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    Originally posted by Strix varia
    One good thing, in a back-handed way, about these first two episodes is that I had been worried that the chemistry would be so good between the "new group" that Sam wouldn't fit in when she finally came back. I'm certainly not worried about that anymore. This just feels like flat champagne when I was expecting something delightfully bubbly.

    I don't monitor any other threads, but I'm curious what the reaction to these first two episodes has been amoungst the Sam-slammers. Are they loving them, or do they, too, feel that things are just a bit off?

    I know that I'm incredibly biased, but unless the writing improves dramatically in the next couple of episodes (which I honestly hope will happen), I'll be waiting for Sam's return to save the season for me.

    This is a great point! I'm not worried about Sam fitting in either because the chemistry is not that overwheliming yet with the other main characters. And we know that Sam and Mitchell get along well---so she is tied to a new character (actually the new most important regular), so that is good. And franky she is the foremost scientist and a lt. colonel, and being the scientist on a SCIENCE FICTION show is a good thing to be!

    I am looking at other forums (and of course GW which always seems to be reasonably balanced in general), but I have purposely stayed away from the one main sam-bashing forum. I have no doubt that a certain number (not all) on that forum (30 maybe?) are loving Vala and wishing she would replace Sam, so I find no reason to read their commentary. It would be predictable that these few would sieze the chance to criticize Sam. And my prediction is that these two episodes are scoring high. (Of course alot of people on other forums and here, IMO, who really like Sam also liked the shows ---- most don't pit Vala against Sam, they can coexist without a problem).


    Let me just say that I am glad that there is no character bashing on this thread or to be honest on any Sam/AT cites I have ever seen. Maybe there is and I missed it, but it is quite noticable how there is no character bashing.

    (I've seen some threads on other forums about getting rid of Vala, and that too is not in good taste, IMO.)


    One other note on the first two episodes---I wonder why there is so little Teal'c. My only guess is that we will see more of him in next week.

    Comment


      Originally posted by NearlyCircular
      I swore I wouldn't read even the epi discussions anymore because those usually drag me down, but I did dip into one last week. Sure enough, the first post I read complained about too many flashbacks of Sam. I quit reading right then, even though I know the poster is a big Danny fan, and probably not representative of the whole thread. Sheesh, Sam is only in the episode for what, a minute, and it's too much?

      Last night after Avalon 2, I read a question in the ask Joe M. thread which was not Sam bashing, but may be indicative of some of the Danny cult's mind set. They loved the interaction between Danny and Vala and begged for more Vala, which probably means less Sam, of course.


      NC
      Yes, there is this minority that want Vala, Vala, Vala, because she is tied to Daniel---so with Vala, Daniel is in the center of things. Any Sam time takes away from Daniel My guess is that TPTB know that there are quite a few types of fanbases out there in neverland, and that they need to try to appeal to all of them. Right now the focus is on farscape fans and Daniel fans. But they know that they've got Sam in their back pocket for the sixth episode on to keep in the Sam fans and Sam/Jack fans. And they are not just doing Ori stories. So I think they are trying to cover all their bases.

      It will be interesting to see what this minority Sam bashing group thinks of Mitchell because they have set it up thus far (and probably will continue) that he has ALOT of respect for Sam---Mitchell will lose some points for this and for interacting with Sam at all!


      Most of the comments on GW on the first episode were very positive on seeing Sam in the first episode----a wonderful surprise for many. And many state that they look forward to her return. Some also mention looking forward to seeing Sam and Vala interact. I think most fans just like the show and all the characters and don't bash any of them!!! Those are really the most common comments, but it is easy to for a negative comment to stand out.


      The one review of Avalon Part I posted---i knew when I saw who was doing it that it would read ---brilliant, brilliant, brilliant. Just like any reviewer, you get to know them and what they like, and of course they have a right to their opinion. I was hoping for another review to though to balance it out because if you look at the numbers in the pole, this season opener has lower numbers that the last three overall. People still liked it---heck I'm trying to like it and I don't want SG1 to drop in ratings---I love this show in general.

      Comment


        Originally posted by chocdoc

        ... My guess is that TPTB know that there are quite a few types of fanbases out there in neverland, and that they need to try to appeal to all of them. Right now the focus is on Farscape fans and Daniel fans. But they know that they've got Sam in their back pocket for the sixth episode on to keep in the Sam fans and Sam/Jack fans ... So I think they are trying to cover all their bases.

        It will be interesting to see what this minority Sam bashing group thinks of Mitchell because they have set it up thus far (and probably will continue) that he has ALOT of respect for Sam---Mitchell will lose some points for this and for interacting with Sam at all!

        Most of the comments on GW on the first episode were very positive on seeing Sam in the first episode----a wonderful surprise for many. And many state that they look forward to her return. Some also mention looking forward to seeing Sam and Vala interact. I think most fans just like the show and all the characters and don't bash any of them!!! Those are really the most common comments, but it is easy to for a negative comment to stand out.

