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  1. #301
    Major Saquist's Avatar
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by jelgate View Post
    The climax hasn't occured yet. The story has turned yet to where have a solution. The destruction of Icarus base would be exposition. Pilots tend to have more exposition then normal episodes. Take Rising. It was all exposition until the shield started to fail.
    If that's true then is the Plot "Air" the central element of the drama?
    So perhaps you're right perhaps this is the case of a very week plot ill placed in the drama.

  2. #302
    Harvey jelgate's Avatar
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Saquist View Post
    If that's true then is the Plot "Air" the central element of the drama?
    So perhaps you're right perhaps this is the case of a very week plot ill placed in the drama.
    The plot is the centerl element of any story. Its like a balance scale. You want more characterization you run the risk of weaking the plot. Too much characterization gives out weak plots and vice versa. But you can have best of both worlds too. You can have strong character moments but you have to make sure to have strong rising/falling action as well. Its a fine line in any genere of story-telling. Finding the proper balance. Being this is only the pilot its understandable SGU hasn't found that balance yet.
    Quote Originally Posted by aretood2 View Post
    Jelgate is right

  3. #303
    Lieutenant Colonel Pandora's_Box's Avatar
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Saquist View Post
    My apologies ma'am.

    Colonel would you would say that the destruction of Icarus base was the Rise in Action or the Climax?
    The destruction of Icarus Base was a rise in action. An episode, or any story for that matter, is not limited to one. I can understand, however, how some would categorise its destruction as being the climax with the realisation of air running out being another rise in action. The Senator's death could even be considered a second, more emotional, climax and then everything else following being the path towards a resolution with the final resolution perhaps taking place at the end of the third part of the pilot.

    And I'm really uncomfortable with the "ma'am" business. I'm also not a Colonel so that doesn't apply either. I'd appreciate it if you'd simply refer to me by my handle.

  4. #304
    Major Saquist's Avatar
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    My apologies,
    Although the General outranks you ...Pandora's Box, I believe you're right it is a rise in action, not a Climax or exposition.

    So a weak plot would be defined as improper transitions from each element?

  5. #305
    Harvey jelgate's Avatar
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Saquist View Post

    So a weak plot would be defined as improper transitions from each element?
    Yes among other things. A weak plot could be insifficent of each element. For example falling action shouldn't take up to much of a plot as its the discovery of the solution. Too much falling make for a slow and weak plot
    Quote Originally Posted by aretood2 View Post
    Jelgate is right

  6. #306
    Colonel s09119's Avatar
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Saquist View Post
    Acknowledge, sir.
    The gate did survive for quite some time, even to be used again in a different episode of SG-1.
    Only due to time dilation. Once the planet was broken apart and sucked into the black hole, it was gone, too. But that example has nothing to do with the strength of a gate's material, just the passing of time relative to a black hole.
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  7. #307
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    or the absence of one the elements?

  8. #308
    Harvey jelgate's Avatar
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Saquist View Post
    or the absence of one the elements?
    That is a possibility but you don't see it to often. When that happens you have a gigantic plot hole.
    Quote Originally Posted by aretood2 View Post
    Jelgate is right

  9. #309
    Major Saquist's Avatar
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by s09119 View Post
    Only due to time dilation. Once the planet was broken apart and sucked into the black hole, it was gone, too. But that example has nothing to do with the strength of a gate's material, just the passing of time relative to a black hole.
    Yet it survived the destruction of the planet which is not a light affair, sir.

  10. #310
    Major Saquist's Avatar
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by jelgate View Post
    That is a possibility but you don't see it to often. When that happens you have a gigantic plot hole.
    Yes, sir.
    I must find my definition of Plot in error.

    The plot is weak rather than absent.
    The Conflict which caused the Rise in action was poorly introduced and explained.

  11. #311
    Colonel s09119's Avatar
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Saquist View Post
    Yet it survived the destruction of the planet which is not a light affair, sir.
    No, it did not. It was only around later because, as the team mentioned, the planet was still in the process of being sucked into the black hole.
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  12. #312
    Major Saquist's Avatar
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by s09119 View Post
    No, it did not. It was only around later because, as the team mentioned, the planet was still in the process of being sucked into the black hole.
    I will look it up,sir.

