simple reason asgard ships are better than lantian ships

[Paladin]

1. Laxian of Earth - that 40% is pure speculation. Also We have never witnessed how many direct hits an O'Neill class can take from an Ori ship. We also have never seen how many hits an Aurora can take from them. Sure the Tau'ri don't use the Asgard tech to it's full potential, but to be honest the Asgard's own ships don't seem all that impressive either. Besides the Asgard didn't really build general purpose ships, they adapted according to the situation. The O'Neill was built to counter the Replicators so there's no telling in how it would fare vs other vessels. The Plasma Beam Weapons were built to counter the Ori shields se we don't know how they would work vs other shielded vessels, since Wraith Hives aren't shielded.

2. Thekillman - What part about the "bolstering" you didn't get?

3.yes we are lol.

4.They didn't get their asses kicked by that protein thingy. Also the Tau'ri had a pretty big part in developing that protein. By the way the Tau'ri had a pretty big part in developing the nukes of the Genii in case your gonna mention that next.

Technologically superior rofl.. they got PWNT. That's all i need to know about their technology. It's like if you were a soldier in the woods. What happens when your fancy-smanchy GPS brakes down? You despair and die? No, if you have learned some more primitive methods, like reading a bloody map properly and know how to orient yourself, then you can come out of it alive.

Your last sentence is pure speculation. Besides the Replicators would probably not even be interested in the Wraith since they use bio-tech. That's speculation too though. Stop trying to make the replicators look like unstoppable gods or something, they're just pieces of metal with a few lines of code.

5. Laxian of Earth - totally agree with your last post.

Cheers.

[thekillman]

we don't know how they would work vs other shielded vessels, since Wraith Hives aren't shielded.

BAMSR comes to mind....

and the Pegasus-Replicators do not form replicator-block-ships

true. By the way, can we agree that The Replicators are the milkyway ones and The Asurans are the pegasus guys? The Asurans are weak. I consider the Replicators much more powerful than the Asurans.

well, i would not say useless (at least in the sense that the replicators can't consume the ships and take them over

Wraith stuff appears to be pretty common organic material. Ergo, it contains carbon. Which can be used for all sorts of real useful, non-organic materials. As the replicators use whatever material available to make more of themselves, they could convert the organic material to carbon-based inorganic materials like carbon fiber and various nanomaterials. Given that they have no problem producing nanites from neutronium (which aside from the Replicators and asurans, only the Asgard and Ancients are known to do), i would consider making nanomaterials a couple of levels below that.

Even if you don't believe they can do that, the Replicators can still control wraith ships because...that's what they do: they hack ships. they've been hacking ships since, forever. If mckay can operate their stuff with just a computer, the Replicators CERTAINLY can.

2. Thekillman - What part about the "bolstering" you didn't get?

i fully understand what you are trying to say. however your vice versa makes no sense.

Stop trying to make the replicators look like unstoppable gods or something

they practically are and were intended to be.

they were only stopped by hitting every single one of them at exactly the same time. A trick that only worked because for some reason i can not fathom, all of them were in the milky way within Dakara-range of a stargate.

The asurans can be stopped by messing with their code. the replicators not.

Even in Ark of Truth they only got stopped because they were designed to respond to a code, up to that point they were kicking human ass. And destroying the ship would be of no use either, since replicators can survive stuff like that (remember New Order where the repliship is blown up?) Even the asurans can survive stuff like that (they were defeated by confining them to one planet, messing with their code and subsequently blowing up that planet). And note that even then, the asurans survived untill Elizabeth betrayed them. and even now, they're defeated but not gone as they're still in space, frozen.

As much as you like to think of the Ancients as the uber race protagonist, the Replicators are the uber race antagonist. They're only stopped by the most insane, one-off measures.

Besides the Replicators would probably not even be interested in the Wraith since they use bio-tech.

while that possibility definitely does exist, i consider it highly unlikely.

The replicators seek to assimilate tech. This is both tech they do not know and tech more advanced than their own. As i noted earlier, Replitech is more advanced, so the Wraith should be of no interest. However, it's unknown (organic) tech and therefore interesting again.

If the replicators decide to investigate wraith tech and the wraith attack, it's a definitive war as the defense directives will come into action.