        The one review of Avalon Part I posted---I knew when I saw who was doing it that it would read ---brilliant, brilliant, brilliant. Just like any reviewer, you get to know them and what they like, and of course they have a right to their opinion. I was hoping for another review to though to balance it out because if you look at the numbers in the poll, this season opener has lower numbers that the last three overall. People still liked it---heck I'm trying to like it and I don't want SG1 to drop in ratings---I love this show in general.
        You' re right, choc ... just like a savvy politician, you better know your constituency and speak to all of them. I think that TPTB will provide some important Sam moments in the future too. And they did write her into the initial script which surprised and delighted many of us. I liked that they acknowledged her importance.

        And, yes, there will be a certain amount of clamor because of the potential camaraderie between Sam and Cam. I think that their mutual respect is a plus for sure. Kudos to the writers for getting that right.

        I'm also looking forward to Vala and Sam interacting and finding support in each other. We all tossed this angle around pages ago and, at the time, I mentioned that they do have more in common than first meets the eye. They could learn from each other: Vala is rough around the edges and doesn't follow any rules but her own - Sam has learned well how to follow rules and has been rewarded for it and for her courage under fire; Vala and Sam both know the effects of goa'uld possession - the pain (of being a host) and the power (of gaining goa'uld knowledge) but Sam has never quite mastered many of the goa'uld devices and Vala could possibly teach her a thing or two (and Sam could teach her how to pick Tau'ri locks!); both are survivors and have had to use their wits and skill to get out of threatening situations, but Vala has never learned to trust and Sam often depends on her team - she could teach Vala how to trust; both are good at hand-to-hand combat too. Now that would be a fantastic future scene - Vala and Carter kicking alien butt together!

        When TR and AT started to play scenes in the first season, they made a pact that the writers would not portray them as "competing" against each other as the only two females; I hope that AT and CB and LD all demand the same for the upcoming season(s). Then we may see some women of substance giving good performances. That dynamic of cooperation rather than competition may almost force the male writers to write more thoughtful material. (Okay, I'm ever the optimist!)

        Regarding portraying realistic female characters ... Astro and I chatted about this before she left. Slightly OT, but I was remarking that I find myself watching BSG more and more because I like how the women get whumped right along with the men. And Astro enlightened me by remarking that she thought the writers on Galactica are writing the characters as "soldiers/warriors" and not as gender-based. This is so true ... we have never seen Sam portrayed as realistically as Starbuck and Boomer and it's a shame. We know AT is ready for more Death Knell scenarios ... equal opportunity so to speak. I may have strayed a little here, sorry but I am wishing that Sam and Vala are placed in situations where they are shown as competent and overcoming great odds, not just showing their cleavage! (Yes, I'm starting to fear for Sam's dress code when she gets back too.)

        So, just to recap my position on the first two parts of Avalon ... disappointed. I think the writing could have been much more creative and inspiring ... the champagne was flat for me too (Strix). The new actors are trying hard and I think they have potential ... I'm more concerned about the scripts at this point.

        The show has a great history in the context of the scifi genre and I hope that, once everyone is onboard, the writing reflects more of what's right about Stargate rather than what's not.

        Peace, CG

        Comment




          AH HA for post #700
          No Avalon abound
          Just Good Olde Sam
          Smiles Abound





          My View From The Peanut Gallery

          Comment


            Just sneaking in here in-between the Avalon posts.

            Remember Amanda’s RL pool shot in Upgrades, when she sank all four balls and won the bets with Martin Wood that she’d do it?

            This is a bit OT, but I came across the RL version of Sam’s pool player, Allison Fisher (born in Cheshunt, England). I surfed into an ESPN broadcast of 9-ball pool and became hooked watching somebody play the table like it was a chessboard – planning all the shots in advance. Here’s an excerpt from the Quetec site about Allison:

            Her 9-ball tournament record is unmatched in the history of professional cue-sports among men or women. She has won more 9-Ball tournaments than the total wins of all her pro competitors combined, and over 5 times as many titles as the player with the 2nd most wins in that span.

            What is it about these Brits whose names begin with A?! They are so amazing.

            Amanda:




            Allison:


            The two A ladies:

            Comment


              Congratulations on post #700!

              It's good to see those smiling pics. I think we needed them!

              Comment


                Originally posted by SamFan31
                Just sneaking in here in-between the Avalon posts.

                Remember Amanda’s RL pool shot in Upgrades, when she sank all four balls and won the bets with Martin Wood that she’d do it?

