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Thread: Michael (218)

  1. #81
    Staff Sergeant Caylynn's Avatar
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    Cool Re: Michael (218)

    I quite enjoyed this episode. I hadn't read any spoilers, so I was really wondering what was going on at the beginning - very creepy.

    It was also great to see Connor Trinneer back in action. I enjoyed Enterprise, and it was great to see "Tripp" back on the screen, even if he was playing a wraith.

    I'm a little disturbed at how easily he got away though - why didn't they have more security in place?

    Very creepy that the wraith probably know all about Atlantis now, though.

  2. #82
    Major General Willow'sCat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    Quote Originally Posted by xfkirsten
    That being said, I have no problem with killing animal life for food - that's just the way nature works. Humans are omnivores. Humans do eat meat. I love a good steak.
    Not all humans eat meat thank you. I did give you green for the other stuff you posted.

    I didn't mind this episode, and Connor was fantastic he did a wonderful job and yes I am a fan. In fact he became the only reason I watched all of STE.

    Teyla! Yea, I am definitely a Telya fan now Rachel was a pleasure to watch in this and she and Connor have great chemistry, I hope one day Connor can reappear in this role. Everyone has pretty much covered the ethical and moral dilemmas so I won't rehash.

    I will say yea! One of the Australians got to be in a scene with Rodney *even if she was in the background*

  3. #83
    Second Lieutenant GateLadyM's Avatar
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    Fairly decent episode, but too much like an old StarTrek-TNG show dealing with capturing a Borg, giving him a name (Hugh) and trying to return him to humanity. Then the question - do we keep him? Return him to the Borg in an attempt to "corrupt" them? Kill him? In the end, Hugh went back to the Borg. This episode wasn't as original as some people may think.

    Teyla was good, and Ronon definitely showed he is possessive of her. Of all the romantic triangles TPTB have shoved at us in SGA, I find the Ronon/Teyla pairing to be the most interesting.

    Connor did a very good job as Michael. Glad to hear he will be returning.

  4. #84
    Data ShadowMaat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    Once again we have an ep with a great concept, but a so-so execution.

    Everyone accepts the idea that it's okay to turn a wraith into a human and turn him loose in the city? Um... No. Granted, it made for a good "moral ambiguity issue" with the wraith calling the humans on what they were doing, but I think this should have been the central issue and that it should have been exploread a lot more.

    Also, as has been said, bringing a wraith back to Atlantis- whatever you plan to do with him- is borderline suicidal.

    Even if I accept that all of the character are morally corrupt enough to attempt this experiment with no qualms and even if I accept that they'd do this in Atlantis, why in HELL would they transfer him from an ultra-high security, inpenetrable cell to a backwater planet with no defensive measures at all? Talk about jaw-droppingly asinine plot devices! And I don't buy the "he could find out too much" BS. He ALREADY knows too much and leaving him in Atlantis isn't going to make him any MORE dangerous. Hell, they've had wraith prisoners before and didn't seem overly concerned about the "security risk".

    What, exactly, were they hoping to accomplish by trying to pretend he was a human member of the expedition? He's a WRAITH. He has absolutely no memory, knowledge, or ability to put ANYTHING human into context.

    The wraith aren't like the borg. They were NEVER human. Michael isn't going to spontaneously generate memories of a life he never had and can't begin to fully understand and I think it was incredibly stupid of the entire Atlantis crew to think that this ruse might work. They would have been better off telling him the truth and playing up the "wraith-ness is a virus" routine and trying to convince him that he's been "cured".

    Like others, I really REALLY wish I hadn't been spoiled on this ep because it not only ruined the beginning of the ep, it made me confused. I spent the first couple of scenes trying to figure out what everyone was doing and saying to myself, "But... isn't he a WRAITH?"

    This could have been a great opportunity to give us some more insight into the wraith culture/mindset. I would have loved for Michael to start remembering more of his former life- what he's done, any friends he might have had (or blood brothers or whatever). I think a homesick Wraith would have endeared him just a bit more (though he was already a sympathetic charcter) and shown us how cold the people in Atlantis can be that they had absolutely no concern or interest in the "man" he was or the "life" he had. They could have shown us how he missed that or, maybe, how he was now slightly appalled by some of the things he'd done...

