Sam Carter/Amanda Tapping Discussion/Appreciation

[stargate barbie]

it depends on why you're saying it. Are you saying it as a 'hey, folks, wake up call' or are you saying it as a 'well if i whine maybe everyone will beg me to stay'?

i understand the sentiment behind the former, i have no patience for the latter

All threads ebb and flow. times and tempers change. And if anyone feels like they're being chased off, don't report it to me if you don't want to, there are plenty of other mods you can bring into it and get a more objective pov.

People should be free to express thier opinions, but they should also be free to do it without experiencing emotional blackmail.

i honestly don't think she was doing the latter. she's gone dude, game over. and i don't think the situation warrants a reporting. i think we're all big enough to sort out our differences amongst ourselves. i hope anyway.

i really don't have a problem with anyone on this thread, i'm sort of playing a type of middleman here, and i probably shouldn't have. i'm really sorry if i've interfered and stuck my nose in where it wasn't wanted. i shall back away now.

[Skydiver]

you meant well and hey, wake up calls are sometimes needed.

maybe i'm bristling a bit, but i'm not seeing hypocrisy earlier in this thread. and i do bristle a bit at having an opinion dismissed just because of its source.

i really wish MM had been better. I wish it had been more enjoyable. I wish we'd gotten more of a glimpse into vala. seen what makes her tick. see what she went through iwth qetesh. here was yet another opportunity to explore 'ex host syndrome' and it gets ignored.

[Deejay435]

I've been talking to Mandy about this for the last hour or so, and had come to the decision that I wasn't going to say anything-because I really don't particularly like to stir up trouble, or say something to or about real people that might be hurtful.

Cam and Vala are fictional characters. Not real people. Sam is a fictional character. I don't particularly get gleeful when people slam her. But I also realize that that's my issue. They have every right to their opinions, even if I happen to think the opinions are monstorously stupid, and they have every right to express them. Because Sam isn't real!

And I agree that people should be able to post whatever their opinions are, without being berated for them. They should expect disagreement, of course, but shouldn't be personally attacked because of those opinions.

But I haven't seen any attacks on people who are happy with, or like Cam and Vala. Not in this thread. Not at all. Please, if I'm wrong-show me, and I'll gladly take it back. I think those that have negative opinions about Cam and Vala should be allowed to voice their opinions without being rebuked for them as well.

Doesn't kindness involve respecting other people the same way you want to be respected? People. Not fictional characters.

[stargate barbie]

you meant well and hey, wake up calls are sometimes needed.

maybe i'm bristling a bit, but i'm not seeing hypocrisy earlier in this thread. and i do bristle a bit at having an opinion dismissed just because of its source.

i really wish MM had been better. I wish it had been more enjoyable. I wish we'd gotten more of a glimpse into vala. seen what makes her tick. see what she went through iwth qetesh. here was yet another opportunity to explore 'ex host syndrome' and it gets ignored.

yeah i'm with you on the wanting to see more of valas history and character insight, and seeing it done well, but i actually thought MM was ok for what it was. of course i was expecting it to be badness of "affinity" proportions, so that may have helped. its a shame that we quite possibly won't get a chance to see any real development to vala now. i can still hope for a few decent sam/vala scenes though. (and some teal'c/sam/vala scenes).

well, now that i've made AD pass out, i think i'll go to bed.

[Agent_Dark]

I've been talking to Mandy about this for the last hour or so, and had come to the decision that I wasn't going to say anything-because I really don't particularly like to stir up trouble, or say something to or about real people that might be hurtful.

Cam and Vala are fictional characters. Not real people. Sam is a fictional character. I don't particularly get gleeful when people slam her. But I also realize that that's my issue. They have every right to their opinions, even if I happen to think the opinions are monstorously stupid, and they have every right to express them. Because Sam isn't real!

And I agree that people should be able to post whatever their opinions are, without being berated for them. They should expect disagreement, of course, but shouldn't be personally attacked because of those opinions.

But I haven't seen any attacks on people who are happy with, or like Cam and Vala. Not in this thread. Not at all. Please, if I'm wrong-show me, and I'll gladly take it back. I think those that have negative opinions about Cam and Vala should be allowed to voice their opinions without being rebuked for them as well.

Doesn't kindness involve respecting other people the same way you want to be respected? People. Not fictional characters.

Oh yeah, thats a given. But its not really fun to hang around a place that is continually bagging your likes. I think that is more the issue here.

[Skydiver]

and i can understand that. But as we're so careful about everyone and anyone else's likes....when do ours come into play?

I'm not saying that it's open season on every other character, but where is the line between caring for everyone else and caring for yourself?

what happens when we're so worried about offending every other member of the fandom that we ourselves 'care' our selves out of existence?

[Skydiver]

we also haven't - to the best of my knowledge and please correct me - said 'those damn scapers, sure knew they'd like it' or said 'anyone that liked MM was an idiot'

I don't see it as much bagging likes as it is having different ones and epressing some not positive views/opinions about characters

[Deejay435]

Oh yeah, thats a given. But its not really fun to hang around a place that is continually bagging your likes. I think that is more the issue here.

