Using the Comunication Stones To Get Home (Ish)

[thekillman]

why are we all thinking so hard?


-use blood to create clones.

-transmit the consciousness of 5 people to "blank" bodies. the bodies on the destiny are now unconscious.

-use the Galaran Memory device or asgard mind transferal technology, to upload the mind and it's memories.

-download the memories into the clones.

-sever the connection. now, both blank bodies and bodies on the Destiny are mindless, the ones on the destiny dead (or the people there are kept alive if we want to).

-repeat untill all 80+/- people are back at earth.

either the originals are left to die (and the clones will never know) or the originals are dead. doesn't matter. everyone's happy and to the originals nothing bad happened.


we can also use the same technology to transfer data from earth to destiny in huge amounts (like Danny's knowledge of ancient language) or the people on destiny have to learn the knowledge needed for transfer and the knowledge is downloaded at earth.

also a simple and effective means of getting the data from the chair.


and the scary thing is, it's very possible

[Mike.]

The Galaran device uses the physical memory engrams inside the brain. Also as far as I know the communication stones don't completely rewire the users' brains (i.e. the synapses and all the other connections).
If the Asgard mind transfer tech is based on a similar design it wouldn't work either. Both would just read the memories of the host (the physical body).

[thekillman]

if a mind with memories is transferred then person A essentially becomes person B. also, it reads of electrical signs, and well, it has to work because otherwise the device is pure magic. it already is, just even more.

[Mike.]

The problem with memories is that they're stored chemically and structurally (neuron connections). The communication stones don't alter these. Whatever mind transfer tech is used would need to be specifically made to interact with the stones otherwise it wouldn't work. Even then I have doubts...
The electrical activity is only something temporary and always changing - a sign that the brain is working. Who you are *permanently* is in the physical brain. Let me put it another way - the electrical activity is like the light projected on a wall, and the brain - who you are - is the candle.

Also - just memories are not a person, it's also how they are processed, as every brain is a completely unique CPU.

To replicate someone's consciousness permanently and accurately you'd need to replicate their brain structure exactly. Down to the atoms and electrons.

[Steelbox]

The stone are not designed to permanently swap consciences. In fact i believe that the stones don't even transfer any conscience. While being affected by it you lose control of your body and assumes the other one remotely. You conscience stays there in the same body, you brain is yours. Just your thoughts, commands and feelings are transfered to the other body, and vice-Versa.

The problem with memories is that they're stored chemically and structurally (neuron connections). The communication stones don't alter these. Whatever mind transfer tech is used would need to be specifically made to interact with the stones otherwise it wouldn't work. Even then I have doubts...
The electrical activity is only something temporary and always changing - a sign that the brain is working. Who you are *permanently* is in the physical brain. Let me put it another way - the electrical activity is like the light projected on a wall, and the brain - who you are - is the candle.

Also - just memories are not a person, it's also how they are processed, as every brain is a completely unique CPU.

To replicate someone's consciousness permanently and accurately you'd need to replicate their brain structure exactly. Down to the atoms and electrons.

Well you posted while i was posting my one. But more or less i sense that i agree with you. The chemical happens on your own body, the thought and memories are remotely sent back to your body.

[escyos]

once again people, if the original body dies, THEY DIE!. if you sever the connection, you return to your body.

you cant upload into a new body and continue your life. besides i doubt the people on board would agree to such a thing

[thekillman]

if a mind is swapped with memories, then obviously that person is in that new body. a galaran memory device works via the electric signals. since the person has brain activity and that brain activity is his, the plan works.


it's impossible if nothing changes about either hosts yet they magically are eachother.

The stone are not designed to permanently swap consciences. In fact i believe that the stones don't even transfer any conscience. While being affected by it you lose control of your body and assumes the other one remotely. You conscience stays there in the same body, you brain is yours. Just your thoughts, commands and feelings are transfered to the other body, and vice-Versa.

and yet they have memory. which is in the synapses. besides, the only way to effectively exchange all commands is to have the stone jammed into your brain stam.

