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  1. #1
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    Default Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    Hi,
    I'm interested in some little brainstorming of the Ori/Jaffa staffweapons. I watched all SG-1 episodes, so based on my memories:

    Jaffa Staffweapon
    -less accurate than the Ori weapon

    Ori Staffweapon
    -seems very deadly
    -more advanced power supply

    my assumptions so far:
    - both weapons should be one shot = dead if hit in torso or head area and wearing no armor
    - Jaffa should be able to sustain up to 2 Jaffa Staffweapon shots in torso area

    Input welcome. I'm also looking for a sound recording of the Ori weapon shot, sadly all samples I took from my dvds always had music playing or were muffled as they were fired in the distance.

    Please help. These guys will salute you:
    http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll246/bla212/1-9.jpg

  2. #2
    First Lieutenant asdf1239's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    iirc teal'c takes 3 staffa shots and takes a while to die in continuum
    R.I.P Stargate 1994-2009

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    Quote Originally Posted by asdf1239 View Post
    iirc teal'c takes 3 staffa shots and takes a while to die in continuum
    Yeah, but he's a badass, Sam took a strafing shot in some episode and nearly dies...

  4. #4
    Lieutenant General thekillman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    Ark Of Truth should give you some good sound samples for the ori weapons.


    anyway, staffweapons suck in every possible way. ori weapons are better but still not great

  5. #5
    Major locutes's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    I can still remember the episode in which the Jaffa say that a staf weapon is a weapon of war and a p90 a trinket. Then a demonstration happens in which the Jaffa sharpshooter hits 2 out of 3 on a stationary dummy and sam cuts it in two with her p90

  6. #6
    Lieutenant General thekillman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    actually O'neill says that. The Warrior.

    a staf weapon is a weapon of war and a p90 a trinket.

    "this *points at staffweapon* is a weapon of terror. it is meant to intimidate your enemy".
    *jaffa shoots a few times, hits a few times, making scorch marks*
    "THIS *points at P-90* is a weapon of war. it is meant to KILL your enemy."
    *sam shoots three times, two hits in the log, the third snaps the rope. she switches to automatic and cuts the log in half*

  7. #7
    Lieutenant Colonel Mister Oragahn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    Based on what we've seen, if you really want to find an explanation to the various firepower levels, aside from arguing that some System Lords give their Jaffa more powerfu lstaves, you may say that they have a way to charge shots. This problem existed since the film. The staves were powerful, but sometimes even several shots would do much less damage than the typical stone blasting bolts.
    In the show, there's been times when we've seen staves do fantastic things. We've also seen Bra'tac rapid-fire his staff weapon with low powered flaming bolts. Me thinks that if one is to argue that a build up is possible, it's generally not used too often for some reason, which could mechanical perhaps. Perhaps it damages the weapon, perhaps it makes the shot's accuracy very random at long ranges, etc.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    Quote Originally Posted by thekillman View Post
    actually O'neill says that. The Warrior.
    "this *points at staffweapon* is a weapon of terror. it is meant to intimidate your enemy".
    *jaffa shoots a few times, hits a few times, making scorch marks*
    "THIS *points at P-90* is a weapon of war. it is meant to KILL your enemy."
    *sam shoots three times, two hits in the log, the third snaps the rope. she switches to automatic and cuts the log in half*
    Yep, I remember that. The staffweapon makes alot of noise and scares little children, but it's not very accurate. That's allready implementated ingame, in my play tests the ratio is like 1 to 3 so 10 SGC soldiers will defeat 30 Jaffa with few surviving.

    This however is also limited to engagement range. If I let them engage as far as 300-350m, the Jaffa will loose pretty surely (even more if I spawn SGC soldiers equipped with M107's and M249's).

    However, if I place the Jaffa nearer like 100-150m or even closer, SGC casulties will rise rapidly.

    As for the Ori I made the Ori weapon abit more accurate, deadlier and the energy bolt faster as it seemed more advanced.


    Quote Originally Posted by thekillman View Post
    Ark Of Truth should give you some good sound samples for the ori weapons.


    anyway, staffweapons suck in every possible way. ori weapons are better but still not great
    Hm yep, that's where I got the sound I'm using now. I used the sound at the beginning where Tomin decides to help SG-1, but the shots in the large battle before that all have music playing . And that sound is abit muffled, doesn't have alot of bass and clarity.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Oragahn View Post
    Based on what we've seen, if you really want to find an explanation to the various firepower levels, aside from arguing that some System Lords give their Jaffa more powerfu lstaves, you may say that they have a way to charge shots. This problem existed since the film. The staves were powerful, but sometimes even several shots would do much less damage than the typical stone blasting bolts.
    In the show, there's been times when we've seen staves do fantastic things. We've also seen Bra'tac rapid-fire his staff weapon with low powered flaming bolts. Me thinks that if one is to argue that a build up is possible, it's generally not used too often for some reason, which could mechanical perhaps. Perhaps it damages the weapon, perhaps it makes the shot's accuracy very random at long ranges, etc.
    Hm that sounds like a solid explanation, but maybe it's just that the writers weren't clear about their own stuff, like e.g. with the zat guns. As I remember in the first episodes they had Z's disappear bodies on the third shot and sometime later the writers said sth. like "oh yep, that was a bad idea" and mocked this particular aspect also in wormhole xtreme. Or maybe Bratac had a "pimped" staff weapon.

