Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 34
  1. #1
    Site Admin GateWorld's Avatar
    Member Since
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    4,047

    Post Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    Visit the Episode GuideDOCTOR WHO - SEASON 35 (9)
    BEFORE THE FLOOD
    EPISODE NUMBER - 3504 (904)
    The Doctor returns to the past where he must confront the alien warlord who is turning innocent victims into transmitters -- only to learn that the Doctor himself may have to die. In the future, Clara and the other survivors of the underwater outpost struggle to survive when it looks like there may be no way out.

    VISIT THE EPISODE GUIDE >>
    Last edited by GateWorld; October 11th, 2015 at 09:50 PM.

  2. #2
    Colonel Teddybrown's Avatar
    Member Since
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Somewhere in the Seven Kingdoms
    Posts
    6,099

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    Definately need to rewatch this one, timey wimey...

  3. #3
    General Blencathra's Avatar
    Member Since
    Feb 2008
    Location
    North Yorkshire, United Kingdom
    Posts
    26,460

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    I'm going to have to watch it again as well to fully grasp the timey wimey bits too.

    But my first impression is one of disappointment. I thought the episode last week was absolutely fantastic, but this one just wasn't of the same standard. I was a little bored in the middle of the episode to be honest.

    Prentis the undertaker was vaguely irritating and not particularly funny. The Fisher King was a great monster but he was disposed of too easily. I'd already guessed it was the Doctor in the sarcophagus, so no surprises there. I thought Clara was really annoying, selfish and self-centred. As Cass commented, she is quite happy at the moment to risk other people's lives. I loved Cass & Lunn and thought it very sad that O'Donnell couldn't be saved.

  4. #4
    Colonel P-90_177's Avatar
    Member Since
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Traveling through Time and Space
    Posts
    7,200

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    Lol. Once again I'm surprised by people saying they're surprised by the Timey Wimey when I understand it all perfectly.
    Please do me a huge favour and help me be with the love of my life.

  5. #5
    Lieutenant Colonel Matt G's Avatar
    Member Since
    May 2004
    Location
    Exeter, UK
    Posts
    3,163

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    1. Well that's one way round working out the identity of the village..make it a Cold War training village.

    2. Interesting bootstrap paradox...those are strange things...

    3. Clara's still trying to be the Doctor...and it didn't really work in this ep.

    4. The genuine article pulled a pretty good stunt though.

    Solid enough

  6. #6
    Molly Hooper Sealurk's Avatar
    Member Since
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Wastes of the East Midlands
    Posts
    2,742

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    Great episode made even better by the Doctor's curiously fourth wall breaking intro and rock cover of the theme tune. I'll need to watch it again as well, but more for the lines and bits I missed than the timey-wimey... which I think I got. Thoroughly enjoyable.
    And now it's time for one last bow, like all your other selves. Eleven's hour is over now... the clock is striking Twelve's.

    Stargate Ragnarok | FF.net | AO3 | Lakeside | My Fallout 3 Mods | Poppy Appeal | Help For Heroes | Combat Stress


  7. #7
    Colonel Teddybrown's Avatar
    Member Since
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Somewhere in the Seven Kingdoms
    Posts
    6,099

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    What did people think of the theme tune? I liked it.

  8. #8
    Captain
    Member Since
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    1,440

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    It was OK, if a tad indulgent, like a few parts this season have been.

    At least this episode actually made sense, even if some of it was only hinted at.

  9. #9
    Colonel P-90_177's Avatar
    Member Since
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Traveling through Time and Space
    Posts
    7,200

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    Quote Originally Posted by Teddybrown View Post
    What did people think of the theme tune? I liked it.
    loved it.
    Please do me a huge favour and help me be with the love of my life.

  10. #10
    General Blencathra's Avatar
    Member Since
    Feb 2008
    Location
    North Yorkshire, United Kingdom
    Posts
    26,460

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    I liked the theme tune too. It was fun.

