The Intruder (202)

[AGateFan]

Caldwell was going to be taking over Sumners Job as head of the Military contingent on Atlantis proper, the job currently occupied by Sheppard. Not sure who would have been put in charge of the Deadelus, some other Full Bird Col I imagine.

[ShadowMaat]

Incidentally, can I just say that I called the whole Hermiod/McKay antagonism thing? After last week's ep I just knew there'd be fun if they ever went head to head.

[LoneStar1836]

Staring sunward in space without massive polarization is a good way to fry your eyeballs and go blind. My understanding of the subject is admittedly wavery and I know allowances have to be made so that we can see the actors doing their thing, but it still seemed pretty dodgy.

Hehe. I would think so. When Shep and Caldwell were looking directly at it, I was like y’all are going to fry your retinas. Course my mom was like, “This is going to end up sterilizing Rodney.” referring to all the concern about the radiation. Hehe. I’m not too sure she or my brother like McKay, like I do.

Overall, I thought the episode was entertaining enough, but nothing that impressive. So far I just haven’t been that excited by SGA. Last week’s was good, but neither of these two were just like Wow!

Liked the stuff with Shep visiting Ford’s cousin. This is going to haunt him like the killing of Sumner. Then his reaction to the Asgard.

I’m not really a fan of Teyla, but there at the end I really didn’t like the way Weir kind of gave her the cold shoulder, imo. Maybe it was just me. *shrug* I wasn’t really too happy with Teyla about how she acted when Zelenka had something to show Weir. That whole sequence on Atlantis just really felt off to me.

Shep pulling out a move from the old Maverick handbook, eh. The movie Top Gun, throwing the brakes on the guy behind you.

So is this exposure to radiation going to play into a future episode other than McKay having a bad sunburn? I’m thinking about “Conversion”…………

[Melyanna]

Can someone explain something to me, please? There was a scene where Weir and Caldwell were talking and I thought she made some comment about him being in command and it wasn't the one he wanted, but the flashback that followed it seemed to indicate that his being in command was part of the plans all along.

Or was he planning to transfer to Atlantis proper and lead there, allowing someone else to be in charge of the Daedalus?

Either I missed something or I misunderstood that entire section.

It seems that Caldwell isn't commander of the military contingent. At least, I think that's what we were supposed to assume after Elizabeth stood up for John and got him promoted. After all, the point of her telling them to promote John was countering Caldwell's argument that John was too low in rank to be in command of the military contingent.

So Caldwell probably first assumed he'd be getting command of the base and was told that the President wasn't going to remove Elizabeth, and then assumed he'd at least be getting command of the military contingent. But Elizabeth won that fight, and Caldwell was left in command of the Daedalus, which isn't even on an exploratory mission. It seems to just be shuttling back and forth between Earth and Atlantis. That would explain how he's involved in Atlantis but not in every episode.

Anyway. Enjoyed the episode more than I was expecting to, though it had the classic problems of episodes that try to jump forward in time. It's just too jarring.

Did anyone else wonder if Joe Flanigan is doing the voice of Hermiod, or do we know who's doing it?

[Major Fischer]

Also, the military have sweaters with their ranks on them? (Caldwell in the flashbacks)

Yes, all the US armed services have optional-purchase pullover sweeters modelled after the British 'woolly pully'. They're also worn by women.

As for Weir and her behavior with Landry and Caldwell... they were in there to screw her and she was simply returning the favor. They were patronizing to her and she was protecting her people.

She barely knew Caldwell, and had he managed to wedge his way onto Atlantis as the military commander it was highly likely that he'd have tried to get her job too. I don't think she was rude to them, but she was putting them in their places.

I find it a little funny that people who are non-shippers are seeing more ship in this episode than I was. I didn't see much of any. I did think that Simon was an ass for not telling her straight off that he had met someone, instead of dragging it out for her. I had the distinct impression that he moved on before her message in LFP, after all you have to remember the last few episodes of Atlantis season 1 took place over a two week period ...

I interpretted her being upset as more to do with realization that he had moved on before she had. I also have the impression that her relationship with Simon has always been a bit stormy, and the reason she knew Myst!Simon was off was because he was being too nice.

[ShadowMaat]

Well, I'm admittedly over-sensitive to the whole ship issue and as I said, I'm particularly suspicious because Joe and Paul wrote this ep and I consider them to be the shippiest writers among the entirely shippy PTB.

