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  1. #61
    Captain Ashizuri's Avatar
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by flynn1959 View Post
    Other than the fact that it would show the characters, and by extension the US military, in a very bad light and even that doesn't seem relevant anymore.
    How do you know this supposed confirmation/romantic scene isn't set after Jack retires? Or after Sam is wounded so bad she is medically discharged? Or Jack is fired? Sure, none of those scenarios are very likely at all, but we don't know how or when the "romance" happens so the idea that it will show the military in a bad light is pure speculation at this point.

    Besides, this is a show where a General (Landry) went on a personal vacation with his subordinates. I can't see how Sam/Jack would be considered any more inappropriate than that.

    After all the Sam and Jack in the movies won't be the real S/J will they? I've lost track of all the AU/AT etc but there is no way that any of the characters are the same ones that started season one! Don't you agree?
    If thats the case, then it doesn't matter if Daniel's in the movie because he's not the Daniel we started out with. No need for Teal'c either. Why not just get a whole new team.

    None of the fans of other pairings do.
    Really, this isn't a Sam/Jack-only issue. I've seen Daniel/Vala fans want confirmation. I've seen fans of every pairing in every fandom want confirmation. I've been one of those fans on occassion.

    TPTB have led Sam/Jack fans on a merry chase for years, always teasing and never following through. I hope this time they actually get the moment they're hoping for.
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  2. #62
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    This is also a show with co-leaders(cam and sam, MASSIVE NO-NO, military loves a clear chain of command) , nepotism on the base (lam and landry shouldn't even be serving ON the same base, much less be reporting to each other. Not when he's the CO. Since he's the CO, she'd never be allowed to serve there. and nepotism is a bigger issue than frat regs), plus tons of other random little things that the real military would frown upon. (tank tops as part of the uniform, random hair issues, characters wearing medals for wars they weren't old enough to fight in)

    Keeping the Air Force completely and totally happy hasn't been a concern of the writers for years now.

  3. #63
    Captain Ashizuri's Avatar
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Skydiver View Post
    Keeping the Air Force completely and totally happy hasn't been a concern of the writers for years now.
    Very, very true. And I've said it before, but the rules and regs only seem to get brought up in regards to Jack and Sam. (At least that I've noticed.)
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  4. #64
    Lieutenant Colonel VSS's Avatar
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Skydiver View Post
    Keeping the Air Force completely and totally happy hasn't been a concern of the writers for years now.
    That's probably true. But just in case it is a concern, what and whom Jack is directly in charge of has been unclear ever since he left the SGC.

    As long as he's not clearly her direct superior, I can't see many people getting too torqued about it at this stage.
    Last edited by VSS; January 13th, 2010 at 01:07 PM.


  5. #65
    Acme Lab Student Engineer leiasky's Avatar
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by VSS View Post

    As long as he's not clearly her direct superior, I can't see many people getting too torqued about it at this stage.

    That's the crux right there. Only the most rabid fans ARE even concerned about it. (for or against, it doesn't matter). No one else cares. And as evidenced by SGU, nor do the writers care about relationships within the chain of command.
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  6. #66
    Major Petra's Avatar
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by flynn1959 View Post
    Why do people who ship S/J even feel the need for confirmation? None of the fans of other pairings do. I mean people have been slashing Jack and Daniel since the first movie, there is a vast amount of fan fiction devoted to that ship, endless websites, fan art, fans, heck even the actors themselves played into it to a much greater extent than they did S/J. It has been talked about at cons at least as much as the S/J ship, maybe more, even mentioned on the episode commentaries, and yet J/D fans are not clamouring for confirmation, far from it! What make S/J worthy of more than a blink and you miss it confirmation above all the other ships?
    Can you give some examples? From what I've read neither MS nor RDA were particularly thrilled with their characters being slashed and the scenes were changed specifically to avoid slash contex (locker scene from Fallen comes to mind) so what you say in news to me.
    Just don't say "wedding" in 200 because this episode was making fun of everything in fandom I mean actual episodes.