    Talking of which... The clockwork squirrel made an appearance.


  11. #11
    Colonel
    Member Since
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Travelling the river Iss
    Posts
    7,124

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    Quote Originally Posted by Sealurk View Post
    Great episode made even better by the Doctor's curiously fourth wall breaking intro and rock cover of the theme tune. I'll need to watch it again as well, but more for the lines and bits I missed than the timey-wimey... which I think I got. Thoroughly enjoyable.

    Well I interpreted it as the Doctor talking to Clara and we see her POV..

  12. #12
    Colonel
    Member Since
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Travelling the river Iss
    Posts
    7,124

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    I thought the teaser before the credits was really breaking the 4th wall. I have very mixed feelings about this episode. I just am not sure how I feel.

    Did anyone pick up on the easter egg. The name on the amplifier was the Magpie as in the episode "The Idiot's Lantern."

    20 minutes into last week's episode I tagged the Doctor as being the one inside the casket...

    5/10

    BTW the dam might flood the town but how can it stay flooded? Water recedes over time... doesn't it?

  13. #13
    Molly Hooper Sealurk's Avatar
    Member Since
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Wastes of the East Midlands
    Posts
    2,742

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    I'm not sure why but I loved the fourth wall breaking intro with the Doctor talking - apparently - to us, the audience. I think he did this in Listen as well.

    Great spot, Blen. Hadn't seen the clockwork squirrel - or the Magpie Electricals amp it's sitting on!

    LOVED the rock intro - seem to remember reading/hearing that was actually Capaldi playing (he used to be a in a punk band). Somehow wouldn't surprise me, but even if it isn't it is still awesome and suits the sort of carefree, aging rocker persona that Twelve has developed. He really is the biggest Doctor Who fan of us all, isn't he?

    I really liked O'Donnell, I adored her "It's bigger on the inside!" squeeing fit, and I am quite sad she didn't make it because I was seriously hoping she'd be the next companion - much like another Toby Whithouse character, Rita from The God Complex. That said, she didn't half grab the idiot ball and run with it when the Fisher King cuts the group off from the TARDIS. "Let's split up!" Seriously? Are horror movies just not a thing in the 22nd century?

    Liking how arc-light this series seems to be so far, or at least how much more subtle the show is about any kind of running arc. The Minister of War reference intrigued me though.

    "If you'd occupied us you'd be home by now."

    The idea of Toby Whithouse eventually replacing Moffat is an increasingly attractive one based on his recent output and his characters (which I sometimes think are Moffat's weakness).

    Clara is really bugging me now, her personality is not in any way endearing and her (latest) rant at the Doctor just made her sound bossy, selfish, childish, demanding, controlling and just simply egomaniacal. I am actually looking forward to the character leaving the show now.

    The book Prentis is holding when the Fisher King kills him, Celestial Almanac - I'm now wondering if that's an easter egg, a portent of things to come or just a cool prop.

    Twelve is certainly a lot darker and colder than most Doctors. Admittedly he did try to prevent O'Donnell's demise, but as Bennett said, not very hard. Clara's headed the same way but doesn't disguise it as well.

    Peter Serafinowicz on typically fine and creepy form doing the voice of the Fisher King (why is he called that? Isn't that an Arthurian legend?). Slipknot's Corey Taylor only does his roar apparently.

    The bait-and-switch with the suspended animation pod was reasonably predictable but clever.

    How come the other ghosts treated the Doctor's holo-ghost as one of them?

    Why didn't the Fisher King run to the hearse when the dam blew? If his survival instinct was that strong wouldn't it have been better to seal yourself in a water-tight vehicle than just stand and roar at an oncoming wall of water?

    Overall a very strong and enjoyable episode. Particularly loved the use of the bootstrap paradox / causality loop, nice to see somebody other than Moffat doing timey-wimey (actually, as at least one article has said, Whithouse may have just out-Moffated Moffat). Definitely loving the focus on two-parters, and I definitely think that this is setting up a format change for the next year or perhaps more. A return to slightly more serial stories with little or no arc is, for me at least, very welcome.
    And now it's time for one last bow, like all your other selves. Eleven's hour is over now... the clock is striking Twelve's.