There was nothing as overt as the hug last week, but because of that hug I'm now doubly inclined to watch the Shep and Weir scenes more closely. The musing scene at the beginning might have seemed less suspicious if another writer had written it... and if it hadn't followed on the heels of last week's hug. I just get a very bad vibe off the whole thing, now.

And on another note, was I the only one bothered by the fact that Shep and Weir were apparently notified about the doctor's death before Caldwell was? They were on the scene first, and even with the excuse of Caldwell being asleep and needing to get dressed first, it seemed a little odd.

Does anyone know what the protocols would be in a situation like that? I know Beckett falls under Weir's command, but would that be adequate reason to notify her of what happened? Shouldn't it be the Commander's decision, once he's on the scene? Or are she and Shep simply the next step down in the chain? Was Caldwell's XO there, at the very least?

[not so ancient]

Also, the military have sweaters with their ranks on them? (Caldwell in the flashbacks)

Yep, all branches have that.

As much as I liked Caldwell in that, because it shows off Mitch's big shoulders, I wish he had been wearing Landry's leather jacket. Because hello, leather jacket on him? Rawwwwwwrrrr.

Oh sorry. Got a bit hormonal there. Never mind me. Carry on.

:::turns up air conditioner:::

[Major Fischer]

Does anyone know what the protocols would be in a situation like that? I know Beckett falls under Weir's command, but would that be adequate reason to notify her of what happened? Shouldn't it be the Commander's decision, once he's on the scene? Or are she and Shep simply the next step down in the chain? Was Caldwell's XO there, at the very least?

My impression was they were told first only because they were around the corner.

[knocknashee]

My one BIG complaint - in SG1, every time someone got a promotion, a big deal was made of it, but we only hear Sheppard has been promoted in a very brief moment. Then, when Shep is visiting Ford's family, he is still is not in uniform. We are now in season 2, but have never seen Shep in "Dress." Does the Wardrobe Dept. not have an Air Force uniform that fits Flanigan?

Apparently not...*feels slightly deprived* They made such a big deal about his promotion in the spoilers...what an anti-climax...

All in all though, I think it was a pretty good episode, though I think I'd have prefered more about the fallout after The Siege Pt III - it just seems a little like Harry Potter arrived on Atlantis, waved his wand and suddenly everything is fixed... *shrugs*

Just my £0.02 worth...

[okrichie]

Clips for this weeks Hermiod translations are now in the official thread

http://forum.gateworld.net/showthrea...6&page=1&pp=50

Thanks for the quick translations sparklegem, I don't have access to the episode as quickly as you do But now we can all hear the clips

This episode was another fantastic episode as far as i saw it. I loved the Asgard interactions, and I loved the fact that they left Atlantis in Weir's control. I love that they have opened the board for hundreds of different plot branches from here on in. Great stuff

[sparklegem]

I thought Elizabeth was being a tiny bit overzealous with Landry and the others. I appreciate her defending her position and being strong and assertive, but she was almost threatening to have her way as soon as another leader was brought up, and I thought it was reasonable business to want to appoint a more experienced leader.

To everyone who thinks Wier was too pushy in the flashback with Landry: is it not okay for Stargate's characters to have flaws? Is it not okay for people to get defensive when they feel threatened? I mean, seriously, you guys seem to expect these people to be a bunch of angels... I guess that's why so many don't like BSG...? Actual, real characters?

I was just expressing what I thought of Weir's behavior. I wasn't condemning her because she's not perfect, I'm glad the characters have flaws and welcome them.

I'd have found it a little more likely if he'd gotten impatient and straightened up to complain only to get transported mid-snark.

I love the idea! That would have been really funny too.

[Excali5033]

Yes, the sweaters are evil. Sigh.

As for the whole sunblind thing, anyone designing a space vehicle that DOESN'T add polarizing canopies deserves to be fired. Minor issue. Personally I'd like to see Stargate take a hint from BSG and make the starfighters maneuver more realistically, but I guess that's a minor issue, too.

