The Hive (211)

[Atlantis1]

Atlantis1, I don't mind that Sheppard can work Wraith tech so easily, per se. It's more the lack of any explanation or, indeed, even questions about this ability that gets to me. Though even this depends ultimately on how the Wraith tech works. If it works on anything like the mental/emotional interface of Ancient tech, I'm going to need something more about why Sheppard can do what he can. Ask yourself this: If Sheppard's amazingly steep and largely intuitive learning curve with Ancient tech can be attributed to a combination of his mindset and his magic ATA gene, what then can Sheppard's equally boggling use of Wraith tech be attributed to?

Part of what I was trying to say was alot of aircraft seem to have simular functions so if a person has enough skills they may be able to figure things out. I don't think you have to have a magic gene to fly a dart. Why would the wraith have to worry about making some special key to start the dart. It would seem suicidual to fly into a hive ship (Of course the wraith wouldn't mind ).
So if the dart can be flown by non-wraith I personally don't see a problem. For me it is like if I set my mind to want to achieve something I usually can do it. Sheppard comes across to me as a smart guy. He looks at what he needs to do and goes for it.
It could be that I see him differently then others. I tend to fill in the holes with what seems like obvious solutions. It is just my style and I think some of it comes from watching tv in the late 50's and the 60's. Often things back then were left to the imagination (which I have been told I excell in )

[AutumnDream]

Also, it was using a HUD (Heads-Up Display) system. I could play one of those first-person shooting games that I hate in a language I don't understand, or that I've never played before, because I understand the basic mechanics of the game genre and most of the useful information is graphically displayed onthe screen. As long as someone told me which button did what. And McKay told Shep just that!

[The Engineer]

I liked this episode.
The clown thing wasn't that funny for me, more like a filler.
What I liked was the implications. Something is rotten in the Wraith Reign. They are teritorial, suicidal. Not stupid (after all they find a way to jam the asgard beam). They tried a more inteligent way of extracting information from Shepperd (that girl).
The fact that not Daedalus destroyed the 2 hive ships, and the fact that Shepperd was more inteligent when he choose to provoke one of the Hive ships. The rest was like a naval battle.
I also like Mckay's (DH) part and the knives part.

[Dorka]

I have lot of captures, can I put the pictures here ?

I liked this episode very much! But does a question remain, Ford is it always in life?

I make a vid about this episode, if you are interresting:
The hive
music: hysteria, Muse

I really liked your vid, really matching with the song! Haven't seen the episode yet, so it gives me a good insight to look forward to it even more... Will post a opinion here, as soon as I watched it!

[AlphaBlu]

I guess I put too much expectations on this episode. I dunno why, I'm used to being dissapointed by 'Part 2's' (Tok'Ra 2, Unnatural Selection, Evolution 2, Last Stand especially). That said, I did enjoy this episode quite a lot - not as good as The Eye, but that's a hard episode to top.

McKay was excellent - both his 'backed into a corner' and incoherent ramblings had me rolling.

Ford was good (I hope he's alive!!!).

The Clowns bit was awesome.

Ronan's knives was fun.

Wraith Groupies were weird... hope we get more expansion on them.

And I really hope we have a Wraith civil war brewing.

BYE

[angeltorri]

I really liked your vid, really matching with the song! Haven't seen the episode yet, so it gives me a good insight to look forward to it even more... Will post a opinion here, as soon as I watched it!

oh thanks a lot

[macktheknife]

This ep was sort meh. Had some moments.

[Lexa Jayde]

i have only seen snippets of this ep. and i love it so far... anyone got transcript yet...????

[IWantToBelieve]

I had to take a little while to discuss this episode. When I finished watching it, the prevailing thought was "What? What was THAT?" Because to me, The Hive had the feel of a poorly written fanfic. Emphasis on poor.

