Bad Guys (1016)

[jenks]

My only problem with these episodes is that in The Shroud we learn't that the Ori have sent several more ships into our galaxy and they have the power to send more and we have episodes which deals with people who yet again don't know about the stargate etc, come on how many more of these episodes do we need, we should be out their trying to find advance weapons in which to defend ourselves. The episode, if it wasn't for the humor then I would say that it is the worse episode to deal with the Ori series this is the reason the show is being cancelled boring episodes.

Isn't that exactly what they were doing?

[langdonboom]

Another post-Stargate Stargate episode -- I happened to really enjoy it, and sure, its not taking Stargate very seriously at all anymore, but there is still enough of a bone thrown to the original concept (I always love the first contact goes bad episodes) and the new baddies, and even though (as I've said numerous times here) I do miss the show taking itself more seriously, this was good fun and a great chance for some silliness in the Stargate universe.

Stargate is dead! Long live Stargate!

[Maltrancko]

because it makes a thrilling conversation over a lovely brunch?

[jenks]

Carter was not in this episode because she was telling the President what it was like in the Alternate Reality with the public knowing about the Stargate & the SGC now has a way to hide the Earth from the rest of the galaxy. Why would the President of the United States want to hear what Carter had to say if they are not planning something ?

Because he just wanted to know? The briefing would probably discourage him from revealing the program anyway...

In reality it was probably just thought up for an explanation as to why Carter was not in the episode...

[langdonboom]

- Woman screaming. Was that supposed to be funny?
- Vala having one of those glass cutter things with her. Does TPTB think we're really that stupid?
- Pathetic security guard actor/character.
- Dull storyline
- Bunch of aliens who are pretty much identical to us
- Girls b1tching at each other... wtf???
- Daniel, not sure what the actor was smoking when he filmed this ep
- Ending. Over in 3 seconds.
- Yet another 'hey I managed to figure out a gate address to a planet with a large supply of ancient stuff' episode
- Hooking a bomb up to a stargate? Please.
- Cheap drama factor: a ticking bomb
- Did I mention boooooooring.
- A waste of an episode.
- Another ep where a main character is missing.
- Camp secondary character guy. Horrible actor, horrible characterisation.
- Not funny except for a few Vala bits.

Don't you (and other who have decried this episode) get it?! Its post-Stargate Stargate -- we are now out of the realm of 1st generation Stargate and we're playing with all the concepts and characterisations of past first-generation "real" Stargate. So I can understand how you'd hate this if you are still clinging to the image of what SG-1 used to be. But we met the end of the Goa'uld and the Replicators, and we found Atlantis -- so much of the weight of the original stories are OVER. Now its time to play.

Sure, the humor is kinda kitchy ("Die Hard...") and its all super tounge-in-cheek but LET GO OF THE PAST and come with me into the new SG-1. We've had 8 good years of Stargate stories with serious stuff, and we do get a little 'galactic doom' from the Ori (but even they are post-Stargate characters) but the show is on borrowed time and has been since RDA left, so I think its high time we all just went with the flow, remembered what we're doing here (watching TV to pass the time enjoyably) and stop clinging to old glories. The producers of this show certainly aren't!

If that's the case, I really give up on this once amazing show.

Good! True 'giving up' would probably result in seeing this show for what it is -- self-referential playtime with the Stargate characters, universe, and concepts.

#
That was the whole point though...he had to be so out of character in the situation. It was sureal, an actor playing a character, playing a character and MS did it so well, as usual. If Daniel had been himself they would probably end up dead.He had to stall.

I'd go one level further! The 'character' of Daniel himself is now a quote or a post-modern version of what he had become over the years. He's Daniel 2.0, a changed man after all the insane stuff he's been through (dying a few times? becoming a prior, etc, etc?) -- there's literally no where else to realistically go with this individual, so he's BOUND to have an 'above it all/seen it all before' attitude about him. Its different, yes, but funny and entertaining in that way that smarmy knowingness can be.


IN CLOSING, I reapeat -- Stargate is dead! Long live Stargate!

[Stef]

Here are some screen captures from the episode (spoilered for size):

Spoiler:

-Stef

[P-90_177]

maybe he was considering what would happen if he had to unveil to the world about the stargate in the even the ori attacked. seems to make a lot of sense to me.

[majorsal]

wow... well, reading everyone's thoughts on this ep, i think i'll be giving it a pass. first off, after enduring the sam-less eps of season 9, i don't know if i could purposely go through that again. and secondly, it doesn't sound like daniel was very daniel-like in this ep. (daniel-vala hogging the show has given me a permanent twitch)

what's the next ep?




sally

[Stef]

wow... well, reading everyone's thoughts on this ep, i think i'll be giving it a pass. first off, after enduring the sam-less eps of season 9, i don't know if i could purposely go through that again. and secondly, it doesn't sound like daniel was very daniel-like in this ep. (daniel-vala hogging the show has given me a permanent twitch)

what's the next ep?

sally

Oh, I wouldn't miss this one. It's a nice, fun little episode. Although, I'll admit that I'm not a Sam-lover (I don't dislike her or anything)...so I can accept her absence easier.

