Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

who would have won the battle, Renly or Stannis?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    #16
    Slimjim,

    Robb doesn't want Westeros. Just the North and the Riverlands.

    ETA

    Sorry you obviously ment Joffery.
    Last edited by Ser Scot A Ellison; 04 May 2012, 12:45 PM.
    All plot and no character makes for a dull story... All plot and no character makes for a dull story... All plot and no character makes for a dull story... All plot and no character makes for a dull story...

    "Scott isn't out. Actually, he'll probably soon get back in, then out, then in, then out, then in, with rhythm and stamina." reddevil 4/22/2010

    Comment


      #17
      Originally posted by slimjim View Post
      I don't care about that even slightly

      where directly told by Renly (and before you say he'd bias, Ned didn't disagree) that he's just a good military commander

      what Renly has going for him is he's not an insane teenage boy, his army isn't made up of Dothraki or wildlings and he's not just a good military commander like his brother (having set on the king's council), in other words he's the best of a bad lot
      Don't be so racist about Dothraki and Wildlings. The Dothraki are awesome warriors, and would put many knights to shame. Jorah Mormont wouldn't have stood a chance vs a Dothraki if they were both mounted. The Wildings are exactly the same as northerners, just born on the other side of the Wall. The Night's Watch shouldn't be concerned about them, the Wall has nothing to do with them.

      Stannis also sat on his brother's small council, as master of ships. He is very capable as a leader, probably the most honourable king too. He's tough, but fair. He doesn't go out of the way to make people like him however, which means most of the realm simply doesn't like him. If he were made king, I could see a fairly large % of the realm end up taking the black, which to be fair would probably be a few good thing with the others resurfacing.

      Comment


        #18
        Originally posted by HoloRob View Post
        Don't be so racist about Dothraki and Wildlings. The Dothraki are awesome warriors, and would put many knights to shame. Jorah Mormont wouldn't have stood a chance vs a Dothraki if they were both mounted. The Wildings are exactly the same as northerners, just born on the other side of the Wall. The Night's Watch shouldn't be concerned about them, the Wall has nothing to do with them.
        the Dothraki are good fighters but nothing else, they know so little about politics that they have to be told like children not to steel from people helping them.
        the distinction between wildlings and northerners may have started out as an arbitrary one but has since as a result of it's self become meaningful owing to the fact that it meant wildlings where cut of from the rest of civilization where the northerners where not

        Originally posted by HoloRob View Post
        Stannis also sat on his brother's small council, as master of ships. He is very capable as a leader, probably the most honourable king too. He's tough, but fair. He doesn't go out of the way to make people like him however, which means most of the realm simply doesn't like him. If he were made king, I could see a fairly large % of the realm end up taking the black, which to be fair would probably be a few good thing with the others resurfacing.
        I'd be more inclined to believe that if Ned's objection to Renly putting himself forward had been "your brother is a better king" not "your brother is a better solider"

        Comment


          #19
          Originally posted by HoloRob View Post
          Don't be so racist about Dothraki and Wildlings. The Dothraki are awesome warriors, and would put many knights to shame. Jorah Mormont wouldn't have stood a chance vs a Dothraki if they were both mounted.
          Even if Jorah would have lost in single combat on horseback (and that's highly debatable) it doesn't matter. Skill in single combat does not win battles or wars, the ability for a force to fight as a disciplined unit, and the ability of the commander to make use of that unit effectively is what decides victory in battle. And frankly while the Drothraki are savage warriors, if they came up against a combined arms Westerosi force lead by a good commander, they'd be beaten, badly.

          The Drothraki may be loosely based on the Mongols, but they possess none of the advantages that made the Mongols such an effective fighting force. Unlike the Mongols they are undisciplined, tribal, lightly armed and armoured, lack heavy cavalry, engineers, siege weapons and levies.

          The Wildings are exactly the same as northerners, just born on the other side of the Wall. The Night's Watch shouldn't be concerned about them, the Wall has nothing to do with them.
          Ok firstly the Nightswatch has a hell of a lot to worry about from the wildings, since Mance Rayder has put together a force of 100,000 with the intention of marching south.

          Secondly, again the wildlings may be fierce and savage warriors, but they are also tribal and undisciplined. They don't even have steel weapons or armour, and their primary advantage over the Nightswatch is that they outnumber them massively. Again if they met a Westerosi force of equal number in open battle, they'd be smashed to pieces.

