Stargate hits iTunes

[AndyStargateUK]

Who else feels that Sony should set up a deal with Apple to sell Stargate: SG1 and Stargate Atlantis on i-tunes* video downloads?

On the forum currently there are some who speculate with the lack of adverts on downloads compared to Sci-Fi mean more people are downloading Stargate and Stargate Atlantis which seems to be having a negative impact on ratings which is a key factor is deciding whether a series gets renewed for another season by Sci-Fi.

There are also fans in Australia who have been left in the dark as to when Stargate will appear again on Australian tv screens , whilst fans in the UK are left waiting for Sky One to catch up on the July/August/September episodes that Sci-Fi show in the Summer but Sky hold back until late September.

Fans on this forum all respect the fact that the hard work and effort put in by everyone involved in Stargate SG1 and Stargate Atlantis should not go unpaid.
Yet many are annoyed by either a high frequency of advertising or personal reasons which mean they can't tune in on a Friday night to Sci-Fi or the fact in the part of the world where they live they have to wait many weeks or months to watch Stargate at the whim of broadcasters who sometimes can't care less.

Isn't it time that Sony offers a legitimate way for fans to access Stargate and Stargate Atlantis onine while being able to financially contribute to the company for all the hard work that goes into both of these great shows and all the people that work on them.
Say $1.49-$1.99 a show (or a seaon pass with a 10% discount) and maybe even a HD option for an extra $1.50 a show from i-tunes*. Also make downloads not just for the US but for around the world.
That way the money can filter to Sony , some of which can be paid to Sci-Fi to offset the loss in viewers caused by downloads to keep them happy and renewing the shows each season and the rest to the hardworking people of Stargate and Stargate Atlantis.

Does anyone else feel a petition needs to be set up , perhaps gateworld can get in contact with a Sony rep and see what they think can be done. Does any one know a direct Sony contact to try and get Sony to sign a deal with I-Tunes* as well?

*Note with an i-tunes download it can be either played on your video i-pod,on your notebook/laptop,and your home pc (you can even hook up your laptop/pc to your tv be it a standard or high definition tv and watch the i-tunes download via your tv).

[Commander Jumper]

I do though I don't have an Ipod but that would be all the more reason to get one.

[rarocks24]

Ah...but I have a notebook, so I would have portability to watch it. Though I could also get it from TiVo and download it to my notebook (but then I wouldn't own the copy of it...) So when I fly to Italy- 2 batteries, worth about 10 hours of life while using both...equals a quick flight.

[Endeavour]

Yes, it's long, but if you're one of the crazy people who thinks downloading is illegal please read this


The entire idea that downloading TV shows is illegal is somewhat of an urban myth. Too many people have just assumed that downloading TV shows is exactly the same as downloading movies, which it's not. But because both use the same system, they're tarred with the same brush.

The techno-legal side first, I'll come back to the show-relevant stuff in a minute.

The reason downloading movies and mp3's is illegal is because it's breach of copyright. If I do it, I'm obtaining something I haven't paid for (hence the adverts equating movie piracy with theft).

But what about downloading TV shows? At first glance it seems the same, but it's really not. If I have a cable-tv subscription, I'm already paying to receive certain channels (Scifi in the US, Sky 1 in the UK). Now that they have my money, they don't care what I do - I could leave the TV turned off all year if I want. It's my choice, I paid for the service, I can choose to use it or not.

That's common sense, right? Okay, so Stargate is on at 8pm on a Friday, and I always work until 9pm. So I set my VCR to record it and watch it on Saturday afternoon. Nothing illegal there.

Last week it was my birthday/christmas/kwanza and I got a Tivo for a present. I chucked my VCR in the trash and hooked up my Tivo. Now my Tivo records SG-1 to its hard disk every friday night, and I watch it on saturday.

Let's think about this a second. I've paid for my subscription to a channel, and I'm recording a program I want to watch. Nobody could even question whether any of that is illegal - it's absolutely not.

Except Tivo is actually a computer. It runs Linux. You can even buy a network card for it so you can stream video over your network (go check ebay). So what's the difference between recording something on my Tivo in the living room and streaming it to the bedroom, to recording something onto a VHS tape in the living room and taking it to the bedroom? Nothing.

So we've established that it's perfectly legal for me to make a digital recording of a TV show on a channel I legally pay a subscription for.

But last week my Tivo broke, and I didn't get SG-1 recorded. I'm not waiting 8 months for the DVD's to come out to see the missed episode - I'll buy the DVD boxset anyway, because I'm a fan. I just want to see the episode.

So I fire up my p2p client and download the missed episode. Uhoh, suddenly everyone thinks I'm doing something illegal. I'm really not. Downloading an episode of a TV show is no different to watching a recorded copy of it. It's no different to recording it at your friends house because his Tivo works and watching it at your house.

