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    Originally posted by jelgate View Post
    Some of the space did look red
    Wasn't it a boney shade of red
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      Originally posted by GoSpikey View Post
      Now why would a regular person know how many bullets fit into what gun?

      What are you up to?
      I'm normal (enough) and I know the standard clip capacity of a few handguns. It's just stuff you pick up and are able to retain.

      Comment


        Alrighty then......I haven't finished uploading yet and it's getting late here......Or it's early,depends on how you look at it Anywhoi'll finish capping tomorrw but i'll put the link up for the caps i've uploaded for anyone who wants them..

        Daedalus variation caps
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          Cool! Thanks.

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            Originally posted by Falcon 304 View Post
            Cool! Thanks.
            No worries....I'll upload the rest tomorrow......ARGH....I mean later today
            sigpic

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              Yeeeeeehaw! That was fun!

              It's been a while since Atlantis has done one of these "one peril after another" episodes, and this one was just plain awesome. I'll admit, there wasn't much in the way of analysable character stuff in this episode like the last 3 (even The Seed had some good stuff with Woolsey), but sometimes you just have to get your mind out of the English lit classroom and into...study hall, I guess, and have some relaxing good times. The Daedalus Variations was just a fun scifi romp with a great concept, great team banter and sweet moments, EXCEPTIONAL CGI that blew me away, and a constant tension that kept building throughout the episode, and the ending had me wracking my brains on how they'd get out of it. I loved it.

              So, the concept. An alternate reality storyline is nothing original, and yet when I heard about the plot for this episode I was ecstatic! This is really something I've never thought of before. Ok, I'm not a connaisseur of SciFi, but still, this seemed pretty original to me. It's usually always about staying in one alternate timeline and trying to change it back, or trying to get back to your own, but I haven't heard many stories where we jump through multiple realities like this (ok, Sliders, but I never saw it so it doesn't count ). The realites themselves were facinating in their own right, but I'll cover them later. The fact is, this was an excellent concept. The execution could've gone 2 ways: 1). the way the show actually happened focused on the danger in each reality while the common thread of getting home is always in the back of the epiosde, or 2). another way to do it would be to lessen the danger, but increase the number of realities. I think, instead of going backwards, they could've kept going and find a way back that way (it's just a simple case of technobabble anyway), and on the way encounter more strange and wonderful realities. After all, the concept was pushed aside midway through the episode and the tension factor was pushed to the forefront. Though I am disappointed that we didn't see any new variations to the space around Lantia (and the possibilities were limitless) beyond the 4 + our own, the tension more than made up for it, as I was on the edge of my seat the whole way through...but more on this later.

              Of course, a show needs more than just cool concepts to keep it afloat. There were some hilarious moments between the team members in this episode, as well as several tender, sweet moments. Whats more, these moments also tie back into the show's continuity, especially the Teyla-Torren-Rodney thing. The opening banter between Rodney and Shep (and exasperated looks from Lorne and Zelenka) was just great, and "continues" the baby storyline and how it's impacting the people of Atlantis. We hear that everyone's held baby Torren, which says that he has become quite a star on Atlantis. That's just cute; I suppose holding a (sleeping) baby is just a good way to get away from the dangers of Atlantis. I am SO glad they are continuing with this and not forgetting it; Torren is a big part of Teyla's character now, after all, and having it brought up at these appropriate times just shows how Teyla's character is developing. She certainly didn't have this to worry about earlier on in the show, and the fact that her scenes have become more meaningful lately just confirms that IMHO. For instance, her scene with Ronon in the room with the un-ring-transportable boxes was just sweet, and shows how the fear of her death depriving Torren of a mother continues to gnaw at her even though she's put her foot down and joined the team, as it's supposed to be. That scene also showed some new stuff with Ronon, and reaffirmed some old stuff; we've always known that he's protective of Teyla, and that character trait comes through clearly here; also, we see that he's actually listening to what McKay's saying, and know enough to interpret them for his own ends. That's new ground for Ronon. Later on, we had the short exchange between McKay and Teyla; Rodney, in his infinitely blunt wisdom, made a rather caring comment that I loved a lot; he won't let this be Teyla's last mission, for Torren's sake. So you see, this baby storyline is much more than just Teyla's thing; it's affecting everybody.

