McKay/Keller - Impact on SGA

[iolanda]

I agree with Katikatnik... Rodney didn't feel like Rodney any more, he didn't seem to act like himself around Keller after Tabula Rasa.

That early? Nah... I'd agree, but in later episodes.

I find the whole Geek/Beauty Queen thing sexist. How come the ugly/nerdy/etc guys always get the hot/gorgeous/girl?? It's been done a million times!
[...]
But despite all the McKellerness, I'm still looking forward to the SGA movie (tho that might change as we start to hear anything about it). Maybe they'll have a good plot/story with plenty of fun and action and a touch of romance that will make the pair more convincing? I'm willing to wait and see.

Funny is, that I don't think that Keller is that uber-hot. She sure looks nice but I wouldn't call her hot. On the other side I don't think that McKay is ugly. Both have their background as outsiders, so from the basic elements of their characters they can fit together, just not in the way shown.

I also hope for the movie to even some odds, but I am afraid, that TPTB are too confident that their way was the right one.

Well I look at back in S4 before the idea of a romatic relationship was envison. Back in Trio when the idea of McKeller was mostly of those those crazy McKeller shippers (You know who you are). I thought when it was just friendship they worked well off one another. If you don't like the Trio example look at Adrift when McKay and Keller were talking about the implications of reactivating Weir's nanties. I thought they worked together then. It was when TPTB began the romantic relationship of McKay and Keller in S5 that I think they lost the chemistry.

Yes, yes and yes! S4 was all the right way and then they screwed it.

[katikatnik]

This is the argument where I get lost. Yes, Brainstorm was all about McKay and Keller, and the ridiculous global warming plot. After that, there were four episodes. Infection had that one scene between McKay and Keller on the ship. Identity had the one scene at the end with McKay showing up at her bedside. Vegas had the 30 second scene in the hallway. And EATG had the 30 second thing at the end. I don't see how the McKay/Keller ship pushed anyone off the screen. If Ronon and Teyla were marginalized, and they mostly were, the ship can't really be blamed. It's the writer's fault for not knowing how to utilize the characters they created. It's not like we would have gotten a meaningful Teyla moment if the McKay/Keller scene in Infection had been cut.

It's not about the show being all about McKeller suddenly, it's about their character development - if you can actually call it that - compared to everybody else's in the last four episodes. Did we see Teyla and Kanaan and Torren? Did we see Teyla and John sparring? Did we see John and Ronon sparring? Did we see John and Rodney bickering? Of those we didn't get even 30 seconds. Does Teyla even still have a baby? We didn't see her with her boy in the very last scene but we got a "wuf-wuf" cut of McKeller. So basically, their ship became the front and center of all the existing relationships on the show. And that bothers me.

[Ewokmonster]

It's not about the show being all about McKeller suddenly, it's about their character development - if you can actually call it that - compared to everybody else's in the last four episodes. Did we see Teyla and Kanaan and Torren? Did we see Teyla and John sparring? Did we see John and Ronon sparring? Did we see John and Rodney bickering? Of those we didn't get even 30 seconds. Does Teyla even still have a baby? We didn't see her with her boy in the very last scene but we got a "wuf-wuf" cut of McKeller. So basically, their ship became the front and center of all the existing relationships on the show. And that bothers me.

But I don't think that if you removed the 3 minutes of McKay/Keller ship out of the last four episodes, you'd suddenly have the answers to those questions. It's not that they took screentime away from anyone else. It's that the writers barely decided to show up for work the whole last season and severely underdeveloped everything, including their one canon ship.

[fumblesmcstupid]

My problem is with the the "I love you" at the end of "The Shrine."

Rodney is supposed to LOVE her and yet not once did he call out for her.

All he did was call for John not Keller!

He wants his best friend, but not the woman he loves...sure!

That bugs me the most , you are scared and confused you want the person you love and there she was standing right next to him and he called for John.

Then she liked him when he was altered because of the parasite, it makes you wonder who she really likes.

Then she wants to change him to be something he isn't.

Watching his "I love you" over and over at the was just a creepy for me. He was not himself but she really believed it.

