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    Originally posted by astrogeologist
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    I loved the scene in Sam's lab where the two Sam's are synergistically technobabbling while Jack's eyes bounce back and forth between them for a few minutes... and then he looks like his head is going to explode or some such...
    The Von MajorSam Family Singers debut CD... Coming soon

    ^^Sam/Jack^^
    |||Official Member of the Chevron Guy Fan Club||

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      Honestly, the character just BEGS for some major split-screen action.

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        ROFL!

        I hope we get see AT playing both Carter's at once in Moebius Part 2
        Last edited by Agent_Dark; 17 February 2005, 06:25 PM.

        Comment


          Originally posted by Coley
          I agree with all the positive postings for Sam whumping and for the same reasons - I'm a little bit tired of women being portrayed as weak when it comes to pain. Yes some positive stuff should be shown on facing up to and overcoming pain and injury.
          Originally posted by ChopinGal
          A script about a woman soldier in combat would carry different expectations regarding injuries and physical violence. The fact that, even as I write this, there are hundreds of women in the armed services around the world, and especially in the Middle East, who are putting themselves in harm's way doing their duty would be the reality of what Sam would be experiencing in extreme conditions. Viewing a scene like that and the woman struggling and surviving would show that women are, indeed, capable of defending themselves in overwhelming circumstances. I think it could actually send a positive message to many women who may feel victimized. Just MHO.CG
          Originally posted by ChopinGal
          Sally, you're not babbling and you and AstroG have made some good points about a topic we haven't really brought to the surface: Sam or female torture scenes. Why are the media comfortable in portraying a woman as a rape victim but rarely in other violent situations? I think showing a woman in severe pain does carry the danger of moving into the whole S&M territory and that eroticism, as you mentioned, may be the restraining factor. Not that sex doesn't sell (unfortunately) - so go figure!

          I think a good writer and director would be able to realistically portray a woman in distress and it would be understood that women in combat and Sam as soldier would have scenes where they would be in physical danger. I think that's why we liked Death Knell so much - it was a side of Carter that had been missing. And she handled it so well. I often wondered, too, just how Baal and Sam would have played out in Abyss. From what you wrote, it sounds as if the writers knew it was too hot to handle and they didn't go there. I wish they would just take the risk sometimes. By surviving extreme physical punishment, the character grows stronger and more heroic.

          And, of course, why are there so many fanfics that take Sam down that dark path of serious whumpage?! Hmmm - I'm even tempted myself. I like my female heroes to be gritty and gutsy and fall down sometimes and, certainly, rescue themselves - not always waiting for a man to come and save the day!
          Great comments, Coley and ChopinGal! Well stated!

          Originally posted by ChopinGal
          So, here's to the ladies
          One and all
          Let them fight
          And let them fall

          It may not be pretty
          But beauty won't last
          I'd rather see struggle
          As a sign of true "class"


          (the Jester is trying hard to be a Bard)
          Blue Jello for the Bard!!!

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          Originally posted by NearlyCircular
          "equal opportunity whumpage" YES!

          But, I grew up watching a lot of really crappy women as victim stories. You know the ones I mean - running away from bad guys, the "girl" trips and turns/sprains her ankle so that the hero has to bravely turn back into the face of danger just to rescue her. (it's a miracle that a whole generation of women don't trip over their own feet every time they go out - oh wait, some of us do )
          OK, NC...! You just hit my pet peeve right-square on the head! In fact, I was visiting my mother last month and I launched into a diatribe on this very example of how women have been portrayed in the media! The woman trips or stumbles (usually wearing high heels while they run away from the bad guys) - and the male lead (hero) slows down and helps her up and half carries her along. Rescuing her, saving her... at the risk of his own safety. Even when I was 8 years old it pissed me off when I was watching some action show on TV!

          So... great example, NC! And, getting back to Stargate and the character of Sam Carter... What I said to my mom was that here is a show where I don't think they've resorted to 'that horrible stereotypical scene'!

          Originally posted by NearlyCircular
          Anyway, I love whumpage, if it's written well, meaning not a woman being victimized just so she can be rescued, but so that she can show her strength.

          How about a story where Sam has to go back and rescue the guys who are in need of assistance. And maybe gets injured in the process, thus satisfying all of us whumping junkies.

          If you like fan fic, here's a link to a Sam story that I really like, called Night Terrors, which has Sam rescuing the guys and Sam whumping as well.

          Night Terrors

          NC
          Night Terrors is a great fic!
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          Comment


            Originally posted by MajorSam
            You guys are out of control tonight! Someone's been hitting the sauce ... and LOL at your "buy one, get one free" offer!

            Get the rhumba goin', huh? Madam President, what will your loyal subjects think?

            Personally, I've always pictured a tango goin' ... between Jack and Sam! I think they'd look quite sexy in black and red.