              Of course, Teyla also grew more useful thanks to Major Marks's training. IMHO it wasn't out of nowhere; after all, she's on the premier Atlantis team, so it was about time she got a lesson in how the ship worked, especially as that ship has been involved in a lot of their missions. It's great that TPTB is giving her more to do this season. In fact, I'd say she's had more screentime relative to the others this season than most of Season 2 and 3.

              The team's reactions to their counterparts' deaths was certainly interesting as well (and I did NOT see this revelation that there'd be another team onboard coming). As mentioned earlier, Teyla grew concerned as one of her greatest fears is realized in alternate reality form. McKay, the genius that he is, forms the surprisingly obvious conclusion with his chilling line "They are us, and they FAILED!" That was a creepy moment; after all, that doesn't happen often, but here are 4 bodies that proved that they aren't as undefeatable as they'd like to think they are after all the crap they've had to go through the last 3 years together (and for 3 of them, 4 years); Sheppard brushed it off, as he usually does in these strange, science-fiction-y cases; he's one to trust his own judgement, and not be swayed by these weird events; Ronon's reaction was great; I loved that he cited his former experience with the Replicator-created Duplicates from "This Mortal Coil", an excellent example of past episodes affecting a character's views that's not seen very often in episodic TV. As with Shep, Ronon seems to want to steer clear of these SciFi concepts, and would rather make things simple: the alternate team was as good as strangers to our team, and we shouldn't care about them. Or, as Teal'c says, "our reality is the only one of consequence."

              Speaking of continuity, I also liked that they actually related this to the alternate future seen in The Last Man. What was deemed a "waste" to a lot of fans have now been referenced in 3 of the past 4 episodes (all but Broken Ties).

              Did anyone else notice the short, high-pitched squeal Rodney...uh..."emitted" when Teyla, on the other end of the intercom, wanted to leave the console to help Ronon and Shep deal with the firefight while they were diverting power to the shields or something? I had to rewind to make sure it was him making the noise and it cracked me up; these random sounds just make these characters all the more human: they're not always dignified.

              Character development aside, there are some hilarious lines and moments. The opening banter was classic Shep-McKay stuff; the scenes with Ronon vs. Console was genius, and exploited the fact that we've never seen Ronon use any weapon that didn't come with a trigger and a barrel that are directly attached to each other. I loved that he got frustrated, and started hammering the buttons. Poor Ronon, this was way over his head. That scene also gave me one of my favorite lines: "Easy Chewy, tho-tho-those buttons are your friends! Keep trying!" "I'M TRYING!!!" I loved it. And then there is the subtle moment where Shep wanted to try the alien gun. It was just so...boys-with-toys. Hilarious. We also had the surreal moment of Shep talking to Shep (which goes well with Ronon's earlier comment that "maybe they already have a Sheppard), and how he was complimenting himself; I love that Rodney was the first to be annoyed. Finally, we have more classic Shep-McKay with that "thinking opposite" thing; and of course, the ending with Shep's "don't drop him" and Rodney giving him a look. Speaking of which, it was nice seeing McKay holding Torren, very cute, and dare I say it, foreshadow-y.



              Ok...screw what I said earlier about there being no analyzable character stuff. Heh.

              Let's talk about those new bad guys. As far as I'm concerned, they weren't particularly very interesting (all they did was shoot and grunt, after all), but I still want them back, because their potential is HUUUUUUGE. I mean, they are clearly not human, they are very powerful, physically and technologically, their ships are cool, and they have their own logo and everything! The basics are there, and if TPTB wanted to elaborate on them they can pretty much go in ANY direction. They could've been created by a race we know; they could be from outside the galaxy; they could be in this galaxy waiting to be encountered, etc. etc. I would love to see them back...and find out what those lights on their heads were for.

              Hey, did anyone else notice that Ronon had to remove his gun before sitting down at the weapons station?

              And, of course, the CGI. The moment I saw the brand new shot of the PJ going up towards the Daedalus and getting REALLY close, I knew I'm in for a visual feast. The initial look at the underbelly of the Alt!Daedalus was just sweet. In fact, I had to rewind it a few times to take it all in. It was truly a grand ship. But, that was nothing compared to the battle the team soon finds itself in. It seems that the VFX guys at Stargate have hit a winning formula with Search and Rescue's dart-302 battle: always keep the camera moving, make the shots dynamic. I'm glad they're continuing with that, as the first battle was just great. I was following the action with my whole body, moving along with the fighters and what not. Not only were the shots dynamic, but they were also long. The days of short little bursts of CGI are over for Atlantis, and I for one am glad. Not only that, but the detail has become a lot more pronounced; during the shot where Alt!Daedalus jumps to another reality, you see on the back of those alien fighers spinning things. What are they? Who knows, but they certainly add to the authenticity of those ships...somehow. Hey, moving parts = more real in SciFi. Ok. The first battle was truly an engaging engagment (ba-dum-bum ch!). However, I do have a minor nit here: the hull breach the kamikaze fighter made was never seen on the "turtle shell" on top of the Daedalus, even though that's where the hole should've been. Odd. Budget issues, or just a mistake? Either way, it didn't bother me that much.

