Another problem with Riley's situation

[RobertF]

Wait - are we absolutely sure Riley wanted Young to strangle him? The look of panic in Riley's eyes suggests he had second thoughts.

I think the more humane option would be to give him morphine, and then put him out of his misery with some of those handy alien toxins they recovered on the jungle planet in Season 1.

I agree with the earlier poster that we may see Riley again. Given what happened to TJ & her baby last episode, perhaps he'll be reincarnated on the artificial world they discovered.

[Gollumpus]

Wait - are we absolutely sure Riley wanted Young to strangle him? The look of panic in Riley's eyes suggests he had second thoughts.

I think the more humane option would be to give him morphine, and then put him out of his misery with some of those handy alien toxins they recovered on the jungle planet in Season 1.

I agree with the earlier poster that we may see Riley again. Given what happened to TJ & her baby last episode, perhaps he'll be reincarnated on the artificial world they discovered.

Yes, we are absolutely sure Riley wanted Young to strangle him.

He mentioned that he wasn't going going to ask for Young's sidearm with which he could shoot himself because he feared that blame could fall on Young. He stopped Young from getting TJ, who would have any drugs (assuming she actually had ANY), because he didn't want to burden her with the guilt. Further, he had lots of time to ask her to put him out of his misery, and he did not.

Strangulation was the only means that Riley and Young had to end his life. Being a thoughtful (as in thinking about stuff) guy, he chose the option which allowed him to die and the crew to a) not feel bad about abandoning him to die all alone; b) allowed them to have a fantasy that he did die from his injuries and not from any actions on Young's part. If Young had beat in his skull with a rock then there would be doubt of how he died.

All that he needed was the someone to carry the burden of knowing what really happened in the shuttle (ie. to kill him). That person could only be Young, although I would have liked to have seen Rush get that job...

The look of panic would be there regardless of whether Riley wanted to die or not. The will to live is a very strong thing. Riley's body would struggle to survive even though the mind was telling it to not resist.

I really liked the Riley character, however, I'd like him to be gone. Done. I'd prefer this artificial world to not become the dumping ground for characters that the writers may want to use at some future point in time. That would be a little too 2001 for me.

regards,
G.

[RobertF]

OK, it sounds like a very logical decision on Riley's part - no doubt we were led to believe that he weighed all the options concerning how he would die, and strangulation was the best.

And yet . . . I felt creeped out about Riley choosing (if he did) to end his life by being strangled by another man. I don't quite buy the arguments against asking Young to shoot him. Riley could have addressed everyone in the party, told them he chose death by a bullet through the heart, a more dignified way of dying than suffocation. Or just ask the rest of the party to lift up the panel and prop it up on a rock so he could quickly bleed to death.

Well, at any rate, maybe we're supposed to feel creeped out and disturbed by this scene. We're way beyond the (by comparison) light-hearted adventures of Stargate SG1. No heroic deaths here.

[morbosfist]

And yet . . . I felt creeped out about Riley choosing (if he did) to end his life by being strangled by another man. I don't quite buy the arguments against asking Young to shoot him.

Just to put this idea right out, Riley shows Young that he wants to be strangled. How? He makes a very difficult effort to shove his free arm under his back so he won't be able to resist. Not a lot of options to go by, and Riley clearly determined which one was going to be available.

Riley could have addressed everyone in the party, told them he chose death by a bullet through the heart, a more dignified way of dying than suffocation. Or just ask the rest of the party to lift up the panel and prop it up on a rock so he could quickly bleed to death.

TJ would definitely not be down with that. Neither would Park or Eli. Scott and Greer might, moreso Greer than Scott I would think, but even then they'd be resistant. Riley had to ask Youg alone, because as his commanding officer he must have felt Young would understand.

[RobertF]

Just to put this idea right out, Riley shows Young that he wants to be strangled. How? He makes a very difficult effort to shove his free arm under his back so he won't be able to resist. Not a lot of options to go by, and Riley clearly determined which one was going to be available.

Hard to say what Riley was doing. Searching for his firearm? The transcript on this website has Riley feebly attempting to push the panel off his legs so that he can bleed to death. But you're right that Riley didn't resist Young's suffocation, although he did stare at Young with a panicked look throughout the suicide assist/murder, which was weird (why didn't he shut his eyes to make it easier on Young?).

