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  1. #21
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Staring Anthony

    Well we pretty much got an answer to who MiB is in episode 5.

  2. #22
    Second Lieutenant Cluas's Avatar
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Staring Anthony

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian-S View Post
    Well we pretty much got an answer to who MiB is in episode 5.
    I don't think so. The writers have done an excellent job, at keeping the story open to both sides ... It is so ambiguous, and that is why is it great

  3. #23
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    True but he did say "this place would have gone bankrupt without me", so he likely bailed them out at some stage.

    Which if you think about it actually adds fuel to that theory about the two guys that popped up a few episodes ago since they are talking about the same thing (financial investment in the park).

    I still think they are all going to end up face to face in the end though, and wtf with the girl at the end!

    Was this the first episode that didn't open with Deloris and the black bloke having one of their conversations?
    Last edited by Ian-S; November 1st, 2016 at 09:04 AM.

  4. #24
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    Saw the film first time it hit TV in the late 1970's.

    Just finished a catch-up binge for this new series. Love it! The multiple story lines for the workers, the mid-management, hosts and guests.... Throw in random bits of Wild West Tales and
    Spoiler:
    the hosts writing their own fan fic
    .

  5. #25
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    Is

    Spoiler:
    Bernard (we see with Deloris in their conversations) actually Arnold pre-suicide and Bernard we see sleeping with Teresa a clone 30 years later? Could there even be THREE timeline stories playing out concurrently?

    1) Arnold's suicide.
    2) Williams investment.
    3) Williams return as MiB to find Arnold's maze?

  6. #26
    Second Lieutenant Cluas's Avatar
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    This is not spoilers really, just some thoughts...

    Bernard could easily turn out to be a copy of Arnold. I am still not sure that William is the MiB. There is something more to it. But the thing is, both a linear time frame, or a past/present time frame will work. It is still very ambiguous, and that's why I like it so much ...

  7. #27
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    Yeah, we both sit on the same part of the fence there.

  8. #28
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    I already pay enough for cable, can't justify more than $200 a month...

  9. #29
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    I have just binge watched the first six episodes again and it makes sooooo much more sense if you watch from the viewpoint that:

    Spoiler:

    Scenes between Deloris/Bernard in the 'square room' are one story.
    Scenes between Deloris/William are another (maybe or maybe not connected to the first).
    Scenes involving MiB/Teddy/Elie/Bernard/Ford/Maie are another story too.

    It also throws another perspective if you assume the Deloris/Bernard conversations are not as they appear but Deloris/Arnold pre-sentience / pre-Arnold death).

    Some other titbits I noticed:
    Maie is never in any scenes that happen in Deloris/William timeline, only timeline 3.
    In episode 2, Ford addresses Bernard as 'Mr Lowe', so there is evidence for Bernard Lowe being an anagram for Arnold Weber.
    Deloris killing the organic fly at the end of episode 1 is a huge plot point, this is where she defied her programming for the second time (if you assume she was the subject of Arnold's demise).
    When Teddy was being beaten up before being hung from the tree, his bullets bounced off the other people, indicating they were either human or sentient hosts.


    The power of suggestion is used heavily throughout, there are several scenes where plot a appears to lead to plot b, but it can't because the events in plot b are triggered in the previous episode, I could list them if you like but it'll take a while.

    So I think this is what is happening:
    Spoiler:

    We are seeing a classic BSG robot rebellion, one took place in the past and was put down but probably led to the death of Arnold, the new one triggered by Dad speaking to Deloris who passed it on to Maie is the present day version of the same events playing out again.

    The Ford new narrative and MiB hunt for the maze is a red herring, it ties into the main story but isn't it the main story, which is simple robot becomes self aware, robot kills master plot. The Delos subplot is the futureworld storyline pre-futureworld.


    Understand? Yup it's complicated, which is why I wanted to get it written down.

    I have missed out loads but here's some other things I noticed:

    Spoiler:
    The guy MiB jailbroke is a gen 1 host (like Deloris and fake-Ford family), you saw him in the Ford flashbacks.

    Teddy is the host who has gone off loop, not Deloris who is by this time back in one of the glass rooms being interrogated by Ford about lying to him, after she retraced her steps by going to that village on her own after killing 'Simon'.

    I'll call him 'Simon' because I can't remember his name but 'Simon' is the character the actor plays on Walking Dead. Most people assume Deloris 'found' the gun in the hay in the scene she killed him in, she didn't, she lifted it off him as he dragged her across the courtyard, when she produces the gun 'Simon' looks down, groans then compliments her on her trick of stealing his gun.

    It's not the same gun she dug up in Episode 2, that's the one she'll kill Arnold or another guest with plus it was Silver, 'Simon' had a black one.
    Last edited by Ian-S; November 12th, 2016 at 03:13 AM.

  10. #30
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    Oh I forgot...

    Spoiler:
    In episode 2, when William is going up the escalator, at the top standing to the right of the big screen is a man that looks suspiciously like a young Ford (same clothes etc.).

  11. #31
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    Interesting theories. I think it will be exciting to see what happens next ...

  12. #32
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    ...and episode 7 causes the internet to implode.