              Then we get a breather with a stupendous shot of a boiling expanse of red, glowing plasma, complete with prominences and that..."rice-like" surface pattern. It was short, but it was also beautiful.

              To be Continued....again...

              Comment


                And now, the Conclusion.


                But the pièce de résistance was the final battle between the alien fighers, Alt!Daedalus, and the Alt!302s. That was...that was...daaaaamn that was just MAGNIFICIENT! I'd say it was one of the best dogfights in Stargate history, just because it was so unique. It was the battle around Michael's cruiser taken up a notch, with multiple sequences of the fighers cruising and threading the various holes within the Alt!Daedalus itself (it'd make a great amusement park ride ). Mark Savela and his team really outdid themselves with this one; I was going "woah woah woah" with every one of those sequences just because they were so insanely elaborate; and it all ends with a grand, sweeping shot as we pan around the Daedalus; it felt like Matrix-style bullet timing as the smoke trails from 2 missles sweep past us as we continue the panning. Absolutely brilliant. I cannot praise them enough for this.

                I mean, people were comparing this stuff to battles from BSG; and while I agree (and am thankful) that Stargate fights have become more dynamic like BSG, I feel that ours is better, simply because the motions are dynamic AND smooth, making for an easier time following the action (don't even get me started on how awesome it was watching the 302 flying UNDER the turtle shell of the Daedalus as we were following it. Damn, damn damn man. Awesome), unlike in BSG where every shot is tempered by sudden zoom-ins and what not. I am really really proud of Stargate's VFX guys.

                While the CGI was a feast for the eyes, Joel Goldsmith once again created a feast for the ears. The music was very noticable in this episode, which for me is a very good thing, because it means that it's great. Joel created a very fast-paced, high-tension score with many crescendos that really added to the overall atmosphere of the episode. Well done Joel!

                And to tie the whole review together, let's talk about that mounting tension. It was exquisite, and even though I was interrupted many times during my viewing of the episode, the tension still never let up! The calm period before the first battle was just that, a calm period that allowed our characters to establish what had happened to them. Then, with the battle, it just started getting more and more tense. The explosions and sparks raining down...hell, the overall direction of that whole sequence just upped the ante, and just when you think they're out with that jump...they end up next to a red giant. Right away, the tension rises again along with the hull temperature, and before you have time to digest that we have 2 desperate situations happening at once, with McKay doing all he can to transfer power to the shields and Shep and Ronon's intense firefight. Then, and I loved this, McKay drops the shields but is still 2% short of the goal. I totally tensed up as that thing ever-so-slowly counted down to 100%. Then, another breather, and yet the tension still didn't drop. A few character moments later and we're back in the huge dogfight. As soon as it ended though, I knew something was up: there were still 7 minutes left in the show. So we jumped again, and boom! The alien shows up and ruins our team's plans. I knew the alien would come back, but I didn't know that he'd remove their lifeline. I had no idea what would happen at this point. The ship returns to Atlantis, Lorne and Zelenka go to investigate...and the ship jumps! I was utterly confused as to what will happen...then they appear floating in space. I thought they actually threw themselves overboard and were unprotected, awaiting for pick up (because you can actually survive in space for a few minutes, given you don't pass out from the lack of oxygen; you don't actually explode or freeze like in the movies...though I suppose the radiation may kill ya, I'm not exactly clear on that), but nope, they had spacesuits...OBVIOUSLY! I can't believe I didn't see that coming. So yeah, that whole last few minutes was INTENSE!

                And the ending was very cute.

                Normally, I'd rate this episode a 10, but after reviewing most of SG1 and some of early SGA in the last few months, I've come to the conclusion that only the best will receive the perfect mark. From here on out, 10s are reserved for the few that manages to hit every single aspect of Stargate storytelling perfectly...well, relative to Stargate episodes (no story is perfect, after all). I'm talking about extensive character moments (angst + funny) and continuity, great CGI, great plot, something about the Ancients, etc, etc. For an episode that I've enjoyed greatly but don't quite hit all of these marks, I'd give them...