    One silly, minor thing that bugged me is that they had Michael be from Texas (complete with the cliched cowboy hat) and yet he had no trace of a Southern accent. Granted, HE might not know the difference, and I suppose not all Texans have strong accents, but still... why bother with that detail? Was Trip from Texas? Or was it playing back to Lt. Tyler from SG-1's Fifth Man?

    Whatever. Frankly, I'm glad he didn't have the accent because the few times I saw Enterprise, I LOATHED Trip's accent. Conner's voice sounds much nicer without the mouth full of marbles. And with that in mind...

    One thing I really loved about this ep was Conner's performance. He really brought Michael to life and made him an engaging and sympathetic character. I can't say I've paid too much attention to wraith movements before, but I wonder if he maybe got some coaching from James Lafazanos about how wraith should move.

    The half-wraith makeup job was also a nice touch. A little too shiny in places for my tastes, but nicely done. And I think it says a lot about how much Michael has changed (beyond the physical) that he didn't immediately kill Teyla (he even released her) and that he hesitated before trying to feed.

    I'm sure we'll be seeing more of Mikey in upcoming eps. This is gonna come back to bite us in the ass BIG time and I look forward to seeing how it plays out.

    I just wish we could have been spared the kitschy "we're gonna need more firepower" crap at the end. Yeesh. I hope we aren't being set up for a repeat of the first season finale, because that's sure as hell how it sounded.

    Siege was good ONCE, guys. Now drop it and find some NEW drama for us to angst over.

  5. #85
    Captain Wyrminarrd's Avatar
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    It does sound like they are heading towards the same thing this season. Perhaps there will be some great spin on things like them finding a pair of ZPM´s and flying Atlantis into combat against he Hive ships.

    Either that or launching an attack against he hive ships before they ever enter the Atlantis system. A forward defense like that might be very cool.

  6. #86
    Data ShadowMaat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    I don't want a spin. I am SICK of spin. I want an ORIGINAL FRACKING IDEA. I don't need more leftovers.

  7. #87
    Captain Wyrminarrd's Avatar
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    Thats the problem with Atlantis, it´s a one trick pony. There are the wraith and then there are the Wraith. At least with the Goa´uld they had very different personalities and MO´s so even if SG-1 was always dealing with them it seemed a lot more diverse.

    Atlantis needs to run into more baddies or at least make the wraith be more diverse. Until then you´d better get ready for the same thing time and again.

    Besides, I don´t hear you come up with other possibilities

  8. #88

    Default Re: Michael (218)

    There were some good moments in this episode but as a whole it didn't do too much for me. I'm left astounded by the sheer inanity of the Atlantis expedition, it seems to me they're doing everything in their power to get Atlantis destroyed. Couldn't they have just called the wraith and said "We're alive, come get us!"?

  9. #89
    Data ShadowMaat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrminarrd
    Besides, I don´t hear you come up with other possibilities
    Actually, I have. But this isn't the thread to discuss such things.

  10. #90
    Major aaobuttons's Avatar
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    Quote Originally Posted by ShadowMaat
    And I think it says a lot about how much Michael has changed (beyond the physical) that he didn't immediately kill Teyla (he even released her) and that he hesitated before trying to feed.

    I thought as a whole the episode was quite good. I try to overlook plot conviences when possible because this is just a TV show (and seriously, how many times can a city be in danger or a main character be in danger and in real life statistically survive?).
    My character critiques: Weir's dark turn I didn't really buy, Carson's I did. Why one and not the other... I don't know. I thought Ronan was over the top with his whole grabbing of the neck and throwing against the wall thing. Shep I felt was too lax for not arguing the point more (I did like the whole "you need a name, let's call you Mike" part). Hightmeyer is getting annoying, she needs more than one dimension if she's going to be a reacurring character. I want to like her, she's just nothing but a cut out copy of a shrink.

