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  1. #1

    Default Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    "The Al’kesh spaceship is a powerful Goa'uld medium-range bomber and troop carrier used in area bombardments of planetary surfaces, designed to support invasions of planets by System Lords. It is larger than the Tel'tak scout ship and Death Glider, yet much smaller than the Ha'tak mothership." - Stargate Wika

    As the quote above states, the Al'kesh is a very robust craft and we have seen it one of this ships disable a Hat'ak (Season 4, Episode 22). It has been used by races of Aliens as Cargo and Troop drop ships. There are many reasons why I believe that the Al'kesh is the best Goa'uld warship.

    Give me you're input on this!

  2. #2
    Chief Master Sergeant PacoJr67's Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    the Al'kesh is a great bomber/transport, yes. it wouldn't be quite as effective without fighter cover

  3. #3
    Second Lieutenant Serenity000's Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    It is probably the best all-around ship the Gou'uld have. But it has only one weapon and it has limited coverage.

  4. #4
    First Lieutenant Ed's Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    Quote Originally Posted by Serenity000 View Post
    It is probably the best all-around ship the Gou'uld have. But it has only one weapon and it has limited coverage.
    It has a staff turret and energy bombs the only flaw is that some are unsheilded it seems some alkesh are better than others probably due to the feudal nature of the gould they wont share all their improvements also the anubis refit

    I agree its the best gould ship for its size though i doubt one alkesh could hit a fully crewed hatack as hard as it it did SG-1s

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    The size and versatility should be the model for a new Earth ship, with obvious improvements in shields, weapons, generators, etc.

  6. #6
    Second Lieutenant Serenity000's Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed View Post
    It has a staff turret and energy bombs the only flaw is that some are unsheilded it seems some alkesh are better than others probably due to the feudal nature of the gould they wont share all their improvements also the anubis refit

    I agree its the best gould ship for its size though i doubt one alkesh could hit a fully crewed hatack as hard as it it did SG-1s
    The Ha'tak that was attacked in Sg-1 in "Exodus" had no shields up butonce the shields were up the Al'kesh ran to the planet.

  7. #7
    Lieutenant General thekillman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    Alkesh are indeed very good ships, in terms of ratio's and comparisons.

  8. #8
    Edna Mode UniverseSizePlotHole's Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    I'm surprised we didn't see heaps of Al'kesh rather than a wing of gliders against Icarus Base

  9. #9
    First Lieutenant Ed's Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    wwould have made more sense too they could just have had the alkesh dodge the beam weapons instead of pretending they don't exist

  10. #10
    Captain spinny magee's Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    Combine it with 2-3 more of them with a squadron(10 or so gliders) and it would be quite a force to be reckoned with.
    Tst

  11. #11
    First Lieutenant Ed's Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    yeah the hatak should not have engaged the hamond just spammed alkesh and hit it fast enugh that the beams dont get many kills

  12. #12
    Lieutenant General thekillman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    well it's possible the hammond is not completed fully. we also know that 304's can take a few plasma bolts on the hull, but at the expense of many systems. it was an ambush and they immediately fired, so the Beams couldve been taken out by the ambush, as happened in The Last Man.

    a pilot is only so long and only so much can be explained.



    Al'kesh should be equipped with nukes. really...

  13. #13
    Brigadier General Buba uognarf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    There was no evidence that the Hammond was hit with its shields down, the initial scene of the battle made it look as though the Hammond was in perfect condition. 'Air' has been stated to take place just a week after 'EATG' at which time the Hammond was incomplete the beam weapons probably weren't installed.

    Alkesh aren't that good, they have a poor firing arc and poor defensive capabilities (with the exception of the Alkesh in Continuum).
    Robert Jastrow (self-proclaimed agnostic): "For the scientist who has lived by his faith in the power of reason, the story ends like a bad dream. He has scaled the mountains of ignorance; he is about to conquer the highest peak; as he pulls himself over the final rock, he is greeted by a band of theologians who have been sitting there for centuries."

  14. #14
    Lieutenant Colonel Mister Oragahn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Pink View Post
    "The Al’kesh spaceship is a powerful(1) Goa'uld medium-range(2) bomber(3) and troop carrier(4) used in area bombardments of planetary surfaces(5), designed to support invasions of planets by System Lords(6). It is larger than the Tel'tak scout ship and Death Glider, yet much smaller than the Ha'tak mothership." - Stargate Wika (7)

    As the quote above states, the Al'kesh is a very robust craft(8) and we have seen it one of this ships disable a Hat'ak (Season 4, Episode 22)(9). It has been used by races of Aliens as Cargo and Troop drop ships. There are many reasons why I believe that the Al'kesh is the best Goa'uld warship(10).

    Give me you're input on this!
    Oh yep. I really beg to differ.