And I still think it's our Daniel, just a less serious side of him...that, honestly, I think he needs to show more often. And Daniel/Vala don't hog the episode. They only share scenes in the first 1/4 of the episode (and that's with Teal'c and Cam as well). I think there was a lot of Daniel but then Cam and Vala kind of split up the rest of the time. Teal'c, of course, didn't do a whole heck of a lot but he had his moments. If your problem is with Vala, if it makes you feel any better, she wasn't as "wacky" as she usually is.

I would say that if you're looking for some laughs, this is a good episode. Better than "Bounty" in terms of that. It's a stand-alone episode, so if you're looking for Ori stuff, obviously, you won't find it here. Just my opinion though.

EDIT: kpnuts, just curious, what was the last episode you actually liked? It seems like every time I come onto an episode thread, you seem to have something negative to say about it. I mean, that's fine, you're entitled to your opinion but if you hate what the show has become so much, I wonder why you'd even want to continue watching it.

-Stef

[Uber]

Wow.

What an incredibly bad episode.

I don't even know where to begin except to say that it is now a foregone conclusion that Daniel is no longer capable of stalling for time without sounding like a blithering incompetent idiot. Period. If I wasn't convinced from The Company of Thieves, this definitely sealed the deal.

And what was it with him being so incredibly naive? He's been on this team for NINE years now and used to be significantly more perceptive. I mean, he saw what was going on just like the others, yet he was the only one of the group that had to be convinced that letting the hostages go would be, you know, a bad thing. He apparently was unable to piece this together for himself; and after his extensive experience on SG-1...especially the events of episodes like New Ground and Icon...he has no excuse.

And clearly, Daniel took his whiny pill right before heading offworld. Yikes. And since when does he speak for the team? Did I miss the episode where he was put in charge??? Needless to say, he ruined what little I did enjoy of this episode.

Vala had some cute moments although her carrying a glass cutter made as much sense as the hair dryer from The Quest 1. As in...it didn't. But she did call Teal'c "Muscles" again...and as a Vala/Teal'c shipper, I must squee for that at least.

Mitchell didn't annoy me as much as he usually does...so that's a plus...although the overdose of cultural references is starting to grate.

Plot wise this story had some interesting potential. I was looking forward to seeing how the others would handle getting out of a situation without Sam there to help them figure it out. And that part with Vala, I actually enjoyed her working with the bomb, trying to get it free from the case and such and seeing her rig it to the gate.

But the hostages? What the heck was with the screaming woman? Was that supposed to be funny the same way Novak's hiccups in Prometheus Unbound was supposed to be? Neither of these things were, by the way. Then there's the Barney Fife-esque security guard. *sigh*

And you know, it might have been nice to at least offer the chance to open a dialog with these people. They would have refused of course, or better, the could have agreed then reneged. At least then there would have been a reason to try to contact these people again. You know...us holding out a hand of friendship as a positive gesture after causing such an uproar.

I thought the premise of the story was interesting enough...but I'm afraid the execution was nothing more than a farce.

Thank goodness Carter wasn't around for this meaningless romp/mess.

[Stef]

And clearly, Daniel took his whiny pill right before heading offworld. Yikes. And since when does he speak for the team? Did I miss the episode where he was put in charge??? Needless to say, he ruined what little I did enjoy of this episode.

Well, considering the alternatives.....I'd say Daniel was the best choice. I mean, could you see Teal'c or Vala doing the negotiating? So the only other person would have been Mitchell. Daniel is supposed to be the expert on cultures, and he's usually the one to deal directly with them (as the sort of diplomat), so it would make sense that he would be the one to try and talk to the police. Plus, I got the sense that Mitchell was already frustrated with the people....so that was probably a reason why he didn't take over.

I happened to really enjoy Daniel in this episode...he had some of my favorite scenes. It was nice to see something different from the character...not the usual serious/annoyed vibe I get from him most of the time.

-Stef

[madaboutdanny]

Wow.

What an incredibly bad episode.

I don't even know where to begin except to say that it is now a foregone conclusion that Daniel is no longer capable of stalling for time without sounding like a blithering incompetent idiot. Period. If I wasn't convinced from The Company of Thieves, this definitely sealed the deal.

And what was it with him being so incredibly naive? He's been on this team for NINE years now and used to be significantly more perceptive. I mean, he saw what was going on just like the others, yet he was the only one of the group that had to be convinced that letting the hostages go would be, you know, a bad thing. He apparently was unable to piece this together for himself; and after his extensive experience on SG-1...especially the events of episodes like New Ground and Icon...he has no excuse.

And clearly, Daniel took his whiny pill right before heading offworld. Yikes. And since when does he speak for the team? Did I miss the episode where he was put in charge??? Needless to say, he ruined what little I did enjoy of this episode.

Vala had some cute moments although her carrying a glass cutter made as much sense as the hair dryer from The Quest 1. As in...it didn't. But she did call Teal'c "Muscles" again...and as a Vala/Teal'c shipper, I must squee for that at least.