    A firemode for burst fire could be implemented, but I would leave it only for player use for now as it seems it was used rarely.

  9. #9
    Lieutenant Colonel Stewart5's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    I think, if a staff weapon hits a vital area, it should be more or less one hit kill on humans, a couple on Jaffa. IF it hits. It has horrible ergonomics.

    then agaian, the P90 is vastly overpowered and accurate in SG shows, too. I'd rather have a half-brick than either

    385 Heroes coming Home

    Here's to smart Mods

  10. #10
    Lieutenant Colonel Mister Oragahn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    I never understood how it was a bad idea. It's not like it would change much to the plots, considering how they're used most of the time. And if I have time, I'll post an explanation how what zats do.

    As for staves, if one watches Continuum, you'll notice that they're actually good weapons. Ba'al's men had no issue to score very good hits, and that even at long medium ranges, weapon to the hips.
    Besides, before the shift to the ceramic-armoured vest, bolts would cook people in, while we do know that real rifles won't always kill. In general, aside from special main characters and plot convenience, one shot still manages to kill SGC troops at times, and will at the very least incapacitate a soldier with a serious wound.
    See episode Heroes, O'neill was knocked down and needed immediate care, Frasier got shot and killed, and the wounded trooper she was taking care of wasn't exactly in good shape either). We also saw in this episode how a punchy bolt could send Siler fly backwards. Now it seems he wore an experimental heavy flak jacked, cause he didn't suffer from the near point blank range shot, while the troops certainly didn't seem to benefit from that kind of protection.
    There's Moebius, some screenshots:




    On the second picture we see that the bolt literally goes through the trooper. Same thing happened when O'neill shot a Jaff in the stomach with a staff in Children of the Gods:


    Then consider the staff bolts when they crack open boulders (see several examples here), put fist sized holes in stone pillars and concrete walls, and cause serious damage to trees and make big explosions like in Thor's Chariot.


    1 2 3

    4 5 6

    And an example from the movie, here.

    Besides, considering that the bolts explode, they're prone to cause some lethal shrapnel over a short radius.

    EDIT: I'd invite you to read this post, but some videos have been removed.
    EDIT2: Wow, many IMG tags have been changed into URL tags. WTF?? I don't know what the hell happened. It worked fine when I left it yesterday.
    EDIT3: "Last edited by Bagpuss; Today at 03:12 AM. Reason: IMG tags changed to URLs.Gifs were all way over the 100KB max. " - OK, got it. Back to URLs. Oh boy that messes up the post. Is it good now?

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    Wow, thanks for the in-depth reply, may I rent you for further "QA" in the future ?

    I adjusted the damage now (all for the jaffa staff), torso/head/neck is instant death, legs/hands/arms will need 2 hits.

    Also shrapnel range has been increased to 1m (0.2m) before and will deal 2dmg which is 20% of the damage a direct hit causes.

    See my test (rated M I guess):
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bL21S0ILyk

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    Quote Originally Posted by bla232 View Post
    Hi,
    I'm interested in some little brainstorming of the Ori/Jaffa staffweapons. I watched all SG-1 episodes, so based on my memories:

    Jaffa Staffweapon
    -less accurate than the Ori weapon

    Ori Staffweapon
    -seems very deadly
    -more advanced power supply



    my assumptions so far:
    - both weapons should be one shot = dead if hit in torso or head area and wearing no armor
    - Jaffa should be able to sustain up to 2 Jaffa Staffweapon shots in torso area

    Input welcome. I'm also looking for a sound recording of the Ori weapon shot, sadly all samples I took from my dvds always had music playing or were muffled as they were fired in the distance.

    Please help. These guys will salute you:
    http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll246/bla212/1-9.jpg
    i'd imagine Ori staff weapons more advanced, since Ori more advanced than Goa'uld; curious--did u see a certain scene causing u to think Ori staff weapons have more advanced power source?

    Quote Originally Posted by asdf1239 View Post
    iirc teal'c takes 3 staffa shots and takes a while to die in continuum
    Teal'c is one of the toughest, hardiest Jaffa ever so he can survive injuries longer

    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Oragahn View Post
    Based on what we've seen, if you really want to find an explanation to the various firepower levels, aside from arguing that some System Lords give their Jaffa more powerfu lstaves, you may say that they have a way to charge shots. This problem existed since the film. The staves were powerful, but sometimes even several shots would do much less damage than the typical stone blasting bolts.
    In the show, there's been times when we've seen staves do fantastic things. We've also seen Bra'tac rapid-fire his staff weapon with low powered flaming bolts. Me thinks that if one is to argue that a build up is possible, it's generally not used too often for some reason, which could mechanical perhaps. Perhaps it damages the weapon, perhaps it makes the shot's accuracy very random at long ranges, etc.
    keen observations n well-thought-out-deductions
    If you're interested in reading my longest fanfic story, which is an action/adventure story involving the elusive Furlings (as well as if you want to read the others), please click the link below.
    [URL="http://www.fanfiction.net/s/6888222/1/Tauri_Furling_First_Contact_and_Alliance[/URL]

    RIP Sep 2010 to beloved gateworld.net member and forum contributor Weedle, very skilled soldier with military special operations, a wonderful human being, and a friend to so many on gateworld. May we keep his memory close.

