The Predator

[Gollumpus]

That thing would attack herds of elephants for kicks. I'm sure they were hoping for a shot at the eyes.

Yup, as TJ said. What I'm pointing out is that if they hardened the wood (fire hardening is where you remove the moisture from the wood which makes it "harder" and therefore more durable) they might improve their chances a smidge. Would it ultimately make a difference? Likely not, however, I'd take every tiny bit of edge I could get.

regards,
G.

[thekillman]

so where did Tj found wood to make fire? I'm guessing the creature had a stack of it somewhere in the cave

there were trees just outside the cave.

Her kind are intelligent, but they don't have opposable thumbs; she just carries it on a stick in her mouth and maintains/shares it that way.

very touching, but you kinda need opposable thumbs to do more than just hold a fire.

opposable thumbs are extaordinarily useful, from basic texting on your phone to making small devices or huge machines.

Absolutely correct. This being said, were I in that situation a pointed stick AND a torch might improve my chances of survival just that little bit more

given that a fear for fire is natural, yes, i'd go with pointy stick AND torch.

[Sim]

there were trees just outside the cave.

- They couldn't leave the cave because of the predator patrol
- The entrance was high up so they'd have to climb down to gather any wood

very touching, but you kinda need opposable thumbs to do more than just hold a fire.

opposable thumbs are extaordinarily useful, from basic texting on your phone to making small devices or huge machines.

Things that this animal has obviously no need for. "Lol totally wtfpwnd teh n00bs trying to base camp me".

I would say it is intelligent for 3 things:
- Disabling one of the captives to make the other not leave it or slow them down.
- Setting a trap for the hunting party
- Recognizing fire and non-aggression

[thekillman]

- They couldn't leave the cave because of the predator patrol
- The entrance was high up so they'd have to climb down to gather any wood

actually they could. the predator was quite a bit down and there were trees inbetween them and the predator.

- Disabling one of the captives to make the other not leave it or slow them down.

that's not intelligent. it likely bit in his leg to drag him along and used his other two legs to drag TJ. creatures commonly bite in other creature's legs to drag them along, since you preserve the meat the most that way.

- Setting a trap for the hunting party

nothing intelligent to it. smart, perhaps. but that doesn't make the creature intelligent. not intelligent enough for "omg wtf th3y havs fir3"

- Recognizing fire and non-aggression

which was my objection against the creature.


the creature backing down in the middle of his cave was stupid too, for no other reason that creatures, especially predators, are most dangerous near their home, because they're territorial.

[morrismike]

the creature backing down in the middle of his cave was stupid too, for no other reason that creatures, especially predators, are most dangerous near their home, because they're territorial.

The show isn't well written for one. The writers seemed to be implying a Velociraptor (Jurrasic Park), alien (Alien), or even killer whale sort of behaviour to put across the intelligent idea. I agree that inside the cave, Greer posed no threat (other than possibly blinding the creature) with that 5.56mm weapon or his 9mm sidearm. It is likely the predator felt the crew were no threat and backed down its aggression level. There is no sense in threatening the sirloin steak in the refrigerator is there?

A bear will endure thousands of stings to get a little honey. The creature probably bottom-lined it and came to the conclusion they weren't worth the trouble (smarter than the bear).

[KEK]

The animal was intelligent, and recognised that they were also intelligent because of the fire. That's why it let them go.

[Ben 'Teal'c would WIN!!' Noble]

Lots of animals are smart but I would have no problem with anyone eating them. I just don't get that just because it looked at the fire that means it must be intelligent.

[D Toccs]

Lots of animals are smart but I would have no problem with anyone eating them. I just don't get that just because it looked at the fire that means it must be intelligent.

It's not just that it looked at the fire. It's that it recognized that creating fire made the humans intelligent, it was also intelligent enough to create a fake trail and ambush the rescue party. It was also intelligent enough to understand that Greer chose not to attack it, and it let them leave peacefully.

From what we saw, I would say that it was probably at a similar level of intelligence to what Homo Erectus was on Earth. Not fully sapient, but definately sentient.

[Ben 'Teal'c would WIN!!' Noble]

It's not just that it looked at the fire. It's that it recognized that creating fire made the humans intelligent, it was also intelligent enough to create a fake trail and ambush the rescue party. It was also intelligent enough to understand that Greer chose not to attack it, and it let them leave peacefully.

From what we saw, I would say that it was probably at a similar level of intelligence to what Homo Erectus was on Earth. Not fully sapient, but definately sentient.

And you know this because it told you?

[D Toccs]

And you know this because it told you?

Because it was the implication of the episode.

[thekillman]

The animal was intelligent, and recognised that they were also intelligent because of the fire. That's why it let them go.

every superior predator ever in history is dead. because of humans. we made dozens of species that would absolutely and totally dominate all modern wildlife, go extinct. from bears that make modern bears look cuddly, to wolves that make modern wolves like chihuahua's, to birds that make modern birds look like specs of dust.


we killed them all. why would the predator out of the good of his heart, let us go. for what sane reason? the only sane thing for the creature to do was kill and attack, since we -being intelligent- are a humongous threat to it.


like i said, if the creature is intelligent, it raises plotholes, and if it's not intelligent,it raises plotholes.


even intelligent animals that saved humans, like dolphins, only ever helped us because they didn't loose anything. Dolphins are known to display empathy. they help humans to fight off sharks/orca's. but from a natural POV, this makes sense. by denying their natural opponent their food, they can live in a safer world.


but this predator allowed outright competition. we were hunting on it's ground. we stood in it's cave. no creature no matter how.. intelligent... will tolerate that.

we won't even tolerate it ourselves!

[garhkal]

Maybe it understood we would be gone soon..

[Gollumpus]

Because it was the implication of the episode.

True. This being said, perhaps they should have written it such that the creature witnessed them creating the fire thereby spelling it out a bit more. As it was it was a bit vague.

Example of where they could/should have gone: the movie "Quest for Fire" (QfF). Not a great film, and they didn't really get a lot of stuff right but there was one very powerful scene where the "hero" sees one of the people from a somewhat more technologically advanced culture make a fire. It was a highly emotional, religious experience for that character. He was from a fire using (even worshiping) culture, not one which made fire. I would put this creature in the same category as the more primitive culture in QfF. They certainly respect it on some level, possibly use it (but for what?), but they do not seem to be capable of creating it.

As it was, the creature entering the lair, seeing the fire, and putting two and two together that TJ made the fire is a bit of a stretch to me. If it has never made fire, has no knowledge of tool using or fire making, and only uses fire if/when an opportunity arises (like after a lightning strike) why would it think that this new prey is intelligent and that they made the fire? And what value would this creature put on humans being intelligent? Why would it care?

regards,
G.

PS - also (as noted), what would this species need with a fire? The species seems perfectly adapted as a top of the food chain predator.

[garhkal]

True. BUT i also wonder WHERE it learned that 'making fire means intelligence' from? Has it ever seen other aliens do so?

[Gollumpus]

True. BUT i also wonder WHERE it learned that 'making fire means intelligence' from? Has it ever seen other aliens do so?

This could be the answer. The creature did witness other aliens make and use fire, however it didn't like the taste of them...

regards,
G.