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  1. #41
    Chief Master Sergeant
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    Post Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    Quote Originally Posted by majorsal
    can i ask one thing? does he pull any one-liners in this ep?
    sally
    Remarkably, Mitch's character had displayed greater depth than just employing one liners. Hell, and this is coming from a vocal critic of both Mitch and VAla.

  2. #42
    Second Lieutenant thorshammer's Avatar
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    Thor Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    This ep was totally predictable. The only thing was that her husband was the one that killed her but the other stuff I figured out pretty quick. The actor that plays Cameron as a kid didn't look anything, anything like Cameron as an adult. Although it was cool that we got some backstory on Cam. Was the part on the jet all CG? Because if it was It looked very, very real.

  3. #43
    Colonel ShimmeringStar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    Quote Originally Posted by ShardsofGlass
    The "kirking" criticism kills me. So, because Kirk slept around a lot, no character is ever allowed to have a bit of romance in a Scifi show?! Sheesh. Poor Cam. I bet he hasn't been with a girl in a long time, and the time he meets someone nice, she's murdered! I wouldn't call that "kirking"!
    When you're on duty as an emissary from your planet you ain't off the clock 'til you're back in your own bed on Earth. Call it what you will.... Kirking. Whoring. A quickie on the clock -- whatever moniker you want to name it.

    I hope Cam has a wild-n-crazy intimate life, but not on 'company time.' Cam does seem like a pretty likeable character but it can be way too easy to make him into a cartoon character boinking every alien chick he meets.... Plus... the man seems to have morals -- look the writers have him nearly quitting the AF because of the angst he had over killing what ended up being a civilian target. He's showing signs of deep thought, convictions, a moral code. Guess some of us kinda, sorta thought he'd have some morals about his professional *ahem* intimate conduct too.

    But like many have already said..... it was strictly a plot device, although I wonder... had the sex part had been removed, it *still* would have been a good ep. He didn't have to *ahem* her to make anyone (her ex or the general) mad enough to kill her....
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  4. #44
    First Lieutenant kazbaby's Avatar
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    Default Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    I have to watch it again, oh hardship abound , but for now I have to say I liked Samantha not leaving Cameron alone during the search through his memories. That continues to show that he…rather they… respect each other and have a friendship beyond the SGC.

    They maintained the team aspect by having Teal’c and Daniel go over the details of the investigation. Other than Sam, there are no others that pay as strict attention to detail, even if it had colored Mitchell in an unfavorable light.

    Yes, this type of storyline has been done in the past by other shows, as I said earlier. But they did it in their own way.

    As for the complaint about the flashbacks for Mitchell’s history?

    How else do you want them to tell it aside from a roundtable discussion and Cameron just talking. What fun is that?
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  5. #45
    Lieutenant Colonel Dani347's Avatar
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    Default Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    The one liners and Kirking were really a minor part of the episode, but enough for a mention. Other than that he was great. His reaction to having those memories in his head, and then his anger when he was told that he should be grateful to be allowed to go hone with the memories still in his head were very well played.

    Is it just me, or was Daniel talking much slower than his usual high speed?
    I'm a girl! A girly girly girl!

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  6. #46
    Lieutenant Colonel AGateFan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    Quote Originally Posted by Seshat
    I liked the unexpected twist at the end, too. That is, if you mean the final erasure, as who actually killed her was apparent to me as soon as she was murdered.

    LOL, I immediately thought of Tom Paris and the implanted memories and the murder HE didn't commit in ST:Voyager. (Hey, AGateFan, let's duke it out over whether the plot more resembled B5 or ST:Voyager! LOL )

    I liked the "dad" bits because we FINALLY got to learn something about Cam's past. Overall I'd say it was the best ep so far this season.
    I just meant the erasing of his memory as punishment for the crime. On B5 instead of executing you if you commited capital murder they sentenced you to "death of personality". Had the telepaths wipe you clean and send you back to serve society...... The rest of the ep was all Tom Paris and Voyager
    Joseph Mallozzi -"In the meantime, I'm into season 5 of OZ (where the show takes an unfortunate hairpin turn into "the not so wonderful world of fantasy")"

    ^^^ Kinda sounds like seasons 9 and 10 of SG-1 to me. Thor, ya got Aspirin?

    AGateFan has officially Gone Fishin (with Jack, Sam, Daniel, Teal'c) and is hoping Atlantis does not take that same hairpin turn.