It's not illegal! If I didn't pay for a satellite/cable subscription and did it, then yeah, *maybe* that's illegal (ever let a friend borrow a CD?). But using an alternative mechanism to get something *I've already paid for and am entitled to is not illegal*.

However, there is another side to it - TV show ratings. This isn't a legal or ethical angle, it's a stupidity angle.

P2p downloads of TV shows are incredibly, unbelievably popular. The TV studios know it, why do you think the first 2 eps of Battlestar Galactica S2 were released on the net ages before the season started on TV? But because the stupid, insane, incorrect and technologically moronic ratings system doesn't take into account downloads, shows get hurt for it. Come on, people, even music charts are beginning to count MP3 downloads.

But they don't get hurt for it in the way people think. We all know that the rating system (Nielsen, for example) is based on a sample of homes who agree to have the black box and record their viewing habits. There are thousands of Stargate fans on this forum, and I'd be surprised if even 1 was in the Nielsen rating program, and that doesn't take into account fans outside the USA. So if everyone on this forum stopped watching Stargate today, what would happen to the ratings? Nothing.

So the question is, does downloading a show affect it? Yes, but only because the networks are too stupid/blind/ignorant to accept technological progress.

In the UK there is something called Teleport from a cable company called Telewest. Subscribers get all the normal cable stuff (set top box, 1 billion channels etc), but they get something extra. They have a menu they can go to and watch shows that have played in the previous week or 2 at ANY TIME. They can pause, rewind, fast forward these shows. Teleport even has complete series available to watch. And it doesn't cost a penny to watch as many shows as you want, when you want. If you have Teleport, you pay nothing extra.

So tell me. What's the legal difference between downloading a tv show and watching it on teleport? The answer is: nothing.

(oh, edit, in case you care, I don't download Stargate eps because I like watching them each week

[AndyStargateUK]

[COLOR="Red"] But because the stupid, insane, incorrect and technologically moronic ratings system doesn't take into account downloads, shows get hurt for it. Come on, people, even music charts are beginning to count MP3 downloads.

The ratings for Sci-Fi help determine (during sweeps) how much they get in advertising revenue,since downloads don't contain the same adverts counting them as a Sci-Fi viewer wouldn't mean Sci-Fi would be able to gain more revenue as the people who download the tv show don't watch the adverts.
In the long run is Sci-Fi going to keep paying up for Stargate and Atlantis if its audience and advertising revenues decrease but while more and more people enjoy the show for free online? There will come a point where they will say enough is enough, that's why the shows need to be avaliable via i-tunes.

Music charts do count MP3 downloads, that is paid for downloads.

In order to keep the show going Sony should allow Stargate and Atlantis to be avalaible via i-tunes , some of that money can go to Sci-Fi to offset it's loss of viewers to downloading so that when it comes to renewing the show each season not only do they know they get so much advertising revenue from those who watch on Sci-Fi but that they also get some sort of fixed revenue from those who chose to watch Stargate without adverts, but who pay to download of the likes of i-tunes.
The rest can be shared out amongst the hard working people who give us these great shows just like at the moment they get a share of dvd revenues they should get a share of downloading revnues as well once people start to pay.

[FallenAngelII]

Not to mention that some countries don't even air Stargate. Sweden stopped after season 2 (and it took us several years since they did a several year long pause between seasons 1 and 2)!

So I just chucked it off and didn't watch any Stargate 'til my friend introduced me to Atlantis (downloaded). So I started downloading s1 and s8 of both shows and am now retroactively downloading AND buying the show on DVD.

People don't download the show if they have Sci-Fi or can get it. It's much better to watch a show on TV, especially if it's the 1st time it's ever aired. "I'm among the first in the world to watch this!".

But some of us don't live in the states. Some Americans can't even get Sci-Fi? What's the alternative? Wait for ages for the DVDs? No, we download. And those of us who really like the show eventually buy the DVDs. People who don't buy the DVDs wouldn't tune in every Stargate night to watch it religiously, anyway.

[Endeavour]

The ratings for Sci-Fi help determine (during sweeps) how much they get in advertising revenue,since downloads don't contain the same adverts counting them as a Sci-Fi viewer wouldn't mean Sci-Fi would be able to gain more revenue as the people who download the tv show don't watch the adverts.

Yes, but I addressed this point. Fact is during sweeps (I think I know what that is, but I'm not from the US), just as for the rest of the year, the only rating data comes from the sample households with Nielsen etc boxes. So again, whilst you're correct in saying downloaders don't watch adverts, in reality this has zero effect. Revenue is based on companies purchasing advertising, advertising purchase is based on ratings, ratings are based on a sample set of viewer-households and you and I can't affect that unless we're one of those selected households and tick the "stargate sucks" box.

Music charts do count MP3 downloads, that is paid for downloads.

Right, that's what I'm talking about. As my really long post explained, if you subscribe to Scifi/Sky 1 but download the eps, there is no difference. You're still paying for the service (as opposed to just pirating mp3s, which I wouldn't expect to be counted in a chart).

Maybe I didn't explain it very well, I was just trying to explain why downloading shows isn't illegal and doesn't affect ratings.

If the advertisers thought they could get more people watching adverts by adding them to downloadable episodes than by buying airtime, don't you think we'd be doing a lot more downloading? TV networks are scared of downloads because they can't compete against them in a legitimate (non-piracy) market.

Give it 5 years for the bandwidth to become widely available, we'll see high-definition, legal downloads of tv shows with adverts in them that are available before they show on TV. The supplier has low overheads (no expensive broadcast equipment needed) and high profit, with no cost difference to the end user - cancel your Scifi subscription, pay the same amount to the new supplier.

[NowIWillDestroyAbydos]

I do though I don't have an Ipod but that would be all the more reason to get one.

I don't own an iPod (but I want one), but I still watch Podcasts and TV shows (that I legally download) on my computer. An iPod would let me watch stuff when I'm away from my computer.

And yes I do support it.

[Cpt. Obvious]

i'm all for it. i just got a video iPod for Christmas and was so excited about downloading videos and all and was very disappointed to see that the only thing they have from SciFi is BSG which i've watched maybe once. i would love to have episodes to watch away from home. i mean what do i do if i get stuck somewhere unexpectantly? that's right, whip out my iPod and watch Stargate. that's just awesome to think about.

[Eoin]

Im all for downloading stargate from i-tunes

[NowIWillDestroyAbydos]

I've created a petition on this subject, sig coming soon:
http://www.petitiononline.com/sgitunes/

[HirogenGater]

Only way I would support this is if they offer more music than what is available on the current cds, which I own. I want some Asgard music! and more battle music like from Lost City.

[Red Tigress]

I think it's a great idea! As a huge supporter of iTunes, I'd be all for it. I'm getting an iPod video next year, but I think it would be a great way of expanding the fan base, and getting eps to people in countries that don't have it, or are seasons behind.

[Space Cadette]

FYI: You should be able to watch downloaded videos from iTunes in the iTunes program on your computer even if you don't have an ipod. I believe the iTunes program is a free download available for both Macs and PCs.

And yes, I think SG1 and SGA should be available as downloads on iTunes. SciFi/USA have other shows up there.

[annalouise]

<----- has to read huge books on copyright and fairuse laws for advertising bit of graphic design degree. For some unknown reason.

Except Tivo is actually a computer. It runs Linux. You can even buy a network card for it so you can stream video over your network (go check ebay). So what's the difference between recording something on my Tivo in the living room and streaming it to the bedroom, to recording something onto a VHS tape in the living room and taking it to the bedroom? Nothing.

So we've established that it's perfectly legal for me to make a digital recording of a TV show on a channel I legally pay a subscription for.

But last week my Tivo broke, and I didn't get SG-1 recorded. I'm not waiting 8 months for the DVD's to come out to see the missed episode - I'll buy the DVD boxset anyway, because I'm a fan. I just want to see the episode.

So I fire up my p2p client and download the missed episode. Uhoh, suddenly everyone thinks I'm doing something illegal. I'm really not. Downloading an episode of a TV show is no different to watching a recorded copy of it. It's no different to recording it at your friends house because his Tivo works and watching it at your house.

It's not illegal! If I didn't pay for a satellite/cable subscription and did it, then yeah, *maybe* that's illegal (ever let a friend borrow a CD?). But using an alternative mechanism to get something *I've already paid for and am entitled to is not illegal*.

Downloading episodes is illegal because it's public distribution. Regardless of whether you would have seen the episode anyway. Full stop end of story. Recording them on your TV and transferring them to your computer isn't as it's still for your own private use. Giving your friend your CD/video isn't illegal, but them making a copy of it is. Of course no-one is going to come banging on your door to sue you for it, but it's still not legal. It's not unethical however, since most fans will not only watch the episode, but buy the DVDs as well, and no doubt if it was availble on i-Tunes we would watch the show, buy the DVDs, and download the episodes :b

I am all for more TV shows in general being made availble through the internet and especially iTunes (apple sure have cornered the market on that) Though it's basically impossible to predict what would happen to the ratings/DVD sales if such an event were to occur as iTunes itself is still in its infancy, so we don't really know what the long-term effects of the internet merging with TV media is going to be.