Page 2 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 83
  1. #21

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    Quote Originally Posted by techs View Post

    Fanboys are science fictions biggest enemy. Accepting mediocre programming and defending it as good scifi lowers the bar for everyone.
    Hmm, I guess my response to that barb is supposed to be, "Ouch!", I think...

    But it will not be.

    I gave SGU a chance for two long seasons; it wound up letting me down during most of S1, but I stuck with it through S2, and was pleasantly surprised. Again, I still *gave it a chance*.

    I will also give Defiance a chance, as well. I am not absolutely 'wowed' by it so far this season, but it does just enough to be keep intrigued as to where the plotlines could be heading-- especially after revealing a very dark past between Nikky and her 'daughter', the lady doctor.

    Just keep the lemming-fanboy talk to yourself until Defiance actually totally FLOPS, after which we will all have a proper post mortem on SyFy’s latest production victim

  2. #22
    Lieutenant Colonel
    Member Since
    Jan 2007
    Location
    gone...
    Posts
    4,787

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    Quote Originally Posted by medegno51 View Post
    Hmm, I guess my response to that barb is supposed to be, "Ouch!", I think...

    But it will not be.

    I gave SGU a chance for two long seasons; it wound up letting me down during most of S1, but I stuck with it through S2, and was pleasantly surprised. Again, I still *gave it a chance*.

    I will also give Defiance a chance, as well. I am not absolutely 'wowed' by it so far this season, but it does just enough to be keep intrigued as to where the plotlines could be heading-- especially after revealing a very dark past between Nikky and her 'daughter', the lady doctor.

    Just keep the lemming-fanboy talk to yourself until Defiance actually totally FLOPS, after which we will all have a proper post mortem on SyFy’s latest production victim
    Agreed. Don't start cooking the pow until its dead.

    I however disagree with techs, fanboys keep franchises going and they exist in just about EVERY scifi show that has ever existed. Would you call someone who likes star trek a fan boy? Probably but it was their fanboyishness that allowed those shows to keep going.

    Defiance is a once in a lifetime thing, its scifi and one of the richest shows from the get go yet people still want to complain about it not being firefly or stargate. And despite all their complaints Defiance is and always will be TRANSMEDIA. Go they better get used to it, because other shows will follow suit.

  3. #23
    Chief Master Sergeant
    Member Since
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    158

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    I just saw online that an episode of Defiance costs Syfy 2.5 million dollars. An episode of
    Sanctuary cost Syfy 1 million dollars. Yet, they both have about the same viewership. Scary.

    Oh, it cost Syfy about 2 million dollars an episode for SGU.

  4. #24
    Caffeinated Teacher Nolamom's Avatar
    Member Since
    May 2004
    Location
    Toll Booth - Home of the Tollans
    Posts
    14,085

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    maybe they will and maybe they won't. If the transmedia thing is found to be wanting, why would other shows follow that formula? It's a test. Sometimes products pass the test and become successful, other times they fail the test and are cast on the junk heap. How many people are buying the product, are satisfied with the product, and become repeat customers? We've all seen products introduced that didn't make it. Often introduced with a great deal of fanfare, lots of money invested, and so forth. That doesn't make it a good product. Sometimes the product can be improved and then becomes successful.

    That's where Defiance is at the moment in my opinion. It's a new product that has been introduced and could stand some improvement if it is to become a complete success.

  5. #25
    Colonel RealmOfX's Avatar
    Member Since
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Seeking a new reality!
    Posts
    7,640

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    Quote Originally Posted by techs View Post
    I just saw online that an episode of Defiance costs Syfy 2.5 million dollars. An episode of
    Sanctuary cost Syfy 1 million dollars. Yet, they both have about the same viewership. Scary.

    Oh, it cost Syfy about 2 million dollars an episode for SGU.
    Syfy did not make Sanctuary and it cost the producers My Plastic Badger (Kindler, Tapping & Wood) over $1.6 million per ep in the first season and just under $2 million in the last seasons. SGU cost more than $2 mil, probably somewhere between $2.4 mil and $3 mil (based on reports that Sanctuary had a budget 2/3 of theirs).
    -

  6. #26
    Chief Master Sergeant
    Member Since
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    158

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    Quote Originally Posted by RealmOfX View Post
    Syfy did not make Sanctuary and it cost the producers My Plastic Badger (Kindler, Tapping & Wood) over $1.6 million per ep in the first season and just under $2 million in the last seasons. SGU cost more than $2 mil, probably somewhere between $2.4 mil and $3 mil (based on reports that Sanctuary had a budget 2/3 of theirs).
    Actually it cost the producers about 1.44 million US dollars since the US dollar was worth about 10 percent more at the time. Syfy only paid the makers of Sanctuary about 1 million dollars to air the first season episodes with the remainder of the costs for the studio expected to be made up in DVD sales and airing rights to be sold to other countries.

