Jack O'Neill/ Sam Carter - Part of a team, not a ship

[jdjunkie]

SG1 continues to be a favorite of mine because it's just damned entertaining, but just like SGU, i find myself skipping scenes on my DVDs because they're just too painful to watch.

One of the reasons like SG-1 so much is that I often find new things to enjoy every time I watch an ep. I don't mean honking great plot or relationship stuff, just little touches here and there that make me think, "Yeah, that's why I love this show." Then again, re-watches confirm things I don't like about the show, hence I rarely watch much of season six (minus the gorgeous Abyss, Changeling and Full Circle) and I always fast forward through chunks of Threads, D&C and one particular scene in Heroes. No prizes for guessing which ones.

TPTB wrote friendship well--they should have stuck to it.

Oh, if only. The friendship moments were golden. Might be nice to take a moment and share our favourites.
I love the Daniel and Teal'c scene in Avatar, where Teal'c has all but given up, and Daniel says they'll make it through ... together.
I love the Sam and Daniel scene in (ack, can't remember the title of the ep, In the Line of Duty?) where Daniel sits quietly on Sam's bed after taking her flowers.
I love the Sam and Daniel scene in FiaD, where Daniel talks about the pen and Sam takes him cookies.
I love the Jack and Daniel scene in (insert title because I'm hopeless at remembering them) after they've lost Teal'c, and Daniel tells Jack he's sure he did his best. So much goes unspoken, but it's a huge testament to their friendship.
So many. *happy sigh*

[jckfan55]

^good choices. Daniel has a great reaction when they think Sam has been killed by the replicators in New Order. Not histrionic but definitely a reaction. And he wants to keep looking to see if she survived. Also a great scene when TEal'c and Sam are reunited after the Prometheus blows up. Great look and moment between them.

[jdjunkie]

^^ Also love the individual "saying goodbye" moments in Meridian. So lovely and meaningful. And saaaaad. *wails*
Oooh, and that moment in the Cassie ep (Singularity, possibly) where Daniel tells Sam she doesn't have "to do this alone."
Ooooh, and the team standing by Teal'c in Cor-Ai, and later in Demons.
Oh, oh, and the conversation between Jack and Daniel in FiaD, with Daniel in tears and Jack talking about being saddled with Rothman.

::somebody stop me. I could go on forever::

[Frostfox]

One of the reasons like SG-1 so much is that I often find new things to enjoy every time I watch an ep. I don't mean honking great plot or relationship stuff, just little touches here and there that make me think, "Yeah, that's why I love this show." Then again, re-watches confirm things I don't like about the show, hence I rarely watch much of season six (minus the gorgeous Abyss, Changeling and Full Circle) and I always fast forward through chunks of Threads, D&C and one particular scene in Heroes. No prizes for guessing which ones.



Oh, if only. The friendship moments were golden. Might be nice to take a moment and share our favourites.
I love the Daniel and Teal'c scene in Avatar, where Teal'c has all but given up, and Daniel says they'll make it through ... together.
I love the Sam and Daniel scene in (ack, can't remember the title of the ep, In the Line of Duty?) where Daniel sits quietly on Sam's bed after taking her flowers.
I love the Sam and Daniel scene in FiaD, where Daniel talks about the pen and Sam takes him cookies.
I love the Jack and Daniel scene in (insert title because I'm hopeless at remembering them) after they've lost Teal'c, and Daniel tells Jack he's sure he did his best. So much goes unspoken, but it's a huge testament to their friendship.
So many. *happy sigh*

^good choices. Daniel has a great reaction when they think Sam has been killed by the replicators in New Order. Not histrionic but definitely a reaction. And he wants to keep looking to see if she survived. Also a great scene when TEal'c and Sam are reunited after the Prometheus blows up. Great look and moment between them.

