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  1. #1
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    Exclamation Logistics: Out of bullets

    I noticed the SG-A teams use mostly P90s and 9mm pistols as their weapons (no Zats or other energy weapons, as discussed on other threads).

    But what about the logistics of that decision? No matter how many clips they brought, they will eventually run out. And since they knew beforehand that they might never be able to contact earth again, there must have been a plan.

    So, even if they used most of their 36 minute window to carry (tons of) crates of ammunition to Atlantis, it might take a while, but eventually they will run out of them. Then what? Will they set-up ammunition factories on Atlantis? And gather the resources to manufacture them? Doesn’t seem like an easy task!

    Either that, or they will avoid firing against the wraith to save ammo.

  2. #2
    Chief Master Sergeant
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    Quote Originally Posted by maverick
    But what about the logistics of that decision? No matter how many clips they brought, they will eventually run out. And since they knew beforehand that they might never be able to contact earth again, there must have been a plan.
    I thought about that too, and all the other things they would need. All the basic essentials. But haven't the writers now said that they're not planning to leave them abandoned there forever?

  3. #3
    Second Lieutenant dd78matt's Avatar
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    that was a rish they were willing to take, but thye did bring a lot of ammo. not to mention they thought they might find the ancients here or ancient weapons, so this doesnt mean they will always use earth weapons. o ya, did i mention they broguth tons of ammo?

  4. #4

    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    Give me a break all it takes to make new bullets is simple tools and common supplies. Out of all the supplies they brought they probably came with a reloading machine (I forget the name). Even if they didn't then getting charcoal/sulfer and a pinch of salt ain't that hard. Granted it isn't as good as what they came with(more smoke) but it still works. I am sure Teyla would know where to get these basic elements to make gun powder. Don't tell me they might not exist in pegasus since the geni have them.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    Quote Originally Posted by Hunter391
    Give me a break all it takes to make new bullets is simple tools and common supplies. Out of all the supplies they brought they probably came with a reloading machine (I forget the name). Even if they didn't then getting charcoal/sulfer and a pinch of salt ain't that hard. Granted it isn't as good as what they came with(more smoke) but it still works. I am sure Teyla would know where to get these basic elements to make gun powder. Don't tell me they might not exist in pegasus since the geni have them.

    I thought about that, too. Building up a kind of colony in the pegasus galaxy requires total autonomy. This includes ammo production in atlantis, it shouldn't be too difficult...

    Or, maybe the authors did not mention this problem because they've never intended to leave the expedition in atlantis with no connection to earth, forever.

  6. #6
    Chief Master Sergeant
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    a more interesting conundrum is where do all the glowy jellyfish of DOOM come from? The number they fired from the puddlejumper means they can't squeeze all those glowy little guys in those side compartments.

    I'm telling you people that they yank them out of some extradimensional realm and modify them somehow.

  7. #7
    Data ShadowMaat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    The ammo thing was a running joke at the Stargate Universe con this weekend. PDL kept saying that Atlantis needed to get back to Earth to get more toilet paper, popcorn and P-90 bullets.

  8. #8
    Brigadier General Madeleine's Avatar
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    In the nineteenth century hunters made their own bullets. All they needed was a mould and some suitable metal. There's plenty of metal hanging around the city. I'm not sure what modern bullets are like - are they solid metal or are they a bit fancy?

    Madeleine

  9. #9
    Lieutenant Colonel Major Fischer's Avatar
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    Quote Originally Posted by Madeleine_W
    In the nineteenth century hunters made their own bullets. All they needed was a mould and some suitable metal. There's plenty of metal hanging around the city. I'm not sure what modern bullets are like - are they solid metal or are they a bit fancy?
    There are really two answers to this. Modern bullets can be very complex bits of technology, designed to do a number of different things (for example, expand within human flesh to make make large wounds, but not go through walls.) The thing is, the Marines would, for the most part, not be using these kinds of specialized rounds in their P-90s for example.

    Under the laws of war, the standard round used by the US is called a full metal jacket. A copper jacketed bit of led, set in a brass case with powder. It is essentially, easy technology to reproduce and I would bet that they brought at least some equipment to do that, and one or two Marines who are arms specialists (probably working under Ford) who could manufacture a limited supply of bullets.

    It would probably NOT be ideal though, and my bet is if they did bring such equipement, that it was for emergencies.



  10. #10
    Captain Cpn. Chris(tine) Bowman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    What I worry about is mostly medical equipment (at some point there won't be any more band-aids) and erm...female sanitary necessities. I'm sure the Athosians have crafty ways to er... remain dry...but what about Toxic Shock Syndrome? The lady members need their tampax!

    On the other hand, it would be hilarious seeing Weir send Sheppard and his team out to get some materials to make Atlantian pads

    Even if the writers didn't plan on them being stranded, they should have adressed the matter of the ammo for the sake of realism. After all, the expedition members didn't know that they wouldn't be stranded forever therefore they should have prepared for every contigency.
    May our transmatter beams cross again...

    Proud Member of the Chevron Guy Club

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  11. #11
    Second Lieutenant AsgardCarnage's Avatar
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    yeah it does seem weird they havn't said anything about what they had planned for the ammo. sure they wern't exspecting an uber enemy and a constant threat of death but they should have still planned for it anyway. i guess the main way they get around adressing it for this season is that they didn't show the full 38min window so who knowns what the ratio of ammo/medical stuff/people/ other equipment.

    hell they didn't even know if there was any other life in that galaxy so they should have exspected to be fully self sufficiant, they didn't even know there is dirt to grow things in that galaxy for all they knew there we going to atlantis in space on a totaly artifitial place, the ancients could have built something like that.

    so basicly we have to assume for 30 of the 38minutes all they were doing was throwing ammo through the stargate and then they all ran through with medical stuff and got 150+ people through the gate in 8minutes.