  7. #27
    Colonel RealmOfX's Avatar
    Member Since
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Seeking a new reality!
    Posts
    7,640

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    Quote Originally Posted by techs View Post
    Actually it cost the producers about 1.44 million US dollars since the US dollar was worth about 10 percent more at the time. Syfy only paid the makers of Sanctuary about 1 million dollars to air the first season episodes with the remainder of the costs for the studio expected to be made up in DVD sales and airing rights to be sold to other countries.
    No, it cost over $1.6 mil. When the first season was being produced the Canadian / US exchange rate was between 0.99 and 1.01, no need to devalue there.

    Making comparisons between production costs and licensing fees isn't really sensible, there are too many different variables involved. By the way where did you get the info about Sanctuary's licensing fee? (I'm not asking to be mean and go "prove it" but because I am genuinely interested in finding sources for this type of info) Generally Syfy is not in the habit of making public those kind of details.

    While we're at it, where did you see the info on how much Defiance costs per ep because I have seen different info on Adweek where they said that Syfy confirmed that the Defiance series portion of the total $105 mil was $40 mil.
    -

  8. #28
    Lieutenant Colonel
    Member Since
    Jan 2007
    Location
    gone...
    Posts
    4,787

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nolamom View Post
    maybe they will and maybe they won't. If the transmedia thing is found to be wanting, why would other shows follow that formula? It's a test. Sometimes products pass the test and become successful, other times they fail the test and are cast on the junk heap. How many people are buying the product, are satisfied with the product, and become repeat customers? We've all seen products introduced that didn't make it. Often introduced with a great deal of fanfare, lots of money invested, and so forth. That doesn't make it a good product. Sometimes the product can be improved and then becomes successful.

    That's where Defiance is at the moment in my opinion. It's a new product that has been introduced and could stand some improvement if it is to become a complete success.
    Defiance is the first transmedia on this scale. Many shows have had online information for them and others have spawned books, games, trading cards etc. Its not a new thing, its just the next step. And it has been noted that many of these other media do gather quite a following (even ones that are not canon) and so a sci-fi show that refuses to embrace that will die.

  9. #29
    Caffeinated Teacher Nolamom's Avatar
    Member Since
    May 2004
    Location
    Toll Booth - Home of the Tollans
    Posts
    14,085

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    Heck, I could get a Munsters lunchbox back in the 60s. Just because a show spawns books, games, etc. does not make it transmedia. It's marketing. Product licensing fees can be a significant source of revenue. However, the shows themselves were never dependent on outside "stuff" to fill in the blanks as it were. No, this is the first show that I can recall that initiated with a tie-in that was required of the viewer if they wanted the entire program. Not the same thing as after-the-fact generation of additional products. Yes, there have been movies made from video games (Tomb Raider for example), I've even read books based on games, but those are not dependent on the audience actually having played the game or even be familiar with it. I just think that Defiance is not giving the whole story on the screen, but hoping that the audience will jump to their bidding by exploring other content. Hopefully even purchasing their game. Is it a 43 minute weekly infomercial for their gaming product, or is it scripted entertainment?

  10. #30
    Lieutenant Colonel
    Member Since
    Jan 2007
    Location
    gone...
    Posts
    4,787

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nolamom View Post
    Heck, I could get a Munsters lunchbox back in the 60s. Just because a show spawns books, games, etc. does not make it transmedia. It's marketing. Product licensing fees can be a significant source of revenue. However, the shows themselves were never dependent on outside "stuff" to fill in the blanks as it were. No, this is the first show that I can recall that initiated with a tie-in that was required of the viewer if they wanted the entire program. Not the same thing as after-the-fact generation of additional products. Yes, there have been movies made from video games (Tomb Raider for example), I've even read books based on games, but those are not dependent on the audience actually having played the game or even be familiar with it. I just think that Defiance is not giving the whole story on the screen, but hoping that the audience will jump to their bidding by exploring other content. Hopefully even purchasing their game. Is it a 43 minute weekly infomercial for their gaming product, or is it scripted entertainment?
    Yes but you could say that many books, games etc fill in the gaps, JM's blog for example.

