Sam Carter/Amanda Tapping Discussion/Appreciation

[LadyJeep]

I did think

Spoiler:

That Jacob was sacrificed for the 'always'

but that's my only peeve with Threads.

As for character arcs...I prefer standalone episodes. I feel that standalones give the best character development. Such as Emancipation in season one. Where Sam went from 'the girl' to being a full member of the team that Jack had confidence in her.

The same as Death Knell did more for her character in showing her quick and on-the-spot-thinking, than the season eight arcs could ever do!

Lys - no missiles from me! I may be a shipper, but 'luvvy-duvvy' soppy romance should be limited to fanfic. I'd have 'kicka$$ Sam' over 'midlife crisis Sam' anyday!

Hear, Hear, sueKay! I'm a shipper and agree wholeheartedly!

[majorsal]

That way if AT decides to leave the show due to family comitments - there still may be a future for the show without her.

*plugs ears* la la la!... *mumbles to self, 'sam will always be in stargate sg1, sam will always'... *



sally

[majorsal]

AAAASTROOOOOOOO, welcome home!!

and *thank you* sooo much for all your hard work on delivering amanda's gift! jeez, woman, you've went far and above the call duty! (((astro)))



sally

[ForeverSg1]

I thought this fic was well written; but you're right, it did have the stupid sugary things. Someone else on this thread recommended Infirmary After by Teand; as far as rape fics go, it's far more realistic. [God, that sounds terrible, I know]

Oooh, I really like this one. Can't believe I missed it the first time around.

[majorsal]

Plus it wouldn't hurt to get our wormhole back.

... do you know that i didn't even notice our wormhole colors were different. (shows how much they'd shown it recently )


sally

[ForeverSg1]

I just wanted to apologize to all the nice shippers for my behavior tonight. I know I've been a bit negative in my past posts and I'm very sorry if I've offended any of you. I have no reasons for behaving this way tonight, other than I think I've OD'd on too much sweet fanfic recently and it's beginning to mess with my brain a bit.

Everyone has the right to read or write whatever type of fanfic they enjoy, I guess I'm just a bit envious right now because I really wish there were a bit more fanfic out there where the characters are written as I see them. But maybe the real problem lies in how I perceive the characters to be, because obviously there are a lot of people who see Sam and Jack in this way.

Oh well. I promise I'll be much nicer tomorrow.

Kat

[binkpmmc]

Okay I'll try Sally's idea now that I have lost a 5th post on this topic:

First I agree with the notion of kick-butt Carter versus any of the shipper stuff, I am not anti-shipper I just do not care about it and I think that too much of Carter's time was spent on it in the past season and a half, that includes the horrendously idiotic storyline that I will not even mention by name as it still irks me no end.

On to my post I have been trying to make since this (now yesterday) morning. One caveat, many of you know my feelings on how TPTB wrote Carter over the past season and a half and I feel very strongly in my beliefs about what TPTB did to damage this character. I know several of you think it was character building and that is fine, everyone is entitled to an opinion. I do not say any of the following to offend or anger anyone - it is just my opinion on the state of things with this character and I am in full rant mode since reading Mallozzi's lame post on it.

There have been several excellent comments regarding the Mallozzi post. First let me say that his post irked me, SURPRISE, (I will not call his posts answers or responses because 9 out of 10 times they are not answers or responses, they are just coy, cutesy game playing. I know he does it to get people going and I try to ignore him but this time he really twisted my knickers.)

