The End of Time, Part 2 (2009)

[PMN1]

Vampires does not equate to Twilight - believe it or not, Vampires were around long before those damn movies/books.

I liked the 90's TV series 'Ultraviolet'....too bad they only made 6 episodes.

[Reefgirl]

Spoiler:

I agree with EVERYTHING that you have said here.

I'm not an RTD 'hater', he deserves a lot of credit as producer, but as a writer I don't appreciate him. He frankly reminds me of a fanfiction writer - his stories have that level of quality to me.

Let's take New Who S2 for example, all the fantastic episodes like Impossible Planet, or School Reunion, WEREN'T RTD, instead he delivered us the attrocious Army of Ghosts with it's horrifically fanwanky battle between Daleks and Cybermen - seriously, this is the sort of crap you get in forums *looks around - ah...* where fans like to argue about 'who would win???1' it may be amusing to discuss, but it should NOT be brought onto screen, it's tacky. He's also responsible for that damn ending of Doomsday with Rose. Ergh. Oh we can also blame him for Love and Monsters.

Runaway Bride? Atrocious. Honestly awful with the exception of the scene where the Doctor actually kills the Racnos.

Don't get me wrong, he's also done some GREAT stuff. Sound of Drums trilogy, Midnight, Turn Left, Journey's End, brilliant. But ultimatly, he's written the WORST stuff. Furthermore, and I WILL say this - he does still manage to ruin GREAT episodes with some utter ******** concepts. Did we really need the love story with Rose? What about turning the Doctor into Dobby? *sigh*

I also think this whole Time War think has been dragged on too long... essentially ALL of the finale's have been, in some way, about the Time War. I get it's been an important theme, and it's a GOOD concept. But there was no need for it all the time.

I think that RTD just likes big and shiny, and thinks that equates to 'epic'. If it's not moving Earth across time and space, it's turning everyone on Earth into the Master. Some of the best Doctor Who stories imo are lower scale.

But hey, what do I know.

Other than the fact that DT has, wrongly, imo, been put on a pedastle when he is no different to any other actor who has played the Doctor. I AM looking forward to the new era, because even if Matt Smith isn't great, I think the writing will be fantastic.

If it's true that the reason we saw the gang at the end is because we won't ever see them again - good. The only two of those imo that should be revisited are Sarah Jane, and Jack Harkness.

In spoiler tags for length of post

I agree with everything you've said, RTD has spoiled some perfectly good ideas with some really crap writing. I think you'll also find that alot of the DT/Pedastle putting stuff has been done by David Tennant fan's rather than Dr Who fan's. Don't get me wrong I think David Tennant is an outstanding actor and can play emotion really well (anyone see him in Hamlet?) but I don't think he's the Best Doctor EVAH!!! that honour is jointly given to Tom Baker and Chris Ecclestone. The sad thing is I've heard a number of people say they're not going to watch Dr Who anymore now that David Tennant's left, it's a shame that people have not bothered to follow a show properly but just watch because the lead actor is hot

[Reefgirl]

Vampires does not equate to Twilight - believe it or not, Vampires were around long before those damn movies/books. Besides, Twilight is about 'sexy' vampires - these vamps don't look all that sexy.

That's true but there's no denying that Vampire's are in at the moment and everyone is getting in on the act, so why should DW be any different

[Flyboy]

In spoiler tags for length of post

I agree with everything you've said, RTD has spoiled some perfectly good ideas with some really crap writing. I think you'll also find that alot of the DT/Pedastle putting stuff has been done by David Tennant fan's rather than Dr Who fan's. Don't get me wrong I think David Tennant is an outstanding actor and can play emotion really well (anyone see him in Hamlet?) but I don't think he's the Best Doctor EVAH!!! that honour is jointly given to Tom Baker and Chris Ecclestone. The sad thing is I've heard a number of people say they're not going to watch Dr Who anymore now that David Tennant's left, it's a shame that people have not bothered to follow a show properly but just watch because the lead actor is hot

Agreed.

And in addition, how could I have forgotten the Giant Stay Puft Marshmallow Cyber Man rampaging through London? Or the Doctor rescuing someone's son, instead of helping him find the strength to step up and be a hero himself. Or how about Martha becoming the legend, in Sound of Drums.

In any case, you're also right about the fans. My ex used to call them the 'berets' because there was a bunch of them in berets who turned up to every event with DT in, and once actually practically mauled him outside - ever seen 'Singing In The Rain'? Just like happened to Don Lockwood at the start of that. And it IS a shame, because, yes, I've really enjoyed DT's Doctor, there IS something magical about him. But as you said? Is he 'teh best doctah evah???' no, I wouldn't say so. I personally still prefer Peter Davison and Paul McGann over him any day.

[Aerilon]

If it's true that the reason we saw the gang at the end is because we won't ever see them again - good. The only two of those imo that should be revisited are Sarah Jane, and Jack Harkness.

I have read this rumour elsewhere too, and I believe it to be true, at least with respect to Doctor Who. Sarah Jane and Cpt Jack may see each other again, though a Gay Immortal in a Children's show isn't the best of ideas...

