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  1. #21
    Lieutenant General thekillman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    well before we go that way i'd like to see the god goauld first. later on it might change, and even later the LA would make full use of the potential. but essentially a "well of eternal youth" created by a god of healing indeed would be nice and fitting.


    intar do need some tweaking in order to prevent them from being too uber. i liked the need for multiple hits to stun. allows our heroes to be hit a few times without instant stun.


    staffweapons are nice, i like them, they're iconic. but after a few years, once the goauld start their process of realisation, they might switch to better weapon.



    i'd like to establish one rule:


    -whatever we can find, whatever we can think of, our enemy can do that too.

    the goauld might at first be different, but yes we can have one-off or short-arc enemies that are more intelligent. the Aschen should be a highly intelligent but also local threat.

  2. #22
    Chief Master Sergeant the-alguroan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    i would like to join.

    I agree that the staff weapons should have some other versions. if the gate program is a sercet orgazation type thing, doesn't that limit personal and resources?
    time doesn't go in a linear path like everyone thinks, time is a ball of timey wimey wibbly wobblely uh....

    Google won't search for Chuck Norris because it knows you don't find Chuck Norris, he finds you.

  3. #23
    First Lieutenant lord groovy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    Just 2 questions :

    - are all the Goa'ulds supposed to be bad guys? can we have delusionnal ones that really think they are benevolent gods and just mess up with lesser race while trying to make them better?

    - what are the civilization associated with the goa'ulds? ancient egypt and greece? what else?
    La vie est une tragédie - Tout le monde meurt à la fin.
    L'Histoire est une comédie - Les gentils gagnent toujours à la fin.

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  4. #24
    Brigadier General Crazy Tom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    OK, I'm a bit late to the party.

    I've read the first pages and I've already lost track of a lot of things. Can I propose that we take this one episode at a time? Starting with Children of the Gods and working out way forward, changing bits and pieces that need changing and adding new stories where required as we go along?

    This would give us a solid foundation from which to build upward and it would make it easier to keep track of events, developments, new tactics and tech that's been added, etc.

    What do you guys think?

    PS. Killman has a point on several issues: The Jaffa foremost, their armor is supposed to be made out of trinium and naqudah so we should have them take a lot more punishment before going down, and the same for their staff weapons, in the movie and in COTG they were far more powerful than later in the series.

  5. #25
    Brigadier General Crazy Tom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    Quote Originally Posted by lord groovy View Post
    Just 2 questions :

    - are all the Goa'ulds supposed to be bad guys? can we have delusionnal ones that really think they are benevolent gods and just mess up with lesser race while trying to make them better?

    - what are the civilization associated with the goa'ulds? ancient egypt and greece? what else?
    Not all of them. The tok'ra are technically the same species for example, but a different culture. And it's the System Lords who are the really ego-maniacal ones. I'd like to see more minor goa'uld like Killman. In fact, I propose ahead of time that we capture a few of these to give us a leg up with out alien tech research.
    I say, plant some pressurized sleeping gas across the market place on the day of some public celebration of a minor Goa'uld where all his homies are expected to come out and vie for his favors than release it int eh middle of the celebration. Come in, kidnap all the Goa'uld, strip the place of any and all useful tech, and bug out before anyone wakes up. More dangerous than a more limited spec ops raid, but the physiological value should make up for it.

    As to cultures, any and all. The Goa'uld came after those cultures developed and took up the forms of pre-existing deities.

  6. #26
    Major Daryl Froggy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    So this new fleet is absolutely going for an AU sort of direction? Also if so how Alternate will it go?

  7. #27
    First Lieutenant lord groovy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Crazy Tom View Post
    Not all of them. The tok'ra are technically the same species for example, but a different culture. And it's the System Lords who are the really ego-maniacal ones.
    Well I was thinking on Goa'ulds like Hathor (sex, drug and rock'n'roll) or the other one on that planet where people live only a few days. Basically, people working for them would enjoy every last of the few days they have to live while still being enslaved.

    I'd like to see more minor goa'uld like Killman. In fact, I propose ahead of time that we capture a few of these to give us a leg up with out alien tech research.
    I say, plant some pressurized sleeping gas across the market place on the day of some public celebration of a minor Goa'uld where all his homies are expected to come out and vie for his favors than release it int eh middle of the celebration. Come in, kidnap all the Goa'uld, strip the place of any and all useful tech, and bug out before anyone wakes up. More dangerous than a more limited spec ops raid, but the physiological value should make up for it.
    Well that's an idea I'd like to give to the Free Jaffa. If we are going to have an Alternate Universe, that's probably the kind of stunt that could make them powerful allies. It could be used also against some Tok'ra operatives acting as minor Goa'ulds.