                Score: 9.5/10

                Man, I REALLY need to learn to summarize my thoughts. It's getting ridiculous.

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                  Why is it so hard to believe that Teyla could understand how to use a computer or read a schematic or show an aptitude for science? I've been trying to find time to watch S4 eps and of the eps I have had time to watch I have seen Teyla exhibiting a growing competence with things technical. See "Tabula Rasa." See "Quarantine." Maybe, from the time Sheppard took her off the team until the time Michael kidnapped her, she spent her time off, oh, I don't know, learning a few things. I don't think that's beyond the realm of possibility or out of character for her either.

                  Remember, in Teyla's own ever so slightly sarcastic words, her people "have mastered fire."

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by GoSpikey View Post
                    Now why would a regular person know how many bullets fit into what gun?

                    What are you up to?
                    Several reasons. I airsoft for one, so I learn a lot about the real weapons the guns are based off of. I play a lot of war video games. Some say video games don't do anything for you, but I've sure learned a lot of military knowledge from it. I've actually fired many different weapons in my life. I watch the military channel nearly every day, and that tells you a tremendous amount of information. Besides that, I'm just interested in weapons and the military. Why's that so hard to imagine? I know quite a lot about a great deal of weapons. I AM a regular person, with a different hobby. Astounding, ain't it?

                    EDIT: Anyways, ah HA! I was correct. Sheppard was using a 1911 in this episode. I didn't have to rewatch the episode to see it either, thanks to the Gateworld episode gallery.

                    http://www.gateworld.net/gallery/dis...lbum=590&pos=8 He's holding a 1911 there.
                    http://www.gateworld.net/gallery/dis...um=263&pos=420 Here is Sheppard in The Defiant One, using the standard M9.

                    Anyway, it doesn't matter much, I just found it interesting.

                    EDIT Once more:

                    Here is a closer pic of the M9 Ford used in The Seige Part 3. http://www.gateworld.net/gallery/dis...um=272&pos=330
                    Last edited by Lt. Ford; 02 August 2008, 07:54 PM.

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                      Originally posted by ladyjanus View Post
                      Why is it so hard to believe that Teyla could understand how to use a computer or read a schematic or show an aptitude for science? I've been trying to find time to watch S4 eps and of the eps I have had time to watch I have seen Teyla exhibiting a growing competence with things technical. See "Tabula Rasa." See "Quarantine." Maybe, from the time Sheppard took her off the team until the time Michael kidnapped her, she spent her time off, oh, I don't know, learning a few things. I don't think that's beyond the realm of possibility or out of character for her either.

                      Remember, in Teyla's own ever so slightly sarcastic words, her people "have mastered fire."
                      I believe that she COULD learn it, but boy, did that moment make me roll my eyes. She made it sound like (and I am probably wrong, but it is what she made it sound like) it was an afternoon tutorial Marks gave her. I am thinking all the different things that Sheppard was asking her to do would take a LITTLE more than that to learn. I have had this issue before with Stargate. My favourite character in all of Stargate-dom is Daniel Jackson, but the couple times when he takes over one of the consoles on the Odyssey, I look kind of cross-eyed at the screen and think "He is very smart, but how in the world would HE know what to do?". It actually just came up again this week in Continuum
                      Spoiler:
                      when Sam figured out Ba'al's time travel device so quickly (and while they were under fire!), even though it didn't resemble anything we had seen before.


                      But mainly my eye-roll for Teyla knowing the systems were due to this: It was asked on another thread why so many people dislike Teyla. And my personal reason has been that she has no character flaws. She is kind, sympathetic, a good listener, a wonderful mother, always calm and rational, an amazing warrior with most weapons and hand-to-hand, has a strong enough mind to defeat Wraith queens, she a leader of her people, but a perfect team player, and I can't think of a time when she was wrong about something important. So, OF COURSE, she can run the Daedalus, too! Give her some weaknesses already!

                      That said. I did really love this episode. It was a wonderful action piece and the new baddies are fascinating already. Only sad part? I erased it off the DVR too fast. Someone on another thread said there was a quote that was something like "Easy Chewie, the buttons are you're friend.". Dang! If there was, I missed it and now I have to wait for the rerun! That must have been hi-LAR-ious!