Mitchell didn't annoy me as much as he usually does...so that's a plus...although the overdose of cultural references is starting to grate.

Plot wise this story had some interesting potential. I was looking forward to seeing how the others would handle getting out of a situation without Sam there to help them figure it out. And that part with Vala, I actually enjoyed her working with the bomb, trying to get it free from the case and such and seeing her rig it to the gate.

But the hostages? What the heck was with the screaming woman? Was that supposed to be funny the same way Novak's hiccups in Prometheus Unbound was supposed to be? Neither of these things were, by the way. Then there's the Barney Fife-esque security guard. *sigh*

And you know, it might have been nice to at least offer the chance to open a dialog with these people. They would have refused of course, or better, the could have agreed then reneged. At least then there would have been a reason to try to contact these people again. You know...us holding out a hand of friendship as a positive gesture after causing such an uproar.

I thought the premise of the story was interesting enough...but I'm afraid the execution was nothing more than a farce.

Thank goodness Carter wasn't around for this meaningless romp/mess.

Thank goodness indeed!!! After 2 ep full of her I needed to watch something different! I love to see Daniel a little out of his usual caracther, this is the reason why I like Vala, because she drives him crazy

[DrBravo2]

You guys thought this was a Die Hard spoof? The plot was exactly like Airheads.

[Uber]

Thank goodness indeed!!! After 2 ep full of her I needed to watch something different! I love to see Daniel a little out of his usual caracther, this is the reason why I like Vala, because she drives him crazy

?

Line in the Sand, while having actual, meaningful content for Sam (a nice change of pace) was a team episode, not a Carter episode. And while The Road Not Taken, was Carter-centric, there have been two full episodes since then...The Shroud and Bounty...neither of which could be deemed Carter-heavy.

[PG15]

It's like Irresponsible all over again. Spoilers for that ep...

Spoiler:

What? You think I thought the episode was horrible? Fat chance, that almost never happens with Stargate. Fact is, I liked Irresponsible for its humor and team moments, but loooooathed the sets and the annoying villagers (or in this case, the...uh...city slickers). Same thing with this episode.

Now, for those who don't want to look in the spoiler tags, here are the main points:

1. Sets were pretty bad.

2. Most of the extras and guest stars were annoying.

3. Otherwise, a solid and entertaining episode.

So yes, I can never hate an episode, and although during parts of it I thought it might happen, the goodness that is the main characters brought me back from the edge. Above all else, this episode excelled in the humor department, even more so than Bounty. We're talking about at least one LOL moment a minute here, maybe more. It might not be as spectacular as the last few episodes (Bounty was slightly better), but it definately entertained me and made me laugh.

So, the points:

I'll get the bad stuff over with; namely, the sets and the guest stars. The security guard, although funny, was a tad of a caricature. The screaming girl, just, shut the hell up. The other girl, ugh, so freaking annoying, despite having only about a minute of screentime. And the guy between them? I hate those jacka**es. Whew, that's a lot of venting.

Now, Sisiroh(?), although a little bland, was quite good as a character. He was like the old Daniel, in a way; bright eyed, naive, etc. Vala was right, Danny found his inner child. I also liked the negotiator; he was basically a stock "bad guy commander" sort of character, but I think the actor really sold the seriousness; and for a standalone like this, they don't have much time to do that; a sign of talent here.

Now, the sets. Damn people, I saw binders! Real life, plastic binders! Lamps, bookshelves...did these guys sneak to an Earth IKEA or something? I hope they're either 1) Low on budget after the episodes from Quest to Shroud, or 2) Low on budget because something big is being planned for the last few episodes. Either way, it didn't help when I recognize the main building as a school I used to drive by.

Yes, this is still the same old PG15 who gushes over everything. I'm getting to it!

Now that the venting's over with, let's get to the bigger stuff. I loved how the beginning of the episode just flowed. I mean seriously, I can't believe they didn't touch on this sooner. A MALP is basically a camera mounted on a small tank, it can't tell if what its seeing is real or not (well, there was Urgo, I suppose). I loved the concept of the episode, it just sort of...fizzled out afterwards. Still, very original thinking IMHO.

But above alll of that, is the humor. There were so many good lines in this episode. From Teal'c's extraordinarily calm "Die Hard" to Danny's frustrating "shut up!", to Vala's spiel about stealing the bomb...it was just hilarious. Some have said that Stargate's going too far for the laughs, and although the security guard was teetering, I think the rest of the episode was just fine and dandy. In fact, I could spend hours just citing all the funny moments in this episode...but it's almost bed time.

But before I go, I just like to say that I loved the ending, with us facing the gate. Very symbolic. Heck, even before that, when SG1 was preparing to step through the gate, I got the feeling that I think I should've had thoughout the episode, namely a race discovering they're not alone for the first time. Anyway, even though there were several bad aspects, its humor and pure entertaining bits won me over, so I'm giving it...

Score: 7/10