    About S/J in the third movie..as a shipper of course I'd like to have some confirmation but while I wouldn't be unhappy with a big kiss or something along these lines I'd prefer something more subtle. Mentions of their home or vacations spent together or some photos showing them as a couple would work just fine for me.

    The placement of the "romantic scene" BW wrote also doesn't matter to me as long as it's not at the very end - this should belong to The Team. 4 of them or 7 of them, whatever whoever likes, but the whole team, together. I just think that S/J scene at the very beginning would be easier to do (and to swallow ), plus it would save time spent on notifying the characters about the new challenge.
    Last edited by Petra; January 13th, 2010 at 01:46 PM.

  7. #67
    John Druitt Frostfox's Avatar
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by col aga View Post
    Can you give some examples? From what I've read neither MS nor RDA were particularly thrilled with their characters being slashed and the scenes were changed specifically to avoid slash contex (locker scene from Fallen comes to mind) so what you say in news to me.
    Just don't say "wedding" in 200 because this episode was making fun of everything in fandom I mean actual episodes.
    Well, this article is about 200 but the stuff about the slashy out-takes in the wedding scene is near the end of the article and RDA seems quite relaxed about it.
    http://www.tvguide.com/news/Richard-...son-39758.aspx

    Edited to put the relivant, brief quote here.

    Anderson goes off to rehearse the big wedding scene. Sam (Amanda Tapping) is the bride, and Daniel (Michael Shanks) is the best man. No doubt saluting the fans who want Jack and Daniel to hook up, they do a couple of "Brokeback" takes. In one, Richard takes the bouquet out of Amanda's hands and gives it to Michael. In another, Richard takes Michael's hand at the altar, which causes the assembled cast and crew to erupt in applause. (You'll just have to watch to see what ends up on air.)

    TV Guide: That was cute, the hand-holding with Michael.
    Anderson: [Laughs] Over the years, it's been alluded to, so we did that just for us.

    And, from the same article, RDA on Sam and Jack -
    TV Guide: Should Jack and Sam wind up together at the end of the series?
    Anderson: I know it's a pressing issue for the fans, but luckily we've been able to justify not just doing it for doing-it's sake. There's always been something that's kept us apart, obviously. But I don't know whether there should be an allusion to it at the end, whenever the series goes its merry way.

    FF
    Last edited by Frostfox; January 13th, 2010 at 01:54 PM.

  8. #68
    Lieutenant Colonel Aragon101's Avatar
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by col aga View Post
    Can you give some examples? From what I've read neither MS nor RDA were particularly thrilled with their characters being slashed and the scenes were changed specifically to avoid slash contex (locker scene from Fallen comes to mind) so what you say in news to me.
    Just don't say "wedding" in 200 because this episode was making fun of everything in fandom I mean actual episodes.
    I'm no slasher, but off the top of my head i'm sure there are many "Slashy" scenes in just about any heavy Daniel episode. It's less that it's intrinsically slashy, and more that it can be interpreted that way.

    I keep forgetting Skydiver's analogy, but a scene can mean 4-5 differnt things. it think the one she likes to use is 48 hours with Sam working on saving Teal'c. It can mean one of several things.

    Then again, TPTB have been VERY clear that they WANT Sam/Jack. and nothing is going to stop that. And i do mean absolutely nothing.

    Riker and Troi. That's how i see it. It doesn't add to each character, only make me sad for them to have waited so long.

    I still think it'll be the last scene of their characters. probably just Sam standing there on teh bridge of the Hammond, and Jack sidling up and taking her hand revealing some rings or something. that's about as overt and subtle as you can get at the same time.

