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  1. #1
    Frosty
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    Default Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    Hey all, I am not sure if this was already asked however I did search for it and it said I needed to narrow my search so it didn't work.

    Anywho, my question is this... Why would the Ancients put gates in space? We know none of them in the MWG were except for the midway gate before the midway space station was built but that was placed there by us. With that being said, why would the Ancients put gates in space, or do you think the Wraith did that? We know the people of the Pegasus galaxy relied on each other mostly for trade but in the MWG most people were under Goa'uld control and only the Goa'uld and Jaffa mostly used them. So why would they put gates in space? Sure the people weren't there when the Ancients and eventually the Wraith were but do you think the Wraith put them there for culling from their hive ships since we do know you can dial the stargate from their darts or do you think the Ancients put them there for stealth for their ships or am I missing something?

    Thanks!

  2. #2
    Chief Master Sergeant RunnerRonon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    I talked about this with a few of my friends, and we agreed it was most likely the Wraith put the gates in orbit around some of the planets they culled. This way, the humans on the planet had no means of escape, and wouldn't see the Wraith coming(someone might've been waiting by the gate on the planet until it started dialing, and had at least some time to run back to the village and warn people. It might not be much time, but significantly more than if the gate had been in orbit). Another benefit for the Wraith is that the gate is relatively safe up there, the people wouldn't be able to move the gate, nor can they bury and deactivate it.

  3. #3
    Major General sueKay's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    I think it might also have been for the Ancients to carry out experiments - to leave people free from the influence of those from other planets, such as the civilisations in The Game who seemed to have contact with the Oracle and no-one else.

    Part 2 coming very soon!! (this is a fic btw, not the Fandemonium novel)

  4. #4
    First Lieutenant Xaeden's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    I have two theories. One is the same as sueKay's which is that they did so for experimental reasons (mainly that they were trying to artificially advance human civilizations and did not want their experiments to be contaminated by outside influences). We only saw those satellites around that one planet from "The Game," but that doesn't mean they didn't once also exist around a lot of spacegate worlds before the Wraith took them out. Also, they may not have used the game to conduct all their experiments and there may have been other experiments that they wanted to keep humans from interfering with, so satellites may not have been used in all situations.

    The other is that it was a failed attempt to stop the Wraith. After the Wraith were unleashed from that one dark world, as mentioned in the pilot, they could have spent who knows how long using the gate network to attack human worlds before developing space tech. The Ancients could have then gone around trying to eradicate them, but never managed to get to all of them on all the planets they infested at once and so the Wraith managed to repopulate and spread too quickly to contain. As a result, the Ancients may have decided to try to put an end to the spread of the Wraith by moving all gates into orbit, but stopped part way through the effort because doing so spurred the development of the Wraith's first ships.

    I find the idea that the Wraith did it problematic because we've seen spacegates on worlds that they should not have had access to. Certainly it seems unlikely (albeit not impossible) that they would have been able to move the gate from the planet in "Trinity" because by all indication the reason the facility remained intact was because its defenses scared the Wraith off. Then there's the world from "Sanctuary," which was protected by an ascended being and also had a spacegate. Granted though that's a fair bit murkier because we don't know how long she has been protecting that planet for.

    None of these examples provide a smoking gun, but another issue that I have is that the placement of spacegates seems arbitrary for the Wraith's purposes. It's clearly not done to protect their non-food related resources because some of the worlds that they put structures on/land ships on have had spacegates and some have had regular gates. It's also clearly not done to completely stop humans from spreading on their own because otherwise they would have converted all gates. So why would they want to stop only some humans from moving around? Some spacegate worlds are controlled by the Wraith, some have had high human populations at times, some currently have small populations, and some have no populations. The last two could have previously been high population worlds, but are they really so lazy as to just leave the gates like that? Wouldn't it serve their interests to put the gates back on those worlds so humans can naturally repopulate them? More room to spread out = a higher population which means more food for them, so that's odd.
    Last edited by Xaeden; February 14th, 2015 at 07:46 PM.

  5. #5
    First Lieutenant McAvoy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    Maybe the Milky Way Gates did have space gates but the Goa'uld took them down since it was easier to walk through the gate then fly through it.

    Just an idea.
    Hi There!

  6. #6
    Frosty
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    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    Hey McAvoy, I don't believe that to be the case. Space gates didn't need DHD's and they had DHD's on the ground with the Stargates.... I believe it was the ancients watching other society's grow or it was the Wraith, although I believe it was the ancients because their ships had the DHD built in and they're the only ones capable of doing so, although the wraith could've as well, but I think its more reasonable for the Ancients...

  7. #7
    First Lieutenant
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    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    Quote Originally Posted by jfarrell327 View Post
    Hey McAvoy, I don't believe that to be the case. Space gates didn't need DHD's and they had DHD's on the ground with the Stargates.... I believe it was the ancients watching other society's grow or it was the Wraith, although I believe it was the ancients because their ships had the DHD built in and they're the only ones capable of doing so, although the wraith could've as well, but I think its more reasonable for the Ancients...
    I have to agree with this. We know the ancients came from their home galaxy many millions of ago to the MW where they built stargates. It's also known that Dakara was the first planet they settled on when they arrived. They built the device in the mountain sometime after seeding the galaxy with gates, and for intents and purposes created everything there was in every system with a gate. Then very soon after that came to Earth, because according to Carter the DHD and gate in Antarctica was the "oldest" in the known gate in the galaxy since the power source became deplete soon after being discovered. So that being said, the question I wanna know is when did they launch Destiny. It had to have soon after arriving in MW since their design was more archaic and basic than the MW version, and the Pegasus version seems to been the second upgrade to THAT version.

  8. #8
    Major General garhkal's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    Quote Originally Posted by sueKay View Post
    I think it might also have been for the Ancients to carry out experiments - to leave people free from the influence of those from other planets, such as the civilisations in The Game who seemed to have contact with the Oracle and no-one else.
    That is a good point. OR it might have been a method they tried to control the spread of the wraith at first.. Till they found the wraith had ships.

  9. #9
    First Lieutenant
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    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    Quote Originally Posted by sueKay View Post
    I think it might also have been for the Ancients to carry out experiments - to leave people free from the influence of those from other planets, such as the civilisations in The Game who seemed to have contact with the Oracle and no-one else.
    I agree with this thought as well, but I also think it may also have something to do with their plan for dealing with the wraith. We know from The Defiant One a 15 hr jumper trip from a space gate led to a planet that had a defensive satellite in orbit. It was never mentioned how many of those satellites actually existed, just that that was the last one that was still salvageable. Other space gates may led to other facilities on planets the ancients were conducting research on like the Arcturus project, etc.
    Last edited by Bhousden; November 27th, 2016 at 12:53 AM.

  10. #10
    First Lieutenant
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    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    Quote Originally Posted by jfarrell327 View Post
    Hey McAvoy, I don't believe that to be the case. Space gates didn't need DHD's and they had DHD's on the ground with the Stargates.... I believe it was the ancients watching other society's grow or it was the Wraith, although I believe it was the ancients because their ships had the DHD built in and they're the only ones capable of doing so, although the wraith could've as well, but I think its more reasonable for the Ancients...
    Have you forgotten that the darts had DHDs?

  11. #11

    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    Most likely the Wraith or the ancients were some cold SOBs. If you're a human walking into the stargate on your planet expecting to walk onto other planet but instead walk into space you're dead and you have no way to tell others not to come with you. The ancients would have known the gates were used and will be used by humans in the future.

    The ancients putting gates in space makes sense if they cannot be dialed from regular ground-based DHDs but I don't think that was ever suggested in either show.

  12. #12
    First Lieutenant
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    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    Quote Originally Posted by atterodevice View Post
    Most likely the Wraith or the ancients were some cold SOBs. If you're a human walking into the stargate on your planet expecting to walk onto other planet but instead walk into space you're dead and you have no way to tell others not to come with you. The ancients would have known the gates were used and will be used by humans in the future.

    The ancients putting gates in space makes sense if they cannot be dialed from regular ground-based DHDs but I don't think that was ever suggested in either show.
    How would a DHD know if a gate was in space or not? More importantly if a DHD was programmed not to dial a space gate, and it was later moved to space, i.e. the midway station, there's no way to update the DHDs on the ground to know if a gate had been moved. The correlative update program only dials the gate's address to update it's location in the galaxy. That address would be the same whether it was on the ground or in space. I don't see the wraith putting gates in space either. Mostly bc how would they move it? To our knowledge hive ships don't have a cargo bay and even if they did how would they get it in there? Also considering the fact that in Ghost in the Machine when Weir overwhelmed the jumpers system and they bumped into gate there were thrusters on the gate to correct it's orbit. A ground based gate wouldn't need those. So back to my original thought. The space gates were placed by the ancients.

  13. #13
    Major General garhkal's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    On those thrusters.. I think that all space gates have them, just to keep them in orbit...

  14. #14
    First Lieutenant
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    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    Quote Originally Posted by garhkal View Post
    On those thrusters.. I think that all space gates have them, just to keep them in orbit...
    Exactly my point, which implies they were meant for space all along meaning they were placed by the Ancients.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    Quote Originally Posted by Bhousden View Post
    How would a DHD know if a gate was in space or not? More importantly if a DHD was programmed not to dial a space gate, and it was later moved to space, i.e. the midway station, there's no way to update the DHDs on the ground to know if a gate had been moved.
    That's somewhat my point. The DHDs wouldn't know so either people walked through a stargate into cold space so why would the ancients put gates in space where that could happen to humans on various planets? Far more likely the gates were moved.

    Maybe there is something in the ground DHDs that normally prohibits locking on what was originally a space gate so only jumpers or other DHDs (like darts) could dial them. That's never brought up in the show though so I don't think that's the case.

    The correlative update program only dials the gate's address to update it's location in the galaxy. That address would be the same whether it was on the ground or in space. I don't see the wraith putting gates in space either. Mostly bc how would they move it? To our knowledge hive ships don't have a cargo bay and even if they did how would they get it in there?
    Rope. I mean, if you have advanced spaceships you have the technology to tie a gate to a couple darts or the bottom of a hive ship and fly it to space.

    Also considering the fact that in Ghost in the Machine when Weir overwhelmed the jumpers system and they bumped into gate there were thrusters on the gate to correct it's orbit. A ground based gate wouldn't need those. So back to my original thought. The space gates were placed by the ancients.
    Thrusters could have been added by the wraith. They have spaceflight.

    I'm not saying the ancients definitely did not place them in space but if they had then they did so knowing humans and other species that also use the gates could dial a space gate and walk to their deaths with no way to know the difference. That makes them real jerks.

  16. #16
    Major General garhkal's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    Maybe there is something in the ground DHDs that normally prohibits locking on what was originally a space gate so only jumpers or other DHDs (like darts) could dial them. That's never brought up in the show though so I don't think that's the case.
    I could see that. Original space gates are keyed in planetbound DHDs to not connect. Any moved out there though is buggered!!

  17. #17
    First Lieutenant
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    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    I still don't see the wraith moving a gate from the ground to space. It don't make sense to me, personally. The only reason I can see the wraith taking gates from the ground and putting them in space would be to keep the people from escaping during a culling which don't make sense considering that they dial into the gate preventing them from escaping. For me it would be have to all or none in order for the wraith to put the gates in space, but that's just me. Unless it's because of the size of particular hive alliances and they didn't have the "personnel" to dial a ground gate to keep the people from escaping.

  18. #18
    First Lieutenant Xaeden's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pegasus Galaxy Space Gates

    Quote Originally Posted by atterodevice View Post
    That's somewhat my point. The DHDs wouldn't know so either people walked through a stargate into cold space so why would the ancients put gates in space where that could happen to humans on various planets? Far more likely the gates were moved.
    But how likely is it that someone would happen onto the gate address of a spacegate? I would guess that the Ancients initially gave some humans limited lists of addresses and they were passed down through the generations. They wouldn't have much expectation that humans would accidentally stumble through a spacegate in that scenario because it's highly unlikely that a peasant pounding randomly on a DHD will happen on an address (although, it did happen once in SG-1) so as long as the Ancients were around they could either simply choose not to give spacegate addresses or they could only give out spacegate ones with warnings that it's only for advanced humans to use.

    The one way I could see it becoming a bit of a problem is if advanced humans got their hands on an Ancient database at some point after the war and went around scamming people by trading previously unknown addresses for valuables, notably spacegates. If someone is stupid enough to simply test addresses by dialing them up and confirming a connection be made with the intent to go exploring at some point after the scammers left (as opposed to smartly making a person trading an address go to that address and come back to confirm it's safe) then they could rack up a bunch of deaths before word gets out. But, that's one of those scenarios that only exists because the Ancients unexpectedly lost.

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