    <Snipped by Moderator>
    Last edited by Bagpuss; June 27th, 2013 at 08:05 AM.

  11. #31
    Caffeinated Teacher Nolamom's Avatar
    Member Since
    May 2004
    Location
    Toll Booth - Home of the Tollans
    Posts
    14,085

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    You have missed the point. Books etc, may add to the story AFTER THE FACT if viewers are inclined to pursue them. JM's blog is an excellent example. There is nothing in his blog, nor has there ever been, that is necessary to the enjoyment of the show. More that 99% of viewers have never read it, nor even heard of it.

    Using one's brain has nothing to do with it. There are many thought-provoking shows that require a great deal of brain usage. Take Doctor Who for example. You have to watch very closely and make connections - somewhat like Easter eggs - to upcoming stories. You do not, however, have to go anywhere else BUT the show for the information.

    Several times folks here have pointed out that it is not the idea of a transmedia program that is problematic. It is the concept that the casual viewer is not going to enjoy the show and will therefore tune out. This is not good for SciFi as a network. You apparently think that if someone disagrees with you that they are complaining. Please learn the difference between honest critique and complaining, <Snipped by Moderator>
    Last edited by Bagpuss; June 27th, 2013 at 08:47 AM.

  12. #32
    Staff Sergeant Lt.UrsulaKenmore's Avatar
    Member Since
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Washington, USA
    Posts
    95

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    Quote Originally Posted by medegno51 View Post
    I will also give Defiance a chance, as well. I am not absolutely 'wowed' by it so far this season, but it does just enough to be keep intrigued as to where the plotlines could be heading-- especially after revealing a very dark past between Nikky and her 'daughter', the lady doctor.
    Where did you get the idea that Doc Yewll is Nikky's daughter? If anything the SGU-guest star episode would put it more likely that it was the Doc who 'created' Nikky.

    Anyways, I'm not minding Defiance and for all the numbers games going on here, I would also point out that at this same slot are alot of other shows that do not repeat their line-up the way Syfy does. After Warehouse airs, Defiance repeats itself right after at 11 pm. Some people, like me, who have other shows they like and do not have tivo or anything like that, watch the non-repeating shows then tune into the repeat of Defiance. Where are those numbers?

    As for poorly made or poorly written, there have also been alot of things said by Stargate fans on Gateworld about the quality of writing and production towards the end of both SG1 and SGA, let alone the movies. I actually like Defiance. I do agree that no one is really likeable. I think Amanda's prejudicial against Votan (although she tries to cover it up), Nolan as soon as either of the women he's either screwing or wants to screw (Kenya or Amanda) are suspected of anything forgets completely that he's supposed to uphold the law and instead covers his booty-call's butt, leaving Tommy to be the only one who's actually doing any lawkeeping. I liked Sukar, but he got nixed. And, yes, the Romeo and Juliet (I mean Alak and Christie) thing could jump off a cliff and I wouldn't care. However, the same flaws can be said of all sci-fi shows; some things you like and some you don't. Personally Nolan could be less the macho bullying dude and be more non-cliche, but I'm not one of the writers.

    I think what the S1 problem here is is establishing everything about the world of Defiance. Now that might be done with the help of the game, but not everyone has a gaming system to play the game let alone the want or will or finances to buy it and play the way it's supposed to be played thus the info. does have to be included in the show. And there is a lot of ground work to lay down. I'm hopeful for S2 (another thirteen episodes) so that we can see less explaining everything in these really simple ways because a bunch of storylines are interlaced together and get more to the good stuff.

  13. #33
    Colonel Gatefan1976's Avatar
    Member Since
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Smashing skulls!!
    Posts
    5,097

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lt.UrsulaKenmore View Post
    Anyways, I'm not minding Defiance and for all the numbers games going on here, I would also point out that at this same slot are alot of other shows that do not repeat their line-up the way Syfy does. After Warehouse airs, Defiance repeats itself right after at 11 pm. Some people, like me, who have other shows they like and do not have tivo or anything like that, watch the non-repeating shows then tune into the repeat of Defiance. Where are those numbers?
    Everyone is pretty much using the numbers from "TVbytheNumbers", which only show the top 100 shows, the repeat of defiance does not rate in that anymore. It did for the first few episodes however. The lowest one I saw (for this week) was .755 for "real housewives" so somewhere under there are the numbers for the Defiance replay. Personally I would be curious about the L+7 numbers, but I dunno if anyone on here has access to that info.
    ALL THANKS TO THE WONDERFUL CREATOR OF THIS SIG GO TO R.I.G.
    A lie is just a truth that hasn't gone through conversion therapy yet
    The truth isn't the truth

  14. #34

    Talking Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    [QUOTE=Lt.UrsulaKenmore;13868167]Where did you get the idea that Doc Yewll is Nikky's daughter? QUOTE]

    ==slaps head== Re-watched "If I ever Leave..." again last night WITH the CC *on* this time. Nikky said "Doctor" instead of 'daughter'...