Technologically superior rofl.. they got PWNT. That's all i need to know about their technology.

there is only one reason the Wraith still live: the show Stargate Atlantis went on longer than the show Stargate SG1. They also did not get "pwnt". they were winning like crazy and only through sheer luck did they loose in the first place. and of course they were gonna loose because otherwise we'd have no Stargate show to watch.

The wraith not loosing from the proteine? seriously? Last Man shows that the wraith get brought to their knees in years just because Michael spreads a retrovirus amongst the human population. No complex, hyperadvanced (Dakara was ancient, your favorite race remember?) technology used in combination with an advanced infrastructure to wipe an enemy out across the galaxy: just a virus you dump in the water and the wraith get wiped out.

By season 5 of Atlantis the wraith are shown to be extremely weakened. They certainly are nowhere near the race they used to be, and it only got worse. From an enemy united and bringing in a large fleet of hives, to petty hiveships fighting among themselves.

[StargateWatcher]

i have been reading this and just want to throw this in:

the asgard have beaming technology (and they can "vanish" things with that) - what hinders then to use the beaming-tech like a modern day CIWS-System against ancient drones (they might not get them all, but that would greatly enhance their chances against anything using missile-based-smart-weapons)

greetings LAX
ps: argh - someone already thought of that (sorry, i am reading this thread from the start ^^)

got something else to say:

some people take the 304 for performance standarts of asgard technology, but IMHO that is so dead wrong because those "buckets" lack the power generating ability of a real asgard warship (otherwise they could travel to pegasus in days - not weeks) and a ZPM would not enhance them by this much...IMHO the asgard strapped systems meant for their ships (O'Neill class warships!) onto the earth build frame and while that is working pretty well, it is no where near 100% (40% maybe...but not more, because even fully upgraded such a ship needs a ZPM to stand a chance against an ori vessel - at least if it has the luck of not being hit constantly)

you should read Senrab Nomis's The Ongoing Journey fanfic on fanfiction.net; he has Thor use the beams to dematerialize incoming drones which an evil Ancient (not Ori but still evil) fires at his ship

[Paladin]

1.What is bamsr? Some episode's name? It's not like i know each of the hundreds of episodes by name... You'll have to do more to refresh my memory. Was it some wannabe version of a Wraith shield?

2.To be honest SG is full of inconsistencies and everything is done so it would fix the plot, just like ship sizes vary from episode to episode in order to make it more dramatic visually. I wouldn't say the Asurans are weak. They'd pwn everyone in the Milky Way and Pegasus if left to their devices.

3.The replicators are clearly not unstoppable and are cleary not gods. They got stopped several times, manipulated several times and finally destroyed.

Besides the Asurans were meant as a weapon, so they were meant to be controlled via a code.

I'm not saying the Ancients are some sort of a protagonist. They're just uber.

Well the replicators didn't get much screen-time and got pwnt relatively fast. Whereas the wraith after 5 seasons of SG! are still not defeated.

4.Indeed, but the reps in that case don't even feel like a major threat. Since as you claim "everyone's tech is inferior to them anyway", they wouldn't even pest anyone. Since everyone = cavemen compared to them, then they'd just exist and do nothing to harm anyone else. So where's the major threat then? Let them be

Now the wraith don't stop threatening people because they are less advanced, they'll eat ya non the less = more of a direct threat.

Besides who's to say that the races can't just use measures/techniques used by others to defeat an enemy. It's not like they have to count solely on their own race's knowledge. Just like the Asgard used Ancient knowledge to make the anti-rep gun etc.

5.The duration of the show has nothing to do with it. Do you really think they could not have conjure up another enemy race if they wanted to? Besides i wouldn't say they were winning like crazy. To me it seems the show made then quite stupid to be honest. I'd have just pwnt the Asgard planet and Earth first and then cruised my way along the rest of the galaxy. Wtf were they doing out there anyway for so long? Fail plot imho.

Besides we don't know what Ancient weapons, like the drones would do to them.

Overexaggeration. They didn't get brought down to their knees. Ofcourse it dealt them a blow, but they sort of adapted to it and started to find measures against it. Besides that virus crap was not exactly a good weapon to use, i mean 50 % death ratio, later 30 %...LOL

The Wraith wouldn't get entirely wiped out and it wasn't easy to distribute the virus anyway. Oversimplification on your part.

Well they me be fighting each other by the end, but it's not like the replicators got along 100% either. Remember Fifth and Repli-Sam and the others?

Cheers.