The plot holes were massive, and normally I'm not one to get up in arms about plot holes, but Ford's escape was a writing cop-out that was ridiculous. The other guy DIES from his withdrawal, and Ford, who has been on it longer, is able to magically escape from? Where? How? I mean, come on, this isn't a small thing here, it's the pivotal turn of events on the Hive ship. It's almost tantamount to McKay suddenly showing up and shooting the queen and telling Sheppard "I'm here to rescue you" - Ford was on death's door and then all of a sudden, he's loose and rescuing Sheppard.

Okay, but let's set that problem aside and look at a larger issue. What are they doing with these wraith enemies? Here is an enemy that overwhelmed and defeated the Ancients, and have enough intelligence to create these massive space ships, yet they all come awake and start a massive culling of the Pegasus galaxy. This creates a food shortage because they woke too early. Okay, fine...and in Condemned we briefly (and I might add briefly) got a small sense of how this is affecting the wraith, and then we fast forward to our guys being in the wraith's hand. They know about Earth, otherwise the ruse to find out more wouldn't have made sense, so if they know about Earth, and they know how much food awaits, and YOU were starving, wouldn't you think that finding out how to get there would be top priority?

Either the wraith are stupid or...they're stupid.

Because the pitiful attempts at finding out Earth's location, and then the queen deciding to feed on Sheppard (saved miraculously by Ford), doesn't fit the scheme of what's going on.

The queen falling for his claim of being a wraith worshipper - again, are they stupid or are they stupid?

This terrible enemy is being made into a laughingstock of the pegasus galaxy. There's absolutely no tension and fear when the wraith are on the screen anymore. Big deal...because all they do is cock their heads and try to feed on the poor humans.

At least the one in The Defiant One had some substance...

This was a big let down. The Lost Boys was a well done lead in to what should've been an awesome episode. If they couldn't get the story done in one more episode, they should've made it three, but instead we get huge plot holes, cliches, and overall a shoddily written episode.

Were there good moments, sure, but the big picture is so pockmarked that the good moments aren't enough to carry the episode.

I thought McKay's scenes were good, and Beckett, but there at the end, we've got the other teammembers in mortal peril and all we see is a lot of talk about McKay and no sense of urgency to wake him the hell up and find out what happened to the others.

Next we see him waltz in to Elizabeth's office and only THEN do they start talking about it.

You know, I love this show, I really do, but if there are too many episodes like this, the show is going to suffer. They need to have more episodes written by the people behind Conversion, Instinct, Trinity, etc and the guy behind this travesty and Condemned needs to have careful hand holding and help when he delivers a product like this that has gaping problems. The Atlantis producers as an entirety need to stop letting things like that go and figuring the fans won't mind.

This was a huge let down. It could have been so much more and they just dropped the ball completely.

[Ouroboros]

Actually, since TPTB went the way they did with the enzyme withdrawal (clichéd though it might be), the episode needed to happen over several days. I make wild guesses at approximately how many days in my previous post.

Not really. Who's to say the super drug doesn't wear off faster, like hours instead of days. You could even explain it that it wears of faster when you do a lot of physical activity or when you're under stress. These things all raise the metabolism so it wouldn't be totally unbelievable at all. Failing that they could even have had the Wraith inject them with something to counter the drug.

There's really nothing to be done about this, I think. It's a sci-fi convention and, like the drug withdrawal, I think the audience, to a certain extent, expects it.

That's why doing it another way is such easy drama. It's completely unexpected. Now granted a little thing like this isn't going to turn an episode from what we got here into gold but adding up a few unconventional approaches like that is what constitutes innovative original writing.

ROTFLMAO! Maybe TPTB thought it would be... too undignified? And it looks like---the cap with Teyla standing right there for comparison was especially helpful---it would be a tight squeeze. Falling back on my personal experiences being passed through a rope web during a cheesy outdoor team-building exercise, lol, the gaps higher than waist-height would be difficult, logistically speaking, to send Teyla through when there are only four other people (Ronon aside) to support her. And they're all on one side. It doesn't help that the bars are solid and unyielding; the person going through the hoop, so to speak, doesn't have a lot of control, and nobody would want to be bent over, face up or down, one of those bars. Hmm...