  12. #12
    First Lieutenant SP90's Avatar
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    All they had to do was show a shot of an Asgard thingy synthesizer and all their everyday needs would be solved! Hook that up the a nadquada generator and you'll get ammo, tampax, food, asprin...just about anything.

  13. #13
    Captain lionel_pendergast_rocks's Avatar
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    Quote Originally Posted by SP90
    All they had to do was show a shot of an Asgard thingy synthesizer and all their everyday needs would be solved! Hook that up the a nadquada generator and you'll get ammo, tampax, food, asprin...just about anything.
    yeah, i was thinking that too. why dont the asgard give us one of those for a reward for saving their 'little grey butts'?

  14. #14
    Probie MacLeod67's Avatar
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    Quote Originally Posted by maverick
    I noticed the SG-A teams use mostly P90s and 9mm pistols as their weapons (no Zats or other energy weapons, as discussed on other threads).

    But what about the logistics of that decision? No matter how many clips they brought, they will eventually run out. And since they knew beforehand that they might never be able to contact earth again, there must have been a plan.

    So, even if they used most of their 36 minute window to carry (tons of) crates of ammunition to Atlantis, it might take a while, but eventually they will run out of them. Then what? Will they set-up ammunition factories on Atlantis? And gather the resources to manufacture them? Doesn’t seem like an easy task!

    Either that, or they will avoid firing against the wraith to save ammo.
    *spoiler*
    .
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    they havnt really been exhausting their ammo that much so far this season, they will eventually run out of course... but supposidly we will get back in touch with earth at the end of this season and re-establish a supply line ... so the writers didnt plan on making atlantis like star trek voyager... it appears that the writers plant to make only the first season the of atlantis to be stranded from earth... so in other words, if their supply officer did the logistics right from the start then they should not run out of bullets before getting in touch with earth, unless there are several large scale battles ahead. However, the characters wouldnt know they would be getting in touch with earth at the end of the season, so it does seem like something they should address later in the season as the supplies start to drain...

  15. #15
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    Post Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    I was thinking more about them making "high-tech" specialized bullets, like hollow point, or maybe the armour piercing type that require harder (and less common) metal alloys on their coating. I didn't really saw them mining and making refineries to get those metals, hence my question.

    What i didn't know, was that it was that "easy" to make basic (primitive? )bullets. Granted, they wouldn't be as effective, but at least they wouldn't have to use harsh language to fight the wraits and whoever.

    It would be nice to see them getting concerned about running out of ammo towards the end of the series though.

  16. #16
    Lieutenant Colonel Major Fischer's Avatar
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    Quote Originally Posted by maverick
    I was thinking more about them making "high-tech" specialized bullets, like hollow point, or maybe the armour piercing type that require harder (and less common) metal alloys on their coating. I didn't really saw them mining and making refineries to get those metals, hence my question.
    Most "high-tech" small arms bullets are outlawed under the Laws of War.



  17. #17
    Lieutenant Colonel aAnubiSs's Avatar
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Fischer
    Most "high-tech" small arms bullets are outlawed under the Laws of War.
    So is genetic manipulation, torture and 200000 other things we see on SG1 and SGA. Dr. Beckett himself said that ADA-gene therapy wasn't allowed on Earth, however no one on Atlantis seemed bothered by them doing it there. So I don't see a reason with bullets that rip apart the victims.

  18. #18
    First Lieutenant veneticuss's Avatar
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    Quote Originally Posted by aAnubiSs
    So is genetic manipulation, torture and 200000 other things we see on SG1 and SGA. Dr. Beckett himself said that ADA-gene therapy wasn't allowed on Earth, however no one on Atlantis seemed bothered by them doing it there. So I don't see a reason with bullets that rip apart the victims.
    Ehm, there was any kind of torture in Atlantis?

    btw, Atlantis itself is a special case. There's only military law.
    "Maybe one day you will learn that your way is not the only way!"


    Visit Dr. Radek Zelenka's Complete Translations and thunk thread

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  19. #19
    Captain Cpn. Chris(tine) Bowman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    Quote Originally Posted by veneticuss
    Ehm, there was any kind of torture in Atlantis?

    btw, Atlantis itself is a special case. There's only military law.
    Well... *SPOILERS*












    they wouldn't feed Steve, that's sorta like torture. They promised him munchies if he cooperated. Then they tested a Wraith poison on him. Weir did say it went against the Geneva convention but since the Wraith hadn't signed it then... Yup. The Atlanteans are not too hung up on the rules of war and the like. It's not like they can be Court Martialed on Atlantis and they don't know whether they'll ever get home.
    May our transmatter beams cross again...

    Proud Member of the Chevron Guy Club

    "Out of that sea of stars came all the elements that make me what I am. "



  20. #20
    First Lieutenant veneticuss's Avatar
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    Default Re: Logistics: Out of bullets

    Quote Originally Posted by Cpn. Chris(tine) Bowman
    Well... *SPOILERS*












    they wouldn't feed Steve, that's sorta like torture. They promised him munchies if he cooperated. Then they tested a Wraith poison on him. Weir did say it went against the Geneva convention but since the Wraith hadn't signed it then... Yup. The Atlanteans are not too hung up on the rules of war and the like. It's not like they can be Court Martialed on Atlantis and they don't know whether they'll ever get home.
    Ehm

    They didnt have Wraith food supplies
    He didnt cooperat
    They didnt know it was a poison. They though it like a sort of protection just
    Does Geneva conventions really matter in Atlantis?
    "Maybe one day you will learn that your way is not the only way!"


    Visit Dr. Radek Zelenka's Complete Translations and thunk thread

    All translations will be found in the first post of this thread, though i recommend to read the whole discussion ;]

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