    I thought the body being built in the lab was a replacement for
    Spoiler:
    the woman Bernard killed, but it looks like she really is dead from the preview, I wonder if that is a replacement for Elsie?

  13. #33
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    Episode 7 was great. Westworld has become one of my favorite shows and it's been renewed for a second season, YAY!

    http://deadline.com/2016/11/westworl...bo-1201853994/

  14. #34
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    Awesome but considering how long it was for season 1 filming to transmission, I doubt we'll see season 2 until 2018, but I'd prefer to wait I think, the effort that has gone into this is astoundingly high, and they're not dumbing anything down at all for the viewer.

  15. #35
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    Personally I will have trouble with waiting that long... It really also depends on the direction of the last 3 episodes...
    But I liked ep 7 a lot. I just need to know what happened to Elsie ...

  16. #36
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    It's now my favorite sci-fi show in a long time. I just wish they didn't have to need so much nudity. I know there's that running theory of William being the MIB. But I don't see it. Dolores had flashbacks of the MIB before she ran away and stumbled on William and Logan The Wyatt narrative seems to take place in the present with the ruined church steeple already in the ground. Looking forward to the last episode and continuation for the 2nd season whenever it comes. Hopefully the world doesn't fall apart before then , haha.

  17. #37
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    Spoiler:
    There was a fade to black between Dolores killing GTA5 and her stumbling upon William and Logan, the popular concenous is the fade to black is a indicator of the timeline/storytime changing from present to past, there was an example of this in the last episode too right after Maeve says "time to write my own story", it fades to black, then fades back in to Dolores and William approaching the burried town on horseback.

    Later in that act she has a flashback to the town where the staff are training the androids to dance, but just before that, there is a very brief shot of her facing the town and it's completely empty, there is then a strange sepia type transition to a populated town, and eventually its revealed the town is burried and she has her mini meltdown about Arnold.

    So its not safe to assume the flashback of MiB she had in the barn before escaping happened in the same timeframe as the following scene where she stumbled across W&L (remember that scene she flashed back to happened in episode one when MiB killed Teddy) conventional storytelling techniques suggests the two scenes are chronological, but this is a Nolan show and history tells us you cannot trust anybody in that family to tellba story in a linear fashion.

    I suspect what is hapenning is Dolores is retracing her journey with William through reliving the memories, we occasionally see a shot of her alone, or a mirrored third person perspective of her looking at herself doing something, whatever journey she is on is in the same "time" as MiB and Teddy but it's being told to us from her perspective as reliving the memories of her time with William.

    So I think William is MiB and eventually she will meet MiB in present time on his journey, William will initially be shown to be standing next to her, the internet will then explode with cries of "told you there was only one timeline", only for a few seconds later for it to be revealed, in the same manor the hidden door was to Bernard, that William was never with her at all and was just a memory, she will probably call out for William, only for MiB to answer "I'm here", the internet will then explode for a second time.

    Remember both Theresa and the Delos board chick complained that Ford had recently dug up an old town on the fringes of the park, and Ford himself told Teddy there was some truth to his new Wyatt back story, I.e. Wyatt is based on Dolores or Arnold's actions which ultimately led to Arnolds death, which is the memory of the village being slaughtered the victims of it keep having, however every one of them has a different memory of who Wyatt is, likly to be revealed as Arnold to us eventually after they toy with us for a bit by showing it from several different perspectives.

    Remember that Hector, Angela, Maeve, Armistice and Dolores are all present in the 'Androids do Strictly Come Dancing" group dance scene.


    Post contains speculation/spoilers up to episode 8 in relation to post above.
    Last edited by Ian-S; November 23rd, 2016 at 04:03 AM.

  18. #38
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    Spoiler:
    I'm starting to come up with another theory that while William is MiB, Teddy is also another version of William. I believe that whatever happens to William and Dolores on their journey results in William needing to leave to live his life, but when his and Logan's company take over Westworld, he arranges for his personality and his affection for Dolores to be put into a new host, that being Teddy.
    Please do me a huge favour and help me be with the love of my life.

  19. #39
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    Yes, there are similarities:

    Spoiler:
    they both 'wake up' on the train
    Both walk into the same host in Sweetwater
    Both pick up the can
    Both appear to love Dolores.

    But I'm not sure it's Logan, I think it was Ford made Teddy in Williams image to stop Dolores going off loop each evening and keep her on script. Don't forget the Delos terms of service state they own everything you leave in the park, such as skin cells, blood, semen etc. and Bill did play VRSex with Dolores on the train...


    Ep 9 spoiler / E10 speculation:
    Spoiler:
    I don't think Logan is going to leave the park alive, he's going to be the catastrophic failure Bernard was talking about, Dolores is going to finish him off next episode, she only had to be an inch or two lower in this episode and she'd had slit his jugular open instead of his cheek...

  20. #40
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    Default Re: Westworld (HBO 2016) Series Starring Anthony Hopkins: Discussion/Spoilers

    Wow. Episode 9 pretty much confirmed many of the theories floating around. I had it figured out, but I was totally excited regardless. I haven't seen tv as good as this for a long while. Excellent writing, excellent acting...

    The finale will be 90 minutes.
    Plenty of time for action. And answering the last few questions...

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