Wow we're really trying hard here huh. You know you can just admit it. We both know there is no good reason why she didn't squirm through those giant gaps. She's demonstrated extreme physical prowess and dexterity in the past. This should have been kids stuff for her.

It shouldn't be your job to strain your brain to make their lackluster episode make sense.

I'm giving this too much thought.

You don't have to defend it all you know. I like to argue myself but you gotta know how to pick your battles.

See, Ouroboros, while I think you look for your show to provide you with these sorts of plot details---something I also look for, obviously---many others look to SGA for character moments. And that, I think, is what's "taking up all that space."

What character moments though. That was actually another gripe I had. The first part had the start of a great bit of character development for Ford and in this one he was pretty much just ignored. I mean he makes a heroic escape from 5 armed Wraith and they don't even show it. More to the point though remember when he said all that stuff about wanting to go home in part 1 then later said it was just to play Sheppard. Yeah it would have been nice to get some follow up on that, it was a good emotional thread for him. Ford is still very young and he's in way over his head here. We started to see some cracks appear in him as a result last time but here it was all forgotten.

Why didn't they just let Martin Gero finish the story he started writing instead of bringing in another guy? Two people working on two opposite ends of the same story just seems like an invitation for something to go screwy.

Hive queen gets annoyed look and runs out of important interrogation. Another hive ship arrives. Hives have worked together without apparent conflict before. Thus, the queen is going off to confer or otherwise deal with the other queen, but the two hives are not going to immediately engage in a fight to the death.

Like I said before though. We (the fans) can turn this into a great episode but we have to do all the work ourselves. The stuff we're dreaming up in this thread that wasn't shown in the episode is actually more interesting than the episode itself!

This is obviously not right. Fans are supposed to add in a few details here and there but not fill in giant gaping holes where really cool plot critical scenes should have been.

I thought maybe the hive queen got the mistaken impression that Sheppard was going to be more or less completely resistant to her mind probe. I'm not sure she connected Sheppard with Atlantis and, thus, Earth until later. She was questioning him pretty exclusively about the stolen dart at first. Which happened to be the one thing Sheppard honestly didn't know. His ignorance read as a mental block to her? Hence the roundabout way of getting information about Earth.

See once again, why should you just have to pull that out of the air to explain her irrational behavior. Because the way the episode presented it didn't make sense and now the fans have to make a series of progressivly more dubious excuses for it.

Could the pursuing guards have been herding them toward that corridor? Not trying to recapture them?

Again see above. They were so far behind though that this doesn't really work.

No, that's not what I meant. If Neera and the other Wraith worshippers acted out of self-preservation, like the Genii, I don't think you can so easily label them "evil."

I got that I just used the word evil to interchange with badguy back there. How about short instead, there's no arguing that one.

Well, Sheppard and Ford could've at least worked out some likely locations, right? Ford got lucky? And searched around more than was shown? Logically checked around where the prisoners were being held? Since he knew where Ronon and Teyla were.

Again, why do you need to work to make it make sense?

There's no way to tell. With the Wraith psychic abilities, I imagine the queen could pick up pretty much everything that happens on and happens to her hive.

Once again you're doing all the work. This is something that could have been cleared up with a 2 second cut into the other hiveship where the other queen says "they're attacking us, destroy them!".

Eh. Different effects on whatever the hive ship's made of as opposed to Atlantean materials? Would it matter that it was in space? AutumnDream has a good point about secondary explosions and such as well. If anyone would know where to fire for maximum effect, Sheppard would. (And never mind how he managed to fly and fight the dart in the first place! )

Space should make the explosions actually appear smaller since there's no air to feed the flames. There's also not going to be secondary explosions until you penetrate the armour. The dart shots in rising could barely penetrate dirt or the walls of the control room. Just like most of the rest of this episode it doesn't add up. This thing's a mess from the major plot points like Ford's escape to trivial details like the size of these explosions.