[Mike.]

Actually we don't know if the stones actually transfer your complete consciousness. It's more likely that they just connect your brain inputs and outputs to another person's body. Like creating "spines" over intergalactic distances. Yeah, this must be it.

[thekillman]

unless you actually know a thing or two about brains

[Steelbox]

if a mind is swapped with memories, then obviously that person is in that new body. a galaran memory device works via the electric signals. since the person has brain activity and that brain activity is his, the plan works.


it's impossible if nothing changes about either hosts yet they magically are eachother.



and yet they have memory. which is in the synapses. besides, the only way to effectively exchange all commands is to have the stone jammed into your brain stam.

I never said they did not have access to their memories. They can access anything that is on their bodies, aside from phisical reactions.

Actually we don't know if the stones actually transfer your complete consciousness. It's more likely that they just connect your brain inputs and outputs to another person's body. Like creating "spines" over intergalactic distances. Yeah, this must be it.

Thats what i meant.

[thekillman]

again do you have ANY idea how brains work? if the consciousness is transferred, or even is in remote control of the other body, there's gonna be an electric field to detect and use. and that's what the Galaran device does. it reads electric fields and uses those to access memories. therefore it works.

[Mike.]

again do you have ANY idea how brains work?

Actually I do. I studied this. The question is - do you, especially after those last statements. If we were to go by what's real then the stones wouldn't work (using a complete transfer) and neither would the Galaran device if according to you it only uses the electrical fields (to work, the Galaran device has to read the physical structure of the brain and make physical changes in the people who receive those memories).

Let's go into detail about how the electrical activity actually occurs - as a byproduct of cell metabolism an electrical charge builds up on the inside of the membrane and on the outside - more precisely ions with opposing charges (negative and positive) - only one type on each side of the cell membrane. Brain cells specifically target this. At some point the buildup of these ions allows an electrical discharge to occur. This travels along the membrane from the cell body along the axon to the endings. This is more of a chemical process and it's much slower than the speed of light through proper conductors like iron. Think of dominoes on both sides of a piece of glass, like dominoes on a mirror. When the discharge reaches the endings special chemicals are released (called neurotransmitters) that chemically relay the message to the dendrites of the next neuron in line. The electrical activity is not a good way to access any permanently stored info, it only represents what's happening right now, what processes are in use - and I guarantee it - your full memory will never be sent at the same time to allow for a snapshot of this activity to be accurate in the sense of copying a person's consciousness. I just doesn't happen. Also permanent information is stored chemically and structurally and cannot be copied just by using the electrical activity at an arbitrary point in time. It really can't be done.
Secondly a lot of who you are is influenced by the manner you process the information, not just the info because every brain is physically unique. You might be cold blooded killer if your frontal lobe is damaged even if you had the happiest of childhoods.

An analogy: basically a Dollhouse style "we wipe your brain and store someone else's and you become that person" is complete bs. The show later redeemed itself by showing that the wiped state cannot be removed, is always there and will impact what the imprinted active does, and is unique from person to person. And it's shouldn't be just Echo - it should be everyone.

The stones could never transfer someone's complete consciousness. The maximum they could do is relay the sensory information from the body to someone very far - and that someone sends the motor commands. This is even reflected in the show - if people are disconnected they don't remain in the swapped bodies - they simply loose the ability to control the others remotely and stop seeing what those are seeing. The stones don't put them back because they don't need to.

[thekillman]

long term memory is stored chemically, yes. and the stones are BS i said that already. the only way to properly work would be to attach the stones to your brain stem, where about all nerve connections go, and it's the connection point of brain to the rest of the body.


also yes the galaran device uses electric fields. how it precisely gets memories is unknown, but we know it can make you either relive them or experience other memories via electric fields, which far as i know is in the real of possible technologies.

it's possible it also injects chemicals or so, but we don't know that.

on the other hand, from a show's perspective, it's completely possible