Ultimate showdown of ultimate stargate destiny

[QueteshRuled]

watch this : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=reEbY...mbedded#at=199

now. imagine it with stargate characters (tau'ri, asgard, nox, whatever, only fighting no ships or other vehicles) who would win.

Im all for the giant out of our phase alien (if he was in our phase)

[fugiman]

The Ascended Beings

If not them then Anubis

If not Anubis then I'm going with the priors (including Adria)

If not the Priors I'm going with the Replicators (Milky Way Version)

If not them then then the Kull Warriors

If not Kull Warriors I'm going with the Wraith from the Defiant One

If not the wraith from the Defiant One then Teal'c


But really who cares about a physical ultimate showdown in stargate?

[immhotep]

Walter is the closest SG gets to fred rogers. I put my bets on him. Iris control is a mighty weapon.

[Choo1701]

now. imagine it with stargate characters (tau'ri, asgard, nox, whatever, only fighting no ships or other vehicles) who would win.

The fans?

[QueteshRuled]

The fans?

haha lol... i now root for ascended beings just because watch maternal instinct and all of Omas lightning crap.

[Kab]

The Ascended Beings

If not them then Anubis

If not Anubis then I'm going with the priors (including Adria)

If not the Priors I'm going with the Replicators (Milky Way Version)

If not them then then the Kull Warriors

If not Kull Warriors I'm going with the Wraith from the Defiant One

If not the wraith from the Defiant One then Teal'c


But really who cares about a physical ultimate showdown in stargate?

Priors+Adria>Anubis.

Hell, Prior>Anubis.

[fugiman]

Priors+Adria>Anubis.

Hell, Prior>Anubis.

Why and how?

Anubis is a half ascended being. All Anubis has to do is posse the Prior or Adria and game over. If Ba'al can do it then Anubis can definitely do it

[Kab]

Why and how?

Anubis is a half ascended being. All Anubis has to do is posse the Prior or Adria and game over. If Ba'al can do it then Anubis can definitely do it

Anubis can't actually do anything with his half-ascended powers, he can only do what he could do as a Goa'Uld, if I remember correctly.

And the only reason Ba'al could possess Adria was because of the anti-prior device, unfortunately for Anubis, he probably has no idea that the Ori even exist, so I doubt he has a device that can stop their powers.

[fugiman]

Anubis can't actually do anything with his half-ascended powers, he can only do what he could do as a Goa'Uld, if I remember correctly.

And the only reason Ba'al could possess Adria was because of the anti-prior device, unfortunately for Anubis, he probably has no idea that the Ori even exist, so I doubt he has a device that can stop their powers.

Goa'uld can take hosts, therefore Anubis can take a host like Ba'al. Therefore if Ba'al can do it then Anubis can do it.

Next Anubis is a half ascended being who either needs a shield of sorts (his cloak) or a host (we see this in season 8)

So how does anything you said disprove that Anubis could take over Adria?

Also we have seen Anubis working on Advanced humans and most of the knowledge gathered by the SGC to battle the Priors and Adria came from Anubis's own work.

So once again how does that disprove Anubis taking over Adria?

[Keeper]

Anubis can't actually do anything with his half-ascended powers, he can only do what he could do as a Goa'Uld, if I remember correctly.

partially true - he's not allowed to use his powers. at least not against lowers - he's able to go in and out of daniel's cafe easily, and only 'ascended' can do that iirc.

he was, however, able to prevent the ancients from descending him fully. making him a damned powerful ascended when he was fully there, and very powerful even now.

however, with the ori info, that might be explainable: the ori gained power from worshippers. anubis had less of them, but they were all his - and he wasn't fighting the ori either. thus, in a showdown, he can at least hold off against an ancient, and perhaps against a single ori with only their share of the flock to power them.

adria, orisi, he could probably make her bow. adria, post-ascension - not a chance. she's got the entire ori galaxy at her command - even an ancient couldn't reveal themselves. post-ark, though, she's equal to an ancient due to loss of followers.

