Implications and representation of homosexuality on SGU

[GateGipsy]

This is the thread to discuss the wider issue of gay relationships and characters in SGU. Yes, we will accept that a little bit of side discussion is inevitable concerning the definition of gay, and relationships.

However, this is not the place to discuss gay rights either for or against - take that to off topic folder please. Anyone wanting to discuss their own sexual journey is welcome to - in their own thread, in the off topic folder. If you find the discussion is going to go anymore than one or two posts into a tangent then THAT TANGENT NEEDS ITS OWN TOPIC. And you should start it.

The mods aren't going to babysit anymore. If you find you're having the start of what could be a promising new discussion topic, then take it to its own thread. It isn't difficult to do. It took forwever to disentangle this thread, and we won't be doing it again. Any off topic stuff is going to simply get deleted.

As always, the respect rules apply here. If you want to make personal, generalised remarks about someone's political affliations (such as all conservatives are closed minded or all liberals are bleeding heart do gooders) then do so via PM because they will be deleted from this discussion.

Do you understand me? Because the mods will be wielding the moderating knife here, and we're not going to stop to explain each action, notify or justify.

[Thor_1980]

I can't disagree with you more Vladius. My belief is that you're born gay, it is a part of who you are. However, this is not the place to discuss how right or wrong you might be on whether or not gay people should have relationships (note to all!). In reference to the show, I do not see anything wrong with them having a gay relationship on the show, as long as it isn't any more a focus in the show than a straight relationship would be. I'm happier that it is an established relationship, and not one that might develop over the course of the show. I really do dislike 'will they won't they' storylines, and I'm not a fan of on-screen sexual tension between two characters simply because they are the male and female leads.

Sexual tension as an invention of the fans is something else. Then it is fun, and an enjoyable part of the fandom and makes for great discussions. I don't ever like it being made canon in the show, or shown on-screen. So non-existant hair sniffing in Out of Mind is OK for me, while Divide and Conquer was not. I'd feel the same way regardless of whether it is a gay or straight relationship.

What I do like is either established relationships (thinking Medium here, that sort of thing) or the exploration of friendship between the two characters.

Everyone is entitled to there own opinion. I for one think the editing of this thread in particular has muted valid points against having homosexual characters, facts are facts. If SGU can be kept it in good taste and questionable behavior could be kept to a minmum that would be acceptable and appreciated.

[SGFerrit]

Everyone is entitled to there own opinion. I for one think the editing of this thread in particular has muted valid points against having homosexual characters, facts are facts. If SGU can be kept it in good taste and questionable behavior could be kept to a minmum that would be acceptable and appreciated.

There are no arguments against it. Just peoples prejudices. Gays are a bug part of the world, like it or not. People here wouldn't dare say "how dare they have a black character" or "how dare they have female characters". Frankly, they shouldn't be coming out with "how dare they have gay characters" either. It's a prejudice. The sooner the world no longer has prejudiced people, the better.

[jelgate]

There are no arguments against it. Just peoples prejudices. Gays are a bug part of the world, like it or not. People here wouldn't dare say "how dare they have a black character" or "how dare they have female characters". Frankly, they shouldn't be coming out with "how dare they have gay characters" either. It's a prejudice. The sooner the world no longer has prejudiced people, the better.

I don't think that will happen. Prejudice is just part of human nature. We are all prejudice against something or someone at certain time. It really comes down to your envirment. When it comes to predjudice a lot is bred on what your family has taught you. So to truly to get rid of predjudice you need a few generations of being raised of not experencing that hate. And cynic in me says that is unrealastic and says that will never happen

[Vladius]

The main problem is that there was never a true straight relationship, much less a gay one. Let's work on portraying television before we work on portraying the "human condition," especially if it cuts off a portion of your fanbase.

[Madwelshboy]

The main problem is that there was never a true straight relationship, much less a gay one.Let's work on portraying television before we work on portraying the "human condition,"especially if it cuts off a portion of your fanbase.

There have probably been millions of relationships potrayed on TV, both gay and straight. In stargate you had, McKay/Keller, Mckay/Katie Brown, Jack/Sam (ok more sexual tention than a relationship), Teyla/Kannan (mostly off screen), Sam/Pete etc
As for portraying the "human condition", sci-fi has allways been about exploring the human condition

[SGFerrit]

I don't think that will happen. Prejudice is just part of human nature. We are all prejudice against something or someone at certain time. It really comes down to your envirment. When it comes to predjudice a lot is bred on what your family has taught you. So to truly to get rid of predjudice you need a few generations of being raised of not experencing that hate. And cynic in me says that is unrealastic and says that will never happen

I disagree. People are a lot more accepting now than they were 50 or 100 years ago. Wasn't it illegal to be gay, and practically a crime to be black or a woman too? I'd say that younger people today or a lot more accepting now, and that will hopefully continue.

