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What if Wray had use non violent passive resistance against Col Young?

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    What if Wray had use non violent passive resistance against Col Young?

    What if Wray had use non violent passive resistance against Col Young?

    Wray's little speech about civilian authories over the military.

    Most of the civilian crew join Wray's mutiny because Col Young abandon Dr Rush, and they believe civilian should have control over mlitary.

    It got me thinking, about Gandhi's passive resistance against British.

    Wray doesn't need a coup or mutiny against Col Young?

    Wray can organised some sort of non-violent passive resistance.
    Col Young violented Dr Rush's human right , and broke the military regulation ,and law.
    Wray can openly move agisnt Col Young.

    with action such as Strike , all civilian strike , let the military do the work .What could Col Young do ?
    Force them to work or shoot them or abandon them on the next planet.

    Hunger strike , Gandhi' did very well with huger strike .

    Dr Lisa Park could close her book club (at least only open to civilian crew member) that probably affect Greer in some way.

    #2
    I'm sorry, I thought that's what she was trying to do. She didn't steal weapons. Besides, a sit in is hard to pull off when aliens or some other crisis make it necessary that the scientists get to work.

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      #3
      Ya it was totally non violent, but a hunger strike or something wouldn't have done much good cos when hunger and dehydration sets in they aren't going to be much use fending off aliens are they... I think Dr. Rush should have locked down every single door on Col. Youngs side so they couldn't move from room to room even... it would have slowed him down enough to maybe give the civilians time to make young cave in
      I dunno what to put in here now..

      Comment


        #4
        Respectfully disagree. She and Rush threatened them with death by dehydration / starvation.

        I believe she would have been far more successful bringing legitimate concerns about safety, responsibility, control of personnel and resources to the existing commander for negotiation. They have a pretty good position of strength due to the scientific expertise they control, but it was never used as a proper negotiating tool.

        Instead she and Rush decided to use that expertise to change Col Young's best alternative to a negotiated agreement. They failed.

        In the end, their failed attempt at coup, doesn't necessarily lower their position of strength, but they have definitely strained the interpersonal relationships significantly. That makes negotiating on the actual issues far more difficult.

        Not smart in my opinion.

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by ckwongau View Post
          What if Wray had use non violent passive resistance against Col Young?

          Wray's little speech about civilian authories over the military.

          Most of the civilian crew join Wray's mutiny because Col Young abandon Dr Rush, and they believe civilian should have control over mlitary.

          It got me thinking, about Gandhi's passive resistance against British.

          Wray doesn't need a coup or mutiny against Col Young?

          Wray can organised some sort of non-violent passive resistance.
          Col Young violented Dr Rush's human right , and broke the military regulation ,and law.
          Wray can openly move agisnt Col Young.

          with action such as Strike , all civilian strike , let the military do the work .What could Col Young do ?
          Force them to work or shoot them or abandon them on the next planet.

          Hunger strike , Gandhi' did very well with huger strike .

          Dr Lisa Park could close her book club (at least only open to civilian crew member) that probably affect Greer in some way.
          ...you mean like she did use?
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            #6
            Originally posted by s09119 View Post
            ...you mean like she did use?
            cutting them off from food and water is completely different from passive resistance. Sure they may not have intended it to go far enough for anyone to get hurt but the threat of it is what is important.

            Simply going on strike or something to that effect would've been passive but trying to stage a coup is not.

            Comment


              #7
              I don't think that a more passive resistance would have been practical. All that the scientists do they do for the benefit of everybody on board. It would hurt them if they were to stop growing food or stop making repairs. As for resistance during a critical situation, that would be suicidal.

              They should sabotage the showers of all the military personel and refuse to help them in small but significant ways. The intelligent person's response to bullies.

              Comment


                #8
                I think the method she used was a non-violent protest. The military holds all the weapons and can use force - in fact, they were willing to use force. The only possible chance the civilians had was to barricade themselves in and try to hold out. It looked a lot to me like a typical sit-in protest. And her demands were extremely reasonable. Young was preventing her from contacting Earth to protest his behavior; there was no other choice.

                Actually, the plan was not Rush's at all. He goes along with Camile, helps her, for two reasons:
                1 - he was scared to death of Young which he has every to be - Young's tried to kill him twice and the implant in his chest gives Young a very good excuse to do it again
                2 - he and Chloe are hijacking Camile's plan so that they can attempt to save everyone from the aliens. They both know Young will do the absolutely wrong thing plus they need to buy time to deal with the implanted tracker in his chest.

                I thought that was the most fascinating part of the episode - not Camile's plot itself - but Rush and Chloe coopting her plot into a private plan of their own. Plots within plots - that's what makes this drama so good.

                Comment


                  #9
                  The real one wasn't very violent to begin with. And from the end it seems highly unlikely for Young to issue severe actions for the civilians and their munity. So provided in the real munity and this hypothetical one ends with the military retaking the ship I see the end result of "finding a way to work together" being the same
                  Originally posted by aretood2
                  Jelgate is right

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Non-violent protest would be refusal to take action.