    Teyla got to shine in this episode. She was the only one who seemed to think of Michael as a real person, not just an experiment. She knew to be careful but didn't judge him. If anything is going to leave a lasting impression on Wraith!Michael it's going to be her and her kindness towards him. What sort of impression that will be could be interesting. I think although he felt betrayed by everyone, he felt it most sharply with Teyla. She had supposedly been his friend, and when he had nothing else to remember, he had felt a connection with her and had held on to that.

    Michael raises more questions about the wraith than answers and I'm left definetly wanting more! How much of Michael was the drug and how much was his innate character? We've only seen the Wraith interacting with humans and usually in hostile situations. How do they act around eachother, with their friends (if they have any) with their families (again if they have any)? Michael while on Atlantis (pre realization) was friendly, curious, apologetic; he was never menacing, cruel, or cold. After he found out he was a wraith he still didn't act like we would think a wraith would. He didn't want to fight anyone or kill that soldier, he just wanted to escape. The fact that he repeatedly tried to get the soldier to put his weapon down makes me wonder even more. With Teyla too at the end we see confusing elements; he's Wraith!Michael by now, but he lets Teyla out of her restraints, he has more than enough opportunities to feed on her while she's knocked out but he doesn't. He could have easily taken her down to the ship or fed upon her but he doesn't... is it because he still has some of that other Michael left in him with the drug, or because he doesn't want to hurt her, because he sees her differently. I loved that battle inside him with that "Instinct" coming into play again just like with Ellia. Would he have fed on her in the end, he went after her, but would he have stopped, would the instinct have been too much? Too bad we didn't have the chance to find out, but hopefully we'll see some indication next time we see Michael.
    It's beer o'clock. Now where the HELL is my riot !?!

  11. #91
    Chief Master Sergeant Callie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    I couldn’t read everything written on Carson’s calendar, but one of the days says “Dinner with Cadman”. He really has to stop calling his girlfriend by her surname! You can’t even argue that she prefers it, because Rodney called her Laura all through Duet and she never asked him not to.

    Nice continuity with Teyla mentioning how much Rodney likes MREs.

    When we see the close-up of the piece of slate that Teyla was drawing on, it’s hard to tell what’s drawing and what’s scuff marks that were already on it, but it looks like there are a lot more than six symbols on it. However, she did do a good job – Pegasus symbols are a lot more complicated than Milky Way ones and I know I’d find it hard to draw any of them, especially behind my back!

  12. #92
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    Quote Originally Posted by AutumnDream
    I don't care about time constraints. If a story is too big to do in 45 minutes, don't try to do it in 45 minutes.
    But what if it's too small for a 2 parter, or even a 90 minute episode? Do you really want the episode to be filled with 50% fluff?

    Quote Originally Posted by ShadowMaat
    I don't want a spin. I am SICK of spin. I want an ORIGINAL FRACKING IDEA. I don't need more leftovers.
    There's no such thing as an original idea, not anymore.

  13. #93
    Data ShadowMaat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    Quote Originally Posted by PG15
    There's no such thing as an original idea, not anymore.
    Oh, spare me.

    Anyway, back on topic, I do think Teyla did a good job in this ep. A bit predictible that SHE is the one to show any empathy, but at least it gave her something to do for a change.

  14. #94
    Second Lieutenant dark_faith's Avatar
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    Quote Originally Posted by PG15
    But what if it's too small for a 2 parter, or even a 90 minute episode? Do you really want the episode to be filled with 50% fluff?



    There's no such thing as an original idea, not anymore.
    well if we could focus a bit more on the city itself, on the ancients, on the characters... it could be original...