[Vladius]

Those were not fully developed, and they were never meant to be a long standing thing, or in most cases, not even the main basis for an episode. They were like the show is supposed to be - short, fun, not very serious.

This new thing seems like they're trying to make a point about "Civil Rights," and many people think that's a good thing and are kind of up front about it. I was glad that they didn't ever go for an episode on racism, which would seem dumb and preachy.
With this route, it's not only preachy, but for many, it's wrong.
Feel free to call me prejudiced.

[SGFerrit]

Those were not fully developed, and they were never meant to be a long standing thing, or in most cases, not even the main basis for an episode. They were like the show is supposed to be - short, fun, not very serious.

So why does knowing that a character is gay take away from episodes being short, fun, and not very serious? We knew that Daniel was straight, or Sam was blonde, or that Ronon was an alien. Just because she's gay doesn't mean she's going to be the center of attention.

This new thing seems like they're trying to make a point about "Civil Rights," and many people think that's a good thing and are kind of up front about it. I was glad that they didn't ever go for an episode on racism, which would seem dumb and preachy.

Why? This is another problem, why does including a mixed group of people all of a sudden become 'all about civil rights'? The problem here doesn't lie with the show. It lies with the backward people who are still not accepting of others because they're 'different', despite the fact that we live in the 21st century and are supposedly 'intelligent'. It's like saying they're making a point about civil rights because Greer is black or Wray is Asian.

Feel free to call me prejudiced.

Gladly. You're prejudiced.

[Vladius]

So why does knowing that a character is gay take away from episodes being short, fun, and not very serious? We knew that Daniel was straight, or Sam was blonde, or that Ronon was an alien. Just because she's gay doesn't mean she's going to be the center of attention.

I can understand where you're coming from, and we'll just have to see how it's treated in the episode. However, they've made it clear that they want SGU to be much more serious and character based, so at this point I think it will invariably have some unfavorable aspect to it.

I never said that I view a group of mixed people that way. Ideally, you would be color blind and not care.
Gay =/= Female, black, religious, disabled, veteran, etc. Let me state that in no way is the gay "Civil Rights" movement comparable to the black Civil Rights movement as some may suppose.

[mod removed]

Hopefully they won't pander to anybody, but judging from this and their other shipping episodes, it's not likely.

[razzel_daxxel]

I can understand where you're coming from, and we'll just have to see how it's treated in the episode. However, they've made it clear that they want SGU to be much more serious and character based, so at this point I think it will invariably have some unfavorable aspect to it.

I never said that I view a group of mixed people that way. Ideally, you would be color blind and not care.
Gay =/= Female, black, religious, disabled, veteran, etc. Let me state that in no way is the gay "Civil Rights" movement comparable to the black Civil Rights movement as some may suppose.

[mod removed]

Hopefully they won't pander to anybody, but judging from this and their other shipping episodes, it's not likely.

[response to mod removed]

Why is the gay fight for quality not like that of the black people or people of other minorites for that matter??? And if you come back with...."Being Gay is your choice".. then you have already lost the debate by using a point proven to be false.....

[jelgate]

Im assuming by conservative, you DONT mean the politcal party in the UK? Becuase they support "Gay Rights"....

Why is the gay fight for quality not like that of the black people or people of other minorites for that matter??? And if you come back with...."Being Gay is your choice".. then you have already lost the debate by using a point proven to be false.....

I thought we agreed the other day its part choice part genetic. Things usually aren't just not that black and white.

[Mitchell82]

Those were not fully developed, and they were never meant to be a long standing thing, or in most cases, not even the main basis for an episode. They were like the show is supposed to be - short, fun, not very serious.

This new thing seems like they're trying to make a point about "Civil Rights," and many people think that's a good thing and are kind of up front about it. I was glad that they didn't ever go for an episode on racism, which would seem dumb and preachy.
With this route, it's not only preachy, but for many, it's wrong.
Feel free to call me prejudiced.

I can't disagree with this more. Gays have every right to be portrayed on television and equal rights is something I will always support.

[Madwelshboy]

I thought we agreed the other day its part choice part genetic. Things usually aren't just not that black and white.

I've never meet a gay/lesbian/bi person who chose to be homosexual. Nor is it in human nature to be different from the norm.

[razzel_daxxel]

I thought we agreed the other day its part choice part genetic. Things usually aren't just not that black and white.

Your right we did... my bad, but i still hate it when people use that as an excuess to try and cover bigotry......

That last bit was meant to be a joke?.. I giggeld and i would feel bad if it was not.....if it was a joke then ill green ya for it, if not ill apologise for my sense of homour!