and they just give him command of a huge fleet right off the bat, no admirals needed lol? They wouldn't even give Picard a crappy old science vessel but they'll give Riker a friggin fleet lol! I expected the admiral who swears a lot to be in charge of it to be honest. But hey's there's some fan service to be given here and I guess I should be happy Michael didn't try to kill him off too lol! I've seen people on the internet making fun of the obvious CGI background behind him too.. I can see why, as it doesn't look any better than the ones in the fan film Star Wreck, a movie made by a bunch of Finnish nerds in their bedrooms 20years ago lol (great film though haha). If we're wrong and that's a redressed discovery set or something then boy did they mess that up as it really looks fake lol.

    And what the hell was going on with all the ships????? The entire romulan fleet was made out of 1 ship design plus a special capital command ship. These guys lost their homeworld and the vast majority of their population yet apparently they can afford to throw out all their old ships (except for that 22nd century Rom ship in ep 4 lol) and have a brand spanking new fleet lol. I mean this was the PERFECT opportunity to give more fan service and fill the fleet with old Valdors and D'deridex's.

    Copy and paste a lot of that for Riker's fleet too. He warped in with 200 friggin ships that look the same.. what the hell!! When I think back to the giant federation fleets used in the Dominion war that were filled with old ships.. by then excelsiors would have been about 90 years old (at least the design anyway) and reliants and saratogas would have been over 110 years old. So why not stick some old galaxys, sovereigns and defiants in this fleet??

    For a show that has a budget the old trek shows could only dream of I'm amazed that they literally built 2 giant fleets of the same ships using copy & paste.. Also was it just me or did the ships also look rather fake CGI looking.. they must have accidentally blown the budget out and run out of money.. that has to the be the reason for calling it in surely? The CGI DS9 fleets looked better than this for christ sake. This video pretty much confirms it lol.

    Anyway then he just left... a dying Picard is like "oh yeah I can handle it from here Will".. and Wills like "sure bro.. I'll take all these ships we had to pull from vital missions and just turn around after being here for all 5 minutes" lol. If I was the Vulcan commodore chick I would have said "hey the federation is abandoning the planet again lets turn around and blow sh*t up before they come back again.. EVERYONE PREPARE TO FIRE SOME MORE!!!" lol.. Someone that obsessed aint gonna care about the treaty of Algeron. Also she's responsible for the deaths of everyone on Mars and most of the Romulan homeworld (by destroying the rescue fleet).. but nah its cool you can fly off lol.

    Oh well.. I could pick at a bunch of other things but I'll stop complaining haha.. time to move on! I'll probably still cop the hater title from some people who loved it but like I said before normally I love all scifi and am super tolerant and am often the one taking on the haters lol but this show (much like the new main star wars films) just rubbed me the wrong way from ep5 onwards.. I guess its because these characters that I grew up with mean a lot to me and I don't like seeing them having to run the Michael Chabon gantlet of death and misery.

    At this stage I now actually prefer Discovery over Picard. Probably because they're not screwing with my beloved childhood characters as much haha which means I can tolerate more plot and technology gaffes. I thought they handled Spock and Pike pretty well in s2 and it really made the show so much better having them and the Enterprise there. So I worry a bit about Disco s3 as they won't have those improvements anymore.. however I'm super excited about the ST Pike show. At least they listened to the fans on that one!

  13. #333
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    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    i called the ending-with few errors- way back in the beginning of march... hey, i am not usually right so i got to brag when i get the chance!
    <<besides,, i really peeved off a few people at "that other site" when i said it and then was right!!! >>>

    Spoiler:
    ok,, crazy, outside darkhorse bets on what may happen in PICARD, time

    i am putting out one now---

    either in the course of the show- like next season, or at its end, Picard will be near death and he will have his consciousness uploaded into a synthetic body

    an apex of his human and borg experience and his affinity for Data all purpose built into a machine that is part Soong synth and part Borg

    mark your calendars folks!!
    THIS SPACE FOR RENT
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    https://www.gatefans.net/gforums/thr....28948/page-25

  14. #334
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    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    Been said the reason why in Picard we saw none of the following is due to licensing issues and fees. that kurtzman did not pay for their use or Paramount simply would not sell the rights--YEA OR NAY?