[Kab]

Goa'uld can take hosts, therefore Anubis can take a host like Ba'al. Therefore if Ba'al can do it then Anubis can do it.

Next Anubis is a half ascended being who either needs a shield of sorts (his cloak) or a host (we see this in season 8)

So how does anything you said disprove that Anubis could take over Adria?

Also we have seen Anubis working on Advanced humans and most of the knowledge gathered by the SGC to battle the Priors and Adria came from Anubis's own work.

So once again how does that disprove Anubis taking over Adria?

What I meant is that Adria can hocus pocus Anubis since nothing is inhibiting her abilities. Sorry for the misunderstanding, I thought it was obvious that I meant that.

And although I'm sure that Anubis could make a device to inhibit Adria's and Priors powers, you're forgetting the setting that this fight occurs, he won't be able to conjure one up.

partially true - he's not allowed to use his powers. at least not against lowers - he's able to go in and out of daniel's cafe easily, and only 'ascended' can do that iirc.

he was, however, able to prevent the ancients from descending him fully. making him a damned powerful ascended when he was fully there, and very powerful even now.

however, with the ori info, that might be explainable: the ori gained power from worshippers. anubis had less of them, but they were all his - and he wasn't fighting the ori either. thus, in a showdown, he can at least hold off against an ancient, and perhaps against a single ori with only their share of the flock to power them.

adria, orisi, he could probably make her bow. adria, post-ascension - not a chance. she's got the entire ori galaxy at her command - even an ancient couldn't reveal themselves. post-ark, though, she's equal to an ancient due to loss of followers.

Sorry, but this post is just rampant with assumptions.

Firstly: We don't know if he has any powers, we have no way to define a half ascended being, maybe he doesn't even have any powers, maybe he has them but in severe limit to those of ascended beings, but what we do know is that he's not allowed to use them, so the argument is moot anyway.

Secondly: We don't know that he had any doing in his half-ascendedness as far as I know, we just know that The Others didn't descend him fully. Whether it had anything to do with power or not is an even bigger question.

Thirdly: Again, no idea how the Ori do it, and it is doubtful that Anubis could do or could think of whatever they did by himself.

Fourthly: Well.. the fourth paragraph is just a summary of all the other assumptions, so yeah.

[Keeper]

Sorry, but this post is just rampant with assumptions.

Firstly: We don't know if he has any powers, we have no way to define a half ascended being, maybe he doesn't even have any powers, maybe he has them but in severe limit to those of ascended beings, but what we do know is that he's not allowed to use them, so the argument is moot anyway.

he's stuck halfway and can enter the ascended cafe. that indicates power.

he becomes a wisp sort of thing when disembodied, again some kind of power.

there is no purpose to a ban on his use of power, unless he has access to power.

Secondly: We don't know that he had any doing in his half-ascendedness as far as I know, we just know that The Others didn't descend him fully. Whether it had anything to do with power or not is an even bigger question.

pretty sure oma said the others couldn't. it wasn't explicitly stated then, but we know they normally can descend others - like daniel. while it's a slight leap that he's just that powerful, it indicates he had some means of blocking them.

Thirdly: Again, no idea how the Ori do it, and it is doubtful that Anubis could do or could think of whatever they did by himself.

they drained power from their followers - stated by both adria and sam's ancient friend (the name escapes me right now.) adria states clearly that all that power transferred to her when the rest of the ori died. we also know that morgan wasn't able to go 1-on-1 with her until the priors leading the people were neutered.

we don't know that it requires anything other than worship though, and so it isn't a massive leap to assume that anubis may have either worked it out, or received power automatically. we do know that the only stated mechanic was worship.

Fourthly: Well.. the fourth paragraph is just a summary of all the other assumptions, so yeah.

based on information available on screen, so yeah. but then, any kind of showdown makes assumptions.