His post regarding my Carter question has gotten my knickers in a twist and I think Ann SGC should post her questions to Mallozzi which she mentioned in a post about 4 or 5 pages back. His post irked me not only because it had nothing to do with my question but it also left me, once again, with the impression that they are going to minimize/diminish Carter's character in S9. It also left a bad taste because it was just an excuse, and a lame excuse at that, if they do diminish the character. As I see it TPTB have been pretty consistent in their ability to provide each character with ongoing arcs/themes throughout the 8 years of the show, and now into the 9th with Daniel and Teal'c at least, that are not full focus but are always there in the facts of the stories. Daniel has always had the language abilities, the ability to translate ancient dialects, he also has had the Share arc for several seasons, the Sarah arc for several seasons and now he has the ascension arc/theme. Most of these are carried into season 9 with the exception of Share as that has been wrapped up and Sarah which is just the big white elephant hanging out in the room begging to be addressed. Teal'c has always had the Jaffa warrior rebel, the free Jaffa arc, the leadership of the Jaffa, and the theme of his becoming more human in his behaviour as he spends more time on earth, these too will be carried into season 9. Now for Carter, she HAD Jolinar and she HAD the resultant capabilities, she HAD Janet and Cassie (even if they do mention Cassie in relation to one reason why Carter was away it is, IMO, way too little and way too late), she HAD Jacob and Jacob's death (which just like Janet I do not expect to see any ramifications from), she HAD Replicarter (which was also left flat with regards to Carter), she HAD the command of SG1 (which was a huge waste of a golden opportunity to really show this character's strength and to let her shine but they chose to almost completely ignore that aspect by totally screwing up with the personal life focus which, as many of you know, I see as having damaged this character to a fare thee well).

The operative word for Carter is the she HAD these themes/arcs and most if not all have been unceremoniously dropped or left hanging as gaping holes. It is like they fell through the very crack of the place TPTB have put their heads in the past season and a half when it comes to writing the Carter character. What do we have as a continuing, consistent theme for Carter - her science and technobabble, which are fine and I like them but where is the substance?

Some of the things they have let die or just ignored were, IMO, absolutely some of the greatest themes/arcs they could have pursued for this character and they chose personal, soap-opera life?? It boggles my mind to this day how they could put the front and center focus on the crap they spewed out since mid season 7 and ignore almost totally and completely her command of SG1 and now pull this BS that Mallozzi is trying to pull with his lame excuse that Carter has had several major arcs over the past few seasons - in my mind the one arc she was given was an unmitigated disaster for the character and led to a huge influx of criticism of the character and allowed the vehement anti-Carter brigade a cache of ammunition against the character. TPTB should have known better and they should have done better by this character, IMO. I agree with what others have said about how they have handled Carter’s arcs in the past season and a half, unbalanced, poorly written and misguided.

I am also irked because Mallozzi attempts to further diminish this character by using that dreck as an excuse, especially when it is not fact that Daniel and Teal'c have not had major story arcs - they did and they still do. It is Carter whose story arcs/themes, substantive SG related story arcs/themes, seem to disappear without a word or a good resolution of any kind. Perhaps Mallozzi would have been better off saying that Carter had several eps that were focused on her, a few of which were good stand alone eps like DK, not story arcs because all I saw was the soap-opera as a consistent theme/arc/focus to the detriment of other, more substantive and stronger, arcs/themes.

I am not asking for details from Mallozzi I am asking for him to give the fans of the show a reason to watch for the Carter character. To provide us some hope that Carter will be a central team member (not that she will be the focus of every ep or even half of the eps she is in, only that she will be an integral part of the team and the show. I get the feeling that her eps are going to be one-offs for the character, and not in a good way like DK was, and that the scripts were written with her filling the gaps - no theme, no arc, not from past stories and not any new ones. I am not asking for a major story arc for the character I am asking for a consistency to the character not a relegation to filling in the points of the script that need filling with science and technobabble. I am asking if the character will be important to the storyline, will the character get to show her strengths which are leadership, strength of character, intelligence, independence, heroism, kick-a$$, etc., not the dreck served up in her personal soap-opera. AT herself has said she is working 14-15 hours a day so TPTB certainly have the time to make this character all that she can be and to help remove some of the stigma put on the character the past season and a half, IMO.

If they do as I am starting to feel they will then, IMO, it just continues to damage the character especially if she does not get command (yes I still, maybe naively, hold out some hope that they will not completely shaft the character in this regard even if she gets joint/shared command it will be better than relegation to 2IC again, which IMO is a demotion regardless of how they may try to sugarcoat it. Even if they make it seem like Carter's choice - not after 7 years of 2IC to Jack, with command thrown in when appropriate like Nightwalkers and Spirits, and 1 year in full command, no matter how they spin it I will not buy that Carter gives it up and accepts 2IC to a guy who never even saw a Stargate before so he has clearly never been off-world before and from what little substance I have seen from him he is slightly immature and has not really showed any leadership ability when it comes to these off-world trips - he has shown excitement, giddiness, fluff, smart-a$$ Jack-like behaviour but no real leadership quality, IMO).