Is it a given? Because I sure wasn't getting that feeling.

I know it isn't fun to hang around a place where your likes are getting bagged. But there are much better ways to get that point across than what happened here. (I'm trying really hard here not to be rude, and point fingers, and say 'this and that' was a bad thing to say. I don't know if trying not to do that is a good thing, or a bad thing...but there you go.)

I guess for me it boils down to: Tell me my opinion is wrong, all you like. Tell me you think my opinion is stupid if you must.

But don't tell me I'm wrong for having it, or stating it. And that's what I think happened here.

[Agent_Dark]

Is it a given? Because I sure wasn't getting that feeling.

Mmmm, reading the post again, I was more under the impression that her point was she wasn't happy with the way Cam/Vala were getting 'bashed' when the same people had expressed a dislike at character bashing on some other threads. But she did what she did and that was her choice. I don't really see a point in getting worked up about it.

[Skydiver]

the only thing i'm adding to this as a mod is this

If anyone, and i mean ANYONE feels that they're being picked on or treated against the rules in this thread, report the post. PM a mod - and no, you don't have to pm me, snag one of the others if you want. go for objectiveity

If you feel like anyone is treating you poorly, don't hesitate to report the posts

[Agent_Dark]

Anyway, FIC! http://sdraevn.livejournal.com/90911.html. It's Sam/Vala, with bracelets and alien influences. Very Fun

[astrogeologist]

I'm sorry you feel that way. However, I'm also honestly flummoxed. I just went back and re-read the thread starting from Sky's 'live' commentary last night and I think you've miscontrued a lot. From where I'm sitting, people ripped on the what they perceived to be the overall meh-ness of the episode AND they lamented the lack of Carter, which is not the same as ripping on the ep BECAUSE of the lack of Carter (due to the heaviness of Vala). I saw ONE comment that I would say could fit in the category of 'ripping on Cam because he took away from Carter'. One.

JMO.

Great post, DEM. I agree. I've been reading through the posts on M&M and I didn't feel that folks were trashing Vala or Cam - but rather the writing of the episode that put Vala and Cam into the situations that were constructed. I definitely see that as different than trashing the characters out of malice.

Oh yeah, thats a given. But its not really fun to hang around a place that is continually bagging your likes. I think that is more the issue here.

AD, you've nailed it here. For me the issue wasn't that the folks here had actually done anything wrong, but that many folks didn't care for MM (*not* because it was Sam-lite) and that's hard for folks to read if they did like the episode. The accusation that folks here were trashing MM *because* it was Sam-lite is unfounded (I've read through the posts). However, if there was someone reading the thread and they *did* like MM, I could see that they could get their feelings hurt - and then lash out.

And, MM is undoubtedly not the only issue along these lines. Many of us here have been unhappy with the New Direction that the show took since the beginning of Season 9. Many folks have been pretty careful to point out that if the writing had been different, that they could have loved Seasons 9 and 10 - and the new characters Cam, Vala, Landry, etc. The writing and TPTB have taken the brunt of the criticism. As it should be in my opinion.

However, if someone likes Seasons 9 and 10, then reading the posts here would be tough to take in - and it would be very human for those who like Seasons 9 & 10 to get combative and defensive when reading many of our posts here.

Now I think that the thread is fine. I love the posts and the discussion and the critiques. I have a real problem with fans who get nasty with anyone who criticises the show (I don't believe in 'My Show, Right or Wrong').

Honest criticism is necessary and correct. Too many times in history folks have gone along with things they didn't believe in because they are afraid to speak out or speak up.

Honest and polite critiques and discussions are what a forum is all about.

I'd really hate it (and wouldn't lurk or post or even visit) if everyone simply posted simpering, gushing fan-appreciation comments *all* of the time - no matter what was written for any script or plot or character.

To all who have posted - thanks! I've agreed with so many of your comments - about the series, and about this most recent topic.

[majorsal]

I just saw Pierre Bernards newest Recliner of Rage on Conan O'Brien - He was talking about SG-1 being canceled. He talks about how Stargate is his favorite show. He then talks about Mark Stern being responsible for canceling Stargate. He said Stargate is his Crown Jewel in his Friday night line up. He then then talks about Atlantis and BSG being the rest of the Friday night line up. Then he goes on to say that the glorious line was made more compelling by the presence of the actress Amanda Tapping, Grace Park and Rachel Luttrel how together form his holy trinity of fantasy females. Then he says "My Fantasy three some has been completly destroyed."

that man has taste, that's for sure!




sally

[majorsal]

what's that face supposed to mean? (don't make me regret asking this )




sally

[Agent_Dark]

what's that face supposed to mean? (don't make me regret asking this )




sally

It's a surprised smiley. WHY DO ALL YOU PEOPLE HAVE SUCH DIRTY MINDS???