That shot most definitely didn't kill the hive queen. IIRC, one shot from Ronon's gun, set on kill presumably, couldn't even stun Ellia unconscious.

Going back over the episode she doesn't seem to be on the floor when Shep walks out. Maybe those worshippers dragged her away when they ran?

Oh god now I'm doing it.

For best effect, imagine she came to as the other hive fired upon hers, already pissed about her prisoners escaping.

Gee I would loved to have seen that scene wouldn't you.

"Her spy tried to assassinate me! Open fire!"

Would have taken 10 seconds.

You know, I love this show, I really do, but if there are too many episodes like this, the show is going to suffer. They need to have more episodes written by the people behind Conversion, Instinct, Trinity, etc and the guy behind this travesty and Condemned needs to have careful hand holding and help when he delivers a product like this that has gaping problems. The Atlantis producers as an entirety need to stop letting things like that go and figuring the fans won't mind.

Amen to this. All of it but especially that last part.

Hey we're not stupid guys, stop treating us as if we were.

You'd think that airing an hour before BSG would put some fear into them but I guess since SG is Sci-fi's longtime golden boy they don't really feel they need to compete on pure merit to ensure their future.

[DetriusXii]

The Wraith beat the Go'uld in a race to become comical villians. One single dart was all that it took for the Wraith to start fighting each other. There must not exist defective drones or darts in the Wraith population. And the thought never occured to the queens that the humans were up to something when the Daedelus was in clear view and being fired upon. And if a Wraith explosion could take out another Hive ship, why not move the freaking ships away from each other while firing. Enemies of the Ancients, my ass.

We're just going to have to accept it. The Wraith are written to be stupid. They don't farm or clone humans. They haven't tried repairing their human digestive system or finding an alternate food source. They believe that Sheppard is a servant of another queen even though he doesn't wear the tacky clothing of the Pegasus humans and speaks in a dialect very alien to the Pegasus humans and unrestricted language by not being in servitude to a Wraith. They fight over what could have been a freak accident, the firepower of the Wraith darts is set to minimum most of the time, and they're strip mining their human populated worlds so that there will be no one left to keep them well fed after they fight back the humans, which I don't think is possible right now since they're just so damn stupid.

[AutumnDream]

Argh. I've been defending the episode, but Ouroboros is totally right. I wasexpecting more, and it did seem like a big collection of scenes tied together rather than a continuous episode, for some reason. There were a lot of things that should have been addressed but weren't. I hope Carl Binder reads this and gets some good constructive feedback from it. I know he's a professional writer, but everyone can learn a thing or two, and it's pretty clear there were some oversights. He sure is king of the funny episodes though, with the exception of Duet.

Detrius, keep in mind that had the Wraith actually stayed awake to do any of that stuff they probably would have starved to death. Good thing too, because it'd suck to have come to Pegasus with the Wraith 10,000 years more advanced than they already are. o.O;

(Let's not give up on the wraith just yet, eh? Remember Brad Wright planned a lot about Atlantis before it even started, and I can't imagine him not having made up some really intriguing stuff about them.)

[lily]

Sometimes I wonder whether we all are watching the same show (the same happens with SG-1). I always watch an epi and end up with the feeling "wow, what a great episode!" and I can't honestly think how anybody else would think that epi was less than a very very good episode... Then I come here and usually find people saying that this was a mediocre episode, or dissapointing or things like that.

Oh, well, the world would be such a boring place otherwise

For me, IMHO, this was an excellent episode. I had re-watched "The storm"/"The eye" the same day, and I think "The lost boys"/"The hive" are at least as good as "The storm"/"The eye" or even better.

Personally, I don't care whether or not something is cliche. Lots of cliches still work for me. And I didn't find anything in this episode that didn't work or dissapointed me. Maybe a 3 parter would have been better, to have enough time to explain some stuff better, or to follow up some stuff, such as the Wraith Queen leaving suddenly without feeding on poor Shep. But I still give this episode 5 stars out of 5. The same as all the episodes of season 2 so far.