                This is a bit OT, but I came across the RL version of Sam’s pool player, Allison Fisher (born in Cheshunt, England). I surfed into an ESPN broadcast of 9-ball pool and became hooked watching somebody play the table like it was a chessboard – planning all the shots in advance. Here’s an excerpt from the Quetec site about Allison:

                Her 9-ball tournament record is unmatched in the history of professional cue-sports among men or women. She has won more 9-Ball tournaments than the total wins of all her pro competitors combined, and over 5 times as many titles as the player with the 2nd most wins in that span.

                What is it about these Brits whose names begin with A?! They are so amazing.

                Amanda:




                Allison:


                The two A ladies:
                This *is* great - how did you ever put it all together?! One more question: is this the actual pool wiz who instructed Amanda on set?! Or just her RL "A" counterpart? Either way ... hats off to the ladies!

                Comment


                  Originally posted by tsaxlady


                  AH HA for post #700
                  No Avalon abound
                  Just Good Olde Sam
                  Smiles Abound





                  Oh Royal Chauffeur and Stunt Person, what a multitude of pulchritude! Thanks and a Royal Bean for your 700th!

                  http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y11...dAppleBean.jpg

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by SamFan31

                    What silly fun! Thanks for the link (and it worked just fine).
                    Oops, the link was to poem a la Dr. Seuss
                    Posted by Historian and this is my goof!

                    I meant to quote that, instead I did this ...
                    But congrats, SF31, on Post 200!


                    Last edited by ChopinGal; 23 July 2005, 04:13 PM.

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by Coley
                      Calling all Samandans:-

                      When will our Pres be back?
                      Is our French connection still intact?
                      Does anyone know where Deepspace is?
                      She helped to give this thread some Fizz
                      The keepers on hols - but the flame burns bright
                      With proliferant posts through the British night
                      piccis, transcripts and vids with sound
                      A talented, generous bunch of people found
                      But lets not forget the absent few
                      and keep on posting to all of you

                      Err I think I need lessons from the Jester!
                      MajorSam is away on training
                      Lys is back, new posts maintaining
                      Why hasn't our Royal Page returned?
                      We all do miss her and are concerned

                      Keeper is now scuba diving
                      But our thread is alive and thriving
                      Royal Accountant, have no fear
                      Your poems delight and bring much cheer!

                      Jester

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by ChopinGal
                        This *is* great - how did you ever put it all together?! One more question: is this the actual pool wiz who instructed Amanda on set?! Or just her RL "A" counterpart? Either way ... hats off to the ladies!
                        It was pretty easy to put it together. Amanda's pool shots are just screen grabs from my Upgrades DVD. Allison's photos were mostly from her web site. Then I just combined them in Photoshop.

                        I don't know if Allison was Amanda's instructor, but kinda doubt it. She seems to be pretty busy with all her 9-ball tournaments that are held all over the country. In the DVD audio commentary Martin Wood said they had a double to do Amanda's shot, but didn't need the double - as we all know now. Although, it sure looks like Allison could have easily doubled for AT if there had been a need for it! So, as far as I know she is just Amanda's RL "A" counterpart.

                        And thanks for the 200 post congrats!
                        Last edited by SamFan31; 23 July 2005, 04:26 PM.

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by SamFan31
                          Just sneaking in here in-between the Avalon posts.

                          Remember Amanda’s RL pool shot in Upgrades, when she sank all four balls and won the bets with Martin Wood that she’d do it?

                          This is a bit OT, but I came across the RL version of Sam’s pool player, Allison Fisher (born in Cheshunt, England). I surfed into an ESPN broadcast of 9-ball pool and became hooked watching somebody play the table like it was a chessboard – planning all the shots in advance. Here’s an excerpt from the Quetec site about Allison:

                          Her 9-ball tournament record is unmatched in the history of professional cue-sports among men or women. She has won more 9-Ball tournaments than the total wins of all her pro competitors combined, and over 5 times as many titles as the player with the 2nd most wins in that span.

                          What is it about these Brits whose names begin with A?! They are so amazing.
                          Wow, that's amazing. I wish I had seen this on ESPN. I really enjoy watching a skilled pool player.
                          Last edited by ForeverSg1; 23 July 2005, 04:09 PM.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by Skydiver
                            i haven't read much, but the impression i'm getting is, yes, the sam slammers LOVE it. they love the show, love daniel being front and center, love daniel and vala, yadda, yadda
                            I stopped reading the sam slammers a long time ago. I find that many (keep in mind I said many so if anyone who visits those threads reads this I did not say all), with their incredibly biased attitudes, would probably even love an entire ep of DJ sitting in the woods talking to an alien (oh wait there was an ep like that and they did love it). My take on most of the sam slammer contingent is that it does not matter one whit what Daniel is doing, he could be sitting on his thumbs for all they care, and they would rate it one of the best eps ever, as long as it had no Carter in it, and if Carter were in it then it would be great as opposed to one of the greatest ever and they would spend a good deal of their time slamming Carter for whatever she did, whether she saves the world or makes a mistake, or just shows up for 2 minutes on a videophone, in their eyes it is all the same with Carter - bad and worthy of wishing the character dead, court-martialed or off the show.