    Stargate Ragnarok | FF.net | AO3 | Lakeside | My Fallout 3 Mods | Poppy Appeal | Help For Heroes | Combat Stress


  14. #14
    General Blencathra's Avatar
    Member Since
    Feb 2008
    Location
    North Yorkshire, United Kingdom
    Posts
    26,460

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    Quote Originally Posted by Sealurk View Post
    ...

    Clara is really bugging me now, her personality is not in any way endearing and her (latest) rant at the Doctor just made her sound bossy, selfish, childish, demanding, controlling and just simply egomaniacal. I am actually looking forward to the character leaving the show now.

    ...
    I found this development in Clara to be very disturbing. She is quite willing to have Lunn risk his life, much to Cass' distress, but she isn't willing to risk her own. Later, Cass has to nearly force Clara to go out & look for him. All Clara seems to care about is herself and continuing her exciting adventures with the Doctor. After Clara lost Danny you would think that she would have some sympathy for Cass and her anxiety about Lunn but no, she insists that Lunn goes out of the Faraday cage to find the phone (which incidentally is never needed again). She then has the hypocrisy to comfort Bennett about losing O'Donnell.

    I've been racking my brains trying to think of a companion who would behave in a similar selfish fashion and the only one who I could come up with is Vislor Turlough. I think every companion before this (apart from Turlough) would have gone out to find the phone themselves. I do think that Clara will end up paying for her selfish self-centred attitude.

  15. #15
    Colonel Flyboy's Avatar
    Member Since
    May 2004
    Location
    Great Britain
    Posts
    7,932

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    Quote Originally Posted by Blencathra View Post
    I'm going to have to watch it again as well to fully grasp the timey wimey bits too.

    But my first impression is one of disappointment. I thought the episode last week was absolutely fantastic, but this one just wasn't of the same standard. I was a little bored in the middle of the episode to be honest.

    Prentis the undertaker was vaguely irritating and not particularly funny. The Fisher King was a great monster but he was disposed of too easily. I'd already guessed it was the Doctor in the sarcophagus, so no surprises there. I thought Clara was really annoying, selfish and self-centred. As Cass commented, she is quite happy at the moment to risk other people's lives. I loved Cass & Lunn and thought it very sad that O'Donnell couldn't be saved.
    Agreed on all counts.

    Distinctly average conclusion to a great opening. I loved the classic feel of the first part, with the under water base, being cut off, and the military vs corporate tensions. This just seemed so underwhelming on all counts...


    "Five Rounds Rapid"




  16. #16
    Second Lieutenant GodAtum's Avatar
    Member Since
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Emperor's Palace, Trantor
    Posts
    466

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    No, havent got a clue what happened. How did the Fisher King come back from the dead? he was one of the most useless and underwhelming villans ever.
    "You don't know half of it".
    Former C.I.A. Director George Bush
    (When asked about UFO secrecy by a member of his presidential campaign committee)


    http://www.forumpedia.com/style_imag...ext3420557.gif

  17. #17
    Major General
    Member Since
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Corner of No and Where
    Posts
    13,892

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    I say he wasn't really dead, only in hibernation, he was turning people into beacons to call an invasion force to Earth, and the easiest way for him to get there with no resistance is for his funeral. No one would stop a funeral in case it's part of an invasion plan, right?

    The Fisher King.. Is he The Fisher King of Arthurian Legend? Keeper of the Holy Grail with the power to resurrect the dead?

    Some of it seems to fit

    We might see him again. He was "killed" far too easily and that's a lot of design work for a one-off monster.

    And he was voiced by Peter Serafinowicz.. And we definitely need more of him in Doctor Who.. and on TV in general

    While it was a slightly disappointing episode.. I say the quality this year so far is still much higher than it has been for a long time.