[Kab]

he's stuck halfway and can enter the ascended cafe. that indicates power.

he becomes a wisp sort of thing when disembodied, again some kind of power.

there is no purpose to a ban on his use of power, unless he has access to power.

pretty sure oma said the others couldn't. it wasn't explicitly stated then, but we know they normally can descend others - like daniel. while it's a slight leap that he's just that powerful, it indicates he had some means of blocking them.

they drained power from their followers - stated by both adria and sam's ancient friend (the name escapes me right now.) adria states clearly that all that power transferred to her when the rest of the ori died. we also know that morgan wasn't able to go 1-on-1 with her until the priors leading the people were neutered.

we don't know that it requires anything other than worship though, and so it isn't a massive leap to assume that anubis may have either worked it out, or received power automatically. we do know that the only stated mechanic was worship.

based on information available on screen, so yeah. but then, any kind of showdown makes assumptions.

Being able to go in and out of the cafe doesn't really say much if anything about his power, it just means that he's semi-ascended enough to go in and out of it.
As for the wisp argument.. not really. If he really had some kind of power and be able to use it he'd contain his wispyness in some kind of form, instead of relying to be host to humans.
Well the rule is more of a general rules for all ascended beings, not on him specfifically.

Well this is from the Stargate wiki since I don't remember which episode specifically Oma said that in:
"The Ancients did not want the Goa'uld to join them on the higher planes of existence, and forced him into a state between mortal existence and ascension."
So either: They didn't want to force an ascended being into normal state again or they wanted to punish Oma by having him around.

Aye, it was indeed. But I think it's far-fetched that any being worshipping another automatically gives them power.

[Keeper]

Being able to go in and out of the cafe doesn't really say much if anything about his power, it just means that he's semi-ascended enough to go in and out of it.
As for the wisp argument.. not really. If he really had some kind of power and be able to use it he'd contain his wispyness in some kind of form, instead of relying to be host to humans.
Well the rule is more of a general rules for all ascended beings, not on him specfifically.

it was made specifically clear daniel couldn't go in and out, he'd have to make a choice. and that 'higher beings' could go in and out. by implication - as it was daniel's choice - anubis must be a somewhat higher being, as he can choose to enter and leave. as we know, even human bodies can have powers (kaleb, priors, nirti's experiments.) thus by implication all higher beings should have some powers, no matter how limited.

needing help seemed to be because of rules - specifically, in S8E3 (when he's a wisp) a couple of mentions are made about anubis needing a body, as the ancients will take action if he does anything without one. no other ascended being seems to need a physical body, unless you count adria-as-flesh, which was specifically done to smuggle her behind enemy lines. she appears in ark of truth to have ditched her physical form in favour of the wall of fire, taking up a visual form like oma and morgan are able to do.

Well this is from the Stargate wiki since I don't remember which episode specifically Oma said that in:
"The Ancients did not want the Goa'uld to join them on the higher planes of existence, and forced him into a state between mortal existence and ascension."
So either: They didn't want to force an ascended being into normal state again or they wanted to punish Oma by having him around.

true, looking through the transcript i can't see anything that says they 'couldn't' descend him fully. they chucked daniel out for breaking the rules, though. suggesting that they do, in fact, have that power, and not much issue with using it.

oma tells us that he's not allowed to do anything he couldn't have done as a goa'uld, which implies he has the ability to do so.

additionally, in the cafe, oma seems unable to beat anubis when she fights him - just makes him concentrate on her and no one else.

Aye, it was indeed. But I think it's far-fetched that any being worshipping another automatically gives them power.

by canon, it's all we've got. i won't say i like the idea of it being an automatic transference, but i like it more than a half-ascended being the equal of an ascended.

also, i don't know if i would like the idea of one 'higher being' having more power than another natively - which would be the implication if anubis lost power in his descent and had no power from worship, yet couldn't be beaten by oma.

[Kab]

I started typing a reply but then I realised that the argument is moot anyway, we're not discussing if Anubis has power, it's as simple as he can't use it in a fight anyway and Adria would definitely be able to stop him dead in his tracks, which is why she would win in a fight, she can use her power while Anubis can't. Which is what the whole discussion is about.