  13. #313
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    ok. NOW. I love Rush & Young. These are the best characters from the pilot. I think it was a strong pilot.

  14. #314
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    Carlye was certainly the best actor.

  15. #315
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Saquist View Post
    How can you not assume that the gate will jump exactly at the time of the explosion since it's attached to the explosion directly,sir.
    Because in the event it didn't, Earth would be toast; they couldn't be sure how the destruction of the Icarus planet would go.

    Better safe than (very, very, very) sorry.

    Quote Originally Posted by Icarus View Post
    3) Surely when they are dialling out the ship's gate to the nearby planet for resources, that gate is locked out, seeing as only one gate can take precedent as the point of origin in the solar system?
    The planet they were going to wasn't in the same solar system as them.

    In fact, I don't think Destiny even ended up in a solar system.

  16. #316
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by PG15 View Post
    Because in the event it didn't, Earth would be toast; they couldn't be sure how the destruction of the Icarus planet would go.

    Better safe than (very, very, very) sorry.



    The planet they were going to wasn't in the same solar system as them.

    In fact, I don't think Destiny even ended up in a solar system.
    Yet, sir,
    you can still dial another known gate system.
    It doesn't follow that the people he said that to would follow his lie.

  17. #317
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    That's the thing, he never said anything.

    He pushed aside Riley with the argument that it's too dangerous to dial Earth (which we've just settled is at least marginally true), then he just kept dialing until all 9 chevrons were locked; after that, since it couldn't be shut down, it just didn't matter anymore.

    Since he was in charge of the scientists, I'm not surprised that no one spoke up (besides the possibility that they were curious about the 9th chevron as well). When Young confronted him about this, he avoided the question.

    It was clearly a case of Rush wanting to get to the 9th chevron location and the scientists being caught in the moment and thus staying silent, IMHO.

  18. #318
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    I only read parts of the thread but I just thought I'd chime in with my thoughts.

    I have to say, I'm so happy that the producers obviously studied other shows and included some good elements from them. I've loved pretty every episode of SG-1 and Atlantis in some way, but let's not kid ourselves, after 15 seasons, the look and feel of those shows has gotten a little stale. With Universe, the camera work and lighting has been revamped completely (with influences from BSG, which despite sucking for the last three seasons, always had a really good look), and it helps tremendously to give the whole franchise a breath of fresh air. Obviously it helps that the show actually has a budget now, but the producers still had to actually use that budget, and they sure did.

    As for the plot so far, it's solid. There's obviously some plot devices that might seem a little ridiculous, but I've learned not to overanalyze TV shows so nothing really bothers me a whole lot.

    I really liked Rush, Young, Scott and Eli, mainly because each of them gave a pretty good performance in their own way. The other characters are pretty much unknowns at this point, although some of them were already set up for some flashback action so I'd assume that they're not just redshirts waiting for the next baddie attack. I thought the actress playing Chloe wasn't very good, but I won't judge her on a 15 minute sample.

    Overall, really good opener I thought. There were things that could have been handled better (shutting the door with, I don't know, THE CAMERA), but there's "mistakes" in all shows.

  19. #319
    Chief Master Sergeant
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    A lot of the cliches are killing it for me, but overall the actors weren't really up to it.

    Not many shows have characters that are so unnaturally one dimensional. They'll fill them out with cliche storylines and drama I'm sure, but it won't be interesting because the people doing the acting are either A. Very young and inexperienced actors with no true depth or B. Awkward as hell.

    Robert Carlyle is the only distinguished actor on the show and he's pulling everyone else along. The writing they're giving him is stale but he does himself justice.

    I'll watch it though all the way through until it gets cancelled because I'm a fan, but I really don't think they'll be able to pull it around. Hopefully a lot of it was pilot jitters, but if you have it recorded go to the scene where Scott was talking to Chloe after her father died, the awkwardness was tangible especially when Scott was being called to the gateroom.

  20. #320
    Major Shan Bruce Lee's Avatar
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    Default Re: 'Air, Part 2' (102) General Discussion

    After watching the free iTunes download twice now, I have to say it looked 10x better in HD. First of all the Destiny really stood out. You can really notice the difference in the exterior details. And then the Icarus base/planet explosion looked beautiful.

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