"Soverign states act in their own self interest"

[PJO3434]

While in the real world the statement made by Woolsey is correct, I have an ethical problem with it, and I think Earth has two very important interests in protecting Langara against the Lucian Alliance.

First, my ethical problem stems from the fact that Earth would likely have been destroyed without the help of the Asgard, who had no particular interest in saving it. Sure, the alliance with the Asgard greatly benefited them, but when they started protecting Earth, the myriad benefits could not have been known. Additionally, by giving Earth all their technology and knowledge, the Asgard, I believe, were also giving Earth the responsibility to protect helpless people against aggressors. (I just wish they left us with some of their ships because I would love to see Asgard ships in our fleet.)

Second, I believe Earth has at least two important interests in protecting Langara. The first interest is, of course, preventing the Lucian Alliance from getting access to Langara's stargate. Even if they were unable to reach Destiny because they did not have Dr. McCay's solution, they would destroy our best opportunity to reach Destiny by trying to reach Destiny and exploding Langara. The second interest is reducing the amount of ships the Lucian Alliance has. If the Lucian Alliance tries to invade Langara to secure its stargate, we would have the opportunity to destroy (or disable and secure) some of their motherships (which would weaken them as a threat to Langara, Earth, and all other planets).

[Mister Oragahn]

The biggest problem is that it sounds like something bad.
"Sovereign states act in their own self interest"
Yet there's no proof it would be detrimental to other countries much. It would be particularly hypocritical to say it would largely produce negative effects when it would come from someone who knows that Earth could have access to technologies that would solve a great many problems and literally stop the power mongering of some people in trying to hold more of the same.

[morbosfist]

The Asgard long since moved beyond political divisions. They don't count as far as Woolsey's declaration goes.

As for the rest, Woolsey was bargaining. He was hoping to get them to make a concession, but Ovirda, just as savvy in these matters, knew full well he did not have to.

[D Toccs]

As for the rest, Woolsey was bargaining. He was hoping to get them to make a concession, but Ovirda, just as savvy in these matters, knew full well he did not have to.

Exactly, it was all just political posturing. Woolsey put it on the table as a sort of veiled threat and Ovirda called him on it straight away, which is why Woolsey didn't press the issue.

[Ben 'Teal'c would WIN!!' Noble]

Sometimes it is important for states to work in their own intrest as when in negotiations you to find the soloution that works for you. Like it or not in the Middle East to have our fancy lifestyles and fast cars we have to do deals with unsavory people to get oil supplies. So if we want to get to destiny we might have use force, I don't like that idea but I doubt the people on Destiny care if we have use some force to get a supply line.

[thekillman]

what if helping others IS your self interest. the Asgard were dying and needed a successor. thus helping earth was in their self-interest, especially since we had a knack for beating impossible odds and killing replicators.

[D Toccs]

Sometimes it is important for states to work in their own intrest as when in negotiations you to find the soloution that works for you. Like it or not in the Middle East to have our fancy lifestyles and fast cars we have to do deals with unsavory people to get oil supplies. So if we want to get to destiny we might have use force, I don't like that idea but I doubt the people on Destiny care if we have use some force to get a supply line.

The point is though . . . is an ancient rust bucket and the 60 plus people onboard worth committing acts of aggression on a friendly world?

There was a time when the IOA were going to put the SGC on skeleton crew because they thought that Atlantis and the Pegasus Galaxy presented more opportunities for technological gains.
Now with the databases of both the Asgard and the Ancients within easy reach of the top scientists, Earth is for some reason willing to put their inter-planetary reputation on the line to try and reach a millions of years old ship on a mission that even the Ancients didn't follow up on.
I don't buy it.

[jelgate]

The point is though . . . is an ancient rust bucket and the 60 plus people onboard worth committing acts of aggression on a friendly world?

There was a time when the IOA were going to put the SGC on skeleton crew because they thought that Atlantis and the Pegasus Galaxy presented more opportunities for technological gains.
Now with the databases of both the Asgard and the Ancients within easy reach of the top scientists, Earth is for some reason willing to put their inter-planetary reputation on the line to try and reach a millions of years old ship on a mission that even the Ancients didn't follow up on.
I don't buy it.

Humanity time and time again has shown our hunger to explore what is unknown. In that vein more than anything I can see the prospect of going to Destiny. Yes its risky but to gauge what its seen would water many people's appetite. As for acts of aggression it would hardly be the first time we have done such an act for exploration

[D Toccs]

Humanity time and time again has shown our hunger to explore what is unknown. In that vein more than anything I can see the prospect of going to Destiny. Yes its risky but to gauge what its seen would water many people's appetite. As for acts of aggression it would hardly be the first time we have done such an act for exploration

Don't get me wrong. I can fully see the benefits of reaching Destiny, just the database of the galaxies it's passed through is invaluable.
But alienating a technologically advanced and friendly world to MAYBE get there? I just don't think that Destiny is worth that.

[Flyboy]

Don't get me wrong. I can fully see the benefits of reaching Destiny, just the database of the galaxies it's passed through is invaluable.
But alienating a technologically advanced and friendly world to MAYBE get there? I just don't think that Destiny is worth that.

I would very much agree with that.

[morbosfist]

Don't get me wrong. I can fully see the benefits of reaching Destiny, just the database of the galaxies it's passed through is invaluable.
But alienating a technologically advanced and friendly world to MAYBE get there? I just don't think that Destiny is worth that.

Langara is only in the 1940s as far as tech goes. Their only real resource is naquadria, and Earth has long since moved beyond that as anything but an explosive. And they thought Langara was dealing with their enemies, which is more than enough reason even in the real world.

[Ben 'Teal'c would WIN!!' Noble]

Yon know we already have 3 threads on this topic.

What happened to 'never leave anybody behind', what is the logic here 80 people don't matter and wasn't the whole point of Alliances that Destiny's mission is important and worthwile.

[D Toccs]

Langara is only in the 1940s as far as tech goes. Their only real resource is naquadria, and Earth has long since moved beyond that as anything but an explosive. And they thought Langara was dealing with their enemies, which is more than enough reason even in the real world.

Don't be foolish, Earth might have incorporated a few alien technologies into it's ships, but overall Earth is still at the exact same technology level it was at in 1996 when it started the Stargate Program.

For example : the engineers who designed and installed the ring transporters on all of Earth's moterships, had to ride a clunky old elevator down to the basement where they built those ring transporters.

[Flyboy]

Don't be foolish, Earth might have incorporated a few alien technologies into it's ships, but overall Earth is still at the exact same technology level it was at in 1996 when it started the Stargate Program.

For example : the engineers who designed and installed the ring transporters on all of Earth's moterships, had to ride a clunky old elevator down to the basement where they built those ring transporters.

Hey... hey... we have broadband and touch screen phones. Check your facts.

[Yipikyyaysupremecommanderthor]

Langara didnt want to risk their world to them earth is alien even though they're people originally came from there. The asgard do have divisions there are the evil asgard in pegasus or Loki who is presumed dead along with the good ones. Earth has done things that appeared arrogant and in many ways its american manifest destiny to the stars... the sg team is notorious for americanizing different cultures hence forth they put there needs in front of the more poorer and needier civilizations in the galaxy.



Its clear though that the race who best represents the greed and best interests is the goauld.