THANK YOU! For getting Lift-Support failures right

[Zatnikitelman]

Today in a Voyager episode, 7 of 9 turned off the life support to free up some power. Within it seemed 15 seconds, she was collapsed and unconcious on the deck. Even in a relatively confined space like that (which had the whole ship), the Oxygen wouldn't deplete that quickly and other gasses wouldn't build up that quickly. Stargate in the beginning of Atlantis S3, got it right with Daedalus. It took 9 hours for the CO2 to bulid up and the Oxygen to run out and even then the crew was still hanging on. In addition, other SciFi shows (like Star Trek) portray the least little bit of space exposure as fatal (with the exception of an upcoming movie). With Stargate, you've had people jump out of X-301s, and even had a guy that was beamed into space shoot at the Odyssey with his handgun. Thanks SG, for getting it right.

[rlr149]

for a second there i was confused as to the lack of "elevator" references in your post but got you now

[gopher65]

Captain Archer in Enterprise got tossed out of an airlock for 30 seconds and all he got was a mild case of frostbite IIRC.

(which is wrong. You would lose heat ONLY by thermal radiation, so it would take hours for you to cool down substantially. You'd definitely have a few burst blood vessels though, and a bit of lung damage.)

And in TNG Georgi and Crusher had to vent the atmosphere from a cargo bay in order to put out a plasma fire (while they were inside it). They were exposed to vacuum for a good minute or so before they managed to repressurize the room again. Hardly any ill effects at all. In fact, I can't think of a single instant-death exposure to vacuum scenario in Star Trek - ever. At least not off the top of my head.

EDIT: But yeah, I remember that episode of Voyager. That was just stupid. I also remember an episode of TNG where life support got shut off over the whole ship (the one where the ship "comes alive") and they had 9 hours of shallow breathing left even with over 1000 people on the ship.

[PG15]

^There were some bursting of capilleries around his eyes.

I'm no expert at this, but wouldn't the air exiting the tube with him cool him down by convection or something?

[gopher65]

^There were some bursting of capilleries around his eyes.

I'm no expert at this, but wouldn't the air exiting the tube with him cool him down by convection or something?

No, it would immediately disperse. I think I'll have to rewatch that episode. I liked it.

[Lord batchi ball]

This is my opion but I dont like Voyager it just seems way to unreal
THe thing about space exposer you would die after about 10 seconds give a few etiher way thats if you had no oxygen in lungs if you did you would pop like a balloon and space is so cold that it takes seconds to freeze.

[gopher65]

THe thing about space exposer you would die after about 10 seconds give a few etiher way

No. according to Wikipedia, which jives with what I've read before btw, "Animal experiments show that rapid and complete recovery is the norm for exposures of fewer than 90 seconds, while longer full-body exposures are fatal and resuscitation has never been successful."

That death is almost instant is a commonly believed fallacy.

thats if you had no oxygen in lungs if you did you would pop like a balloon

No. Your lung tissue would be damaged, and your lungs themselves might rupture, but you wouldn't "explode". One atmosphere of pressure simply isn't enough to blow a person to pieces.

and space is so cold that it takes seconds to freeze.

No. This is another common misconception. It would take hours for you to freeze specifically because you are in a vacuum. Temperature is defined as the average energy of the particles of the substance in question. If there are no particles around, then there is no temperature. So *technically* space is very cold, because it is fairly empty. But the very fact that it is empty means that there are no molecules of air bumping into you. Therefore neither conduction nor convection can take place. Fortunately for a person without a spacesuit (and very unfortunately for a ship with a fusion reactor that is trying to dissipate heat), radiation is the slowest of the three methods of transferring energy. So it takes a few hours to radiate away enough heat for a person to freeze.

Interestingly, according to the wiki article, the frost Captain Archer experienced actually happens! (OMG SOMEONE DID A GOOGLE SEARCH BEFORE THEY WROTE THAT SCENE *collapses in absolute shock*) "Rapid evaporative cooling of the skin will create frost, particularly in the mouth, but this is not a significant hazard." It is from evaporative cooling though, not radiative cooling. Huh. But once the water on and near the surface or your skin is gone, this effect ends. Still, frost. Very cool.