    - no "known" starfleet or romulan ship designs
    -No mention of Chakotay
    -No hard tie in with TNG/VOY backstory on several characters vis a vis their situation in PICARD- like Icheb and Hugh. IE: why is the Icheb character "thrown away" possibly the most important asset SF gained from voyager-why put him on some unimportant ship?

    how did Hugh get off of his planet we saw in TNG? how did he end up on a still -assimilating Cube? And again we see him in PICARD not in any recognizable character form as we saw him in TNG and then, killed off so meaninglesly-why have him in the show at all?

    -also the lack of many other standard TNG/VOY iconic items like same style transporters, lack of standard comms and console controls, different personal weapons..etc.etc

    is it all about the money?

  15. #335
    Colonel P-90_177's Avatar
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    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by magi877 View Post
    Been said the reason why in Picard we saw none of the following is due to licensing issues and fees. that kurtzman did not pay for their use or Paramount simply would not sell the rights--YEA OR NAY?

    - no "known" starfleet or romulan ship designs
    -No mention of Chakotay
    -No hard tie in with TNG/VOY backstory on several characters vis a vis their situation in PICARD- like Icheb and Hugh. IE: why is the Icheb character "thrown away" possibly the most important asset SF gained from voyager-why put him on some unimportant ship?

    how did Hugh get off of his planet we saw in TNG? how did he end up on a still -assimilating Cube? And again we see him in PICARD not in any recognizable character form as we saw him in TNG and then, killed off so meaninglesly-why have him in the show at all?

    -also the lack of many other standard TNG/VOY iconic items like same style transporters, lack of standard comms and console controls, different personal weapons..etc.etc

    is it all about the money?
    Since it's 20 years after Nemesis I don't see why any of it matters any way. I don't know much about licensing, but it is true that most of the recognisable ship designs we know like the Excelsior, Miranda, Akira, Sovereign, Steamrunner, Sabre, etc. were all created in movie form first. So if it is true about this split in rights between the movies and TV shows then that would be a part of it. But given that it is 20 years later I don't see why there wouldn't be brand new ship classes anyway, so why should we see any of the older ships at all? I get it. Fan service and all that and I would have loved to see them too, but there's no big need to see them. And ultimately these new shows are going for a new aesthetic and I am all for that. I want to see what new designs they come up with, not how they can reuse someone else's work.

    Now all that being said, the Inquiry Class was pretty low res and we didn't get a great look at it. These are flaws in the episode, but at the end of the day Picard was a VERY VFX heavy show, particularly towards the end of the series so both time and money become a factor in the creation of these things.

    For the other points you mentioned... Why?
    Why do we need Chakotay mentioned? To explain why he and Seven aren't together? Why bother when most people hated that pairing in the first place? There's only so much time in an episode and you can't waste it by just throwing in pointless exposition in regards to characters that don't matter.
    Does it matter how Hugh got to the Artifact? We know at the end of Descent that he was staying on that planet with the other disconnected Borg to try and build a new society. They either figured out how to remove their own implants, which makes perfectly sound sense since we saw that the Co-Operative Borg from season 3 of Voyager do the same, or they got some knowledge of how to do so once Seven returned and likely found them at some point because we know Seven and Hugh know each other and why wouldn't they when we know they are both disconnected Borg? Same as why Seven and Picard would already know eachother. It's not like there are many liberated drones, it's more than likely that they would seek each other out. We don't need that spelling out for us. Same with Hugh being on the Artifact in the first place. Last we saw him he was working to help liberated Borg, so it's perfectly in keeping for the character that nearly 30 years later he would still be doing that.