  13. #13
    Lieutenant General thekillman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    yes Line in the Sand shows the ori have a pretty good powersource, better than 3 naquahdah generators.

    according to carter a staff weapon can't even power a gate. though she was disproven by oneill later, although via very different means of accessing the power. a staffweapon thus generates much less power normally, and lasts long, while when using a powerbooster, you get MUCH more power.

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    i do believe there is a deleted scene where adria says much goa'uld technology is based of ancient desgins

  15. #15
    Lieutenant General thekillman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    and?

  16. #16
    Lieutenant Colonel Mister Oragahn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    Quote Originally Posted by bla232 View Post
    Wow, thanks for the in-depth reply, may I rent you for further "QA" in the future ?

    I adjusted the damage now (all for the jaffa staff), torso/head/neck is instant death, legs/hands/arms will need 2 hits.

    Also shrapnel range has been increased to 1m (0.2m) before and will deal 2dmg which is 20% of the damage a direct hit causes.

    See my test (rated M I guess):
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bL21S0ILyk
    Wow, what a carnage! That said, it does feel right. I noticed that the blonde dude next to the third being shot took some area effect damage.
    What 3D engine is that?
    If you need more info, don't hesitate to ask. Good luck.

  17. #17
    Lieutenant Colonel Mister Oragahn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    Quote Originally Posted by thekillman View Post
    yes Line in the Sand shows the ori have a pretty good powersource, better than 3 naquahdah generators.

    according to carter a staff weapon can't even power a gate. though she was disproven by oneill later, although via very different means of accessing the power. a staffweapon thus generates much less power normally, and lasts long, while when using a powerbooster, you get MUCH more power.
    Well the Ori weapon staff's crystal only managed to cloak one small house. The three generators were going to hide the whole town. Naqahdah generators have the capacity to produce n e2~e3 gigawatt power outputs (that's about ten if not several hundred thousand times energy per second than what a sabot round can deliver, which in general is more than 7 megajoules of kinetic energy, 7 with six zeros behind it), and can be set to overload and release at least more than 83 terajoules (20 kilotons). Obviously an Ori soldier's weapon staff doesn't come anywhere close to that. It may come at a couple dozen kilojoules of bottled up thermal energy per shot and that's about it.
    What it means is that the crystal has a low power capacity (doesn't produce much power) but a phenomenal amount of energy stored inside. It's that crazy. It could literally be a primitive form of small ZPM, but that's just idle speculation.
    The bolts of such weapons never stroke me as being more powerful than those from Goa'uld weapons. I remember no Ori staff managing to do anything more substantial than burn someone over a small area and that's all.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    Quote Originally Posted by thekillman View Post
    and?
    i got confused

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Oragahn View Post
    Wow, what a carnage! That said, it does feel right. I noticed that the blonde dude next to the third being shot took some area effect damage.
    What 3D engine is that?
    If you need more info, don't hesitate to ask. Good luck.
    The blonde dude is actually Major/Lieutenant/doctor/whatever Carter .

    I guess you might have found on your own now, but it's ArmA2, a not widely known game compared to e.g. MW2/BF2 and the casual stuff. It's the successor of Operation Flashpoint from the same developers with a very updated engine (compared to OFP, just the physics didn't really improve).

    The nice thing is you can do lots of things with limited knowledge, if you want to have a quick battle you just click a few buttons and have a working scenario mission, for other games you would have to program and configure, set actor spawns, script waypoints etc, you can do advanced stuff like that in ArmA2, too, but a 12 year old can create a decent skirmish mission in a short time without using scripts or other headache giving forms.

    (Speaking of my experience when playing Operation Flashpoint as a 12 year old )

    E.g. take this "mission" I created, it was 15 minutes work:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WotUrBnJQAc

    I could move the whole scene easily to another location or add even more enemies/SGC, just copy & paste.

  20. #20
    Staff Sergeant ZPM Odyssey's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ori/Jaffa Staffweapon

    since the Jaffa staff weapon can go completly through someone at about 3 feet and in line in the sand Samantha carter is hit by a ori staff weapon at about that and it does not go through her. Also one Naqahdah generator was enough power to hide one small house but it can hide more, about 1/3 of the town almost indefinitly. The ori staff weapon crystal only made up a small amout of the diference. the Naqahdah generator could hide the entire town but only for a tiny amout of time the crystal just gave them some extra time.

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