  15. #95
    Major xfkirsten's Avatar
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    Quote Originally Posted by Drwho'srose
    Not all humans eat meat thank you. I did give you green for the other stuff you posted.
    This is true. How about "humans evolved to eat meat"?
    "Sometimes we reach what's realest by making believe..."
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  16. #96
    Lieutenant Colonel Arlessiar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    Quote Originally Posted by Callie
    I couldn’t read everything written on Carson’s calendar, but one of the days says “Dinner with Cadman”. He really has to stop calling his girlfriend by her surname!
    Maybe they aren't a couple yet. In "Duet", since Carson knows that Laura likes him, we saw him squeeze her hand. And then there was a date mentioned (I forgot in which episode) and later we saw the two of them walking through a corridor in "Critical Mass". Just walking and laughing, nothing else, not even holding hands. And now another date is mentioned. But no-one said that they are together yet. Maybe they are, and Carson just doesn't want to write "Date with my sweetheart Laura" into a calendar everyone can see. Or maybe he and Laura are just taking their relationship slow.
    Personally I don't like the character of Cadman very much, but I like continuity, so I think that it's a funny that something like this is written on the calendar.

    Did I see that right, is the date on the calendar July 2005? That would be the same time they made this episode then, I think.

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  17. #97
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    Quote Originally Posted by ShadowMaat
    Oh, spare me.
    I will not.

    Really, when's the last time you saw anything that's original in anything?

  18. #98

    Default Re: Michael (218)

    I must say this is the most stupid episode of Atlantis I ever saw. A few things which make it that way IMO:

    - Michael has a texan accent from the beginning, what Wraith would have that to begin with. If it would come from humans, texan accent must be genetic .... right...

    - The Atlantis crew thinking if they remove Wraith DNA they will get a sound human. Since when did upbringing and culture cease to be the most important factor in being human??

    - Leaving such a dangerous person so many opportunities to do harm or escape. And with so much knowledge of Atlantis.... Weir should be relieved of duty immediately for such a lack of responsibility. Especially after all other naive decisions she made. Survival of whole Earth is at stake here, for Pete's sake!

    I really love the series, but this is not worthy of being an episode of Atlantis. I hope I will forget this one soon and will enjoy the following episodes the more.

    Of course all in my opinion...

  19. #99
    Data ShadowMaat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    Quote Originally Posted by PG15
    Really, when's the last time you saw anything that's original in anything?
    I've seen quite a lot, actually. It may not be a LITERAL interpretation of "original", but it's different enough to not be the same as everything else. Whereas most of the plots/ideas for Atlantis not only aren't that original, they're generally regurgitations of things from SG-1 or, worse, Atlantis itself.

    And yeah, some of those regurgitated elements weren't "original" to Stargate, but each successive copy degrades in quality with very few twists to try and make it different.

    We're at the same point now in Atlantis that we were almost a year ago: The Wraith know we're here and they're coming for us. It's only a matter of time and now the Eathers have to scramble to think up a plan to save themselves- and the home galaxy- from destruction.

    And "there are no original ideas anymore" is a moronic excuse for NOT trying to be creative. "Oh, it doesn't matter if we've already done this a few times because, you know, there are no original ideas left." Gimme a break.

    There's a difference between not being completely original and not even TRYING to be different. And if you really have any interest in the subject, I suggest starting a thread about it and inviting all opinions, but meanwhile, this is a discussion thread for Michael.

    re: Carson and "Cadman". It's a bit odd and Carson certainly seems the type who would call his girlfriend by her first name, but as said... maybe they aren't quite at that level yet. And maybe she intimidates him just the slightest bit. Either because she's a soldier, or because she's a girl or just because she's Cadman.

  20. #100
    First Lieutenant AutumnDream's Avatar
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    Default Re: Michael (218)

    Quote Originally Posted by PG15
    I will not.

    Really, when's the last time you saw anything that's original in anything?
    People who are inventive enough can do it. I hear original and beautiful music all the time, and I read original and compelling stories all the time. It's simply harder now to come up with something new. A single concept is no longer enough to impress. You have to really think and develop the idea. Unfortunately, thinking doesn't seem to be the strong suit of certain Stargate writers. Then again, Carl Binder seems to write in a awesome-lame alternating cycle.Even putting execution aside, the episode was a mess just considering all the little holes and and stupidities.

    I can't wait until Ouroborus posts. XD
    Last edited by AutumnDream; January 18th, 2006 at 03:44 PM.

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