Also, someone asked 'don't the F-302's have hyperdrives?' I don't think they do. The X-302 had one, yes, but it never worked correctly and that was before they had a viable mothership to carry them (seeing as the Prometheus was plagued with its own problems). Now that Prometheus is out of its growing pains and they have the Daedalus to boot (and more BC-303s on the way, I would presume) there's not much of a point of installing (a very expensive, no doubt) hyperdrives on all the F-302's.

Although this raises another question, I wonder if the BC-303's are still using naquadriah or if the Asgard drives use a better power source?

[ToasterOnFire]

Wow, I actually thought this ep was far better than Siege 3! My thoughts:


-Glad to see everyone back to normal, or at least more so since Siege. The constant snapping and yelling and whatnot was wearing a bit thin. It was good to see everyone work together as a team and stand up for each other.

-Much more Rodney in this ep, thank goodness! So first Rodney has to see Gaul die in Defiant One, then see Grodin die in Siege 1, and now he has to watch his friend die in this ep. Poor guy, he seems to get so much direct emotional whumpage. And we got to see Elizabeth, Carson, and Shep all do stuff on Earth, but not a peep about what Rodney did? Bummer.

-The ongoing problem of Shep's disobedience still bothers me. I found it odd that Weir used the exact same defense on the SGC ("disobedience is okay because he saved lots of lives!") that Shep used on her in Hot Zone. I also found it odd that we never see Shep held accountable for his actions; the conversation between Weir and Shep was never completed in Hot Zone and I'm still unconvinced with how much she trusts him now. Additionally, we saw Weir put up with scrutiny from the SGC regarding Shep, but we never see Shep himself go in front of the SGC. Would a true military force really put up with direct disobedience, done several times over the course of one's career, even if it saved lives? I doubt it, and Shep's promotion on top of that just made it more out of place.

-And on that note: the shippy scenes were less screamingly obvious! Thank you PTB! The brainbleach lives to see another day!

-Shep's scene with Ford's cousin was very well done.

-I figured a Weir/Simon breakup was coming, but it was interesting to see that the breakup was more from his side than hers. I wasn't expecting that at all.

-I was hoping in the very end that we would see some discussion, or at least the beginning of one, between Weir and Teyla. Nope, instead we get an excited Zelenka talking about the city (he was cute, but still). That's too bad; I'd like to see some sort of bond form between those two.

[Redwall]

-The ongoing problem of Shep's disobedience still bothers me. I found it odd that Weir used the exact same defense on the SGC ("disobedience is okay because he saved lots of lives!") that Shep used on her in Hot Zone. I also found it odd that we never see Shep held accountable for his actions; the conversation between Weir and Shep was never completed in Hot Zone and I'm still unconvinced with how much she trusts him now. Additionally, we saw Weir put up with scrutiny from the SGC regarding Shep, but we never see Shep himself go in front of the SGC. Would a true military force really put up with direct disobedience, done several times over the course of one's career, even if it saved lives? I doubt it, and Shep's promotion on top of that just made it more out of place.

I got the impression that Shep's promotion was very much a political move forced by Weir. As a world-famous UN diplomat, she's probably the only member of the Atlantis expedition or the Department of Homeworld Security really trusted by all the countries involved. As such, she can get pretty much anything she wants, especially if she's up against the US military, which none of the other nations want to gain any more power with regards to the Stargate (see Disclosure).

[sparklegem]

-The ongoing problem of Shep's disobedience still bothers me. I found it odd that Weir used the exact same defense on the SGC ("disobedience is okay because he saved lots of lives!") that Shep used on her in Hot Zone. I also found it odd that we never see Shep held accountable for his actions; the conversation between Weir and Shep was never completed in Hot Zone and I'm still unconvinced with how much she trusts him now. Additionally, we saw Weir put up with scrutiny from the SGC regarding Shep, but we never see Shep himself go in front of the SGC. Would a true military force really put up with direct disobedience, done several times over the course of one's career, even if it saved lives? I doubt it, and Shep's promotion on top of that just made it more out of place.

I agree, the fact that we never saw any closure of Sheppard taking accountability for his actions kind of bothered me a little, especially because, last season, General O'Neill tiptoed around all his friends. I can't believe Elizabeth would be comfortable with losing control at such a crucial time. Like I said before, I thought Elizabeth was being a little overzealous when the military was just addressing a reasonable line of business. And it would have been nice to see what Sheppard thought of being made the permanent head of the Atlantis military, since at the beginning he was somewhat the reluctant hero.