Then there was the "triangle of doom" the sad fact is that they all ready knew who Keller was going to end up with like she was a toy at the carnival.

It ruined the relationship between Rodney and Ronon all because of the TPTB thought it was funny to watch two grown men destroy their friendship over a girl.

With the lack of chemistry between Jewell and David it was a joke to watch them it made me dislike the last of the season because of the pairing.

I have never made it a secret that I dislike Keller! I think her dating her patient is wrong I don't care that it is a closed community it is still wrong! IMO..of course!

I used to Love Atlantis but this pairing has made it difficult for me to enjoy the 5th season. I don't even know if I will buy the 5th season when it comes out!

IF and when there is a movie and if there is mention of the pairing I will not buy it!

IMO.. the pairing is just not believable!

[katikatnik]

But I don't think that if you removed the 3 minutes of McKay/Keller ship out of the last four episodes, you'd suddenly have the answers to those questions. It's not that they took screentime away from anyone else. It's that the writers barely decided to show up for work the whole last season and severely underdeveloped everything, including their one canon ship.

It's not the point if they took away a specific amount of time from other relationships. It's about the fact that their relationship was the only one that was developed in any kind at all. I know that it was the writers' decision but when I watch the show, I don't see David Hewlett playing a character written by Martin Gero, I see Rodney McKay. I watch a show for the characters themselves not for the writers hiding behind the script. So when something annoys me, I'm first and foremost annoyed with the character, the writer is secondary to that - even if some of them irk me to hell and back.

And the truth is that any kind of team-ness, even the smallest scenes, disappeared completely once McKeller was introduced fully. I mean, compare Prodigal and the episodes after Brainstorm - in Prodigal, you had Teyla and her baby, John and Rodney having some fun, Ronon actually having a moment with Woolsey; after Brainstorm, the McKeller ship was the only relationship on Atlantis to actually have a moment in every episode.

[Ikaros]

Just some questions to help get the thread started. Feel free to add your own in line with the opening post.

In what way do you feel that the relationship between McKay/Keller impacted the show overall?

How did it affect the other characters?

How did it affect the characters of McKay and Keller?

Is there anything that the writers could have done differently?

Were you pleased with the way the relationship was developed?

What might the writers have done differently?

The writers missed the opportunity to have a seriously funny story, in showing McKay "trying hard" and "desperately" to get the girl and her True Love.
The unnatural think for a 25(or something) year old girl,is to not be interested in men, so they were right to want to get her a boyfriend.
And they were right to give McKay a romance, because he really needed it after loosing Katie.
I'll admit that i would love to see him with Cadman (making his life a hell , simply because "she's been in his head"lol).I would love to see a desperate, love-hate relationship there.
Yet, i started to like Keller and Rodney together since episode "Adrift" and i liked them even more in TLM, BUT, their relationship, as they presented it to us at season 5, wasn't what i wanted to see.
I wanted to see a real thing, fighting, envy,flirting, all the package! instead what we saw, imho, is a relationship that came out of nowhere.That's why people don't feel right about it.
If they'd made it a bit funnier, or tougher for McKay, it would just be part of the show more easily.A line here and there was all they gave, when they could make out a lot, simply because they had to do with "the geek" and the "pretty girl".
I don't mean that the show should focus on their "love-story", but they should have mixed it to the rest of the story-telling in a better way, so when they decided to give us an entire episode with just Rodney and Jennifer it wouldn't be such a shock, for some people.
I would love to see more of Sheppard making fun of Rodney because of it, or Ronon kicking his *** (by mistake?!!!) things like that...

[Mitchell82]

I'm so glad the reds are gone as I can say this without fear of my profile looking like a Christmas Tree.
Question 1:
In what way do you feel that the relationship between McKay/Keller impacted the show overall?
Well I feel it actually made the show better. An actual romance that was shown on screen, that worked well and really developed the characters.
Question 2:
How did it affect the other characters?
It didn't really other than Ronon. Kinda liked the triangle between Ronon and Mckay.
Question 3:
How did it affect the characters of McKay and Keller?
It made Mckay actually show his human side, and made me like him even more and it made Keller even more likable.
Question:4
Is there anything that the writers could have done differently?
Only thing they should have done is shown a little more of Mckay actually dating her or showing his feelings in more than just a few eps. They really only showed it in Trio and TLM and in the other eps it was just very subtle clues that he cared for her. Overall though I'm pleased with the outcome.
Question 5
Were you pleased with the way the relationship was developed?
Overall I am. They could have done slightly more but overall the relationship was done fine.