^^ Also love the individual "saying goodbye" moments in Meridian. So lovely and meaningful. And saaaaad. *wails*
Oooh, and that moment in the Cassie ep (Singularity, possibly) where Daniel tells Sam she doesn't have "to do this alone."
Ooooh, and the team standing by Teal'c in Cor-Ai, and later in Demons.
Oh, oh, and the conversation between Jack and Daniel in FiaD, with Daniel in tears and Jack talking about being saddled with Rothman.

::somebody stop me. I could go on forever::

Oh, yes to all of these, yes, yes, yes.
Team magic.
I loved Solitudes, Daniel working to find Jack and Sam. Teal'c watching over Daniel. Sam struggling to keep herself and Jack alive. Sam pretending to be Sara to give Jack comfort. An episode which proved that the team didn't have to be together for an episode to be teamy. All of this is what SG1 is about for me. When TPTB got it right, they got it right, no silly attempts at romance required to make these characters interesting or three dimensional.

FF

[jckfan55]

Nice team, not shippy moment:

Forsaken--when Sam is conked on the head and tied up, Teal'c & Jack realize it's a trap but they have to go get her anyway. Sam is still "groggy" so Teal'c stays with her. Just straight team. thank you.

[Frostfox]

Nice team, not shippy moment:

Forsaken--when Sam is conked on the head and tied up, Teal'c & Jack realize it's a trap but they have to go get her anyway. Sam is still "groggy" so Teal'c stays with her. Just straight team. thank you.

True, true.
Which is why I call Sam/Jack a net loss for SG1, not a net gain.
Any pairing of two of the team would have been bad for the show, would have been as disruptive and as ill advised.
Stargate SG1 was not and was never intended to be the Sam and Jack show, any more than it was the Daniel and Jack or Teal'c and Jack show. Some of TPTB with their heavy-handed, unsubtle, unwanted and unnecessary attempts at romance unbalanced some episodes with a trivial pairing which sidelined the more important 'A' story line and unbelievable characterisation which showed both characters in a despicable manner.
Any time a feeble attempt at romance is treated as important as your main plot, you've got the balance wrong, it damages the show.
And I can't think of a more lack luster and dull TV romance than Sam and Sir.

FF

[Killdeer]

So I was reading rumors on the SG-1 movie thread that

Spoiler:

Sam and Jack are going to get married in the movie?

How likely do y'all think that is?

[Aragon101]

So I was reading rumors on the SG-1 movie thread that

Spoiler:

Sam and Jack are going to get married in the movie?

How likely do y'all think that is?

even if there IS a movie, i doubt they'd add it now.

They've already pretty much abandoned SG1 and SGA in favor of SGU which is their pet project given all they've thrown into it. I can't blame them since one always wants to be known for ones "mature" work rather than the "comic book style" work (BW's interview a few weeks back made that pretty clear)

It's ridiculous now. i've got no issues with an older couple, but it just doesn't work with Jack/Sam because it's been dragged out for so long that it feels more like an afterthought than anything else. We never saw either of them derive any enjoyment from this "mutual" attraction, and even more, we never got any confirmation whatsoever in any context beyond unsubtle "SEE SEE!!!" hints.

I've heard people say that they want confirmation that Jack and Sam have been in a relationship since the end of Season 8, i don't think we'll get that either since given the "hints" we've gotten, they're still waiting (Sam's cut scene in Trio says that "her guy" in Washington is going to retire soon... and tha tmakes a difference how? Gasp! They must NOT be together yet!)

Each character had SUCH a much more healthy chemistry with others. Sam/Cam, Sam/Teal'c, Sam/Rodney, even Sam/John were better IMO

Jack had awesome chemistry with Kerry, but it was all sold out for Librarian Sam *headdesk*

It's sad when your "official couple" has more chemistry with EVERYONE else than with each other.