    Now Icheb is a good point, I grant. I personally never felt a strong attachment to him in Voyager but I get that some people do, but if you start from the point of wanting to give Seven a redemption arc (which I have no doubt will be continued in season 2) then killing Icheb is a perfectly fine place to start. The whole point is to demonstrate that just like in real life, the world has moved on since those old shows were on and it generally feels much less safe and we all feel more vulnerable and that extends to the Star Trek family. Life continued after the safety of their adventures on board their respective ships whether that be Enterprise or Voyager and bad things happened to good people. I think showing his death the way they did was a step too far. I think even Michael Chabon has admitted that if he could do it over he wouldn't have done it that way, but thematically it works to my mind because what we saw was something as horrific as what happens to Borg when they are first assimilated and a big part of the show was about how Borg are thought of still as drones even when they are not.

    For stuff like phasers, tricorders and other tech I don't see why we'd see any of it anyway. Again it's 20 years later. Are you still using your phone from 20 years ago? Just in regards to Phasers I can think of off the top of my head fifteen different hand phaser designs seen across the Prime franchise. That's not even counting the rifles. And Rios is a civilian so why would he even have Starfleet issued tech beyond the basics like the TNG hypospray Juratti uses on Picard. It's such a tiny nitpick that it shouldn't be worth mentioning.

    Ultimately, my point is, that yeah I mean that stuff might not be in the show because of rights issues. Who knows. But I don't see how having any of that stuff in the show would make it better beyond filling it with even more Easter eggs that the show already has loads of.
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  16. #336
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    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by P-90_177 View Post


    For the other points you mentioned... Why?
    Why do we need Chakotay mentioned?

    Does it matter how Hugh got to the Artifact? We know at the end of Descent that he was staying on that planet with the other disconnected Borg to try and build a new society. They either figured out how to remove their own implants, which makes perfectly sound sense since we saw that the Co-Operative Borg from season 3 of Voyager do the same, or they got some knowledge of how to do so once Seven returned

    Now Icheb is a good point, I grant.
    Chakotay's status would be important because it is with him that we lost saw 7 prior to this

    doing it the way they did here is like reading a book where chpts 1 -10 have a character and then, for no explained reason, the character never appears again.

    one short simple throwaway line of "he got xyz disease" or "he's in a native american hermitage on planet Ke-moh sah-be" would have been great

    IMO it does matter how Hugh got where he did. when we last we saw him, he was leading a group of freed borg on Lore's planet. thats it. Did he and his people even have a cube then?

    and then, boom! he's a researcher onboard a Romulan experiment (and he is apparently human, something not touched on in TNG) for no apparent reason does this role need to be FILLED by Hugh. But being able to secure a fmailiar face from TNG helps to give recognition to PICARD

    but then he is just dead... his death really not meaning much at all

    <<and just why were the romulans so interested in this cube and former borg anyhow? i was really hoping for more romulan/borg interaction. there are a lot of fan theories out there about Borg origins (at least in their cyborg form) and the Romulans. been interesting to see at least some explanation of why the Romulans were so interested in this cube

    Icheb-he wasn't just killed, he was slaughtered. That scene was texas chainsaw quality gore-especially for star trek

    and, as I said, i just dont buy that either Icheb, headstrong as he was or Starfleet would have allowed him ot be wasted on some patrol ship. He was a valuable piece of "human" intell from both the Borg and the Delta quadrant.

    that, together with his innate knack for science.. i dont see his character ever leaving SF HQ
    ------------------------------

    all three of these characters are missing backstory's but we got the backstory on a character we never even knew of- Riker's son. and just what purpose did that story fill?
    ---------------------
    PICARD s1 leaves viewers with a lot of supposition to do own our own. filling in the holes and building reasons to bridge the "if it didn't happen on screen-or at least talked about- then it didn't happen" issue

    ---------------------
    I hope hoping that any licensing issues between cbs and viacom/paramount and kurtzman are erased due to the recent merger of cbs- viacom. this would allow-one would think, for full use of any and all material,characters ,ship designs, story lines ,etc for subsequent seasons of PICARD

    But i have been told that this is not the case (stress on "told" with no citation provided)

    i do like PICARD, i hope it does great, just hope they can polish it up a bit more and stop being so purposefully "Edgy" ..just do Trek

