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    #16
    Originally posted by knowles2 View Post
    But Widmore being Daniel father was a surprise to me. And daniel is not necessarily dead either there always the temple to heal him.
    Eloise spoke about her great sacrifice, so I am sure Dan is dead. She didn't say to Widmore "I had to send him there, where I will hurt him, but we will save it."

    I believe Daniel's theory is wrong. They can't change past and I hope the creators won't delete the timeline of earlier seasons.
    "I was hoping for another day. Looks like we just got a whole lot more than that. Let's not waste it."

    "Never underestimate your audience. They're generally sensitive, intelligent people who respond positively to quality entertainment."

    "Individual science fiction stories may seem as trivial as ever to the blinder critics and philosophers of today, but the core of science fiction, its essence, has become crucial to our salvation, if we are to be saved at all."

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      #17
      Originally posted by Platschu View Post
      Eloise spoke about her great sacrifice, so I am sure Dan is dead. She didn't say to Widmore "I had to send him there, where I will hurt him, but we will save it."

      I believe Daniel's theory is wrong. They can't change past and I hope the creators won't delete the timeline of earlier seasons.
      See she said hurt him, not kill him. Subtle difference, best never to get confuse when working with the mafia. But I am guesting it is the island and stop him from using the bomb.

      And the creators playing with time of cause they going to delete someone or some event from the timeline, it not a matter of if, it a matter of when.
      Last edited by knowles2; 01 May 2009, 10:43 AM.

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        #18
        I think Daniel is dead. At least, he looked pretty dead at the end of the episode. The Lost writers are creative which is why I think the Temple won't factor in saving him. They just used it to save a mortally wounded young Ben, and they've already said it will have consequences. They wouldn't use the same plot device twice in such a short space of time. I think Daniel is dead, simply because it's such an epic way to die.
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          #19
          Originally posted by warmbeachbrat View Post
          I'm not one to avoid spoilers--in fact, I actively seek them out--but I wish I hadn't read this particular one before I saw the episode....
          Well that really sucks.

          I thought Daniel was really stupid for going into the camp with a gun, but didn't really think they would kill him yet.

          And I do think Dan is dead. No island resurrection for him otherwise it wastes the impact of that moment.

          Originally posted by PengYn View Post
          Here are my musings based on reading past Darlton interviews and from watching last nights episode. The Past cannot be changed, and whatever happened, happened is their mantra. However, according to Daniel (*sob*) your choices in your present shape your future - hence the variable. Sawyer, Jack, Juliet, Kate, Hurley, Jin, Sayid and Miles are all living in *their* present regardless of the fact it's 1977. So their choices now could well alter events. It's not so much about changing the past (although it might look that way if you're on the beach with Locke in 2008), now it's about changing the future.
          But their present is also the past in theory. So changing their present, still changes the island's past.

          So either they are destined to repeat the past (in their present) or they do actually change something from the previous past and rewrite island history which in effect alters the timeline in the future.

          We would never know if anything has changed unless the writers show it using a familiar event from the three/four previous seasons of LOST.

          The show is to address the "Incident" in the reamaning eps but I don't see anything changing from what we already know happened considering it is a major event on the island and would more than likely be too big of a timeline changing event.

          This season has just been an exploration of the island's past.



          Originally posted by PengYn View Post
          And seriously, am I the only one who does *not* want Jack to succeed in changing events? If Oceanic 815 does not crash then Kate goes to prison; Claire gives Aaron up for adoption; Sun and Jin's marriage never heals; Sawyer stays the con man he was instead of becoming the leader he is now; Locke remains paralysed; Charlie probably would have died an addict rather than a hero; Rose would die of cancer; Juliet would still get recruited and be living under Ben's thumb; although Ben would eventually die of his spinal tumour; and Jack wasn't exactly doing so well before the crash either. So many of the Lost characters are better because of the Island. If there's a big fat reset button sitting at the end of this series I will be really mad. People were angry when they re-set just one season of Dallas to bring Bobby Ewing back. This would be re-setting six! I'd wonder what the point was. So yeah, plz Jack, don't be succeeding k? thx bai.
          Well I don't particularly want a reset either but at the moment I'm not seeing a lot of other options.

          - The reset button is hit pissing off a lot of people. I think there will more than likely be some resetting of something.

          - Nothing is changed in the past and Jack, Kate, Sawyer, etc of whoever survives live out the rest of their lives in the past going to the present and there are two of themselves on the planet. (they warn their future selves to never go to Australia. lol! thus tossing this into the reset bin....) Not particularly seeing this happen...ever.

          - They find a way back to the "present" timeline that they left from when they jumped back to the past...somebody "moves" the island again to get them back to the present. The most probably I'd say but then it would be the thing that people are most expecting I would think which makes me wonder if tptb will go with the obvious ending (Hmmm...or maybe the reset is the obvious ending...) Anyway, those that survive either remain on the island or find a way off. Heh, they remain and become the island's new set of "Others". The END.
          IMO always implied.

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            #20
            I've probably said it 100 times all over the internets, but I firmly believe that whatever happened, happened. I think Daniel deciding to change the future is what happened, and the fact that it gives Jack the bright idea to try and change things will lead to the incident at the Swan and it'll happen that way because it always happened that way.

            I keep remembering Daniel earlier in the season saying even if you tried to change the past, the timeline would correct itself. Nothing they do will change the fact that flight 815 crashed on the island in 2004.
            || Star Stream || Destiny Song || The Four Suns (My Band) || The Art of War <<== listen please!