            Comment


              Originally posted by astrogeologist

              ... You just hit my pet peeve right-square on the head! ... The woman trips or stumbles (usually wearing high heels while they run away from the bad guys) - and the male lead (hero) slows down and helps her up and half carries her along. Rescuing her, saving her....

              ... And, getting back to Stargate and the character of Sam Carter... here is a show where I don't think they've resorted to 'that horrible stereotypical scene'!
              Of course not, it's much harder to trip and fall when you're wearing combat boots all the time!

              the Jester strikes .... Thank you for my blue Jello!

              Comment


                Originally posted by ChopinGal
                Slightly OT but this thread has touched a bit on women writers and if a woman would write the character of Sam differently. The verdict is out on that because we don't have any data to work from ... so, instead of doing my laundry (which is cascading from my laundry basket), I decided to do some research and identify exactly which episodes had been written/influenced by women.

                Here's the scoop.

                There are two women writers who were influential in the early seasons: Katharyn Powers and Heather E. Ash.

                Katharyn Powers has written: Emancipation , Thor's Hammer, Enigma , Thor's Chariot, Family, Serpent's Song in Seasons 1 and 2, along with teleplays for Brief Candle and Fire and Water ; in Seasons 3 and 4, she writes Pretense and Crossroads; in Seasons 5 and 6, Smoke and Mirrors. Strangely, she really slacks off by the fourth season ... of course, we don't know why this happened. (I have my own theories, but will be on good behavior.)

                I have not determined the gender of this writer but a "Terry" Curtis Fox has written: Prisoners, Secrets in Seasons 1 and 2; Rules of Engagement in Seasons 3 and 4. For this discussion I am excluding this writer unless someone knows, for sure, if Terry is a he or she!

                Heather E. Ash comes onboard for Seasons 3 and 4 and writes: Foothold , Learning Curve , New Ground, and Beneath the Surface ; in Seasons 5 and 6, we only see one story attributed to her, but an important one, Rite of Passage.

                Two other women make important contributions: a story by Victoria C. James is adapted into A Hundred Days in Seasons 3/4. And, Jackie Samuda (who plays Nirrti) co-writes Metamorphosis (Sam whumpage here) for Season 6.

                I wanted to put this out here and let you all take a look.

                Which of these episodes, do you think, were better served because of a woman driving the lines and plot? Why? Or, possibly, do you think there seems to be no difference at all between the quality and direction of these stories versus the other episodes?

                Was Sam's characterization written well? How were the other characters developed or treated? How about secondary characters?

                I think we can really have some fun with this and maybe it should go on another thread (eventually), but I am requesting that we let the give-and-take begin here, around how these women wrote for women characters: Sam and Janet primarily. But look for the other females in these stories and what do you think about how they were portrayed?


                I'll put my two cents in later ... right now, my laundry is calling! Of course, I have already biased the discussion by inserting throughout. But these episodes did have certain Sam moments in them which were memorable.
                ChopinGal - Thanks for looking this up and then posting the results for us! Again, I'd rep you but GW keeps giving me a message that I must go forth and spead green jello far and wide before I can give you any more.

                I'd sure like to give Heather Ash my heartfelt gratitude for 'Foothold' and 'Learning Curve'. I see a common thread here... hmmm... she writes strong, solid female characters - and writes them well! Too bad she's not still on the Stargate staff!
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                  Originally posted by ChopinGal

                  the Jester strikes ....
                  *The Crickets drone in the background



                  I dunno if its been talked about here before, but I was watching the audio commentary for 'Ressurection' last night and it occured to me how great a director AT is. For someone who had never directed an episode of television before I thought she did an outstanding job. It was also kinda amusing to hear that her favourite shot of the episode was the jars full of the dead baby featuses
                  /me hopes for some more AT directing in S9

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by ChopinGal
                    Of course not, it's much harder to trip and fall when you're wearing combat boots all the time!

                    the Jester strikes .... Thank you for my blue Jello!
                    Actually, combat books SUCK. They're massive and clunky and heavy and take FOREVER to do up properly (yes, there are rules on how to tie your shoes!) and then they take forever to take off, and you have to have wool socks over the cotton ones, and then they get soggy so even when you change them your boots are wet, and they NEVER dry... I admit, if you keep dry inside, they're waterproof on the out, but still... and they'r really hard to ghost walk in!! (method for keeping silent)

                    Originally posted by ChopinGal
                    You guys are out of control tonight! Someone's been hitting the sauce ... and LOL at your "buy one, get one free" offer!

                    Get the rhumba goin', huh? Madam President, what will your loyal subjects think?