    Can I propose that we take this one episode at a time? Starting with Children of the Gods and working out way forward, changing bits and pieces that need changing and adding new stories where required as we go along?
    For start, what about looking at the Goa'uld side of the story.

    I remember that on Chulak, Apophis had a city (that we never saw after COTG) with people living there quite comfortably.

    I always thought that they were in charge of the planet administration and wondered why Apophis trusted them with that job when he had all those other Goa'ulds at his service. Maybe we can have one posing as the political or spiritual leader of his cult on Chulak.

    Spoiler:






    Minor Goaulds accompanying Apophis :
    Spoiler:
    La vie est une tragédie - Tout le monde meurt à la fin.
    L'Histoire est une comédie - Les gentils gagnent toujours à la fin.

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  8. #28
    Lieutenant General thekillman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    i'm not talking episodes, i'm talking about roles. the episodes i named were ones i liked, and are what i'd like to see: the ancients, as a very dead race with the occasional trinket and nice device left behind. the asgard as a power but incapable of intervention in the MW, simply because they have better things to do. the Nox should have a somewhat bigger role as a sanctuary.



    again i would like to start differently from the beginning.



    my idea of the start:


    -in approx. 1995 the gate was first activated. on the other side was a nice planet, the gate being near the northern hemisphere, with canada/sweden esque surroundings: snow, cold, pine-tree-like-trees, and the sort of stuff you'd expect at such temperatures. a research base was set up. after nothing major happened for several months, the gate contact became less and less, as each gate activation takes quite some power. a young scientist named Carter figured out the adress system, and used earth's stellar maps to calculate adresses to other nearby planets. a dialling programme was started, and within the year, 4 more planets were found. the first planet found was called the Alpha site, and the other planets named accordingly: the Beta, Gamma, Delta, Epsilon site. on one planet, a crashed ship was found, on the others remnants of alien populations and some technology. by 2000 all planets had research bases and we were exploring these planets. in Rosswell the ship that crashed there has been studied for many years aswel. the G8 funds the entire programme, from the research stations to the crashed ship research.

    the story starts in 2010, 10 years later.

    from here we can take off in several directions.


    -we have built the first interstellar ship and we follow this ship as it explores the galaxy, using a galactic map from one of the crashed ships.

    -we fully figure out the gate system and start exploration from the Alpha site. gate adresses are found in the alien ships.

  9. #29
    Major locutes's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    I like that, more of a combo between trek and gate, great idea! Yet it is still gate.

  10. #30
    Major bradly08's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    Interesting, count me in, i have a great idea for a brand new race of humans

    "Oddly, this is familiar to you, as if it were from an old dream, but you can't exactly remember..."

  11. #31
    Major General immhotep's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    Personally i dont think the idea of wiping out SG1 entirely, i saw that we use SG1 as a base but set our own style up for the continuation. We continue with the war with the goauld, as i would have been if say anubis had not come. So from S6/7. We have our first offworld bases, and our first ship and our first major allies offworld and organised in to a resistance. If from then we continue making bases offworld, set up a smaller network of naquadah mines and begin production of ships from a captured drydock of the goauld, perhaps the one we found in orpheus. We use the goauld drydock but modify and upgrade the plans for goauld ships, incorporating human weapons and elements in to the design. This gives us a foothold from which to launch. We know enough about the goauld and the universe but the uber stuff hasnt happened yet.

    You are the fifth race, your role is clear, if there is any hope in preserving the future it lies with you and your people ~ 8years for those words
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  12. #32
    First Lieutenant guppy338's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    i would like to help i have ideas on the sort of weapons the humans could use in space

  13. #33
    Lieutenant General thekillman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    the pain i have is that some things have been done wrong from the start. we can't make it...better without starting from the beginning. nobody's done this before yet we have the knowledge, the expertise to make this work. using SG1 as a basis is simply overdone and doing it from the beginning has never been done, and though ambitious, we can pull it off. i would like to add in a large amount of common sense and realism. two things that partially lacked from the beginning of SG1, not through writers mistakes ( well, partially) but mostly through budget restraints.


    the goauld weapon yields are a pain in the ass. i think KT weapons are just fine, allows PLENTY of advancements and explorations. besides, i think the equivalent of a KT nuke spammer mounted on ships is sufficiently dreading on it's own. shields would be MT level, so our nukes are resisted. i'm not sure how strong they should be, but there's a big difference in storing humongous amounts of energy in capacitors, and refilling that over a long time, and constantly outputting KT's of energy. i'd say a MT or 500 would be sufficient for goauld shields.

    another pain are some aspects of Naquahdah. the described volatility would make it impossible for the stuff to exist on any planet without annihilating it over a few million year period. chemically it should be relatively inert, so it has incredibly strong chemical bonds but it's not volatile. also, it's fissionable in a clean way, so for nukes it's great, but the energy density should be lower. otherwise it makes no sense for a goauld not to nuke their worst enemies with baseball-sized nukes.