                    They didn't do that. They took action.

                    They took control of the ship and threatened the other side with death by dehydration / starvation. They took a position of power, made demands and threatened death for non-compliance.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      The whole coup/mutiny/insurrection (whatever you want to call it) was poorly timed and rushed, not by the civilians but (as has been pointed out elsewhere) by the writers/producers of SGU. It had to fit in with the introduction of the common threat which is to serve as the unifying force.

                      The civilian insurrection was doomed to failure from the start. They couldn't win regardless of what they did. Go ahead and starve them out, or cut off their air and render them unconscious. Heck, go all out and kill the military types outright. All that would happen is the civilian population would devolve into anarchy. Have an election and decide on some sort of civilian government. What would they do if a portion of the society don't like the decision? Guns would be brought out (which would be under control of whoever was in the "government"). You would have another insurrection with more deaths and the process would continue until there was a handful of folks sniping at each other in the halls until such time as they died.

                      Honestly, regardless of how the civilians went about it, what kind of objectives did they have and how were they looking to enforce them assuming they were able to achieve them?:

                      1.) Disarm the military and place it under the control of the civilian population - and after the military required to be re-armed to face an outside threat, just how were they planning on getting the weapons back if the military didn't want to surrender those weapons?

                      2.) Power sharing - and who was going to decide just how that would be done? By "power sharing" I think that what Wray and company were saying is, "We want the power to tell you what to do." Were they supposed to automatically install Wray on the throne or would there be some kind of committee? Was there going to be some sort election? Would the military be allowed a vote(s) or any kind of representation? And now let's assume that a portion of the civilian population decide they don't like a particular decision their elected representatives have made. Would not the military be called in to support the elected body and if necessary use force? And because it is military force which is being applied because some civilian is saying it is okay, does that make it okay?

                      regards,
                      G.
                      Last edited by Gollumpus; 13 April 2010, 11:15 AM.
                      Go for Marty...

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Work to rule would have been the most logical course of action, but the three main protagonists (Young, Rush, Wray) have been anything but logical in their decision making.

                        The civilians have to think tactically, trying to overwhelm them militarily was playing to the soldiers strength and obviously the worst choice available. Denial of service though would eventually force Young to seek a compromise since he knows they're not going home without the scientists help.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by ckwongau View Post
                          What if Wray had use non violent passive resistance against Col Young?

                          Wray's little speech about civilian authories over the military.

                          Most of the civilian crew join Wray's mutiny because Col Young abandon Dr Rush, and they believe civilian should have control over mlitary.

                          It got me thinking, about Gandhi's passive resistance against British.

                          Wray doesn't need a coup or mutiny against Col Young?

                          Wray can organised some sort of non-violent passive resistance.
                          Col Young violented Dr Rush's human right , and broke the military regulation ,and law.
                          Wray can openly move agisnt Col Young.

                          with action such as Strike , all civilian strike , let the military do the work .What could Col Young do ?
                          Force them to work or shoot them or abandon them on the next planet.

                          Hunger strike , Gandhi' did very well with huger strike .

                          Dr Lisa Park could close her book club (at least only open to civilian crew member) that probably affect Greer in some way.
                          I don't see Gandhi as scheming, conniving and being willing to overlook a plan to frame a man for murder in order to get him out of the way just to grab power, so I think the passive resistance bit is maybe a bit much

                          also, those so called peaceful civilians were more than willing to use weapons themselves, pulling a gun on Eli as he came in. They're not passive.

                          I don't see them (Rush/Wray) as being passive at all, it doesn't seem to fit with their characters
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                          SGU-RELATED FANART | IN YOUNG WE TRUST | FANDUMB

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                            #14
                            evilgrin,

                            Originally posted by xxxevilgrinxxx View Post
                            I don't see Gandhi as scheming, conniving and being willing to overlook a plan to frame a man for murder in order to get him out of the way just to grab power, so I think the passive resistance bit is maybe a bit much

                            also, those so called peaceful civilians were more than willing to use weapons themselves, pulling a gun on Eli as he came in. They're not passive.

                            I don't see them (Rush/Wray) as being passive at all, it doesn't seem to fit with their characters
                            You do recall that Col. Young framed Dr. Franklin for attacking Col. Telford, right?
                            All plot and no character makes for a dull story... All plot and no character makes for a dull story... All plot and no character makes for a dull story... All plot and no character makes for a dull story...

                            "Scott isn't out. Actually, he'll probably soon get back in, then out, then in, then out, then in, with rhythm and stamina." reddevil 4/22/2010

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                              #15
                              The question wasn't "how imperfect is Young", it was the civilians, under Rush/Wray using passive resistance. Gandhi was mentioned I don't believe that Rush/Wray are wired to use passive resistance, so no
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                              SGU-RELATED FANART | IN YOUNG WE TRUST | FANDUMB

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