                            The extremists have lost the ability to reason and to be rational, they have lost complete credibility, IMO, and they have lost the ability to see the show for what it is. I would hope that TPTB, who strike me as smart people for the most part, have also realized the same thing and are able to differentiate between the extremists and the fans that are able to be rational when discussing this show.

                            One of the things I admire most about the people who categorize themselves as fans of Sam Carter is that they are not afraid to criticize the character (or TPTB) when it is appropriate because the character loses her way or because TPTB write something so inane you want to spit - not so for those that would choose to slam Sam Carter, they have no ability to differentiate between a great show, a good show, a mediocore show and a bad show; if Daniel plays any sort of role in it at all, it is always going to be great.

                            I also admire those that categorize themselves as fans of Sam Carter because they rarely, if ever, discuss the character of Sam Carter at the expense of another character and they never, at least from what I have seen, wish for the death, permanent departure, or harm of another MAIN character.

                            i really don't care to play in the episode threads because most of the comments, other than the 'we don't miss sam' ones are all the farscape fans shouting for joy...and persnally i feel more than a little, i guess left out. because i feel like the show folk are doing little more than pandering to the scapers and us longtime stargate fans can just go jump off a bridge...cause we don't matter anymore.

                            those of us that like the show are ok. those of us that don't have 'issues' or are too unintelligent to understand the greatness that is the new show.

                            i feel like i've been told to bugger off. and if that's how the show's staff feel about me, then hey, why should i feel any better about them?
                            you don't care if i watch or what my opinions are, then i really don't care if i watch.
                            That is exactly how I have felt since day one of their PR campaign. There are some negative posts in the ep threads though and I see more and more posts, not just here at GW, that say - well let's hope next week is better. I wonder just how many weeks people will keep watching to see if it gets better before they stop watching. I have been watching this show ever since it found its way to Sci-Fi and I have been on the forums for at least 4 years now and I have never seen so much "I hope it gets better", "next week has to be better", let's hope it picks up", "its just the first 2 eps, hopefully it will be better next week", etc., etc., etc. It is really kind of sad when you think back to when everyone was always excitied about EVERY episode.

                            It is one of the observations I made about the ratings for Avalon 1. People said oh it's summer so a lot of people may not be around (well, last time I looked July is always in the summer and the ratings for the premieres of SG1 grew every year, until now). Last years premiere, almost a year to the day from this one, the rating was a 2.4 as compared to this years 2.1; where were all of those new Farscape fans, and that certain coveted demographic, they are pandering to, and what happened to all of the old Stargate fans who used to never miss an episode? Many of you have expressed the same feeling I have, well if I miss it (or skip it) no big deal, if it sounds like it was worthwhile I can see the rerun in September/October. Which brings me to my other observation, some people also tried to blame the Harry Potter release - please, if my mind is intact I recall that Stargate fans are some of the most loyal fans out there and would not miss an episode. No matter where they would be, they would watch it or they would tape it. I know for a fact that Nielsen picks up ratings off of the VCR so those households would also be included in the ratings. Where were all of those Stargate fans who would tape it if they were out, did they all forget to set their VCRs when they ran out to Barnes & Noble to wait on line?

                            Personally, I thought that, with the old Stargate fans, the new Farscape fans and the coveted demographic, the premiere would have a WOW rating even better than last years (to be honest I was expecting the premiere to have a rating in the neighborhood of 3.2 where Atlanstis' premiere last year came in because of the way they were trying to garner the Farscape fans and that demographic). It appears to me that either they lost a lot more Sargate fans than they thought they would and they did not get enough Farscape fans, or people in that coveted demographic, to compensate for that loss or they did not get the inlfux of Farscape/coveted demographic fans they thought they would to begin with.

                            We'll see how A2 stacks up but I would not hold my breath -- I heard that the planets were all aligned last night so a lot of people may have been outside looking up at the sky so they missed the show . . . sigh. (My luck the ratings will be big and I'll have to eat my hat.)

                            EDIT - Goodness - I just saw how long this is after I posted it - sorry!
                            Last edited by binkpmmc; 23 July 2005, 03:05 PM.

                            Comment


                              Congrats on post 700 tsaxlady !
                              Kingdom of Samanda : Hic Comitas Regit


                              Comment


                                Originally posted by Strix varia

                                I don't monitor any other threads, but I'm curious what the reaction to these first two episodes has been amoungst the Sam-slammers. Are they loving them, or do they, too, feel that things are just a bit off?
                                are you kidding?! they LOVE these eps! sam's not around, jack's not there to qualify the ship even more, and daniel's getting the attention and adoration... yeah, i'd say they've got their perfect show now.


                                sally
                                sally

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