  14. #34
    Lieutenant Colonel Dr Lee's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    I have an idea for a small group of Tau'ri and the few ships is would be able to create and operate....it needs a bit of fine tuning and knowing just where we're starting from before i can finish the idea.... but it would involve the two ships in my sig
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  15. #35
    First Lieutenant lord groovy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    Whatever the case, the first ship we make should be like the Prometheus : a half operational battleship made from scavenged tech.

    The weapons and shields should be weaker than their Goauld's counterparts while the sublight and/or the hyperdrives faster. We are not yet strong enough to fight the goa'ulds heads on but we can outrun them, ambush them, 3 to 1.

    If we keep the generic idea that "more energy = better tech", at least have some uber-weapons we can only use for a short time before they burn out. No need to have the whole ship destroyed or sacrificing itself by ramming the enemy, just let it buy time until it can fire its main cannon, reduce everything to ashes, make it home in several pieces then rest in peace in a museum.

    Oh I like your idea killman but I'd like the story to start a little earlier than 1995.

    Why not start at Heliopolis in 1945? It could very well be the reason why the story is different. This time the scientists didn't give up and managed to rescue Ernest Littlefield. It could be through sporadic gate activations with people and materials being sent through the gate until they manage to make a dialing program similar to the one used later at the SGC.

    If it finally occurs in the 60s, it would give us 50 years to finally understand how the gate works, explore heliopolis, find maybe a ship to replicate, build a significant Alpha site and finally gather other countries' support (G8 or G20 your call). Then Carter make a discovery in 1995 and we can start exploring Beta, Gamma and Epsilon site. 2010 will be the first time we encounter an alien intelligent race. Could be the Goa'ulds, the Tok'ra, the Jaffa or any other human race that could explain to us what's happening out there.
    La vie est une tragédie - Tout le monde meurt à la fin.
    L'Histoire est une comédie - Les gentils gagnent toujours à la fin.

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  16. #36
    First Lieutenant guppy338's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    i think that earth only use projectile weapons or lazers at the exstreme allredy have or can get with grater ease it will also help with yeld calcs

  17. #37
    First Lieutenant guppy338's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    Why not start at Heliopolis in 1945?
    i like it it give you a longer time sort out were you are going with it

  18. #38
    Major General immhotep's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    See correcting every mistake of SG1 from the begining wont heal all the wounds and it makes things so much more difficult. It would be far better to put it in the future, but with an alternate timeline in which the goauld have resurfaced but with better tech and equipment. We wiped out the system lords etc, but new goauld have emerged that are more adept and savvy in using thier technology. Perhaps even the old trust.

    You are the fifth race, your role is clear, if there is any hope in preserving the future it lies with you and your people ~ 8years for those words
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  19. #39
    Lieutenant General thekillman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    well it might work, with the Heliopolis database being one source of info.

    i think that earth only use projectile weapons or lazers at the exstreme allredy have or can get with grater ease it will also help with yeld calcs
    i think that earth should only use projectile weapons. maybe lasers at the extreme. we already have them or we can get them with greater ease. it will also help with yield calculations.
    is that an accurate translation?

    i think that our first ship could be crude. but more from a technical standpoint than just using scavenged materials. also i think that it should be slower and weaker at every point. no need to defeat ha'tak in 1vs1 battle. i was thinking of filling up the gaps a bit. i've designed two goauld ships and i've seen other designs as well. the ha'tak should be a baseship: a ship that also functions as a mobile base. we need a weaker, smaller ship to be used by the goauld so we don't have something too powerful.


    also i don't think we should have ships available immediately.

    If we keep the generic idea that "more energy = better tech", at least have some uber-weapons we can only use for a short time before they burn out. No need to have the whole ship destroyed or sacrificing itself by ramming the enemy, just let it buy time until it can fire its main cannon, reduce everything to ashes, make it home in several pieces then rest in peace in a museum.
    i've been thinking of a greater variety in approaches for ships but also weapons.

    introducing:


    -damage types. this is for general indication, something bigger or more advanced or designed differently has different effects.