    Thanks for the correction!

  15. #35
    Colonel RealmOfX's Avatar
    Member Since
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Seeking a new reality!
    Posts
    7,640

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lt.UrsulaKenmore View Post
    Anyways, I'm not minding Defiance and for all the numbers games going on here, I would also point out that at this same slot are alot of other shows that do not repeat their line-up the way Syfy does. After Warehouse airs, Defiance repeats itself right after at 11 pm. Some people, like me, who have other shows they like and do not have tivo or anything like that, watch the non-repeating shows then tune into the repeat of Defiance. Where are those numbers?
    Here's the 11pm numbers that were published on TVByTheNumbers :
    Date.......11PM Total...A18-49
    ...........Viewers
    15-Apr-13..1,274,000....0.4
    22-Apr-13
    29-Apr-13..1,069,000....0.4
    06-May-13....920,000....0.3


    Quote Originally Posted by Gatefan1976 View Post
    Everyone is pretty much using the numbers from "TVbytheNumbers", which only show the top 100 shows, the repeat of defiance does not rate in that anymore. It did for the first few episodes however. The lowest one I saw (for this week) was .755 for "real housewives" so somewhere under there are the numbers for the Defiance replay. Personally I would be curious about the L+7 numbers, but I dunno if anyone on here has access to that info.
    ... oh Briangate!!!
    -

  16. #36
    Colonel Gatefan1976's Avatar
    Member Since
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Smashing skulls!!
    Posts
    5,097

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    Quote Originally Posted by RealmOfX View Post
    ... oh Briangate!!!
    Brian does not comment on this stuff anymore
    ALL THANKS TO THE WONDERFUL CREATOR OF THIS SIG GO TO R.I.G.
    A lie is just a truth that hasn't gone through conversion therapy yet
    The truth isn't the truth

  17. #37
    Colonel RealmOfX's Avatar
    Member Since
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Seeking a new reality!
    Posts
    7,640

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gatefan1976 View Post
    Brian does not comment on this stuff anymore
    bugger
    -

  18. #38
    Colonel Gatefan1976's Avatar
    Member Since
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Smashing skulls!!
    Posts
    5,097

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    Quote Originally Posted by RealmOfX View Post
    bugger
    There.............was............another..........

    A lass, I cannot remember her name offhand, but she gave us L+7 numbers back in the SGU debate days. Unfortunately, she seems to have left as well.
    ALL THANKS TO THE WONDERFUL CREATOR OF THIS SIG GO TO R.I.G.
    A lie is just a truth that hasn't gone through conversion therapy yet
    The truth isn't the truth

  19. #39
    Colonel RealmOfX's Avatar
    Member Since
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Seeking a new reality!
    Posts
    7,640

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gatefan1976 View Post
    There.............was............another..........

    A lass, I cannot remember her name offhand, but she gave us L+7 numbers back in the SGU debate days. Unfortunately, she seems to have left as well.
    Yeah MediaSavant, she hasn't been around the forum for ages.

    It's a lot tougher to get ratings data since Nielsen put the screws to reporters about copyright.
    -

  20. #40
    Chief Master Sergeant
    Member Since
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    158

    Default Re: Is Defiance a major flop for Syfy?

    The normal ratings that tvbythenumbers posts are live+same day. So they are including the 11 pm showing.

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 526
    Last Post: November 1st, 2015, 03:53 PM
  2. Major Davis vs Major Lorne vs Major Marks
    By fugiman in forum General Stargate Discussion
    Replies: 179
    Last Post: February 26th, 2011, 07:08 PM
  3. SyFy Portal: 2007 SyFy Genre Awards - Nominations Open
    By morjana in forum General Sci-Fi and Fantasy
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: May 6th, 2007, 07:39 PM
  4. SyFy Portal: 2007 SyFy Genre Awards - Nominations Open
    By morjana in forum Stargate Fandom
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: May 6th, 2007, 07:33 PM
  5. SG1/SGA - SyFy Portal: 2006 SyFy Genre Awards Nominations
    By morjana in forum SG-1 News (Archive)
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: June 20th, 2006, 06:16 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •