Emancipation (103)

[Major Fischer]

I think it's entirely possible she got her captains bars on a time in grade thing. You sit in O3 longer than you sit in O1 or O2. I'd say she was a first lieutenant but that's just my own guess. Virtually the only thing I can reconcil with Sam to explain the 100 hours bit (even though she wears no campaign ribbons for the gulf btw), is that she was an air battle manager or a similar AWACs crewman. I can't picture her on a air to air refueling aircraft.

[Major Fischer]

I know nothing about the military... How old would she have been at that point in time? She wasn't a Captain then, was she?

I don't know what Sam's canon age is, or her grad year from USAFA, or when she got her PhD (is where she got it even canon, I've heard MIT, but I don't recall it in the series).

Anyway, in 1993 IIRC, the Defense Department opened up a wide range of jobs for women, including most air force flight jobs including combat. If the "100 hours in enemy airspace" line had been in reference to anything after 1993 it would be hard to say what Sam was doing.

But as it is... there is only a limited number of things someone with Sam's background could have been doing over Iraq during Desert Storm. At least legally.

[Mr Prophet]

But as it is... there is only a limited number of things someone with Sam's background could have been doing over Iraq during Desert Storm. At least legally.

She was out there testing airborne superweapons for the NID and you know it.

[Major Fischer]

She was out there testing airborne superweapons for the NID and you know it.

Well, she does seem to know a lot about cafe's near NID headquarters

[Matt G]

What? As opposed to her work on the Stargate programme?

Well accrding to the fanfic in question, she got hired by Catherine Langford for the Stargate programme circa 1992 and transferred to the Pentagon not long before the movie(There were rumours around the program about Daniel being hired, General West booted Sam to the Pentagon and assigned Jack in her place as miltary personel!)

If I can find the fic again I'll post a link.

[Mr Prophet]

Well accrding to the fanfic in question, she got hired by Catherine Langford for the Stargate programme circa 1992 and transferred to the Pentagon not long before the movie(There were rumours around the program about Daniel being hired, General West booted Sam to the Pentagon and assigned Jack in her place as miltary personel!)

If I can find the fic again I'll post a link.

I'm fairly sure she refers to working on the Gate - as a scientist, more than as military personnel - for something like four years before Daniel made it work. My impression is that it's her baby and the fact that she got booted to make way for another guy was why she was so mad-confrontational in Children of the Gods.

And I'm sorry, but Jack would never be assigned to take Sam's place, on anything, and - leadership of SG-1 maybe excepted - vice versa.

[Major Fischer]

And I'm sorry, but Jack would never be assigned to take Sam's place, on anything, and - leadership of SG-1 maybe excepted - vice versa.

I agree, they have completely different skill sets... though they've made Jack pretty unrealistic I think because they wanted him to be a pilot as well as this special ops man and that just doesn't really work well.

My bet is also that Sam went about paying more attention to understanding her fieldcraft after the mission went through to Abydos and she came to understand that if she wanted back into the program she needed to be competent in that.

At least I can see Captain Carter going at learning that sort of thing with enthusasm if it meant she could get into space. The little grin on her face when the guys are surprised she knows how to set the claymores suggests it.

[the dancer of spaz]

I agree, they have completely different skill sets... though they've made Jack pretty unrealistic I think because they wanted him to be a pilot as well as this special ops man and that just doesn't really work well.

My bet is also that Sam went about paying more attention to understanding her fieldcraft after the mission went through to Abydos and she came to understand that if she wanted back into the program she needed to be competent in that.

At least I can see Captain Carter going at learning that sort of thing with enthusasm if it meant she could get into space. The little grin on her face when the guys are surprised she knows how to set the claymores suggests it.

Completely different skill sets is DEFINITELY true. However, I didn't know Jack could realistically be only a pilot or only a special ops guy. I thought that he's been in the military for half of his life, at least. Doesn't that give him a chance to do both?

What you guys said about Carter being booted to the Pentagon makes sense, since you connected it with her smugness in "Children of the Gods." Looking back at it now - at how young they all were and everything - it's so cool to see her transformation from jaded scientist military woman to extremely experienced scientist and well-skilled military woman. In eight years, these characters have been through a lot. It kinda puts it in perspective for me, when it comes to reaching the full appreciation of these actors and everything they've invested into these characters.

[Major Fischer]

Completely different skill sets is DEFINITELY true. However, I didn't know Jack could realistically be only a pilot or only a special ops guy. I thought that he's been in the military for half of his life, at least. Doesn't that give him a chance to do both?

The short answer? No.

They are entirely different skills and virtually no reason to cross train them. You don't wander from one highly specialized area to another midcareer. And before anyone suggests that he learned to pilot things for special ops missions... the air force has specially trained pilots that just work with special ops units. Jack could not be the special ops badass that we know him to be and also be a pilot qualified enough to fly experimental aircraft.

But no one said television was realistic.

Moreover the air force requires officers with the eligablity to wear aviation badges (like pilots wings) to do so. Jack doesn't.

[the dancer of spaz]

The short answer? No.

They are entirely different skills and virtually no reason to cross train them. You don't wander from one highly specialized area to another midcareer. And before anyone suggests that he learned to pilot things for special ops missions... the air force has specially trained pilots that just work with special ops units. Jack could not be the special ops badass that we know him to be and also be a pilot qualified enough to fly experimental aircraft.