    Or, antoher possibility is that they'll leave hints, but leave it ambigious. I almost hope for this because then, it's left to the viewer to decide.
    Quote Originally Posted by Apostle's Message Redux
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  9. #69
    Captain Ashizuri's Avatar
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by col aga View Post
    Can you give some examples? From what I've read neither MS nor RDA were particularly thrilled with their characters being slashed and the scenes were changed specifically to avoid slash contex (locker scene from Fallen comes to mind) so what you say in news to me.
    I recall seeing an interview or two where MS talked about how they played Jack and Daniel's arguments like "two old queens" or an "old married couple." MS joked about it a lot, but it always seemed to me that he was playing it up for the audience's reaction but that he certainly didn't really feel that way about the characters. At least, that's how I took it, and I would consider myself a Jack/Daniel slasher.
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  10. #70
    Major Petra's Avatar
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Frostfox View Post
    Well, this article is about 200 but the stuff about the slashy out-takes in the wedding scene is near the end of the article and RDA seems quite relaxed about it.
    http://www.tvguide.com/news/Richard-...son-39758.aspx

    Edited to put the relivant, brief quote here.

    Anderson goes off to rehearse the big wedding scene. Sam (Amanda Tapping) is the bride, and Daniel (Michael Shanks) is the best man. No doubt saluting the fans who want Jack and Daniel to hook up, they do a couple of "Brokeback" takes. In one, Richard takes the bouquet out of Amanda's hands and gives it to Michael. In another, Richard takes Michael's hand at the altar, which causes the assembled cast and crew to erupt in applause. (You'll just have to watch to see what ends up on air.)

    TV Guide: That was cute, the hand-holding with Michael.
    Anderson: [Laughs] Over the years, it's been alluded to, so we did that just for us.

    And, from the same article, RDA on Sam and Jack -
    TV Guide: Should Jack and Sam wind up together at the end of the series?
    Anderson: I know it's a pressing issue for the fans, but luckily we've been able to justify not just doing it for doing-it's sake. There's always been something that's kept us apart, obviously. But I don't know whether there should be an allusion to it at the end, whenever the series goes its merry way.

    FF
    Thanks for the link, it was a great interview (gotta love RDA's humour)
    But, as I said, I can't take anything related to "200" seriously as it wasn't meant seriously. They poked fun at almost every section of the fandom, all the major rifts etc. If slash wasn't mentioned I'd be wondering why it was left out.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aragon101
    I'm no slasher, but off the top of my head i'm sure there are many "Slashy" scenes in just about any heavy Daniel episode. It's less that it's intrinsically slashy, and more that it can be interpreted that way.
    Exactly, interpreted. People can interpret anything they want into any given scene; but I don't think any scene was ever seriously meant/filmed to be slashy? Or at least I've never noticed anything of the sort.

    I still think it'll be the last scene of their characters. probably just Sam standing there on teh bridge of the Hammond, and Jack sidling up and taking her hand revealing some rings or something. that's about as overt and subtle as you can get at the same time.

    Or, antoher possibility is that they'll leave hints, but leave it ambigious. I almost hope for this because then, it's left to the viewer to decide.
    Ah, see, this first option works for me. After all nobody wants to see them dating or getting their act together; the confirmation the shippers are after is the confirmation that S/J have been together since Threads meaning: in a serious relationship for years now.

    What I don't want to see is ambiguity. Resolve the issue either way, but just do it already!

    Quote Originally Posted by Ashizuri
    I recall seeing an interview or two where MS talked about how they played Jack and Daniel's arguments like "two old queens" or an "old married couple." MS joked about it a lot, but it always seemed to me that he was playing it up for the audience's reaction but that he certainly didn't really feel that way about the characters. At least, that's how I took it, and I would consider myself a Jack/Daniel slasher.
    Thanks hon. I'm not gonna argue because I've never been interested in slash and my impression that the actors weren't fans of the idea is from reading a few MS interviews (in SFX and such) when he talked about it being weird or something and changing this scene from Fallen which I already mentioned. But as I've never delved into the subject I probably don't know squat

    Thanks for the replies everybody!