  17. #337

    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    I thought Discovery season 1 was okay but there were many things that annoyed me. Season 2 was a huge improvement for me however that was mainly due to the additional cast members playing Pike, Spock and Number One on the enterprise, there was still some silly stuff (lazy writing plot hole things as usual) that annoyed me though. Season 3 loses those great additions so I fear it'll disappoint me again lol. My love of the Disco season 2 Enterprise content of course also leaves me super excited for Star Trek Strange New Worlds (aka the Star Trek Pike show fans demanded heh) as they've said it will be a more traditional episodic Star Trek adventure show on the Enterprise! So hopefully they can't screw that up too much... although there's some rumour (possibly BS) out there that it's also going to have a young bisexual Kirk running about in the show so read into that what you will lol!!

    Back to good old Picard.. I've decided I'm not going to call it that anymore now. To me this show shall now be known as 'Patrick Stewart Goes To Space' (PSGTS for short) as there really isn't much Star Trek or Picard in it lol!!! I've been waiting for the 'Critical Drinker' to review PSGTS as I've become an fan of his after seeing his Last Jedi and Rise of Skywalker reviews on those cluster****s. Sure enough in the video below you can see he hates it and he talks about Picard himself being rather useless just like I talked about in my episode reviews earlier in this thread. Yes I know hating on stuff is kind of his gimmick haha but he makes good points that match a lot of my previously posted thoughts.

    This is Patrick Stewart Goes To Space!


    And this is Star Trek Picard baby!!


    .
    Last edited by Blake00; July 5th, 2020 at 07:53 AM.

  18. #338
    Colonel mad_gater's Avatar
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    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Blake00 View Post
    I thought Discovery season 1 was okay but there were many things that annoyed me. Season 2 was a huge improvement for me however that was mainly due to the additional cast members playing Pike, Spock and Number One on the enterprise, there was still some silly stuff (lazy writing plot hole things as usual) that annoyed me though. Season 3 loses those great additions so I fear it'll disappoint me again lol. My love of the Disco season 2 Enterprise content of course also leaves me super excited for Star Trek Strange New Worlds (aka the Star Trek Pike show fans demanded heh) as they've said it will be a more traditional episodic Star Trek adventure show on the Enterprise! So hopefully they can't screw that up too much... although there's some rumour (possibly BS) out there that it's also going to have a young bisexual Kirk running about in the show so read into that what you will lol!!

    Back to good old Picard.. I've decided I'm not going to call it that anymore now. To me this show shall now be known as 'Patrick Stewart Goes To Space' (PSGTS for short) as there really isn't much Star Trek or Picard in it lol!!! I've been waiting for the 'Critical Drinker' to review PSGTS as I've become an fan of his after seeing his Last Jedi and Rise of Skywalker reviews on those cluster****s. Sure enough in the video below you can see he hates it and he talks about Picard himself being rather useless just like I talked about in my episode reviews earlier in this thread. Yes I know hating on stuff is kind of his gimmick haha but he makes good points that match a lot of my previously posted thoughts.

    This is Patrick Stewart Goes To Space!


    And this is Star Trek Picard baby!!


    .
    According to the New Frontier books Number One was actually an immortal who often went by Morgan Primus and was the mother of Robin Lefler...hmm....potential crossover with "Highlander"

  19. #339
    Air Force Chief of Staff Alan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by mad_gater View Post
    According to the New Frontier books Number One was actually an immortal who often went by Morgan Primus and was the mother of Robin Lefler...hmm....potential crossover with "Highlander"
    Well having not bought any more of the NF books beyond the first four(?) volumes in the range, I rejoined the spin-off with the graphic novel thinking I could rejoin it easily enoug but instead found myself utterly lost by some storylines and character development and that particular story aspect of it you mentioned was...if you'll pardon the pun...Number One on my list.
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  20. #340
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    Default Re: Star Trek: Picard -- speculation/discussion/spoilers

    Vinyl Soundtrack And More ‘Star Trek: Picard’ Tie-Ins Coming This Summer And Fall

    I know this article is from July, but I just now saw this and I don't remember seeing an article about this on Star Trek's website:
    ‘Star Trek: Picard’ Season One Arrives On Blu-Ray And DVD In October


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