Some highlights, IMHO:

- McKay. Excellent. All the way starting when we can see his indecision about taking the enzyhm up to when we see his face when he realizes that Sheppard is alive and is the one who is on one of the darts.

- Sheppard. Gotta watch the episode again to give more details, but I loved every second of his screen time. *sigh*

- Ford. Very good acting. Hope we see him in season 3. I think the ending was left vague enough so we can be sure that he's alive and he can return as a recurring character in future seasons

- Ronon and his knives. That was absolutely hilarious.

I might come up with more after watching the epi more times

[ToasterOnFire]

After watching the ep, I'm afraid I have to put myself with the fans who were let down with the show. Storm/Eye had a fabulous sense of urgency and suspense with the impending death of numerous characters, but TLB/Hive really failed on those aspects. I never was at the edge of my seat, many of the scenes seemed rushed, and the truck-sized plotholes were distracting.

-I'm so disappointed with the wraith now. They just try to be scary and end up comical with their hissing and teeth baring. The setup with the queens and their tension wasn't handled very well. I think the writers are trying to make the wraith seem mysterious but they ended up just confusing me.

-I thought that McKay's overdose and subsequent babbling were a nice mix of hero!Rodney and scaredcrapless!Rodney. That mix is hard to pull off, so bravo to the writer, director, and David for that.

-Teyla and Ronan had some nice scenes together. Shep had some nice ones too with the wraith and I liked his clown lines. I wanted to see more about Ford, but it seemed like he was thrown into the background. If that's the last of Ford I'm going to be most disappointed.

-The whole "hot girl who throws herself at Shep" thing is getting old, but it appears it's merely a taste of what's to come. Bummer.

-Wow, Weir and Caldwell actually seemed to get along. FINALLY. More of that, please.

[srg]

Sometimes I wonder whether we all are watching the same show (the same happens with SG-1). I always watch an epi and end up with the feeling "wow, what a great episode!" and I can't honestly think how anybody else would think that epi was less than a very very good episode... Then I come here and usually find people saying that this was a mediocre episode, or dissapointing or things like that.

This is why I don't go anywhere near the episode discussion threads. I'm in the same boat as you (less so with S9 though). I Just enjoy it for what it is.

[AutumnDream]

Heyhey! This is only the second hot girl to throw herself at Shep, and this time it wasn't even sincere. And I thought we all agreed to never talk about that... other time.

I didn't like how the Wraith bothered to answer Sheppard. At first I thought something weird was up that was making them more talkative, but I guess not. I liked how in Rising they just came in all shrouded in the shadows, threw whomever was in the way across the room, and left without a word. Maybe different hives all have different attitudes. I mean, it's unreasonable to expect every human to have the same attitude.

[Teal'c]

About the "shooting the door control to open it" thing:

Give me Ronon's gun. I go to any door in my university that you have to swipe a card to open. I shoot the swiper with Ronon's gun. Boom! Electromagnet in door is switched off due to a highly broken circuit. Door opens.

[Easter Lily]

Sometimes I wonder whether we all are watching the same show (the same happens with SG-1). I always watch an epi and end up with the feeling "wow, what a great episode!" and I can't honestly think how anybody else would think that epi was less than a very very good episode... Then I come here and usually find people saying that this was a mediocre episode, or dissapointing or things like that.

I'm with you fellow Lily... I was mystified by all the criticism myself... I liked this episode more than I liked The Lost Boys... which was far more grating in some ways.
I suppose people were expecting explosions and lots of kickass action but I just take it as it comes.

[Yeade]

Okay! So, I was a total geek and watched the episode again. A few comments before I reply to the new stuff.

Ouroboros, you called it with Ford and the P90, and I take back my assertion that Ford had a Wraith stunner. I caught the P90 this time around, two vests (with ammo), a handgun, and Ronon's miniature cannon. Ford did have a Wraith pistol stunner that he passed to Ronon, but that was during the earlier escape attempt.