          Comment


            #20
            Robert was a horrible King.
            All plot and no character makes for a dull story... All plot and no character makes for a dull story... All plot and no character makes for a dull story... All plot and no character makes for a dull story...

            "Scott isn't out. Actually, he'll probably soon get back in, then out, then in, then out, then in, with rhythm and stamina." reddevil 4/22/2010

            Comment


              #21
              Originally posted by slimjim View Post
              I don't care about that even slightly
              Some of the nobles of westeros disagree, but this is a minor point anyway.

              Originally posted by slimjim View Post
              where directly told by Renly (and before you say he'd bias, Ned didn't disagree) that he's just a good military commander
              Which is still more than anyone would say of Renly.

              Originally posted by slimjim View Post
              what Renly has going for him is he's not an insane teenage boy
              Agreed, but neither is Stannis or anyone else opposing Joffrey.

              Originally posted by slimjim View Post
              his army isn't made up of Dothraki or wildlings
              Again this is true for all current contenders for the throne of westeros. Daenerys isn't part of the current war and Mance Rayder doesn't give a damn about who sits on the iron throne. So what's your point in bringing this up as a plus for Renly ?

              Originally posted by slimjim View Post
              he's not just a good military commander like his brother (having set on the king's council), in other words he's the best of a bad lot
              You do realize that Stannis sat on the small council, too, right ?

              So Stannis is an accomplished soldier, has at least as much experience on the council as his brother (and given his age probably more) and actually seems to know what he is doing, while Renly just plays at war and thinks being popular makes him a good king. Any other arguments why Renly would be the better king ?

              Comment


                #22
                Originally posted by Selina View Post
                Which is still more than anyone would say of Renly.
                if that was true ned would have said


                Originally posted by Selina View Post
                Agreed, but neither is Stannis or anyone else opposing Joffrey.
                each of the things I listed where intended to mark Renly out as a good king taken all together not separately

                Originally posted by Selina View Post
                Again this is true for all current contenders for the throne of westeros. Daenerys isn't part of the current war and Mance Rayder doesn't give a damn about who sits on the iron throne. So what's your point in bringing this up as a plus for Renly ?
                Daenerys is contender from the audience's perspective and I'm talking about who I want to be king



                Originally posted by Selina View Post
                You do realize that Stannis sat on the small council, too, right ?
                I don't think we've ever bee told that

                Originally posted by Selina View Post
                So Stannis is an accomplished soldier, has at least as much experience on the council as his brother (and given his age probably more) and actually seems to know what he is doing, while Renly just plays at war and thinks being popular makes him a good king. Any other arguments why Renly would be the better king ?
                even if stannis sat on the small council his brother's comment implies it didn't prepare him for kingship very well

                Comment


                  #23
                  Just to clarify: During Robert's reign, Stannis sat on the council as Master of Ships while Renly sat on the council as Master of Laws.

                  Renly doesn't have the kind of battle experience Stannis does. But he understands people better. Stannis would be good at winning the throne while Renly would've been better at keeping the throne.
                  sigpic

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Originally posted by slimjim View Post
                    I don't think we've ever bee told that
                    http://viewers-guide.hbo.com/game-of...nis-baratheon/

                    When you go to HBO's viewer guide, it explains it under Stannis's profile. One of those pesky things that you would generally refuse to believe, since you didn't catch it in the shows. Except that it's specifically there to help keep viewers properly informed about the characters in the series.

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Stannis was on the Small Council. Who disputes that?
                      All plot and no character makes for a dull story... All plot and no character makes for a dull story... All plot and no character makes for a dull story... All plot and no character makes for a dull story...

                      "Scott isn't out. Actually, he'll probably soon get back in, then out, then in, then out, then in, with rhythm and stamina." reddevil 4/22/2010

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Originally posted by Ser Scot A Ellison View Post
                        Stannis was on the Small Council. Who disputes that?
                        Certainly not those of us who know his backstory.
                        sigpic

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Stannis has the experience and is most probably a better military leader but often in war numbers do matter. Renly had the larger army if he was smart and didn't try to be the "hero" he should have won if they had battled. Stannis himself was worried about the larger force that Renly possessed. Stannis who is an experience warrior is worried then it is for good reason.
                          sigpic

                          Favorite quote:
                          McKay: You shot me!
                          Sheppard: Yes, Rodney, I shot you, and I said I was sorry.
                          Ronon: You shot me, too.
                          Sheppard: I’m sorry for shooting everyone!

                          Comment

                          Working...
                          X