Young has psychologically crumbled and needs be removed from command.

[Ben 'Teal'c would WIN!!' Noble]

Tell that to JM.

This could get off topic, but the coords weren't a deus ex machina. There was an entire episode earlier that explained exactly how DJ got those coordinates. As for pops, it was arrogance to assume the Earth couldn't do anything. Hell, it was arrogant to assume that anything could go wrong; remember, Bra'tac planned to start a mini-rebellion by attacking pop's gliders in his son's name. And it caused his mission to fail. On the other side of the coin, there was that military dude who arrogantly explained how they'd deal with pops using naquada nukes. "Goa'uld Busters" I think they were called.



It never felt like circles to me. In any debate, if I am unable to get my point across, I keep trying different tacks. By all means, if you don't feel like discussing it anymore, then feel free to say you're done. I'll keep debating as long as someone else wants to.

I just don't honestly see how you can take an "math expert" seriously if he forgets how to add "1+1." It's such a simple, basic part of his knowledge base, that you'd seriously question his credentials. At one time, he may have been competent, but as many people have noted, he isn't anymore. This isn't about whether he was competent at all, just that he is not *now.*

We humans always seek rationalizations and justifications for our behavior, and that of other people we support. We want to explain away the flaws, so they aren't really responsible. It's what I call the "It's still good!" phenomenom.

*cooked turkey gets loose*
Homer: "It's just a little mobile, it's still good! It's still good!'
*cooked turkey rolls through the street as Bart and Homer chase it*
Homer: "It's just a little dirty, it's still good, it's still good!
*turkey ends up in the river*
Homer: "It's just a little wet, it's still good, it's still good!"
*turkey ends up in a dam, then the pressure shoots off it into the horizon*
Homer: 'It's just a little airborne, it's still good! It's still-"
Bart: "It's gone, Homer."
Homer: *sadly* "I know..."

So, would it be "Young just made a little mistake, he's still good! He's still good!" ?

Edit: Gonna add this question; Since Young basically got the ship taken over and people about to die... to all the people who disagree with the subject of this thread, exactly what would Young have to do for you to go "Yeah, he needs to be removed"? What more could he do, to make the situation even worse, that would make you finally say, "That's too much, he's screwed up too much, and too badly; he needs to go"?

Because I can't see it getting much worse than them all about to die.

Greened for Simpsons quote.

[EllieVee]

Tell that to JM.

JM as in Joe Mallozzi, I take it. To be fair, I think when illogical moments and errors are pointed out to him, he makes something up on the spot. That Rush had a spare communication stone in his pocket is totally illogical yet that's his stance.

Edit: Gonna add this question; Since Young basically got the ship taken over and people about to die... to all the people who disagree with the subject of this thread, exactly what would Young have to do for you to go "Yeah, he needs to be removed"? What more could he do, to make the situation even worse, that would make you finally say, "That's too much, he's screwed up too much, and too badly; he needs to go"?

Because I can't see it getting much worse than them all about to die.

Ah, I know this one. It's the excuse that the anti-Rush mob used when Young beat Rush unconscious and left him to die. It goes, 'But Rush didn't die so that's okay.' The excuse here is 'It wasn't the plan for everyone to die so that's okay.'

[PG15]

That Rush had a spare communication stone in his pocket is totally illogical yet that's his stance.

And the show's stance.

RUSH: We need to talk.

YOUNG: I was thinking the same thing.

RUSH: Were you, now?

YOUNG: The communication stones.

RUSH (shrugging): What about them?

YOUNG: You took one. It's the only explanation. You were the first to open the box; you kept one for yourself.

RUSH: And why would I do that?

YOUNG: Maybe you thought it was some kind of insurance policy. I don't know. You probably thought it wasn't safe to keep in your room, especially after that whole incident with Spencer's gun, so you kept one with you.

(Rush has his looking-at-the-floor guilty expression on.)

YOUNG: That's how the aliens got hold of one and that's how I wound up on that ship.

(Still looking at the floor, Rush shrugs as nonchalantly as he can.)

RUSH: Oh well.

YOUNG: Doesn't sound like a denial, Rush.

[EllieVee]

And the show's stance.

Rush never denies any of Young's ridiculous accusations. It wouldn't do any good if he did anyway given Young's paranoia.

[PG15]

Or...he just took one, just in case.

I really don't see the problem with that. I'd probably do it too.

[EllieVee]

Or...he just took one, just in case.

I really don't see the problem with that. I'd probably do it too.

Except that all the stone were accounted for in the case in the episode before Rush got back. If by chance there had been a spare one in Rush's pocket, Rush wouldn't have needed to use one of them in Air. Had there been any stones missing, someone somewhere would have said something. There were five stones in the case, all of them were there.

[PG15]

Maybe Rush hid one since the beginning, when he went off alone to contact Earth. After all, he was the one who announced to everyone that there were five stones in the box - maybe there was originally six stones and he took one before anyone knew the stones were brought onboard.

[EllieVee]

Maybe Rush hid one since the beginning, when he went off alone to contact Earth. After all, he was the one who announced to everyone that there were five stones in the box - maybe there was originally six stones and he took one before anyone knew the stones were brought onboard.

No, there are five slots in the box. All five were there. If there were more than five, Young would have known from the beginning one was missing. Given that he knew Rush had used the stones, why, if there were one missing from the beginning, didn't he make the accusation sooner? It's not like he holds back when it comes to flinging out accusations. It doesn't make sense he would do so for this.

[jelgate]

No, there are five slots in the box. All five were there. If there were more than five, Young would have known from the beginning one was missing. Given that he knew Rush had used the stones, why, if there were one missing from the beginning, didn't he make the accusation sooner? It's not like he holds back when it comes to flinging out accusations. It doesn't make sense he would do so for this.

Unless a stone was missing before the Icarus base attack

[EllieVee]

Unless a stone was missing before the Icarus base attack

And again, five slots, five stones in them. This is not a difficult concept. If there were other stones, Young would not have held back in his accusations. It would have been out of character for him to do so.

[jelgate]

And again, five slots, five stones in them. This is not a difficult concept. If there were other stones, Young would not have held back in his accusations. It would have been out of character for him to do so.

And who is to say their wasn't another case with more stones on Icarus? Thier was nothing said that Icarus originally only have 5.

[PG15]

Well said, jel. I didn't think of that.

Whatever the case, the aliens obviously got their hands on the stones somehow. Given Rush's personality, it'd make sense for him to carry an "insurance policy" just in case anything ever happened to him. It's the only logical explanation for how Young ended up in the alien's body.

[EllieVee]

And who is to say their wasn't another case with more stones on Icarus? Thier was nothing said that Icarus originally only have 5.

And where has this mysterious case been all this time? You're not thinking this through. If there was another case Rush wouldn't have needed the case that Young took/tossed through the gate. You're simply trying to make excuses. It's completely illogical.

Well said, jel. I didn't think of that.

Whatever the case, the aliens obviously got their hands on the stones somehow. Given Rush's personality, it'd make sense for him to carry an "insurance policy" just in case anything ever happened to him. It's the only logical explanation for how Young ended up in the alien's body.

No, it isn't.

[jelgate]

And where has this mysterious case been all this time? You're not thinking this through. If there was another case Rush wouldn't have needed the case that Young took/tossed through the gate. You're simply trying to make excuses. It's completely illogical.



No, it isn't.

I said one stone. Not the whole other case. As for the using the case in Air its to not draw attention that he may have stolen a stone

[PG15]

No, it isn't.

Then how did Young's consciousness get transfered over to the alien's body?