[thekillman]

you should read Senrab Nomis's The Ongoing Journey fanfic on fanfiction.net; he has Thor use the beams to dematerialize incoming drones which an evil Ancient (not Ori but still evil) fires at his ship

i have no clue what this has to do with anything....

- what hinders then to use the beaming-tech like a modern day CIWS-System against ancient drones (they might not get them all, but that would greatly enhance their chances against anything using missile-based-smart-weapons)

Nothing. I am pretty certain it would work. (unless they use the same jamming tech the Wraith use)

[Paladin]

You really think that if the Ancients were alive right now in their full glory, they wouldn't be able to adapt to some Asgard tactics lol? They don't even need to use drones. They'll just build another Dakara superweapon and destory all life in the entire galaxy in 1 second.

[thekillman]

You really think that if the Ancients were alive right now in their full glory, they wouldn't be able to adapt to some Asgard tactics lol? They don't even need to use drones. They'll just build another Dakara superweapon and destory all life in the entire galaxy in 1 second.

asgard can do the same with ancient tactics. like, disable the stargate network

[Paladin]

Rofl this arguement is pointless, since we can always just say that: my race can adapt to anything your has throws at them, etc...

Dunno what this has to do with their ships though...

Cheers.

[thekillman]

Rofl this arguement is pointless, since we can always just say that: my race can adapt to anything your has throws at them, etc...

Dunno what this has to do with their ships though...

Cheers.

glad you noticed it yourself.



A quick note:

You really think that if the Ancients were alive right now in their full glory, they wouldn't be able to adapt to some Asgard tactics lol?

Post before:

(unless they use the same jamming tech the Wraith use)

[Paladin]

1. Yea glad i noticed it, because you certainly didn't and used it.

2. So? Wow i didn't notice one little senctence that didn't necessarily mean that you thought they were capable of adapting anyway...

Cheers.

[thekillman]

1. Yea glad i noticed it, because you certainly didn't and used it.

2. So? Wow i didn't notice one little sentence that didn't necessarily mean that you thought they were capable of adapting anyway...

Cheers.

2: the very point of that sentence is that i thought they could adapt.

1: i have no idea what your problem with this is. I clearly thought they could adapt. you go all "but the ancients can wipe everyone out!" yet you did NOT believe that the asgard could adapt. especially since the uber-simple counter to that technology is disabling the stargate, something even Earth could do.

Besides, you say "i didn't notice one little sentence", but that's not the case. On several occasions did you miss points i made. In some cases, i already took in account things you comment on later. Strangely, even things in benefit of the Ancients get ignored by you.


But yea, i'll go back to something i said earlier: i'm done with this discussion, primarily for point 2 as quoted.

[Paladin]

1. Didn't look like it.

2.I'm sure the Ancients could build new stargates and ship them to wherever they need.

3.That wasn't even a sentence, more like a part of one and it didn't look like what you're trying to say now in hindsight.

4.What do i ignore? Compose a list and i'll address then one by one.

Cheers.

[Cadklz]

The wraith never wanted to get to MW, why would they, they didn't know there was life there, also we don't know that all of them didn't have the intergalactic hyperdrives, we don't know what type of drive the tria had, the aurora had the intersteller and the orion wasn't made clear though it could ctach up to the wraith ships so it must be at least as fast as them.

The entire purpose of the episode "Aurora" was that the wraith were trying to get their hands on intergalactic hyperdrive technology to reach earth because of the first or second episode of the first season of SGA when the wraith queen probed sheppards mind. literally everything in your comment is wrong.

[Arwis]

Well you have to have 1 thing in mind that Aasgard were at war for a long time, they had experience and need to build better and more powerful warships as opposed to ancients, which for the most part were peaceful explorers and researchers with society build around accumulation of knowledge. Therefore it would make sense that at the beginning there was a lack of experience in that field which might have lead to some heavy loses in obtaining necessary resources.

However with the stargate and intergalactic hyperdrive capabilities and with stargates on planets in thousands of galaxies, they could have easily outsourced their production and resources far far away from PG to combat wraith threat. They had the knowledge to build pretty much everything they wanted to yet for the sake of plot, they were made weak and incapable of thinking.

[Seronax]

i found a great vid about one of my favorite Asgard ship check this out ! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRozrHhKhmE in my opinion the asgard/ancient alliance started with war between each other.When they short war seemed mindless and equal they made peace with each other and made the alliance.Later they found the furlings and the Nox.