Also, paying closer attention to the timing during the end battle, Sheppard didn't even wait until the hives started firing upon each other to break off. After that first strafing run, in a wide shot that follows, a few darts broke off to pursue Sheppard away from the hive he was attacking and off the screen toward, presumably, the stargate. That gives him yet more time to escape before the hives explode.

In addition, there were a few shots in the sequence that I thought might have stood in for a bit of time passage. Namely the wide shots of the hives engaging each other and all the darts being diverted away from culling the planet to dogfight.

And what I thought was the stargate on a display McKay looked at was, in fact, the Deddy. So, I have no clue where the stargate might be except that it was in space somewhere near enough for Sheppard to scram through before the hives exploded or shortly thereafter.

Part of what I was trying to say was alot of aircraft seem to have simular functions so if a person has enough skills they may be able to figure things out. I don't think you have to have a magic gene to fly a dart. Why would the wraith have to worry about making some special key to start the dart.

No doubt Sheppard applied his mad pilot smarts to figure out the weapons joystick and the HUD--I already said as much. I'm more concerned that, if I could borrow AutumnDream's phrasing, no one showed Sheppard which button did what. McKay did not do that. He and Jace installed a computer touchscreen interface over the dart's main control console, and this is where Sheppard entered commands like "rematerialize cargo? yes or no?" That computer did more than translate the Wraith on the HUD.

On my rewatch, I (obsessively) studied the single scene where the camera pans across the dart controls to Sheppard.



Sheppard's right hand is resting on what looks like specially carved grooves for just that purpose on the side of the dart. What that controls is anyone's guess, but I think it's interesting that it reminds me of the gel handrests on the Ancient control chairs. Besides that, there's the joystick, which has a pretty obvious button thing on top to fire weapons. The question is whether the joystick doubles as flight control. If it doesn't, how is Sheppard flying the dart? If it does, how is Sheppard targeting? A stylish black bracket is obviously moving from target to target to hive ship on the HUD.

Automatic depending on where the dart is pointed? Perhaps, perhaps not.

The most puzzling thing, of course, is the main console. IIRC, McKay and Jace's computer interface was placed right over it, so this is the first time Sheppard's even seen the controls. I don't know about you, but the controls look a lot like random lights, and Sheppard figured out--successfully, on the first try--how to work at least the culling beam from this panel. Sheppard was worried whether it would work or not but--god, that's some luck!

As for the Wraith tech requiring some biological key, this is something I admit I loosely interpreted from canon. I follow the idea through because I think it puts a different spin on things, and I see nothing in canon that directly contradicts it.

Teyla's beacon necklace implies that the Wraith are not only aware of the ATA gene but are capable of constructing a device that detects it and activates despite not having the gene themselves. I figure it's only a short hop from there to incorporating something similar into their own technology, and the Wraith have been shown as perfectly willing to take and adapt Ancient tech for their own purposes.

Even if the Wraith thought a biological tech key would be useless fluff--and I could believe this, as overall they don't seem too concerned about security, though this might very well have been different during their war with the Ancients--given the Wraith psychic abilities and aforementioned tendency to steal Ancient tech, I have no trouble seeing the Wraith tech operate with a mental/emotional interface. Which then begs the question of how Sheppard, a human, managed to work an alien system. Or get an alien system to work with him.

For me, it's not so much a matter of why the Wraith would bother but whether Wraith technology would naturally develop this way given what we know of and have seen of the Wraith thus far.

In much the same way that we continually try to streamline our own tech to better fit our physical, mental, emotional, and social needs, I think it's entirely possible to the point where I find it hard to picture otherwise.

Though I could also be imagining things.

Who's to say the super drug doesn't wear off faster, like hours instead of days. You could even explain it that it wears of faster when you do a lot of physical activity or when you're under stress. These things all raise the metabolism so it wouldn't be totally unbelievable at all. Failing that they could even have had the Wraith inject them with something to counter the drug.