    1. Weak. Its weapons are not capable of threatening anything besides a crippled ship and can't even knock down a building. Its mundane bombs rack barely above 500 kilos of TNT (remember, the Goa'uld have access to naqahdah. The Goa'uld don't trust their soldiers, and only give them what's barely above enough to entertain them.
    2. Medium range in terms of FTL, but spitting range in terms of weapons. Its bombing range is worth 20 meters high above the "target", and its turret is barely capable of more than 800 meters against a target like a Ha'tak. As such, they're glorified crop dusters.
    3. A bomber that wouldn't even have a chance to come close to its target if it had to fight on Earth during the 60s. It's been seen using a special type of bombs, blue ones, just once: against an unshielded Ha'tak, and somehow these bombs caused more damage than any typical Al'kesh bomb could do to the hull of a 700 meters wide ship, since a few surface impacts with these special blue bombs (plus some random piss-poor and totally irrelevant traditional plasma shots - unless they were upgraded with more naqahdah) were the only weapons good enough to cripple a Ha'tak.
    4. Goa'uld already have a troop carrier that's bigger and sturdier. An Al'kesh has a ring system, but can't even guarantee the safety of the disembarked people once on the ground.
    5. Huh, "area bombardments of planetary surfaces"? Fancy words, nothing more. And not even totally exact, since as I said, we have seen an Al'kesh harass a Ha'tak by straffing it. Count "starship surface" as well.
    6. They offer no real support. The Ha'tak does all. The Al'kesh is only good if it attacks people with a level of technology inferior to what we had in the second half of our former century.
    7. That wikia. Not so good for a source.
    8. They are not battle-shielded. For ships of that size, made by the Goa'uld, they're relatively fragile. A few shots from a Death Glider in the aft section can take one down. Two anti-air missiles and that's the same story. A single shot from the turret of another Ha'tak and it explodes violently. A single Death Glider's bolt hitting the cabin and the Al'kesh goes down as well.
    9. See point (3).
    10. A warship it is not. That ship is a waste of volume. It's not built by a competent military arm, but by delusional and maniacal alien parasites playing gods, who can't trust their troops enough to give them even a fraction of the high technology the System Lords rely on to maintain their cult and grip.
    A competent army would use such a ship in many ways, notably, first, by using variants:

    • A true long-range bomber: done with the pitiful short range and inaccurate staff cannons, they'd get a scaled down version of the version that's used on Ha'tak, the one that can shoot targets over hundreds of km with good precision and level cities. They'd come with at least an extra turret, if not two (they don't take that much place) to cover the flanks and top arc.
      They would actually use any of those weapons, eventually a scaled up version if the original weapon is small:
      - Plasma repeater, as used by Kull Warriors. Not necessarily accurate, but they penetrate iron rather well and are good for a barrage against unshielded smaller crafts. Luckily, they could even strike down missiles if their aim was improved (think CIWS).
      - Red ring beam, as used by Ash'raks and even Osiris: accurate, narrow, can pierce multiple targets. This would be similar to the Shadows' slicing beams seen in Babylon 5.
      - A heavy and saturated zatnikatel cannon, that could either stun entire legions with just one shot (over tens of kilometers), or leave a huge crater in pretty much any material, thanks to the molecular disruption ability of zat guns, once a given volume of matter is saturated with zat energy/particles. The bolt would be super charged so this effect could be instantaneous.
      - Fast, long range missiles. We've seen that even the Tok'ra could launch a planet cracker at Netu through a silo in the bow of a Tel'tak. Obviously, Goa'uld know the meaning of missiles, and possibly advanced ones (their large communication orbs used in conjunction with stargates float on their own, so they're clearly beyond the miniaturization of drive system that laugh at chemical propulsion).
      - More of these blue bombs that can disrupt a Ha'tak's systems while causing little physical damage to the armour plating (some kind of zat/ion bombs?). With a good range, of course, measured in the dozens of kilometers.
      - Auto-sentry tacs: the small ones were very accurate and aimed on their own. A scaled up version would be perfect to defend a ship, and Jaffa (or whatever competent army would replace them) wouldn't have to aim. Again, think of a CIWS. Thinking of it even more, the target acquisition computer systems could be used for any other weapon.
      - Tactical kiloton nukes, assault multi-megaton nukes, and wrath of god gigaton nukes.
      - Several orbital AG-3 guns. The fact that they would be installed inside a ship would mean that all the maneuvering hardware could be safely removed, so they wouldn't take as much room as their orbital variant. They would be self powered, but could be given an auxiliary generator each. Considering the size of the space vehicle that transported them, which would have been around the size of planned Ares V, say 116 meters long (check this chart for a good idea of how big it should be, and this page on Ares V), and considering that each group of six guns were stacked in ring formations, anchored to a central beam, if the Ares V is 10 meters wide, each gun system would be around 3 to 4 meters wide. This tells a lot about the size of their own reactor, which is rather small. Again, several of those things could be stacked inside an Al'kesh.
      That's actually small enough to place the six of them into the ship's large cargo hold. Powered with liquid heavy naqahdah, the combined six beams incinerated Moscow in one shot.