  7. #47
    Colonel ShimmeringStar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    Quote Originally Posted by Dromag67
    Cons:
    Kirking is getting annoying.
    No one for Teal'c to beat up.
    Especially after that award-winning performance in last week's ep!
    Quote Originally Posted by thorshammer
    This ep was totally predictable. The only thing was that her husband was the one that killed her but the other stuff I figured out pretty quick. The actor that plays Cameron as a kid didn't look anything, anything like Cameron as an adult. Although it was cool that we got some backstory on Cam. Was the part on the jet all CG? Because if it was It looked very, very real.
    That was nice.

    The kid was okay, but more kudos for the casting of the father. Very believable casting there.
    Convention Pix Shore Leave ('06 to '09), AT2, AT3, & AT4 ('06, '08, & '09), and Vancouver ('07)
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  8. #48
    Chief Master Sergeant GenHammondsBarber's Avatar
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    Hammond Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    Welcome to Gen Hammond's barber barber's shop

    Sit down while I review Collateral Damage.

    This was a really good episode earning 6 of 8 Chevron's encoded.

    Overall

    This episode was like Total Recall meets CSI in the stargate universe. It was a unique viewing expereince in the staragte universe. It envoked classic stargate in continuing old issues of politics/technology/friendships, throughout multiple seasons. This time it was done using the Gao'uld memory device and the Gao'ld Asgard treaty. The plot twist was great. We also got to meet a new race that was not connected to the Ori. The episode was much different then I had anticipated after reading plot summaries befoe hand, and kept me guessing.

    The opening was something I have never seen in stargate, and had a CSI feel to it. I thought it was great to see the writers/directors show a darker side to stargate. Shake things up a bit. The murder, the dried blood, the anger in Mitchell's face and eyes. It was a great opening scene. From there I knew I was going to see something that I had not before in Stargate.

    24 hours earlier

    Loved seeing that. Alittle different for your stargate viewing experience as well. I was glad to see some innovation in their style.

    Ben Browder-- I felt Ben's acting was great in this episode. I really felt for his character at several periods during the episode. This is the first time he has gotten me to do that.

    We got to see a new civilization and its history. I enjoy episodes like this. They discussed "The Ring", and had their own internal struggles with what to do with the ring as well as new technology ( interstellar travel--memory deviceonce the Ga'ould fell. We were able to see that this is what many planets and civilizations under the asgard protection treaty are probably going through.

    This was also one of our new SGC's 1st big moral test. They passed.

    Kirking--This was fairly dark Kirking. The darkest I have ever scene in sci-fi. I don't mind kirking if their is some sort of twist or new way to show it. I felt this did it. When have you heard the term Blood Alcohol Level in stargate or sci fi at all.

    You have Mitchell going home and getting drunk with a married woman. They did not play up the romance angle. Instead, they made the woman very aggressive. Now I have seen the woman be the agressor before, but it was to fulfill some purpose....to seduce and gain power...to gian information...this was purely sexual.

    Also, I tend to think this will make Cam and the rest of SG-1 think twice before Kirking in the future.

    I thought the asylum angle was great and highlighted the new politically climate of the galaxy. This has gone largely under the radar in the 1st half of this season. I was glad they were able to shed some light on how the galaxy has changed outside of the Ori, since the Gao'uld have fallen.

    Childhood Memories

    Not only do we get a unique stargate episode, but we get some great backstory on Cam. We learn about his past, and his relationship with his father. I began to like him alot more in this episode. Also, his Dad's legs being taken off was another sign of the darkness of this episode. The determination of his dad to walk again and Cam fighting through the error that killed innocent people helped me get a much better sense of who he is. ALso the Top Gun like plane sequence with Cam was pretty cool too.

    There was a great Mckay/Zelenka moment between the two scientists....when he did not want to waste time explaining his theory.


    Someone stated earlier that once people realized Cam did not committ the murder that they should have focused on the people with the proper expertise---and that this was logical,...and that by not doing so the episode was illogical.

    I disagree. Thats the logical way if you actually want to find the killer, However: 1) Remember that the Emissary did not want this to continue. 2) The only reason the investigation continued is from our own political pressure. 3) Once they found the murderer they did not punish him.

    The society we were dealing with was more concenred with technological breakthroughs and advancing its military then humanity. The episode showed the conflicts of this civilization in the dawn of a new era and I don't think people are appreciating that as much as they are I saw soemthing like this 7 years ago on a babylon 5 rerun.

    We recieved a great epsiode that perhaps requires some to rewatch it before they thoroughly appreciate the work.

    I hope you all enjoyed your time in the barbershop tonight.