[Lord batchi ball]

THE air in your lungs would try to go to less consentration so there would be alot of pressure, and space is cold if you could freeze in less than a minute in the Artic I dont see how you could survive in Space, I have to go later.

[Emperor Tippy]

THE air in your lungs would try to go to less consentration so there would be alot of pressure, and space is cold if you could freeze in less than a minute in the Artic I dont see how you could survive in Space, I have to go later.

Holding your breath in space without a suit is a recipe for popped lungs. If you forcibly expel the air before you enter hard vacuum your lungs wont pop (although they will still most likely get damaged).

And as has been said, you won't freeze in space for a good long while.

[gopher65]

THE air in your lungs would try to go to less consentration so there would be alot of pressure, and space is cold if you could freeze in less than a minute in the Artic I dont see how you could survive in Space, I have to go later.

*sighs* There is one atmosphere of pressure in your lungs. That's it. If you think that one atmosphere of pressure can explode/crush you, then I suggest you never go below 10 meters of water.

Yes the arctic is cold (btw, you do NOT freeze to death in one minute. I live in Canada, and I use to live in Alaska. I've been outside when, with windchill, it was -55C (-67F). I'm still here. I don't even bother putting on a coat to walk half a click to my local 7/11 unless it goes below -30C, or if it is windy outside (wind is what hurts). Death by freezing takes longer than you'd think if your only experience with cold is through Hollywood.).

However, have you ever wondered *why* you are cold in the arctic? It is because there is air brushing against you, sucking the heat out of you(sorta). You cool down by a combination of conduction and convention. Neither one of these is a significant factor in space (well, one your surface water has boiled away it isn't). In space there is nothing to cool you down. That's why in some of the cooler scifi movies the ships have giant radiator fins on them to dump away excess heat. Otherwise the whole ship burns up from the heat it generates.

[gopher65]

This actually brings up an interesting question: If a human could survive in a vacuum for an extended period of time (like a few hours, or a few days) with no ill effects, would they die from overheating?

[Emperor Tippy]

This actually brings up an interesting question: If a human could survive in a vacuum for an extended period of time (like a few hours, or a few days) with no ill effects, would they die from overheating?

Hmm. Now that is an interesting question.

Most likely one would overheat. I mean the body isn't a very efficient radiator, it mostly relies on perspiration to take care of excess body heat.

Oh wait. You would sweat, the sweat would evaporate (hence the frost), and your temperature would go back down.

So good question but no real idea either way.

[Zatnikitelman]

Er...yea sorry about lift support instead of life, long day in IT
So basically, aside from radiation and micrometeroids, all a human needs is a bit of insulation possibly a silica derivative (IR) with a breathing mask to maintain atleast a little atmosphere, possibly as low at 5 PSI like in the Apollo craft.

[gopher65]

Er...yea sorry about lift support instead of life, long day in IT
So basically, aside from radiation and micrometeroids, all a human needs is a bit of insulation possibly a silica derivative (IR) with a breathing mask to maintain atleast a little atmosphere, possibly as low at 5 PSI like in the Apollo craft.

There were recently some news articles floating around about a new type of spacesuit that might end up being developed. It vaguely reminded me of the Kull-Warrior outfit, except without the armour on the legs and arms. Skin tight spacesuits. mmmmm good. I hope those end up getting developed.

A spacesuit also needs to have air conditioners to keep the occupant cool so that they don't fry. Whether that is to keep the cool because they are producing too much heat, or because the sun is heating them too much (probably this one), or because their equipment is producing too much heat, I don't know.

[gopher65]

Er...yea sorry about lift support instead of life, long day in IT

I didn't even notice that. Now that I do, I'm wondering why you are talking about Seven of Nine's Lift-Support failing.*cough*