They've hinted at a "shippy" scene in Revolution, but even if the movie ever gets made *which i highly doubt*, it's already beyond pathetic. This star struck lovers deal hasn't ended there, It's one of hte primary reasons i've quit watching SGU. so it's a systemic problem with teh franchise which i think can only be solved with new blood on the writing team that doesn't get thier inspiration from trashy novels from 7-11.

in a sidenote, older couples can work brilliantly if handled well. Look at Roslin and Adama. You believed it with them, they went from slightly antagonistic, to a love/hate relationship, until finally Roslin admits her feelings to Adama and what does he say? "It's about damn time."

awesome. BSG had it's problems, but the characters were handled brilliantly IMO

And just for giggles...

Spoiler:

[Frostfox]

So I was reading rumors on the SG-1 movie thread that

Spoiler:

Sam and Jack are going to get married in the movie?

How likely do y'all think that is?

Not going to happen; TPTB may make dubious decisions, but, as Martin Lloyd says in '200', they don't actually want to torture their audience by inflicting the Sam and Sir marriage on us, they aren't that stupid. SG1 would be a laughing stock if they did.

FF

[Aragon101]

Not going to happen; TPTB may make dubious decisions, but, as Martin Lloyd says in '200', they don't actually want to torture their audience by inflicting the Sam and Sir marriage on us, they aren't that stupid. SG1 would be a laughing stock if they did.

FF

I'm not so sure. They did the whole joke about the "younger edgier cast" and how it was ridiculous...

then they gave us SGU.

[jckfan55]

I'm actually at the point where I hope they *don't* make another SG1 movie. I fear much of what was said above.
And I don't really like that they've tried to bring SG1 characters into SGU. I pretend it doesn't exist.

[Frostfox]

even if there IS a movie, i doubt they'd add it now.

The longer MGM's death throes continue, the less likely a film becomes.

They've already pretty much abandoned SG1 and SGA in favor of SGU which is their pet project given all they've thrown into it. I can't blame them since one always wants to be known for ones "mature" work rather than the "comic book style" work (BW's interview a few weeks back made that pretty clear)

All shows have a natural shelf life. SG1 is over, SGU is the new, the 'live' show, it needs all their attention, not an old series which ended in 2008. SG1 and SGA are over, end of story, the fans will move on to new shows, active shows. SGU is where their money is too, so of course it's will be their focus.

It's ridiculous now. i've got no issues with an older couple, but it just doesn't work with Jack/Sam because it's been dragged out for so long that it feels more like an afterthought than anything else. We never saw either of them derive any enjoyment from this "mutual" attraction, and even more, we never got any confirmation whatsoever in any context beyond unsubtle "SEE SEE!!!" hints.

I love seeing non conventional relationships portrayed, they are quite few and far between on mainstream TV, but, of course, they have to be realistic and well done, and as we know, Sam/Jack fails miserably in both those categories.
And the interminable dragging out of the supposed relationship for over a decade is the final nail in its coffin, if they had to go with the character destroying mess, they should have had the courage in their convictions about three or four years ago. Whatever they try now, it would be way too little, way too late for both the pro and anti fans.

I've heard people say that they want confirmation that Jack and Sam have been in a relationship since the end of Season 8, i don't think we'll get that either since given the "hints" we've gotten, they're still waiting (Sam's cut scene in Trio says that "her guy" in Washington is going to retire soon... and tha tmakes a difference how? Gasp! They must NOT be together yet!)

It would be ludicrous beyond words to waste valuable minutes of a third film on getting them together. Mature adults would have dealt with the situation, one way or another, years ago. But then, they haven't written S/J as mature adults so far, why should that change now?

Each character had SUCH a much more healthy chemistry with others. Sam/Cam, Sam/Teal'c, Sam/Rodney, even Sam/John were better IMO

Jack had awesome chemistry with Kerry, but it was all sold out for Librarian Sam *headdesk*

It's sad when your "official couple" has more chemistry with EVERYONE else than with each other.

Sam had more chemistry with Thor than Jack, what a sad indictment on a sad and sorry affair.