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              #21
              None of you have taken into consideration that things may have ALREADY changed. I keep thinking of how Locke was trying to convince Jack at the end of last season how he wasnt supposed to leave. Maybe the way things played out in another present, the 6 never left and whoever was supposed to win this 'future war' wouldve won but now, Jack messed it all up. I think Desmond, being special in his own way, is like a bridge to the past. In a sense, he is the only one who can change things and simply by having him around, it would be possible to cause different future events. In conclusion IF the Swan blows up and IF Desmond never needs to the push the button, i think 815 will still crash, just not on the island. Everyone will die except those whove been traveling through time all season and they will have to tell the exact same story as at the end of last season. They will have to lie once again.

              Eh im probably way off. But i was right about getting to see the 'incident'!
              When the mind is enlightened, the body matters not.

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                #22
                Originally posted by Platschu View Post
                I hope Eloise will suffer as long as possible... Dan could have deserved better parents.
                Yeah, he deserved much better parents. I don't know how they could live with themselves, making that kind of decision about their son. Knowing that Eloise, Daniel's own mother, would end up being the one who kills him in the past.

                Overall, a very good episode. I can't wait until this Wednesday night.
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                  #23
                  She knows the final outcome of events on the island. She's also had years to think about. Sure she could try, and not send her son to the island... but I believe since she knows the outcome of events, she had to let it happen or something much worse could come from it.

                  Maybe when we see the final in a few weeks, we'll all look back on his death, and be it sad, say it was for the good of everyone else.

                  I would like to know what he was doing off the island for those 3 years though.

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                    #24
                    Originally posted by Alan Wake View Post
                    She knows the final outcome of events on the island. She's also had years to think about. Sure she could try, and not send her son to the island... but I believe since she knows the outcome of events, she had to let it happen or something much worse could come from it.

                    Maybe when we see the final in a few weeks, we'll all look back on his death, and be it sad, say it was for the good of everyone else.

                    I would like to know what he was doing off the island for those 3 years though.
                    setting up that secret organization that grabbed Miles off the street
                    || Star Stream || Destiny Song || The Four Suns (My Band) || The Art of War <<== listen please!

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                      #25
                      Originally posted by Shan Bruce Lee View Post
                      setting up that secret organization that grabbed Miles off the street
                      Really? Is that true? If it is, I missed something.

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                        #26
                        Originally posted by Alan Wake View Post
                        Really? Is that true? If it is, I missed something.
                        lol no it's just me speculating.
                        || Star Stream || Destiny Song || The Four Suns (My Band) || The Art of War <<== listen please!

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                          #27
                          Originally posted by Alan Wake View Post
                          Really? Is that true? If it is, I missed something.
                          Speculation by fans that they are part of an organisation set up by someone to help Jack oceanic six get off the island. An are separate from every one else we have seen so far.

                          I am on the side it was one of the oceanic lot or Faraday that set them up. It how they act more than anything, they sounded like everyone was against them and even knowing that they were still going to win. That what I got from the 30 or so words we have heard from them.
                          There only three people on that island arrogant enough to program that kind believe into a organisation, , Jack, Sawyer, Ben and we all know which side ben is on, his own. So I believe it Jack or Sawyer or possible Syid that set it up. Infact syid would make the most sense as he would have the knowledge to set up such an organisation. But then Sawyer would have skill to gain the money needed.
                          Of cause this only makes sense if Miles get off the island and back to the future before the rest of the gang. Because I am presuming they were meant to kidnapped him after he escaped the island the second time.
                          Thinking of the overall picture Faraday also makes sense but only if he somehow got the knowledge of what under the statue and with everyone thinking he dead there know way he could know what under the statue to tell the other member of his organisation. Unless a second member of his gange has been place on the island by him already.

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                            #28
                            Originally posted by knowles2 View Post
                            Speculation by fans that they are part of an organisation set up by someone to help Jack oceanic six get off the island. An are separate from every one else we have seen so far.

                            I am on the side it was one of the oceanic lot or Faraday that set them up. It how they act more than anything, they sounded like everyone was against them and even knowing that they were still going to win. That what I got from the 30 or so words we have heard from them.
                            There only three people on that island arrogant enough to program that kind believe into a organisation, , Jack, Sawyer, Ben and we all know which side ben is on, his own. So I believe it Jack or Sawyer or possible Syid that set it up. Infact syid would make the most sense as he would have the knowledge to set up such an organisation. But then Sawyer would have skill to gain the money needed.
                            Of cause this only makes sense if Miles get off the island and back to the future before the rest of the gang. Because I am presuming they were meant to kidnapped him after he escaped the island the second time.
                            Thinking of the overall picture Faraday also makes sense but only if he somehow got the knowledge of what under the statue and with everyone thinking he dead there know way he could know what under the statue to tell the other member of his organisation. Unless a second member of his gange has been place on the island by him already.
                            I think that it's the new Dharma Initiative, since they already know of the island and what it can do, and htey knew what to expect once they got there.

                            KEEP IT CLEAN
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                              #29
                              Damn It! Faraday was my current favourite character.My favourite characters always get killed.John,Ethan,Michael,Keamy,Rousseau,Boone and now Faraday.Guess i'll have to take Jacob.
                              "I have never understood why it should be necessary to become irrational in order to prove that you care... or why it should be necessary to prove it at all."

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