    Particle: a particle cannon has little effect on shields. it does drain them somewhat. for the most part, the energy is converted to heat, which leaks through the shields onto the hull. a ship under siege by such weapons is more likely to have molten armor than a depleted shield. against armor it's like a weak directed nuke, easily cutting through the thickest armor.

    Plasma: Plasma cannons are 40/60 weapons so to speak. against shields they're pretty effective (the 60), against armor somewhat effective (the 40). plasma depletes shields and explodes on contact, as the containment field that keeps the bolt intact is disrupted. plasma leakthrough effect: damage to the ship, both physical and electric.

    Ion: ion weapons have great effect against shields. shields deplete quite fast when targeted by these weapons. if the shield integrity drops below 100%, damage to electronics easily happens. unlike plasma weapon leakthrough effect, this damage is more severe and closer to EMP.

    Thermal: weapons that depend upon a fusion reaction cause explosions on contact. moderately effective against shields, moderately effective against armor. 60/40, the reverse of the plasma weapon. leakthrough: thermal radation and other radiation forms

    Nuke: unlike Thermo(which is a plasma blast undergoing fusion/made of fissioning materials), nukes explode when detonated and they release all energy in an instant. depending on the fuel, the effects wildly vary. against armor, the shockwave can generate a lot of extra damage. against shields, it creates a sudden drop in shield power. often causes a radiation leakthrough.



    Fusion cannons are pretty badass but also pretty primitive. i would like earth to have some. unlike plasma cannons, Fusion cannons have a bolt that increases in energy as it moves. depending on the impact, it could cause a sudden chain reaction and violently explode, or just impact as a regular plasma bolt.



    also:

    i've been thinking of introducing more elements than just the one's we've seen.

    note: names are just ones i made up, this wasn't though of on spot


    Spoiler:
    -Illium. comes in 3 isotopes: stable, mildly radioactive(half-time of thousands of years), and heavily radioactive(half-life of hours to days) liquid, relatively low melting and boiling point. the stable form releases the least energy. higher abundance than Naquahdah, releases less energy.

    -Xerium. comes in just 1 stable isotope. higher atomic number than Illium. non-radioactive, non-fissionable, extraordinarily chemically reactive. on the Periodic table, it would be under Lithium, sodium, and francium etc.
    Xerium salts are numerous and have wildly varying material qualities. solid at room temperature.

    -Valarium. noble gas. radioactive, half-life varies wildly between isotopes. the most stable has a half-life of many millions of years. fissionable, highest energy density of all. there are no Valarium salts, the material is difficult to work with. hard to find.

    others:
    -Naquahdah. i believe it should have a lower energy density.

    -Naquahdriah. element of it's own, radioactive, unstable, but higher energy density than Valarium, which in turn has a highe energy density than Naquahdah.

    -Trinium. stable, non-radioactive, non-fissionable material with extremely high strenght and incredible material properties. the same Exotic Particle Field that keeps these superatoms from degrading (the same exotic particles that Naquahdriah releases on fission) massively increases the Material Properties of Trinium

    -Neutronium. highest atomic number of all. ultra-hard to find. incredible material properties. it's incredibility is only matched by it's rarity and impossibility to be processed. only advanced races with extensive knowledge of this stuff can actually use it for construction.



    uses: (radioactive) Illium takes over the use of Liquid Naquadhah, as the material in itself never made a whole lot of sense to me.

    power density and material incredibility are inversely related to their abundance: the more incredible, the less abundant. the higher the powerdensity, the lower the abundance. Naquahdriah holds the lowest abundance among the Power dense, Neutronium among the Material Incredible.

    Naquahdriah should be the rarest: it's radioactive, and as it's name implies, comes from Naquahdah. natural Naquahdriah has already decayed, artificial is possible. *or recently formed*

    Neutronium is the hardest to find. with it's density and all, on planets it'll be located inside the core.

  20. #40
    Lieutenant General thekillman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

    See correcting every mistake of SG1 from the begining wont heal all the wounds and it makes things so much more difficult. It would be far better to put it in the future, but with an alternate timeline in which the goauld have resurfaced but with better tech and equipment. We wiped out the system lords etc, but new goauld have emerged that are more adept and savvy in using thier technology. Perhaps even the old trust.
    we don't have to correct mistakes. we just know so much more now than the writers ever did back then.

    we have the expertise and knowledge. you have a lot of experience, i have experience, tom has experience, we're no science dummies, we have people who want to help, and i know at least a few of them have fleet experience and well, we can pull it off.


    what is the purpose of the fleet? you of all people know that.

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