                    Personally, I've always pictured a tango goin' ... between Jack and Sam! I think they'd look quite sexy in black and red.
                    What will my loyal subjects think? Ah, but remember, if they think against me, I can simply chuck them out of my country

                    Or go Replicarter style and simply shove my hand in their brain UNTIL they get some rhumba

                    Hm.. Tango... ALWAYS reminds me of the movie "True Lies" Brilliant movie, I adore it!!

                    Yes, they DEFINATELY got some sexy goin on with Black and Red, but wouldn't it be all the better if they took them off

                    Great posts everyone who's recieved Blue Jello!!!

                    And to everyone who hasn't!!!

                    *runs off to check if she can Rep any of her dear subjects yet*
                    Originally posted by Agent_Dark
                    *The Crickets drone in the background



                    I dunno if its been talked about here before, but I was watching the audio commentary for 'Ressurection' last night and it occured to me how great a director AT is. For someone who had never directed an episode of television before I thought she did an outstanding job. It was also kinda amusing to hear that her favourite shot of the episode was the jars full of the dead baby featuses
                    /me hopes for some more AT directing in S9
                    She got nominated for an award for that!!!! She actually did a fantastic job. We talked about how acting is COMPLETELY different from directing. like the opposite ends of the spectrum. With acting, you have to create, enhane, with Directing, you have to have a VERY strong vision, and be able to lead everyone, not just the actors, but the crew and everyone. When I answered her question of "did you watch my commentary on directing!?" with Yes, she was just SOOO pleased. She loves directing, and is very proud of the job she did (as I'm sure we all are!)

                    I really really hopes she directs this season as well, but I have a sinking feeling she won't... We'll just have to write a brilliant Sam-Carter show taht she can direct! (and I can star in )
                    The Von MajorSam Family Singers debut CD... Coming soon

                    ^^Sam/Jack^^
                    |||Official Member of the Chevron Guy Fan Club||

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by ChopinGal
                      Of course not, it's much harder to trip and fall when you're wearing combat boots all the time!
                      LOL! And if you did trip, you probably wouldn't sprain anything other than your pride.

                      NC

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by MajorSam
                        Actually, combat books SUCK. They're massive and clunky and heavy and take FOREVER to do up properly (yes, there are rules on how to tie your shoes!) and then they take forever to take off, and you have to have wool socks over the cotton ones, and then they get soggy so even when you change them your boots are wet, and they NEVER dry... I admit, if you keep dry inside, they're waterproof on the out, but still... and they'r really hard to ghost walk in!! (method for keeping silent)

                        Or go Replicarter style and simply shove my hand in their brain UNTIL they get some rhumba
                        GP's are great footwear! I'd wear mine everywhere if they wern't too small for me now

                        mmmmm RepliCarter style :drool:

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by Agent_Dark
                          GP's are great footwear! I'd wear mine everywhere if they wern't too small for me now
                          Lol, yes, besides all the stuff I stated, believe it or not I do adore my combats In summer training they gave us temporary ones, and by the end of the first week i was PINING for mine...
                          The Von MajorSam Family Singers debut CD... Coming soon

                          ^^Sam/Jack^^
                          |||Official Member of the Chevron Guy Fan Club||

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by Agent_Dark
                            ...I dunno if its been talked about here before, but I was watching the audio commentary for 'Ressurection' last night and it occured to me how great a director AT is. For someone who had never directed an episode of television before I thought she did an outstanding job. It was also kinda amusing to hear that her favourite shot of the episode was the jars full of the dead baby featuses
                            /me hopes for some more AT directing in S9
                            Yes, she did a great job directing that episode, and was nominated for a Leo, right? I doubt we'll see her directing in S9, though, as it takes a massive amount of time, from what I understand. And since she'll have her hands full (literally) with the baby, she probably won't have time to both act in and direct an episode.

                            NC

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by Agent_Dark
                              ...I dunno if its been talked about here before, but I was watching the audio commentary for 'Ressurection' last night and it occured to me how great a director AT is. For someone who had never directed an episode of television before I thought she did an outstanding job. It was also kinda amusing to hear that her favourite shot of the episode was the jars full of the dead baby featuses /me hopes for some more AT directing in S9
                              Originally posted by NearlyCircular
                              Yes, she did a great job directing that episode, and was nominated for a Leo, right? I doubt we'll see her directing in S9, though, as it takes a massive amount of time, from what I understand. And since she'll have her hands full (literally) with the baby, she probably won't have time to both act in and direct an episode.

                              NC
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                              Maybe AT can direct a few episodes of Atlantis after SG-1 ends... (at the end of Season 9... or 10...or ?)
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                                Originally posted by astrogeologist
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                                Maybe AT can direct a few episodes of Atlantis after SG-1 ends... (at the end of Season 9... or 10...or ?)
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                                That'd be great. Though hopefully SG-1 won't end anytime soon

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