  18. #18
    Colonel
    Member Since
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Travelling the river Iss
    Posts
    7,124

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    What about those base doors? Are the round portals in the doors empty? Sometimes there was glass there and other times water poured through the round windows..

  19. #19
    Colonel
    Member Since
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Travelling the river Iss
    Posts
    7,124

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    BTW Blen Oh Blen....

    What's this big theory you had that Moffat has been sewing seeds for the Doctor since the first episode of series 5?

  20. #20
    General Blencathra's Avatar
    Member Since
    Feb 2008
    Location
    North Yorkshire, United Kingdom
    Posts
    26,460

    Default Re: Before the Flood (3504 / 904)

    Sorry I'm keeping my theory to myself for the time being. Firstly if I'm wrong then I'm going to look very silly, but more importantly if I'm right then I will have spoiled a big reveal & I don't want to do that.

    I was just thinking about Clara again last night. Now my first initial irritation about her is over I have done a complete turn around and now I'm actually looking forward to seeing where this development in her character will go next.

    In the past the Doctor has either picked a good person to travel with him, or when he has on occasion picked a bad person, that person has become good by travelling with the Doctor (thinking of Turlough again). With Clara we seem to be getting the reverse, and I think that makes an interesting change.

    Clara started off as a sweet girl, but slightly bossy, who was quite willing to jump into the Doctor's timeline to save him. But now, since Danny's death, she has become this adrenaline junkie. All she wants is faster, more furious, more dangerous adventures. It seems to me that, despite what she says, the death of Danny has affected her more than she knows. She doesn't care about her family or her teaching any more. All she wants is that next adrenaline rush.

    She is losing her humanity. She is becoming more and more like the Doctor and is picking up his bad traits. Donna told the 10th Doctor that he needed somebody to travel with him in order to stop him from going too far. But Clara is becoming like the Doctor. Very soon she won't be able to stop him, because she will be him.

    Also she makes some quite terrifying statements, for instance "Don't you dare die with me." NOT "Don't you dare die". For her the Doctor can die later, but he must stay alive now because he "owes" her. No wonder the Doctor puts his head on the TARDIS console in despair. He's beginning to see that Clara has changed beyond all recognition and not for the better.

    Previous Who companions have left because they either found somebody they preferred to the Doctor (Jo, Leela), or they got fed up (Tegan), or they left on their own terms (Liz, Romana, Nyssa, Martha), or they were forced to leave by external events (Jamie, Zoe, Sarah Jane, Rose, Donna, Amy) or they died (Adric, River) but is very rare indeed for the Doctor to leave somebody behind for their own good. The only one I can think of is Susan Foreman. But that wasn't quite the same, as the Doctor knew that Susan wanted firm roots and that she was in love with David Campbell.

    This time I wonder if we will be working towards the Doctor actually forcing Clara out of the TARDIS and making her leave against her will. That would be an interesting and different way for a companion to go I think.

    Edit - Or here's another idea. If Clara is so desperate to become the Doctor, then what about using the unused (on TV) story arc planned for Ace in the 1980s and send her to Gallifrey to train to be a Time Lord. Missy knows the location of Gallifrey, perhaps she could be prevailed upon to get Clara there. Then perhaps the Clara seen on Gallifrey in The Name of the Doctor isn't just a splinter of Clara, she actually is Clara.

    Last edited by Blencathra; October 12th, 2015 at 01:53 AM.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Tags for this Thread

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 69
    Last Post: November 24th, 2009, 05:07 AM
  2. Replies: 0
    Last Post: August 28th, 2006, 06:21 PM
  3. U.S. Flood Insurance: Sane Budget Cuts
    By Darth Buddha in forum Off-Topic Chatter
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: February 12th, 2006, 11:29 AM
  4. why does atlantis flood?
    By Charles17 in forum General Stargate Discussion
    Replies: 21
    Last Post: September 7th, 2005, 11:40 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •