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  1. #1
    Chief Master Sergeant
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    Default Drones created by Destiny Descendants

    I had a theory today regarding the creation of the Drones and would like to hear your feedback.

    My belief is that the Drones were created by Destiny Descendants at some point in the previous 2000 years (more than likely in the last 200).

    The design of them reminded me a lot of both the replicators and Asgard tech. Not close enough that they were built from the same technology, but similar enough that somebody could have designed them based off “legends” past down by their ancestors.

    Eli also found them far too easy to reprogram for my liking. Now this may be because he is a genius, but even a genius would have a hard time learning a new programming language, in a completely foreign language and doing some decent amount of reprogramming in it. Shown numerous times with Carter in SG1 that could not magically reprogram alien tech until she learned more about it; once she learned a bit about it she could work with it fairly well. This suggests to me that Eli at the least found the structure of the programming language familiar to pick up on key concepts or is a genius beyond even Carter.

    I could not find any screen caps to compare the written languages, but this may have been written in some cypher to make it harder for other Descendants to reprogram. They may have created the cypher code as 1 colony was at war with another or some other reason.

    I believe they made the drones due to what they perceived as a large threat. This may have been another colony of Descendants/Civil War or even a military threat from the Ursini.

    When faced with this threat they were suffering defeat after defeat until one of their scientists remembered the old stories that were learned of self-sustaining machines that could adapt to threats and almost wiped out their ancestors’ home galaxy. The scientist headed a secret mission on one of the colonies to create and launch the drones.

    At some point they lost control of these devices until Destiny once again appeared.

  2. #2
    Second Lieutenant zer0_1's Avatar
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    Default Re: Drones created by Destiny Descendants

    sounds like a good theory, i like the "eli knowing the programming" bit, made a lot of sense

    but what about the settlement not knowing about the drones when they arrive? or the Pittsburgh planet, they were decimated by the drones weren't they?

    unless the drones were created by futurans to aid in the war against the tenarans

  3. #3
    Captain Quadhelix's Avatar
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    Default Re: Drones created by Destiny Descendants

    The idea that the drones were created by the descendants of Destiny's crew raises a particular paradox/problem.

    When Destiny sent the crew back 2000 years, Destiny itself was sent back several hours, preventing the events that sent the crew back 2000 years. This suggests that in the original timeline, there were no descendants running around out there: those descendants were created by the Destiny crew's failed attempt to get home.

    However, the timelines leading up to that failed attempt seem effectively identical, save for the presence of the nearly destroyed Destiny and older Rush (e.g., Rush's and Young's conversation about "10+2"), which would likely suggest that "original Destiny" had also encountered the drones.

    Of course, one possibility is that, without the drones/Urisini wreckage to lure Destiny off course, Destiny's crew attempted to dial home under different circumstances, were sent back more than 2000 years and further along the ship's course. The descendants that resulted from this created the drones and erased their own history by doing so, but still exist because that's the way that time travel works in Stargate.
    "From East Middle School. Suzumiya Haruhi. I have no interest in ordinary humans. If there are any aliens, time travelers, sliders, or espers here, come join me."
    - The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya; Best Character Introduction Ever.

    "And can we lose the ten thousand year old dead plants?!"
    - Stargate: Atlantis (1x03) "Hide and Seek"

    "Hammerheads do not load/unload units immediately – they must descend to ground level first. Initial experiments involving jump-jetting infantry into the Hammerhead’s cargo compartment met with unfortunate results."
    - Command&Conquer 3: Kane's Wrath Hammerhead Unit Spotlight

  4. #4
    Staff Sergeant
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    Default Re: Drones created by Destiny Descendants

    Quote Originally Posted by Durgia View Post
    Eli also found them far too easy to reprogram for my liking. Now this may be because he is a genius, but even a genius would have a hard time learning a new programming language, in a completely foreign language and doing some decent amount of reprogramming in it. Shown numerous times with Carter in SG1 that could not magically reprogram alien tech until she learned more about it; once she learned a bit about it she could work with it fairly well. This suggests to me that Eli at the least found the structure of the programming language familiar to pick up on key concepts or is a genius beyond even Carter.
    ELI WAS the first to figure out destiny's operating system too. eli is a hacker and thusly would be able to understand machine language easily, plus the drones were not advanced tech, in comparison to destiny, and if he could figure destiny out that quick... Plus the drones were remote controlled, meaning a wireless hack was all he needed, making it simpler. I doubt those drones had avast...

  5. #5
    Second Lieutenant Energizer_Vs_ZPM's Avatar
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    Default Re: Drones created by Destiny Descendants

    Aren't we forgetting something here?

    It was clearly explained that the Novans built space ships to escape their planets volcanic activity. It was also clearly explained that they didn't have FTL tech and would spend a few hundred years in space.

    How then could they build drones and drone command ships that could blockade the stars destiny needs to recharge from? - They don't even have FTL tech yet alone hyperspace tech so how do you suppose they built the drones?

    As for Eli, I suspect he managed to translate the code to binary or hex from it's alien language and then assess it from there. Kind of like decompiling a windows .exe - you don't know what it was written in but you can pick bits out to see what its doing.

  6. #6
    Chief Master Sergeant
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    Default Re: Drones created by Destiny Descendants

    Quote Originally Posted by zer0_1 View Post
    sounds like a good theory, i like the "eli knowing the programming" bit, made a lot of sense

    but what about the settlement not knowing about the drones when they arrive? or the Pittsburgh planet, they were decimated by the drones weren't they?

    unless the drones were created by futurans to aid in the war against the tenarans
    It would have been a top secret project so only a very few would have known about it. Once the Descendants lost control of the devices they could have wiped out any number of colonies.

    Quote Originally Posted by Quadhelix View Post
    The idea that the drones were created by the descendants of Destiny's crew raises a particular paradox/problem.

    When Destiny sent the crew back 2000 years, Destiny itself was sent back several hours, preventing the events that sent the crew back 2000 years. This suggests that in the original timeline, there were no descendants running around out there: those descendants were created by the Destiny crew's failed attempt to get home.

    However, the timelines leading up to that failed attempt seem effectively identical, save for the presence of the nearly destroyed Destiny and older Rush (e.g., Rush's and Young's conversation about "10+2"), which would likely suggest that "original Destiny" had also encountered the drones.

    Of course, one possibility is that, without the drones/Urisini wreckage to lure Destiny off course, Destiny's crew attempted to dial home under different circumstances, were sent back more than 2000 years and further along the ship's course. The descendants that resulted from this created the drones and erased their own history by doing so, but still exist because that's the way that time travel works in Stargate.
    The time paradox is one of the best things about the theory. It is a self fulfilling loop. The drones were part of the cause of the time travel and without them it would never have existed.

    Quote Originally Posted by jeremyadamson View Post
    ELI WAS the first to figure out destiny's operating system too. eli is a hacker and thusly would be able to understand machine language easily, plus the drones were not advanced tech, in comparison to destiny, and if he could figure destiny out that quick... Plus the drones were remote controlled, meaning a wireless hack was all he needed, making it simpler. I doubt those drones had avast...
    It was explained in the first episode that Eli learned the "game" language was intentionally created the same or similar to Ancient. Eli was already familiar with the basics of the language before he was brought into the project which can explain his speed at understanding Destiny code.

    Quote Originally Posted by Energizer_Vs_ZPM View Post
    It was clearly explained that the Novans built space ships to escape their planets volcanic activity. It was also clearly explained that they didn't have FTL tech and would spend a few hundred years in space.

    How then could they build drones and drone command ships that could blockade the stars destiny needs to recharge from? - They don't even have FTL tech yet alone hyperspace tech so how do you suppose they built the drones?
    That is one major hole in the theory I have been working on. I have a few points but nothing conclusive.

    - I cannot recall ever seeing the drones enter FTL or Hyperspace, they must move around somehow but we don't know how or how fast they can.

    -It is possible the drones were upgraded by another race and so they could be used on the Descendants

    -It is possible that the colony where the Drones were built was also experimenting with other technologies such as FTL travel. They could have developed some form of FTL that required specialized shielding for biological life forms to survive so they could only send Drones using it to fight the war until they developed the shielding or a different method, which they never did.

  7. #7
    Captain Quadhelix's Avatar
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    Default Re: Drones created by Destiny Descendants

    Quote Originally Posted by Durgia View Post
    The time paradox is one of the best things about the theory. It is a self fulfilling loop. The drones were part of the cause of the time travel and without them it would never have existed.
    Except that it quite clearly isn't a self-fulfilling loop: when they tried to go home, Destiny got sent back in time, stopping them from trying to go home. It's not a closed loop.



    Quote Originally Posted by Durgia View Post
    That is one major hole in the theory I have been working on. I have a few points but nothing conclusive.

    - I cannot recall ever seeing the drones enter FTL or Hyperspace, they must move around somehow but we don't know how or how fast they can.

    -It is possible the drones were upgraded by another race and so they could be used on the Descendants

    -It is possible that the colony where the Drones were built was also experimenting with other technologies such as FTL travel. They could have developed some form of FTL that required specialized shielding for biological life forms to survive so they could only send Drones using it to fight the war until they developed the shielding or a different method, which they never did.
    One possibility is that, when the drones encountered the hyperspace-capable Ursini, they assimilated the technology into their design.

    Of course, if the drones were so much more primitive than the Ursini, that raises the question of how they beat them, let alone how the Drones managed to pose a threat to Destiny.
    "From East Middle School. Suzumiya Haruhi. I have no interest in ordinary humans. If there are any aliens, time travelers, sliders, or espers here, come join me."
    - The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya; Best Character Introduction Ever.

    "And can we lose the ten thousand year old dead plants?!"
    - Stargate: Atlantis (1x03) "Hide and Seek"

    "Hammerheads do not load/unload units immediately – they must descend to ground level first. Initial experiments involving jump-jetting infantry into the Hammerhead’s cargo compartment met with unfortunate results."
    - Command&Conquer 3: Kane's Wrath Hammerhead Unit Spotlight

  8. #8
    Second Lieutenant Energizer_Vs_ZPM's Avatar
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    Default Re: Drones created by Destiny Descendants

    Quote Originally Posted by Quadhelix View Post
    One possibility is that, when the drones encountered the hyperspace-capable Ursini, they assimilated the technology into their design.
    We're not talking the borg here..

    If the Novans did create the drones, then the odds are that if they have no FTL tech, they're not yet able to create AI that can modify itself either. Additionally if the Ursini are capable of interstellar travel, then the drones would be no match for them based on Novan tech.

    I suspect we were going to see more of the drones and their creators had the show continued but I guess now we won't know for a long time if ever at all.

  9. #9
    Major General
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    Default Re: Drones created by Destiny Descendants

    I could have sworn we saw a drone mother ship come in out of FTL/hyperspace in s2 ep 11..?

  10. #10
    Staff Sergeant
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    Default Re: Drones created by Destiny Descendants

    Thy mentioned several times during battles with the drones they had incoming command ships dropping out of hyperspace.
    The Ursini were beat by shear numbers, as far as anyone knows the drones are built by an automated system, The Ursini told Telford that the creators of the Drones had died out long before They had even ran in to the drones.
    Now for hacking the drone, they plugged the drone in to destiny's systems, anbd used Destiny's computers to decode the programming language.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Drones created by Destiny Descendants

    Interesting theory, but if it were true the Ursini certainly would've recognized humans as their enemy—the creators of the drones (who as mentioned were also said to have died out)—but they clearly did not see humans as their original adversaries.
    And yes, the drones & command ships clearly have some type of faster-than-light speed travel technology, certainly beyond the tech of the Novans. The descendants were also clearly unfamiliar with the drones and totally surprised by their appearance, and given their detailed knowledge of their history it is clear that they didn't create the drones.


    In regards to Eli vs Carter (or McKay)... Eli was portrayed as a genius in the sense that his abilities in specific areas were extreme and innate to a certain degree. Geniuses don't really know how they do what they do, nor can they generally explain the process at all (unless that IS part or their genius); it happens largely at a subconscious level. They also tend to be unbalanced and lacking in other areas—although not to the level of savants, and certainly not universally. But this is what we see with Eli at least to some extent.
    Now, in regards to Carter (and even McKay to a certain degree). Carter is brilliant and exceptionally intelligent & gifted, but she was portrayed as someone who first of all worked hard to get to where she was & learn what she knew. She was much more able to understand and explain how she did what she did and all the steps involved. We see her have moments of inspiration, but we also see her struggling and failing and working very hard along the way. Carter is also portrayed as quite a well-rounded person. She is a formidable soldier, she is strong, fit, a great strategist and well-trained in combat and battle, plus she is a great leader and commander, as well as a true team player. She also has a very broad range of knowledge and skills not only in many areas of science but also the humanities and the arts, as well as in spirituality. Carter is the whole package!
    McKay does exhibit some aspects of a genius, but I still see even him much more as a highly gifted individual (who is also very spoiled and conceited) who also received inspiration from time to time; but he also had to work very hard and struggled often, and made many mistakes and poor judgements.

    Eli on the other hand, while aware of his shortcomings and faults, was confident but not arrogant with his areas of expertise/genius. He certainly struggled, but mainly with the things or aspects of things that fell outside of his genius.

    I would argue however, that reprogramming that drone was not exactly something that had been portrayed as his forte—which was essentially math and calculations, as well as formulas and algorithms (maybe slightly less so though). And while programming involves those things, and they also portrayed him as very smart in general and a quick study, it seemed a stretch that he was able to pull that off like that. But I think that

    Basically, I contend that ultimately Eli is a genius and probably the best thing in the stargate program in regards to his areas of expertise (math & calculations at least). But I would say that all around Carter is the superior and the best thing in the SGC—she's got it all!




    Now Chloë, what those aliens did to her was something along the lines of giving her almost savant-like abilities.

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