      Then get shields, as true battle shields (not the atmospheric ones Tel'taks have) like seen in Continuum. We know it can be done, and we've seen the shield mounted on Teal'c's Al'kesh withstand several direct hits rated at many hundreds of gigajoules (or more, the stuff the nerfed Ha'taks were firing still made big booms).
      Depending on the weapons you use, you could easily use the cargo hold and cram a naqahdah generator there. There would always be enough room for a small portable generator, like those built by the Tau'ri which can already provide dozens if not hundreds of gigawatts and be turned into nuclear bombs worth several dozens of kilotons. But if you don't pack too many missiles, just imagine the size of the reactor you could put into that cargo hold! (Which just highlights how a Ha'tak is just so out of their league in terms of power production!)

    • A true military transport. It would have shields. Shields would be used to protect the ground around the rings (think extending shields to cover an area of the ground around the ring-drop zone). With the engines positioned on the stern, we could even have the entire ring transport system removed, to allow the cargo hold to move down with an elevator platform. That, or have lateral ramps to allow the ship, once one the ground, to disgorge material and troops faster.
      The ring transport system represents a good advantage, since it has high orbital ranges anyway, it would be sad to remove it, but considering its size, it could be moved sideways, or placed closer to the cockpit.
      Or perhaps there would be a giant hatch in the roof, so eventually even a Death Glider could be transported. The Al'kesh is capable of FTL transit, but not a DG. Of course, a competent army would completely ditch the DG design and go with just as small, but properly equipped fighter crafts.
      The fact that a stargate was once put inside an Al'kesh by the Trust would actually suggest there's a practical way to load such large loads on board.
    • A survey model. Still equipped with cloaking tech like all other variants, this one would have its cargo hold and hull stuffed with long range sensors capable of scanning space in a radius of several thousands LY. The AG-3 system could cover such a radius, so we would think a dedicated surveyor ship could do just as much, if not better. Have it carry copious amounts of deep space probes: small crafts which would exploit the FTL sensor suit of the AG-3, without the weapon (but with a self-destruct system nonetheless), plus several of those rescue pods, and a couple more, replaced with drop pods (akin to The Empire Strikes Back's probes), equipped with those shielded and armed probes as seen used by Anubis.


    THAT would be a good Al'kesh. But for now, the Ha'tak IS the best starship the Goa'uld have bare none, because it's the backbone of the System Lords' power, and the ships they use themselves, so they can allow the Ha'taks to be more powerful, and have to be well defended. Ha'taks therefore come with real battle shields, powerful and tough, and weapons capable of leveling cities in a salvo. Anything else is mainly used by Goa'uld for their petty games and playing with scared people.

  15. #15
    First Lieutenant Ed's Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    a better troopship for gould would be to have one of those barge things with about 6 ring platforms inside you deploy the ship and then ring troops off a hatak this has two advantages

    1. if the troop ship goes down you lose the crew maybe 5 jaffa as oposed to a whole company
    2. unlimited capacity you ring down as many as you want with one ship if your using more spread them out and send troops where they are needed.

    the DG is annoyingly stupid they should use the ashrack ring tech instead of staff tech for its guns.

    I think its safe to say that alkesh aren't identical some seem to have more stuff installed on them than others.

    ps can you rip into wraith ships next your rants are entataining

  16. #16
    First Lieutenant _Famrir_'s Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    thats like saying the b14 was the best warplane of all time

  17. #17
    Second Lieutenant Serenity000's Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    Quote Originally Posted by _Famrir_ View Post
    thats like saying the b14 was the best warplane of all time
    it isn't the B-24 was.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    Na.. The Maruader B25, and the B17 flying fortress did it for me!

  19. #19
    Staff Sergeant Yipikyyaysupremecommanderthor's Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    i agree the al-kesh can be better but a bomber is necessary to support ground attack even if the only way you can really hit the target or the enemy( i refer to lost city pt1 where an al kesh bombs empty ruins far away from the sg teams at the gate) is to carpet bomb and saturate the area which would take many al kesh to achieve. The Hatak will always remain the backbone of the system lords....and im pretty sure those blue bombs were actually the first attempt of al kesh bombs since that was the first ep. that showed the al kesh not different or stronger ones im just guessing the writers changed their mind on blue bombs
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  20. #20
    Lieutenant Colonel Ouroboros's Avatar
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    Default Re: Al'kesh: The best Goa'uld spaceship

    Their best ship is probably the cargo ship. It's small, hyperspace capable, has a cloaking device and seems simple enough to produce that it can be made in considerable quantity.

    It also doesn't suffer from stupid hybrid disease like "bomber + troop transport", "carrier + battleship" or "fighter + coffin"

    It just carries things in a stealthy way and doesn't have weapons to prevent the Jaffa morons flying it from getting any stupid ideas.

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