If AT wants out after this season fine but TPTB should not use that as an excuse to ruin a character. I know there are many of you who think that even if we get nothing but strong science Carter it's better than no Carter - me, honestly I think no Carter would be better then a diminished character that had so much potential that was wasted, especially as commander of the team. Maybe, just maybe, Mallozzi is playing me and I know he loves it and if he is it is working but somehow I feel I will be truly disappointed. I sincerely hope that all of the eps she is in are not written as one-offs so that the character just fits in to fill in the gaps and the science but I feel a great deal of trepidation for this character's return after some of what Mallozzi has said and after reading spoilers that are available as I have very little trust and very little faith in the current stable of PTB, especially in light of how I perceive them to have almost ruined this character.

I dearly hope they are willing to do the right thing for this character but their consistent refusal to acknowledge criticism of any kind, and to make insulting comments about fans who do criticize, leaves me cold and worried since they often leave the impression they can do no wrong and all is perfect in the world of Stargate SG1 - they need to open their eyes a little, even a small crack, to see that loyal fans of the show, and of Carter, have legitimate criticisms and concerns that need to be addressed with a strong, leadership quality to the character playing a central team member making substantive contributions on a regular basis in S9. That's it rant over - God I hope this works this time otherwise it’s the window option . . .

[zats]

Oooh, I really like this one. Can't believe I missed it the first time around.

Glad you liked it!

[astrogeologist]

Hey Astro sorry about the trouble with getting the SaGC Collection to AT. Hopefully it will work out with the recent shipping. I know what it can be like to get things mailed to other countries, my father was an international frieght forwarder and I work a couple of summers for shipping companies on the East Coast. You should see what the hazzardous cargo custom numbers books look like. One of my jobs one summer was looking up hazzard numbers for shipments - here is some trivia for you there are over 25 different hazzardous cargo numbers for curling irons and if you put the wrong one on custom papers it can mean big trouble in some countries.

ROTFLOL! I wouldn't have known that curling irons were hazardous cargo! And 25 different classifications!

I have read this story and I really think that the author did a very good job with it; however, I have to ask this because this type of story is the reason why I can not and will not call myself a shipper. I found myself completely immersed in the storyline and then all of a sudden Sam would have a flashback and Jack would start calling her Sammy, honey, sweetie or babe(baby) and I would literally start to lose it.

I really, really like the idea of Sam and Jack together and fanfic is a great way to see them that way, but god why do so many authors take an absolutely wonderful story and sugar coat it. This, to me, is so NOT Jack. I can see him being tender and taking care of Sam, but so many authors and stories loose me when they go way over the top like this. And Sammy? *Shiver* The only voice I hear when I see the word Sammy is Jacob's.

Normally, the moment I see these sugary pet names I hit the 'x' button on a story. I don't even bother giving it another glance, because I know I will be cringing through the entire thing. Luckily for this story I was already deeply involved before I noticed the first instance.

So for those of you who aren't S/J shippers, this really is a very good Sam story if you are willing to give it a shot. Just thought a little advanced warning might be welcomed.

Kat

I just read a short fic along the lines of your comments about Jack's characterization - the fic is called 'Delete' by Zoser and it's "Dedicated to all fan fiction writers and readers".
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/2532480/1/

[majorsal]

A lot of people don't get that just because one ships for Sam and Jack that doesn't mean that's the only thing we dig about her.

She is such a multifaceted, well-rounded character with enormous strengths and flaws. What a great character! And like I said, focusing solely on her feelings would be as off-kilter as only hearing her rattle off technobabble all the time or blowing things up every episode.

Okay...I personally wouldn't mind her blowing things up every episode but some might...