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                        I thought they would figure a way to keep the ship. Having an extra Daedalus lying around could be very useful. They could keep that one and return the other to Earth every now and then.

                        I though they would have taken the guns. Also, why don't they do something that they have in star trek and eject the core. They then could have gotten rid of their problem. It also would have been nice to have returned the ship to its rightful place in the universe.

                        Oh well.

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by Crichiel View Post
                          But mainly my eye-roll for Teyla knowing the systems were due to this: It was asked on another thread why so many people dislike Teyla. And my personal reason has been that she has no character flaws. She is kind, sympathetic, a good listener, a wonderful mother, always calm and rational, an amazing warrior with most weapons and hand-to-hand, has a strong enough mind to defeat Wraith queens, she a leader of her people, but a perfect team player, and I can't think of a time when she was wrong about something important. So, OF COURSE, she can run the Daedalus, too! Give her some weaknesses already!
                          actually she has plenty of character faults being judgmental, self-righteous, and emotionally driven.
                          I honestly find it to be the most unattractive qualities a person can have. so she is far from perfect (like Sam )
                          but the truth is I think the writers are sort of lost with this character so they're trying to expand her skill set.
                          Sheppard should have been the one helping McKay out with the ship systems on this episode but that would have left Ronon and Teyla with nothing to do.
                          I mean the guy can commandeer an Aurora adapt a damaged communication array and fix a short-circuit in the control chair but he can't handle the systems of an Earth ship? I smell INCONSISTENCY

                          seriously Sheppard was totally off on this one

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by Heaven View Post
                            actually she has plenty of character faults being judgmental, self-righteous, and emotionally driven.
                            I honestly find it to be the most unattractive qualities a person can have. so she is far from perfect (like Sam )
                            but the truth is I think the writers are sort of lost with this character so they're trying to expand her skill set.
                            I agree 100%. It's one of the things I find annoying with Teyla. The judgmental self-righteousness could very well be the teams undoing.

                            And if my fanfic skills are anything to that, it may yet be shown.

                            Comment


                              Ok something is driving me nuts with all these comments about Teyla and her tech training.

                              Why does everyone assume that a ships computer system would be overly complex? When designing interfaces and computer programs, the point is to make it as simple and easy to understand as possible. Teyla has been repeatedly shown to not be afraid of computers, have a better than average attention span/attention to detail/retention rate. Why is it so hard to grasp that she could handle some basic functions on a computer system?

                              Could she sit and plot a hyperspace jump? Hell no, she couldn't even close off bulkheads (Something that I was extremely surprised isn't automated). She was able to call up view screens, ships logs, and sensors. Something that you would assume would be a standardized interface throughout as much earth tech as possible. Again, you want to make things familiar/easy to use as possible, you don't TRY to make it complex.
                              -Nuff Said

                              "We should let people do anything they want. We haven't tried that in a while. Maybe it'll work this time."

                              Comment


                                Loved it!

                                A great and probially classic Atlantis ep.

                                One thing I liked with the alternate universes was the alternate-universe wraith.

                                (Why do I believe those are alternate wraith?)

                                1. The "Darts" had similar engine sounds to our universe's wraith darts.
                                2. The weapons sounded very similar, just more... soft.
                                3. The overall shape of the fighters.
                                4. The fact that the alien's teeth had blood on them, possibly indicating a canoverous enemy (Cannibals) that eat flesh instead of sucking life. {Ok, a big leap in guessing}
                                5.... well I thought I saw a few other things. They did have metal instead of Bio-Tech ships, but as i said, a very alternate version of the wraith.

                                Truthfully, if they did exist in our universe, I would be disappointed in their overall similarity to the wraith. However, they make one badass alternate universe enemy that I wouldn't mind seeing again in another "dimension-crossing ep"

                                BTW, the scene where sheppard is talking to himself is funnier than heck to me.

                                One thing I didn't like, I do not see why the old SGA team on board the Deadalus didn't use their jumper to escape in another dimension, sure they might be at a place with no Atlantis, no planet or such and such, but most likely there would be some hope of rescue. The only explanation is a far-fetched one, their jumper was damaged and couldn't leave.
                                Last edited by Chev's Ron; 03 August 2008, 12:11 AM.
                                Ani Ohev Eretz Yisrael V'Chol Hakavod L'Tzahal.
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                                I support Israel, my home, and my Jewish bretheren fully and with all my heart. I wish everyone I know in Tzahal health and safety!

                                Is loving the best addition to the Stargate Saga, known as Universe!

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