But no one said television was realistic.

Moreover the air force requires officers with the eligablity to wear aviation badges (like pilots wings) to do so. Jack doesn't.

So, you're saying that he has about as much experience with flying and piloting as Sam does, and therefore isn't necessarily the foremost expert on things like the X-302? Remember Fragile Balance? That annoyed me. It was a bit confusing to me, how they sort of played up that whole "Jack is THE man for this job, no matter how old he is" stunt, without allowing Carter the chance to do it. But that's just me. *shrugs*

[zats]

So, you're saying that he has about as much experience with flying and piloting as Sam does, and therefore isn't necessarily the foremost expert on things like the X-302? Remember Fragile Balance? That annoyed me. It was a bit confusing to me, how they sort of played up that whole "Jack is THE man for this job, no matter how old he is" stunt, without allowing Carter the chance to do it. But that's just me. *shrugs*

THANK YOU! That bugged me! At the least, he should've chewed them out for not listening to her--sort of a "I'm doing it this time but you WILL be paying her due respect next time or you'll be painting the embarkation ramp with a nail polish brush" thing. On the otherhand, not a lot of people that I've mentioned this to have agreed with me--but then they're entitled to disagree, so whatever; it's just my opinion.

[Lord Zedd]

Did you noticed that Carter was saying the following thiing

Carter:I'm so glad to see you guys
O'Neill:no not true don't you remember the time we were on P3X-595 where you drank that stuff where you took off your (was going to say before Carter interrupted :clothes)
Carter:let's don't get in to that right now

[WraithWarrior]

Did you noticed that Carter was saying the following thiing

Carter:I'm so glad to see you guys
O'Neill:no not true don't you remember the time we were on P3X-595 where you drank that stuff where you took off your (was going to say before Carter interrupted :clothes)
Carter:let's don't get in to that right now

I know, I thought that was pretty funny. I also thought that Sam looked very good in that episode. She really did kick butt

[Osiris-RA]

this episode was hilarous. and the oh-so-subtle insinuations towards islamic culture, classic. *laughing uncontrollably*

anyway, Tapping did her job and ended another week with a nice big paycheck. and they'd better have given her a pay raise to wear that outfit.

not the best, but oh-well.

[zats]

anyway, Tapping did her job and ended another week with a nice big paycheck. and they'd better have given her a pay raise to wear that outfit.

Hope they did more than give her a raise...a new car, maybe. Luggage, toaster oven. Producership.

That headdress gives me the screaming meemies ...ick.

[jckfan55]

THANK YOU! That bugged me! At the least, he should've chewed them out for not listening to her--sort of a "I'm doing it this time but you WILL be paying her due respect next time or you'll be painting the embarkation ramp with a nail polish brush" thing. On the otherhand, not a lot of people that I've mentioned this to have agreed with me--but then they're entitled to disagree, so whatever; it's just my opinion.

I agree with you. I think they were trying too hard for the comic effect and forgot that whether the pilots thought she was the expert or not, they owed her respect for her rank. And it occurs to me, protocol issues aside, isn't Carter sort of a legend in the SGC--saving the base several times, etc.? Wouldn't they show her respect on those grounds alone? I don't think it was in keeping with what else we know in the show for them to diss her that way. Sometimes they go for the comic effect despite how it messes with the characters, I guess.

But back on this show--I did kind of like it when the guys gave her a hard time about the dress.

[greytop]

The only reason I like the show is Sam got to kick butt at the end. It showed that she could fight with the best of them. Otherwise, I didn't care too much for it.

[jckfan55]

The only reason I like the show is Sam got to kick butt at the end. It showed that she could fight with the best of them. Otherwise, I didn't care too much for it.

That was pretty good. They certainly established her as tough enough to keep up with O'Neill and Tealc.

[ShimmeringStar]

An okay episode. IMOHO I think TPTB just tried to throw too much into one episode (of course now, in retrospect, what's new, huh? They're still doing that. ). They were trying to 'flesh' out & establish Sam's character as well as hit on women's rights, cultural differences & taboos... and just put too much in it.

Though I can't forget that line that _Anubis quoted where Jack reminds Sam about the stuff she drank that *released* her inhibitions so to speak....

[Naquida Guy]

While not a favorite of mine, I think this episode was nessecary for the show. Alot of sci-fi shows make the mistake of having 'token' characters; the token women, the token minority guy, etc. This gets viewed correctly as a cheap way of trying to appeal to other audiances and it detracts from the show. This was an episode which helped establish Sam as being more then just a 'token women' and begain to build her personality.

Alot of these 1st season episodes too follow the tried and true model of trying to send a moral message, which lots of shows do before they find their 'groove.'

Oh, and it's entirely possible that if Sam's had sufficent training she could easily best someone many times her size in combat. The cheif guy would have alot of experience at that kind of fighting, but he was clearly used to besting people quickly with his superior strength. US Military combat training draws upon thousands of years of hand-to-hand fighting techniques from aroudn the world. Basiclly Sam would have had alot of different ways of winning the fight, where as Mr. Mongol could only rely on his brute strength.