  11. #71
    John Druitt Frostfox's Avatar
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by col aga View Post
    Thanks for the link, it was a great interview (gotta love RDA's humour)
    But, as I said, I can't take anything related to "200" seriously as it wasn't meant seriously. They poked fun at almost every section of the fandom, all the major rifts etc. If slash wasn't mentioned I'd be wondering why it was left out.
    Completely agree about 200 not being taken seriously, but in the interview, RDA doesn't seem to be bothered by the question, indeed, he instigates it by fooling about on set in the first place. As big a star as RDA will have had approval on the article, if he wasn't comfortable, the question would not have seen the light of day.
    And, an aside, as a slasher I can't tell you how happy it makes me to read that the cast and crew applauded when RDA hands MS the bouquet.

    FF

  12. #72
    General majorsal's Avatar
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Skydiver View Post
    subtle would be good. Like i said, each wearing rings, sam responding to colonel o'neill (or not responding), a wedding photo on a desk. there but not a major plot focus.
    is a kiss too 'not subtle'?

    me wants a kiss!!!!!

    i mean, i want sam and jack to kiss!
    sally


  13. #73
    Major Petra's Avatar
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Frostfox View Post
    Completely agree about 200 not being taken seriously, but in the interview, RDA doesn't seem to be bothered by the question, indeed, he instigates it by fooling about on set in the first place. As big a star as RDA will have had approval on the article, if he wasn't comfortable, the question would not have seen the light of day.
    And, an aside, as a slasher I can't tell you how happy it makes me to read that the cast and crew applauded when RDA hands MS the bouquet.

    FF
    As I said, it appears that I was mistaken It happens
    About your last sentence; I'm a shipper and even I was glad to read it. Good to know that folks involved in the series are tolerant, open-minded and with a great sense of humour in real life too.

  14. #74
    General majorsal's Avatar
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    i'm going to take the bait.

    Quote Originally Posted by flynn1959 View Post
    Why would confirming S/J be a big deal? Other than the fact that it would show the characters, and by extension the US military, in a very bad light and even that doesn't seem relevant anymore.
    if they confirm sam and jack are in a relationship, it'll be with the military's approval. so no bad lighty stuff.

    Why do people who ship S/J even feel the need for confirmation?
    the s/j storyline is one that's been done on the show for years. it's shown they went from attraction to feelings to love. ppl that like this storyline want to see if they truly ended up together.

    None of the fans of other pairings do. I mean people have been slashing Jack and Daniel since the first movie, there is a vast amount of fan fiction devoted to that ship, endless websites, fan art, fans, heck even the actors themselves played into it to a much greater extent than they did S/J. It has been talked about at cons at least as much as the S/J ship, maybe more, even mentioned on the episode commentaries, and yet J/D fans are not clamouring for confirmation, far from it! What make S/J worthy of more than a blink and you miss it confirmation above all the other ships?
    jack/daniel wasn't real, meaning it was never shown or acknowledged on the show, in episodes. there's no equality between the two ships, b/c one was actually done on the series and the other was wanted by some fans.
    sally


  15. #75
    General majorsal's Avatar
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by col aga View Post

    What I don't want to see is ambiguity. Resolve the issue either way, but just do it already!
    it's went on for *so* long, and i really believe this 3rd movie will be the end... no more games, no more stretching it out, b/c there prob won't be another chance to tie up this storyline. so yeah, ambiguous has been done over and over...
    sally


  16. #76

    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by majorsal View Post
    i'm going to take the bait.



    if they confirm sam and jack are in a relationship, it'll be with the military's approval. so no bad lighty stuff.



    the s/j storyline is one that's been done on the show for years. it's shown they went from attraction to feelings to love. ppl that like this storyline want to see if they truly ended up together.



    jack/daniel wasn't real, meaning it was never shown or acknowledged on the show, in episodes. there's no equality between the two ships, b/c one was actually done on the series and the other was wanted by some fans.
    Well, that's your opinion and you are entitled to it. S/J has never been actually done on the series, that's my opinion. Of course if you can provide one shread of actual proof, non ambiguous, unequivocal, honest to goodness proof I would be willing to change my opinion.


    Jack and Daniel...the old married couple.