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  9. #49
    Colonel Seshat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    Quote Originally Posted by kazbaby

    As for the complaint about the flashbacks for Mitchell’s history?

    How else do you want them to tell it aside from a roundtable discussion and Cameron just talking. What fun is that?
    I will ALWAYS vote for the showing rather than the telling!

    And who mentioned not liking the shaky camera style? I thought it added a sense of unreality to the ep, mirroring Cam's own sense of confusion at re-living the implanted memories and wondering what was real and what was not. I think that was absolutely intentional on the director's part to highlight the character's dilemma.

    *goes off to look up who directed this ep*

    ETA: WILL WARING! I should have known. I LOVE many of his eps from past seasons.

  10. #50
    Second Lieutenant
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    Default Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    Quote Originally Posted by kazbaby
    As for the complaint about the flashbacks for Mitchell’s history?

    How else do you want them to tell it aside from a roundtable discussion and Cameron just talking. What fun is that?
    Why do we have to know so much angst about his past anyways? Why can't we learn about him as we go. We never saw flashbacks from any of the other characters over the years. The closest to a flashback was when Daniel witnessed his parents killed and that was only one episode.

    I just think with all the back story to Mitchell, TPTB are trying to force us to like him. I'm sorry, he's just not growing on me at all. This was the first episode in 9 years that I wasn't even looking forward to.

    Daniel was and is my favorite character, and I dreaded the sixth season, but for some reason I liked Jonas. We didn't get any flashbacks from him...we knew everything we needed to know about him the first few episodes.

    I don't even really miss Jack. I just don't care for the character of Mitchell and this episode really pushed me over the edge. I'll watch the rest of the season, but not with the anticipation of old. I'm looking forward to Vala returning though and hoping that will liven up the show some.

  11. #51
    Lieutenant Colonel AGateFan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    Quote Originally Posted by nccjones
    Why do we have to know so much angst about his past anyways? Why can't we learn about him as we go. We never saw flashbacks from any of the other characters over the years. The closest to a flashback was when Daniel witnessed his parents killed and that was only one episode.

    I just think with all the back story to Mitchell, TPTB are trying to force us to like him. I'm sorry, he's just not growing on me at all. This was the first episode in 9 years that I wasn't even looking forward to.

    Daniel was and is my favorite character, and I dreaded the sixth season, but for some reason I liked Jonas. We didn't get any flashbacks from him...we knew everything we needed to know about him the first few episodes.

    I don't even really miss Jack. I just don't care for the character of Mitchell and this episode really pushed me over the edge. I'll watch the rest of the season, but not with the anticipation of old. I'm looking forward to Vala returning though and hoping that will liven up the show some.
    What about COLD LAZARUS. That was pretty much a bunch of Jack Flashbacks to seeing his kid shoot himself... I’m just saying, there is precedence...
    Joseph Mallozzi -"In the meantime, I'm into season 5 of OZ (where the show takes an unfortunate hairpin turn into "the not so wonderful world of fantasy")"

    ^^^ Kinda sounds like seasons 9 and 10 of SG-1 to me. Thor, ya got Aspirin?

    AGateFan has officially Gone Fishin (with Jack, Sam, Daniel, Teal'c) and is hoping Atlantis does not take that same hairpin turn.

  12. #52
    Lieutenant Colonel Dani347's Avatar
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    Default Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    Quote Originally Posted by GenHammondsBarber
    [B]

    Not only do we get a unique stargate episode, but we get some great backstory on Cam. We learn about his past, and his relationship with his father. I began to like him alot more in this episode. Also, his Dad's legs being taken off was another sign of the darkness of this episode. The determination of his dad to walk again and Cam fighting through the error that killed innocent people helped me get a much better sense of who he is. ALso the Top Gun like plane sequence with Cam was pretty cool too.
    Aside from just background, this also helped give him a reason for being "determined, never give up" beyond just it being a heroic trait. Mitchell gets this because he had the example of his father battling a bigger obstacle. Plus, they add the need to know the truth (finding out exactly who had committed the murder, and in the flashbacks, needing to know who was in the target.)

    Now, all they need to do is show how these same traits can be a flaw in his character, or show some other flaw to really give him depth.
    I'm a girl! A girly girly girl!

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  13. #53
    Colonel cindyz's Avatar
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    Default Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    So far, the best of season 9! Thanks TPTB for letting Ben show just how great of an actor he is. I really felt his angst/anguish for the first time this season.
    ok, so the plot felt recycled... I guess there are only so many plots to be had in sci-fi.....but at least there was no mention of the Oreos. Getting to know more about Cameron Mitchell was good, too. I give it a 8/10.