I can't quite see the Wraith having something to counter the enzyme as it's crucial to keeping their food alive during the feeding process--developing a chemical blocker would be rather self-defeating. (No snarky comments about how something that stupid seems like just the kind of thing the Wraith would do! ) A good point about physical activity burning the enzyme off faster though... However, I think many might feel cheated of the expected difficult drug withdrawal if it were any faster or easier.

Wow we're really trying hard here huh. You know you can just admit it.

LOL! What can I say? I try. It's what I do.

We both know there is no good reason why [Teyla] didn't squirm through those giant gaps. She's demonstrated extreme physical prowess and dexterity in the past. This should have been kids stuff for her.

Actually, rewatching the episode, I got the impression that the gaps were a lot smaller than they appear on the caps. There's quite a bit of distortion because of the perspective and distances involved. So... I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree here. I truly believe it would've been difficult, if not outright impossible, to squeeze Teyla safely through those bars, and you believe it would've been a great deal easier. If only we had someone on set to provide us with actual dimensions! (Geeky wishful thinking! )

What character moments though. That was actually another gripe I had. The first part had the start of a great bit of character development for Ford and in this one he was pretty much just ignored. I mean he makes a heroic escape from 5 armed Wraith and they don't even show it.

Only, you see, Ford's heroic escape would've boiled down to so-and-so many minutes of action. It's already character development that we and the other characters know Ford made the heroic escape and came to Sheppard's rescue only to make the heroic last stand. Showing it would've appeased people like you and me and IWantToBelieve about the logistics, but I don't think it's strictly necessary for "character development." With limited time and such a large cast, I think certain scenes had to be conveyed by telling. It's just unfortunate that telling doesn't have the same impact or clarity as showing.

Also, regarding Ford, on my rewatch, Sheppard's argument with the Wraith as Ford was taken away jumped out. Sheppard yelled that Ford was sick, and the only reply he got was "we know" or something to that effect. Neera then helpfully adds that Ford was being taken to a cocoon so that he may be kept alive. And this in the context of Kanayo's earlier death is more support for the cocooning having something to do with Ford's survival and recovery.

The Wraith beat the Go'uld in a race to become comical villians. One single dart was all that it took for the Wraith to start fighting each other.

At this point, while I've been frustrated with the Wraith acting in ways that require a lot of fast explaining, I do agree with AutumnDream that we still have too little information on the Wraith to make final judgments. I'm not sure I trust TPTB to spend as much time thinking about the Wraith as I do--just as I'm wary of any romance--but I'm willing to wait and see.

Finally, lily, srg, Easter Lily, don't get me wrong. I enjoyed watching "The Hive," and I loved many of the little moments people have been mentioning, laughed at all the funny spots, and much appreciated teh pretty. It's mostly out of love for my show that I spend so much time untangling the nasty plot snarls and other details that, in the end, were probably never intended to be picked at.

I'm the type, I suppose, that can't help but analyze. And I want SGA to make sense because I love it so.

I take SGA as it is and as it could be.

That said, I'm actually pretty forgiving about all these little details. I have a lot of fun discussing them with others, and I do try to come up with viable solutions, but I always try to keep in mind that the cast and crew probably don't have the time to worry about most of these. While I'll always hope the logical kinks can be ironed out, and I note when there are problems, I definitely don't let it interfere with my squee and support of the series.

So, Ouroboros and IWantToBelieve, as exasperating as it might be that fans often have to step in and fill the plotholes, I wouldn't expect anything else so long as TPTB actually have to air SGA and other shows week after week. And, as a fan, I'm more than willing to provide constructive criticism as long as I can for my own personal peace of mind and in hopes that TPTB will note someone's concerned about this-or-that. I don't much mind the work really.


edit: analysis of end battle, minor rewording

edit: image link, tags

[GatetheWay]

Can some explain why, in the begining of the ep, the queen ripped Sheppard's jacket? What was the point? And by the end of the ep the rip dissapeared.