But the point is that if you focus only on one part of who she is, you can miss the rest of what makes her Samantha Carter...Scientist/Soldier/Friend/Confidante/Mother/Hero/Jack's Girlfriend(?)

what she said.


sally

[Dani76]

I really enjoyed reading your thoughts on Threads. For me it is a very special and sad espisode - not so much because of Sam and Jack (well, maybe a little bit) but more because of Jacob. From the minute he was introduced in Secrets, I just loved that character, and I think that CA did an amazing and wonderful job portraying Jacob (and Selmak).
The relationship Sam had with Jacob was one of the very special ones for me. I guess it has something to do with my dad dying 10 years ago when I was just 19 - I would have given anything to get a second chance with my dad.
But I got to watch Sam and Jacob. The way they both respected each other, trusted each other, and showed their love for each other just always touched me in a very deep way. Plus, Jacob reminded me a lot of my dad.
That being said, Threads was especially hard for me to watch.
I will miss Jacob dearly - his death has taken away one of the special relationships that I enjoyed on Stargate and I am still hopeful that, maybe, we'll get to see him again, even if it is just in flashbacks.

Well, I guess, I can't really put into words what I want to say, so here are my thoughts expressed in a picture.

P.S. I guess I am little late on the topic, so I hope nobody minds me posting it 3 pages later.

[majorsal]

Now, I'm not saying that being Sam's father was a bad gig, quite the contrary. His presence was fantastic for Carter, allowing us to get to know her better than any of the other characters in the show, with the exception perhaps of Teal'c. O'neill's backstory/personal life is mostly shrouded in mystery, painted in broad strokes because that serves the character he's supposed to be. Likewise Daniel, for all of his Sha're and ascension stuff, is also more of an enigmatic character than Sam. We know Daniel cares, we know he has a very personal need to "do something" to help the general weal of the universe, but there's no clear cut reason why. And that, in my opinion, works well for the character. But with Sam we get to see it all. Her past, through Jacob, her present, for eight seasons of SG-1, and her dreams and ambitions for the future, through characters like Cassie and through episodes like Grace and Threads--it's all there for us to see and judge. I suspect that that is why most of the people who post on this thread have such an affinity for the character. I also suspect that that is why other fans treat the character like anathema.

i love your entire post, but this above... just, wow. i've never though of it like that, but you're spot on about that.




sally

[zats]

[Reverently] Wow. Yeah.

[tsaxlady]

ROTFLOL! I wouldn't have known that curling irons were hazardous cargo! And 25 different classifications!

Yep they are listed as "Electric Heating Rods" - It can be interesting have to look up the numbers - just don't every try to mail a lighter we had one company that had made promo lighters with the company logo on them in the US and wanted to ship them to Germany - The only way we could get a box sent for them was to buy a first class plane ticket and have the box sit in the seat. My dad told the the company next time to have the lighters made overseas it would be cheaper.

Well with this I'm off to bed long day at school tomorrow plus a rehearsal tomorrow night.

Sam returns on Friday and I have a gig Friday night - that is what the new TIVO is for I can play Friday night and then go home and watch SG-1 to unwind from the gig.

[SamFan31]

I really enjoyed reading your thoughts on Threads. For me it is a very special and sad espisode - not so much because of Sam and Jack (well, maybe a little bit) but more because of Jacob. From the minute he was introduced in Secrets, I just loved that character, and I think that CA did an amazing and wonderful job portraying Jacob (and Selmak).
The relationship Sam had with Jacob was one of the very special ones for me. I guess it has something to do with my dad dying 10 years ago when I was just 19 - I would have given anything to get a second chance with my dad.
But I got to watch Sam and Jacob. The way they both respected each other, trusted each other, and showed their love for each other just always touched me in a very deep way. Plus, Jacob reminded me a lot of my dad.
That being said, Threads was especially hard for me to watch.
I will miss Jacob dearly - his death has taken away one of the special relationships that I enjoyed on Stargate and I am still hopeful that, maybe, we'll get to see him again, even if it is just in flashbacks.

Well, I guess, I can't really put into words what I want to say, so here are my thoughts expressed in a picture.

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b6...ecial-Love.jpg

P.S. I guess I am little late on the topic, so I hope nobody minds me posting it 3 pages later.

I think you expressed yourself wonderfully. Those final scenes with Jacob always create a lump in my throat and make me think of my father, too. And AT’s catch in her voice when she realizes what Jacob is telling her make my eyes smart.

Your picture is poignant and beautiful.