  14. #54
    Captain BigGator5's Avatar
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    Heart Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    Quote Originally Posted by kazbaby
    I have to watch it again, oh hardship abound , but for now I have to say I liked Samantha not leaving Cameron alone during the search through his memories. That continues to show that he…rather they… respect each other and have a friendship beyond the SGC.
    SAM/CAM SHIP!! <3

  15. #55
    Lieutenant Colonel AGateFan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    Quote Originally Posted by BigGator5
    SAM/CAM SHIP!! <3
    God, please no.
    Joseph Mallozzi -"In the meantime, I'm into season 5 of OZ (where the show takes an unfortunate hairpin turn into "the not so wonderful world of fantasy")"

    ^^^ Kinda sounds like seasons 9 and 10 of SG-1 to me. Thor, ya got Aspirin?

    AGateFan has officially Gone Fishin (with Jack, Sam, Daniel, Teal'c) and is hoping Atlantis does not take that same hairpin turn.

  16. #56
    Second Lieutenant
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    Default Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    Quote Originally Posted by AGateFan
    What about COLD LAZARUS. That was pretty much a bunch of Jack Flashbacks to seeing his kid shoot himself... I’m just saying, there is precedence...
    Yes, I agree there is precedence, but it wasn't forced down our throats like he is. That's how I feel. I respect that you like the introduction of this character this way. I would rather see team episodes of them going to other planets and just learn about him along the way. How he deals with situations. I just don't feel we need to know all about his issues to be told what kind of a guy he is and what kind of a leader he'll be.

  17. #57
    Lieutenant General prion's Avatar
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    Default Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    For those who are curious, JEFF UPTON (mentioned at end of episode in memorium)

    was a gaffer (crew member) on SG1.

    AKA: Chief Lighting Technician
    The head of the electrical department, responsible for the design and execution of the lighting plan for a production. Early films used mostly natural light, which stagehands controlled with large tent cloths using long poles called gaffs (stagehands were often beached sailors or longshoremen, and a gaff is a type of boom on a sailing ship). In 16th Century English, the term "gaffer" denoted a man who was the head of any organized group of laborers.

  18. #58
    Lieutenant Colonel AGateFan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    Quote Originally Posted by nccjones
    Yes, I agree there is precedence, but it wasn't forced down our throats like he is. That's how I feel. I respect that you like the introduction of this character this way. I would rather see team episodes of them going to other planets and just learn about him along the way. How he deals with situations. I just don't feel we need to know all about his issues to be told what kind of a guy he is and what kind of a leader he'll be.
    I agree completely, I would like to see more team stand alones also and I would prefer to be 'shown' instead of told stuff.
    Joseph Mallozzi -"In the meantime, I'm into season 5 of OZ (where the show takes an unfortunate hairpin turn into "the not so wonderful world of fantasy")"

    ^^^ Kinda sounds like seasons 9 and 10 of SG-1 to me. Thor, ya got Aspirin?

    AGateFan has officially Gone Fishin (with Jack, Sam, Daniel, Teal'c) and is hoping Atlantis does not take that same hairpin turn.

  19. #59
    First Lieutenant kazbaby's Avatar
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    Default Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    Quote Originally Posted by nccjones
    Why do we have to know so much angst about his past anyways? Why can't we learn about him as we go. We never saw flashbacks from any of the other characters over the years. The closest to a flashback was when Daniel witnessed his parents killed and that was only one episode.

    I just think with all the back story to Mitchell, TPTB are trying to force us to like him. I'm sorry, he's just not growing on me at all. This was the first episode in 9 years that I wasn't even looking forward to.
    It's not forcing him on us, it's filling us in on an enigma that is now a part of the team. We are learning as we go along, but they're allowing us to get to know him on the same level that we know the rest of the team.

    Quote Originally Posted by BigGator5
    SAM/CAM SHIP!! <3
    Oh, I hope not. I like them having just a friendship. It's another layer to their lives other than adventures.
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  20. #60
    Second Lieutenant
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    Default Re: Collateral Damage (912)

    Ok...Am I really the only one who noticed the Daniel slam dunk in the conference room? I'm starting to wonder if people didn't think it was a big deal. I mean, Daniel was voicing his concern and there was only on a few planets so far Mitchell who was already hot after the alian babe slamming him for his concerns, and then Landry saying..yes, we know that for 9 years that there's been questionable alian devices..but that's what they go to the planets (well, along those lines...not exact quote).

    I just felt that he was totally disrespected in that scene. JMO.

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