This is of course all IMVHO.

[Falcon Horus]

The unnatural thing for a 25(or something) year old girl,is to not be interested in men, so they were right to want to get her a boyfriend.

EXCUSE ME?!?

Who the hell do you think you are judging the female race like that?

*is deeply offended*

Oh yeah, I'm writing up an essay (sort of) in Word and will post my view on the McKeller in season 5 once I'm done. I want it all out of the system once and for all.

[Ikaros]

EXCUSE ME?!?

Who the hell do you think you are judging the female race like that?

*is deeply offended*

[Falcon Horus]

If that's your reaction then I know enough... if there's more, take it to PM for this is wildly OT for the thread and probably will get snipped out.

[Pandora's_Box]

If that's your reaction then I know enough... if there's more, take it to PM for this is wildly OT for the thread and probably will get snipped out.

In all fairness, I think what he meant to say is that nature dictates that a female around 25 years of age to be interested in obtaining a relationship or companionship of some sort. As in, TPTB were merely exploring a natural human impulse by pairing Keller up with someone.

I don't think Ikaros meant any offense. There is a language barrier (he's from Greece I believe) so keep that in mind too.

[jelgate]

In all fairness, I think what he meant to say is that nature dictates that a female around 25 years of age to be interested in obtaining a relationship or companionship of some sort. As in, TPTB were merely exploring a natural human impulse by pairing Keller up with someone.

I don't think Ikaros meant any offense. There is a language barrier (he's from Greece I believe) so keep that in mind too.

As I say this I am going to try to be respectful to FH and people like her who chose simliar relationship patterns so I apologize in adavnce if I do offend you

I don't think its so much of a language barrier as it just is a social norm. It is far more likely in today's world to see a woman (or man) pursue a hetrosexual relationship over a homosexual relationship. So I think Ikaros was just generalizing about the average woman's choice in dating and I don't think the insult was intended just stating right the majority to do.

But we are getting off topic. So I will continue to try to bring us back on topic and continue poor execution is why McKeller doesn't (IMO) work that well. TPTB didn't know plan it out and as a result certain events were rushed from McKay's deceleration of love in The Shrine and the love triangle in mid-S5. I would like to know when that triangle was resolved. We go from McKay/Ronon competing for Keller's love in The Lost Tribe and jump right to McKay and Keller flirting in Brain Storm. Like all Stargate their was no middle ground/

[Pandora's_Box]

But we are getting off topic. So I will continue to try to bring us back on topic and continue poor execution is why McKeller doesn't (IMO) work that well. TPTB didn't know plan it out and as a result certain events were rushed from McKay's deceleration of love in The Shrine and the love triangle in mid-S5. I would like to know when that triangle was resolved. We go from McKay/Ronon competing for Keller's love in The Lost Tribe and jump right to McKay and Keller flirting in Brain Storm. Like all Stargate their was no middle ground/

I think it's pretty safe to say that it was resolved when Jennifer told Ronon she was interested in someone else at the end of The Lost Tribe.

[jelgate]

I think it's pretty safe to say that it was resolved when Jennifer told Ronon she was interested in someone else at the end of The Lost Tribe.

I guess it didn't feel concrete to me. While Keller did say that it didn't seem like Ronon was willing to "give up" for a lack of a better term. Maybe I am reading too much into the way Momoa delivered those lines.

[Pandora's_Box]

I guess it didn't feel concrete to me. While Keller did say that it didn't seem like Ronon was willing to "give up" for a lack of a better term. Maybe I am reading too much into the way Momoa delivered those lines.

Either that or the direction for the scene wasn't very clear. Or...you know...Momoa is just that bad.