  17. #77
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    Cool Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by majorsal View Post
    is a kiss too 'not subtle'?

    me wants a kiss!!!!!

    i mean, i want sam and jack to kiss!
    One big honkin'-not-AU-nonalien-inspired-never-time-rest KISS!

    Quote Originally Posted by majorsal View Post
    it's went on for *so* long, and i really believe this 3rd movie will be the end... no more games, no more stretching it out, b/c there prob won't be another chance to tie up this storyline. so yeah, ambiguous has been done over and over...
    *nod nod* yep it's about freakin' time!

  18. #78
    Chief Master Sergeant never_on_earth's Avatar
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Ashizuri View Post
    How do you know this supposed confirmation/romantic scene isn't set after Jack retires? Or after Sam is wounded so bad she is medically discharged? Or Jack is fired? Sure, none of those scenarios are very likely at all, but we don't know how or when the "romance" happens so the idea that it will show the military in a bad light is pure speculation at this point.

    Besides, this is a show where a General (Landry) went on a personal vacation with his subordinates. I can't see how Sam/Jack would be considered any more inappropriate than that.



    If thats the case, then it doesn't matter if Daniel's in the movie because he's not the Daniel we started out with. No need for Teal'c either. Why not just get a whole new team.



    Really, this isn't a Sam/Jack-only issue. I've seen Daniel/Vala fans want confirmation. I've seen fans of every pairing in every fandom want confirmation. I've been one of those fans on occassion.

    TPTB have led Sam/Jack fans on a merry chase for years, always teasing and never following through. I hope this time they actually get the moment they're hoping for.
    Quote Originally Posted by col aga View Post
    Can you give some examples? From what I've read neither MS nor RDA were particularly thrilled with their characters being slashed and the scenes were changed specifically to avoid slash contex (locker scene from Fallen comes to mind) so what you say in news to me.
    Just don't say "wedding" in 200 because this episode was making fun of everything in fandom I mean actual episodes.

    About S/J in the third movie..as a shipper of course I'd like to have some confirmation but while I wouldn't be unhappy with a big kiss or something along these lines I'd prefer something more subtle. Mentions of their home or vacations spent together or some photos showing them as a couple would work just fine for me.

    The placement of the "romantic scene" BW wrote also doesn't matter to me as long as it's not at the very end - this should belong to The Team. 4 of them or 7 of them, whatever whoever likes, but the whole team, together. I just think that S/J scene at the very beginning would be easier to do (and to swallow ), plus it would save time spent on notifying the characters about the new challenge.
    Exactly!

    And I have absolutely nothing against other ships, slashes included. Thank you for the interview, and the bit about how jack/daniel slash is taken by the cast and crew. I think it's nice. Besides, you know, I've always thought that Sam and Teal'c made a good couple, and I'm sure that during the 50 odd years they spent on the ship in unending, something happenned between them. And I'm fine with that. It just doesn't prevent me from wanting sam and jack ship and even confirmation in the 3rd movie 'cause I think they're are too good together to be left apart. MO.
    Last edited by never_on_earth; January 14th, 2010 at 06:04 AM. Reason: There's been a bug with quoting

  19. #79
    Lieutenant Colonel kymeric's Avatar
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    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by flynn1959 View Post
    Um .. wouldn't Cassie be in her twenties now?
    Still needs a family. Somewhere to visit on holidays. 20s about the age where u grow out of the college partying and go looking for family. Unless shes found a BF and is leeching off him.

  20. #80

    Default Re: My thoughts about Sam and Jack in the third movie * spec and spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by kymeric View Post
    Still needs a family. Somewhere to visit on holidays. 20s about the age where u grow out of the college partying and go looking for family. Unless shes found a BF and is leeching off him.
    Yes, that's true but surely Janet had family, after all she was the one who adopted Cassie. Why would she look to Jack and Sam? And I'm sure a woman in her mid to late twenties could indeed have a boyfriend. Not sure about leeching off him! I don't think there is any way we will see Cassie in the movie, or have any of the characters reference her.


    Jack and Daniel...the old married couple.

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