TJ would definitely not be down with that. Neither would Park or Eli. Scott and Greer might, moreso Greer than Scott I would think, but even then they'd be resistant. Riley had to ask Youg alone, because as his commanding officer he must have felt Young would understand.

A bullet through the heart would be a better way to go than strangulation, surely TJ would have objected less to death by firearm than death by suffocation.

[morbosfist]

Hard to say what Riley was doing. Searching for his firearm? The transcript on this website has Riley feebly attempting to push the panel off his legs so that he can bleed to death. But you're right that Riley didn't resist Young's suffocation, although he did stare at Young with a panicked look throughout the suicide assist/murder, which was weird (why didn't he shut his eyes to make it easier on Young?).

Hadn't actually read that. I have to admit it's possible, but Riley isn't stupid. He knows he can't move that console. It took two guys to lift it a few inches and they couldn't do it for more than a few seconds at a time.

The panicked look is sheer reflex. No way Riley could have shut that down.

A bullet through the heart would be a better way to go than strangulation, surely TJ would have objected less to death by firearm than death by suffocation.

She would have objected to a mercy killing, period, regardless of method.

[RobertF]

The panicked look is sheer reflex. No way Riley could have shut that down.

Can't say I've ever been suffocated to within an inch of my death, so perhaps reflexes do indeed kick in.

She would have objected to a mercy killing, period, regardless of method.

So I suppose TJ would have advocated either sticking it out to the end with Riley, giving him drugs to ease the pain, or simply leaving Riley when the FTL clock runs down. Leaving him would be an agonizing fate - especially if there are meat-eating critters in the vicinity attracted by the smell of blood.

One other thing - when Young informs the group that Riley is dead, TJ is seen walking back towards the shuttle, presumably to check the body. So...would she see definite signs of fishy business - bruises on Riley's neck, crushed trachea, etc.? If so, she's keeping quiet.

[Gollumpus]

One other thing - when Young informs the group that Riley is dead, TJ is seen walking back towards the shuttle, presumably to check the body. So...would she see definite signs of fishy business - bruises on Riley's neck, crushed trachea, etc.? If so, she's keeping quiet.

Everyone there, with the possible exception of Lisa Park (who is sweetness and perky optimism incarnate - luv her) knew what had happened. You could see it on their faces. TJ would have known first as she was aware of Riley's condition and though he was going to die, there wasn't any likelihood of it happening for some time to come.

What the real thing of this is it is another event which is driving TJ and Young apart. Remember how close they were when he first found out she was pregnant? Remember how protective he was towards her? Then the wedges started to appear: the planet where she wanted to stay; how distant she has become since the LA experience (look at their interaction at the start of the episode) and now Riley.

regards,
G.

[garhkal]

Everyone around that shuttle *knew* what had happened inside, that Riley had just not expired on his own. TJ knew it. Greer knew it. Scott knew it. The others would strongly suspect. Young asked TJ to leave them alone because he *knew* that Riley wasn't going to make it, and that nobody would want to leave him there to die all alone, and that he knew what had to be done.

It was also another example of Young taking responsibility for a horrible act for the good of the crew. Young knew the only way that it would end would be that Riley would be dead when Young left the shuttle. Riley, being the sharp soldier and good person that he was, gave Young a way out and asked to be killed. This allows the crew to lie to themselves, that poor Riley died on the planet from his injuries.

regards,
G.

While i agree, it was young doing what was needed, taking responsibility, what other :horrible" act did he do?

Hard to say what Riley was doing. Searching for his firearm?

Na. he was putting his arms under his back so he could not stop young.

[Shadow_7]

Of course TJ might just be going to close the doors on the shuttle. We didn't get to see much to determine purpose plus actions. I just wish that the versions that aired on TV originally, on the web, and re-aired the week after didn't vary so much. Entire lines of dialog and other things present in one, missing in the other. Plus a general oddness to the timing of things. Like some of the LA leaving the ship was less than five seconds of footage. But significant to the plot. I guess that I'll have to buy the DVDs to get the uncut versions.

[garhkal]

I think she just went to pick up her bags and such.

[The Swarm]

YAY, they killed my favorite character yet again...seems to be an SG tradition.

[Gollumpus]

YAY, they killed my favorite character yet again...seems to be an SG tradition.

So it's YOUR fault!!! Quick, say Rush is your fave character.....

regards,
G.