Suffice to say, the new Who show is suppose to seperate itself from the past, and as such, I don't expect to be seeing any of our beloved companions again. I'm not quite sure whether this is a good or bad thing, but they will be missed (some more than others, for sure).

[Flyboy]

I have read this rumour elsewhere too, and I believe it to be true, at least with respect to Doctor Who. Sarah Jane and Cpt Jack may see each other again, though a Gay Immortal in a Children's show isn't the best of ideas...

Suffice to say, the new Who show is suppose to seperate itself from the past, and as such, I don't expect to be seeing any of our beloved companions again. I'm not quite sure whether this is a good or bad thing, but they will be missed (some more than others, for sure).

I can easily do without seeing Rose or Martha again.

Jack is the only one that is really a requirement to come back in my books.

Wouldn't mind it if the Doctor met up with some others such as the Brigadier, Sgt Benton, or Harry Sullivan again though.

[Jonzey]

I can easily do without seeing Rose or Martha again.

Jack is the only one that is really a requirement to come back in my books.

Wouldn't mind it if the Doctor met up with some others such as the Brigadier, Sgt Benton, or Harry Sullivan again though.

I reckon that's more likely. From what I've seen so far, with the trailer and the new logo, it looks like new Who is going to be a bit more in line with old Who rather than current Who. I think there's a fair few two-part episodes next season as well, which could end up more like the earlier serials starting with a slow build rather than trying to keep up a fast pace throughout. I think RTD one too many times went with what he thought kids would find cool, regardless of whether it would make a good story.

[PMN1]

there was no reason for Wilf to knock 4 times after being told by the Doctor that's how he knew it would be time for him to die;

They should have had him suddenly realising what he had done with a horrified look on his face.

[Reefgirl]

In any case, you're also right about the fans. My ex used to call them the 'berets' because there was a bunch of them in berets who turned up to every event with DT in, and once actually practically mauled him outside - ever seen 'Singing In The Rain'? Just like happened to Don Lockwood at the start of that. And it IS a shame, because, yes, I've really enjoyed DT's Doctor, there IS something magical about him. But as you said? Is he 'teh best doctah evah???' no, I wouldn't say so. I personally still prefer Peter Davison and Paul McGann over him any day.

The people at the RSC put out a request that fan's of Dr Who and Star Trek not to bring DW and ST memoribilia to the theater for the stars to sign, it seems a shame that people only went to see Hamlet for DT and PS and not the play. Hamlet is not one of my favourite plays but I did hear him in a radio production of Much Ado About Nothing, he played Benedick, but I'd rather watch Kenneth Brannagh play him.

[mjwalshe]

Vampires does not equate to Twilight - believe it or not, Vampires were around long before those damn movies/books. Besides, Twilight is about 'sexy' vampires - these vamps don't look all that sexy.

still like sancturys take on the whole sexy vamps. :-)

"French Candian Rock and Roll"

[Replicator Todd]

Well, regardless of what everyone says I liked RTD's episodes alot.....but I can't wait for what Moffat brings. The End of Time could of had more, but I was still satisfied with the way it went. Although I kinda wish the Doctor DID die, and somehow another Doctor was brought about. I didn't understand Martha and Mickey at all, alternate universe maybe?

[DigiFluid]

I can't totally fault RTD, there's a number of his episodes that I quite liked: The End of the World, New Earth, Army of Ghosts/Doomsday, Utopia/Sound of Drums/Last of the Time Lords. But I am very tired of the massive gimmick to solve each big plot.

[Matt G]

I have read this rumour elsewhere too, and I believe it to be true, at least with respect to Doctor Who. Sarah Jane and Cpt Jack may see each other again, though a Gay Immortal in a Children's show isn't the best of ideas...

Suffice to say, the new Who show is suppose to seperate itself from the past, and as such, I don't expect to be seeing any of our beloved companions again. I'm not quite sure whether this is a good or bad thing, but they will be missed (some more than others, for sure).

I'm not sure if you were trying to be homophobic but you certainly came accross that way. I don't watch SJA myself but any kids watching it would already know Jack from Who so his homosexuality is a bit of a non-issue.

Still, the way Torchwood played out I don't expect Jack to be swinging by Earth any time soon anyway!

[DigiFluid]

Still, the way Torchwood played out I don't expect Jack to be swinging by Earth any time soon anyway!

As far as I know, series 4 is in the pipe.

[JRDTECH]

I rather enjoyed the episode. It answered why the Master is the way is he is. We learned more about what happened in the last day of the time war. But mostly it was about the Doctor and in the end he sacrificed himself to same one person. And the doctor got his reward by saying goodbye and saving his friends one last time as the Doctor they knew him as.

Also someone mentioned that the 5 specials were just a vehicle leading to the Doctors "death". Remember in all the series there was always underlying seeds placed that would lead to something at the end. Series 1: who/what is Bad Wolf, Series 2: Rose's "death", Series 3: You are not Alone, Series 4: Return of Rose.