The Cylons have sinned before (spoilers for Occupation)

[K07]

So the Cylons are all about not taking their own life. Gina wouldn't commit suicide in Resurrection Ship and wanted Baltar to take her life. The Cylons don't condone the use of suicide bombings on New Caprica in Occupation and say that taking their own life is a sin. They don't kill themselves when mortally wounded but instead treat themselves as if there is no download into a new body. Doc Cottle works to either save their existence or spare them the pain of their deaths rather than just putting a bullet into their head.

However, in season 1 (is it Litmus? I don't remember the name of it) a Number 5/ Doral arrives on Galactica only to blow himself up. Why was that not a sin? Has anyone discussed this? I usually read and reply to topics and don't start my own, but this has been bugging me since I saw Occupation.

[SoulReaver]

They don't kill themselves when mortally wounded

They do

some of 'em anyway

one of the Cavils - they are not as religious as the other models - was (mortally ?) wounded in Exodus Part 1 (when the prisoners were saved from execution) - he reached for a piece of shrapnel & opened his carotid artery to speed up his trip "to download city"


btw Gina also sinned : she blew herself up with a nuke (along with Cloud9 & 2 other ships)

[BubblingOverWithIdeas]

If you're going to download it isn't suicide. Even a more religious model than Cavil would likely have done that. They didn't tell him off for it. "Suicide" bomber Doral was probably downloaded, as the first Resurrection Ship was still around at that time. Gina, however, was almost certainly out of download range, because the ship had been destroyed and because the Cylons would otherwise have come to New Caprica sooner since they would have had someone to tell them about it. Therefore she did sin. She was severely depressed and she may have rationalized it as not a sin, or at least not as much of one, because it was done for the cause.

[hoof]

Cavil commits suicide after the execution squad rescue when they leave him wounded.

Another interesting tidbit is that Caprica Six is accused of the first cylon-cylon murder, yet Helo's Sharon shoots another copy of herself after Helo discovers that she's a cylon. Maybe none of the cylons realized that she was the shooter in that case, thus don't count it as the first cylon-cylon killing? However, they're aware of the shooting that sets up the Helo/Sharon relationship when Sharon shoots a six early in season 1. Is that not considered "murder" because it was a planned killing (to motivate Helo to have feelings for Sharon)?

[K07]

I forgot about Cavil saying that he killed himself. So killing yourself when you'll download is ok; killing yourself with the knowledge you'll never come back is a sin. I know it's just a tv show, but at the time, it seemed like a big plot hole in terms of Cylon religion. I was just overlooking a fact.

And I did notice that part about Caprica Six not being the first murderer of another Cylon, but didn't think much of it because Sharon shooting that Six in season 1 was all a part of the plan. It's ironic Doral shoots Caprica when forcing Baltar to sign the death list. That wasn't part of any plan; it was done in the heat of the moment to persuade Baltar to sign the papers.

[SoulReaver]

If you're going to download it isn't suicide.

If so then Caprica6 bashing that #3 with a rock wasn't murder & neither was Boomer shooting that other #8 - in fact the only cylon who ever sinned (in the sense suicide or murder of another cylon) would be Gina

[jdog]

I think it's important to remember the cylons are less like machines and more like children in adult bodies.

This is like Jr high or High school for them. They have no purpose and have to find one.

[SoulReaver]

actually the humanoid cylons are not machines (no more than humans anyway)

[deadman]

I'm confused about the Human Cylons, how are they Cylons, are they organic machines connected to a Reincarnation Ship? How are they different from people?

[BubblingOverWithIdeas]

If so then Caprica6 bashing that #3 with a rock wasn't murder & neither was Boomer shooting that other #8 - in fact the only cylon who ever sinned (in the sense suicide or murder of another cylon) would be Gina

True. D'Anna didn't say Caprica had murdered her, just that it was the first act of violence between Cylons. They're definitely not counting planned violence like Sharon shooting Six in the first episode. Sharon shot another Eight, which wasn't part of the plan, but since Eight was looking at Helo when she was shot it's believable that she didn't know who shot her.

I'm confused about the Human Cylons, how are they Cylons, are they organic machines connected to a Reincarnation Ship? How are they different from people?

They are organic machines, which is what we human beings are as well really. The Cylons differ in that they have some (hard-to-detect) cybernetic enhancements and some genetic differences. They have brains, blood, sweat, tears, bones, lymph nodes etc. and they also are stronger, smarter, and tougher than us, with the ability to interface with computer systems and share information and even memories with each other. They have reproductive systems which should be fully functional but, to their infinite frustration, haven't worked so far except in the case of Sharon and Helo, who love each other (love does have some biochemical effects, which could be important for Cylon physiology).