They've hinted at a "shippy" scene in Revolution, but even if the movie ever gets made *which i highly doubt*, it's already beyond pathetic. This star struck lovers deal hasn't ended there, It's one of hte primary reasons i've quit watching SGU. so it's a systemic problem with teh franchise which i think can only be solved with new blood on the writing team that doesn't get thier inspiration from trashy novels from 7-11.

in a sidenote, older couples can work brilliantly if handled well. Look at Roslin and Adama. You believed it with them, they went from slightly antagonistic, to a love/hate relationship, until finally Roslin admits her feelings to Adama and what does he say? "It's about damn time."

awesome. BSG had it's problems, but the characters were handled brilliantly IMO

And just for giggles...

Spoiler:

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a1...al/SamShep.jpg

Two words. Riker/Troy. That's all.

FF

[Killdeer]

This star struck lovers deal hasn't ended there, It's one of hte primary reasons i've quit watching SGU. so it's a systemic problem with teh franchise which i think can only be solved with new blood on the writing team

I've noticed a trend on all three shows (for SGU I'm just going by what I've read-haven't actually seen it myself), but what is the writers' fixation with male CO/female subordinate relationships? I'm starting to be a little disturbed by it. If it had been just one couple, but we had Jack/Sam on SG-1, John/Teyla was apparently supposed to be the intended pairing on SGA until Rachel's pregnancy derailed things, and then on SGU,

Spoiler:

we have one female character having sex with her CO in the pilot episode, and then later in the series run, we find out that another female character is pregnant through an affair with her married CO.

Umm. Ok. Am I the only one slightly disturbed by the trend here?

My apologies if I've mentioned this before - my memory is not what it should be.

[Frostfox]

I'm actually at the point where I hope they *don't* make another SG1 movie. I fear much of what was said above.
And I don't really like that they've tried to bring SG1 characters into SGU. I pretend it doesn't exist.

That's really sad. Hugs jckfan55.
I won't get to see SGU for years until it gets to terrestrial TV (or, if enough people tell me I will enjoy it, I might buy the DVDs) so putting SG1 characters on SGU won't interest me.

I've noticed a trend on all three shows (for SGU I'm just going by what I've read-haven't actually seen it myself), but what is the writers' fixation with male CO/female subordinate relationships? I'm starting to be a little disturbed by it. If it had been just one couple, but we had Jack/Sam on SG-1, John/Teyla was supposed to be the intended pairing on SGA until Rachel's pregnancy derailed things, and then on SGU,

Spoiler:

we have one female character having sex with her CO in the pilot episode, and then later in the series run, we find out that another female character is pregnant through an affair with her married CO.

Umm. Ok. Am I the only one slightly disturbed by the trend here?

My apologies if I've mentioned this before - my memory is not what it should be.

I think it's another example of cliché and a lack of genuine creative inspiration. It's rather sad, they clearly didn't learn from their mistakes on SG1 and SGA, did they?

FF

[Aragon101]

My own series does it backwards, Female CO and Male Subordinate

You'd think it wouldn't work, but given the amount of build up i gave it i think i did nicely

I wouldn't mind any of the above mentioned IF THEY"D BEEN DONE PROPERLY.

Instead it's all done by "cosmic" powers of "twu wub".

*shudder* Even SGU has

Spoiler:

Scott and Chloe just jumping into each other's arms after ONE conversation, and there doesn't seem to be any idea of splitting them apart. Young/TJ was preestablished before the series so it sorta makes sense, but even so, it's another Jack/Sam thing with the huge angst and tension and "whaaa!" aspect to it.

Simply put, it feels contrived to the extreme. Nothing feels natural about any of the "official" relationships on SG as far as i'm concerned. That's why i love fanfic, when it does it right, it does it right.

The problem is when it doesn't... then you get something like this




And just because i happen to have it.

Spoiler: