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    Originally posted by chocdoc
    Yes, and I also noticed that Sam won by a landslide on favorite female character.

    And whereas Sam was much more a favorite than Vala and Cam, Teal'c was the least favorite character. That bothered me because he is an original character.
    This is a weird fandom. Well, it's not that I would know really, because SG-1 is the only thing on tv that has driven me to this rather great length of interest. But even having been "online" for a year or two, I'm still totally befuddled by the whole thing. Why there seems to be so little fannish interest in Teal'c is beyond me. I've always loved Chris Judge's portrayal of Teal'c. From the first episode, I was delighted to find that the guy playing "that" character didn't suck. I know, it's scant praise, but the stoic, conflicted warrior is one of the most botched archetypes in tv. It's usually a role that executives look to fill with a body type and a look, rather than with solid writing and acting ability (see Aiden Ford or Ronan from Atlantis, Tyr from Andromeda, or D'argo from Farscape). So personally, Teal'c working as well as he did for me was a welcomed change.

    I also have a hard time understanding why so many people don't like the Jaffa storyline. I do. It's a major, major part of SG-1. The Jaffa storyline is meant to supplement the Tau'ri's struggle against the Goa'uld. In keeping with the realism that the show initially tried to achieve, Earth could never really become overtly oppressed by the Goa'uld. Having the Jaffa as allies/a side plot allowed our heroes to fight for freedom (a storyline that rarely fails) while being free themselves. And while I know that this is not necessarily appealing to all, I've always found that the Jaffa have provided a constant, reliable foundation for the show. A large part of the SG universe's stability comes from the realistic depiction of the Jaffa's stuggle. Rebellion is messy, it's unorganized, and it's filled most often with disappointment. It's a series of fits and starts where it doesn't look like you're going to win right up until one day you do. That's what happened to the Jaffa, in all it's realistic glory.
    I also thought it was interesting that all the original characters were rated high in the excellent category (including Teal'c--yeh!), while the new characters' contributions were much less.
    Honestly, I'm both surprised and not surprised by this. I don't think the new characters are particularly engaging or successful on any level. So, in that regard, I'm not surprised to see their numbers so low. However, I also believe that the majority of respondents are fans of this New Stargate and of the new characters. They're the ones that I think most want to save the show. I think that longtime fans don't really need to see this SG-1 go on, so I'm speculating that many of them didn't participate in the poll. My point is that I think the numbers for the new characters could actually be lower. That is, if all of the former viewers who have indeed stopped watching participated in this poll, wouldn't it stand to reason that the newer characters would have fared worse?
    Surprisingly, for the Atlantis characters, only Mckay and Sheppard had high in excellent category for contribution.
    Nope, not surprised here. None of the Atlantis characters have grabbed me in the same fashion or with the same vigor that those on SG-1 did. I have a greater love for Thor or Kawalsky than I do for any of the players on Atlantis. I think in most fans minds, despite any protestations otherwise, each of us inwardly compares Atlantis to SG-1, and the Atlantis team to the SG-1 team. And, despite any protestations otherwise, I think each of us acknowledges that the SG-1 characters were far more richly drawn and far more aggresively used to facilitate the plot than their Atlantis counterparts have been. I know that as I've watched Atlantis' season three, I find myself saying, "This is where they did Fair Game," or, "Man, they'd already done Point of View by now on Sg-1." Not to mention that other benchmarks for greatness on SG-1, such as Solitudes, Secrets, and Serpent's Song were well in the rearview mirror by this point. What episodes of Atlantis would others characterize as "benchmark" episodes for greatness of plot or character? (Seriously, I'm asking.)
    Also, Sam fared the best overall compared to the other female characters--- Vala, Janet, Weir and Teyla.

    But having said all that, I actually think the survey was not well designed either. As well, though, it's a sad statement that the female characters, except Sam, were rated much lower in terms of being a favorite and contribution to story. I'm not sure what to make of it. TPTB have lost their touch writing good female characters, and/or there is a positive bias toward male characters by those who filled out the survey.

    I also don't like it when people can only answer 1 favorite character. I think a lot of people like a lot of the characters. Only a little more than a fourth picked Daniel as their favorite--another fourth picked Jack. Not surprising that the two originals had the highest scores, given that they are two characters from the movie and are male. Sam came out well, when compared to the other female characters and even to the male characters in general.
    Yeah. Like I said before, this is a weird fandom. For some reason, the female characters on these shows (and their actresses) are held to a seemingly unsustainable standard, while a number of male characters are repeatedly forgiven any lapses in judgement, character, or deportment. Only in Stargate fandom could Sam be derided for uncertainty about her feelings towards Jack, while his more forthright and blatant reciprocation of those feelings remains unchastised by the same fans. Similarly, behavior that is complained about ad-nauseum and which provokes rabidly hatemongering posts about Elizabeth Weir is applauded and immediately forgiven in Rodney McKay and John Sheppard.

    And I know this is a huge, massive, and gargantuan generalization. And I know that "all generalizations are false, including this one." But the majority of the culprits of this hypocrisy are actually women themselves. For some reason, and I'll refrain from speculation as to what that may be, this predominantly female fandom is remarkably unaccepting of flaws in Stargate's female characters. Normal, everyday problems, emotions and responses to stimuli are, when shown in Stargate's female characters, perceived by a major portion of the audience as weakness, as a failure of that character to measure up. So I don't feel that there is a bias in favor of the male characters, but rather that there is a bias against the women of Stargate. C'est la vie.


    PS chocdoc for the win, for breaking me out of my posting funk

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      Originally posted by chelle db
      That's exactly what I said...he looks great doesn't he!! Of Course Amanda is just a stunning as ever...I love her hair...they look great...thanks for the link Melora!!
      amanda is a goddess! that color suits her soooo good. she's like some golden goddess of beauty.

      and rick.... *moans* i swear, he's getting younger! *must be amanda's dress *

      i want to make an avatar of those two at this event, but i know i won't be able to size it down without warping it. hint, hint if anyone wants to help me. my first choices would be #s 16, 3, and 15, in that order. hint enough?




      sally
      sally

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        Originally posted by scarimor
        Well I can hear Sally squeeing!

        (uh, I don't mean that Sally can't separate fiction from reality, I'm just saying people see actor chemistry and... uh, I'm going to stop digging this hole now... )
        i didn't just squee, i melted and slipped off my seat!

        actor chemisty with a shot of hot mama!!




        sally
        sally

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          Pimpage! Visit my SG-1 site and become my friend. P-please???

          I don't have any friends yet.

          *lip wibble*

          http://www.stargatesg1.com/UberSG1Fan

          ...You're ALWAYS Welcome in Samanda: Amanda's Community of New Fans and Old Friends...

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            Originally posted by Agent_Dark
            Dont worry Scarimor. I'll take it one step further (or too far? ;o) and support Amanda/Rick ship.






            sally
            sally

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              alright, skydiver, give me your avatar!!




              sally
              sally

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                Originally posted by chelle db
                Ok...I'm off to bed...well...I'm gonna try to get to bed tonight...had a bad night last night but managed to get some sleep during the day today...but I wanted to rec a fic that I read last night...it's called Vulnerability by Sam I am...you can find it in ff.net...very sad...would you believe it had me crying...I'm not a sooky person so I don't cry easily but this fic was so emotionally charged...anyhow...if you want to read a sad fic...this is the one...it does have a nice ending though...wish I could tell you more but that would be spoiling it!!
                Night all...have a great day/night where ever you are!!
                link please!




                sally
                sally

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                  something else to consider for the shep/rod skew to the poll.

                  most/many of the slashers that preferred jack/daniel have left stargate. little use now that half thier pairing is gone. and the most popular male slash pairing on atl is shep/rod

                  and many of the folks on savestargate are the slash fans from sg1, so there's a correlation between preferences and preferred characters
                  Where in the World is George Hammond?


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                    Originally posted by majorsal
                    alright, skydiver, give me your avatar!!




                    sally
                    MINE, all mine!!!!!!!!
                    Where in the World is George Hammond?


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                      Originally posted by Strix varia
                      Interesting that Amanda has long hair in the new pics of her and RDA. Didn't Lida say that they just wrapped up (or are in the process of wrapping up) the season finale this week?

                      So, maybe they are doing a jump forward in time for Unending, to when Sam has long hair. Perhaps?
                      Spoiler:
                      And didn't Sam have long hair in the wedding scene in episode 200? Maybe the shippers will get their wish after all.
                      when you get a shipper excited with speculations like that, we spontaneously vomit from excitement.

                      cleans up computer screen





                      sally
                      sally

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                        Originally posted by Skydiver
                        vala, weir and teyla ARE weak. they are nothing more than stereotypes.
                        Yup. Depite my previous post, I partially agree with this statement. Weir and Teyla are weak characters, but not due to a fundamental or inherent weakness in who they are or how they've been conceived. They're weak because the writers on Atlantis don't want to want to explore who they are. They're weak because they don't get any sort of true attention from the people who decide just how exactly each episode plays out. Their weakness (or perceived weakness) is borne out of their relative usefulness to the storylines of the show. It's only Atlantis' hierarchy of character importance that relegates its female characters to weakness. Sheppard and Rodney, by sheer virture of their place in the pecking order, are perceived as stronger, regardless of any flaws in their characters' conception or execution or plausiblity (three categories where I feel Weir and Teyla have both males licked).

                        As for Vala, I don't necessarily believe she's a weak character. SG-1, by it's nature, is always kinder to its characters than Atlantis is. As such, Vala has had more of a chance to develop and grow in a handful of episodes than Weir and Teyla have had in three seasons. And Vala has gotten a lot of development, certainly more than her fair share. So, in Vala's case, her marginal and polarizing success as a character isn't due to sheer neglect on the part of the writers. For me, Vala is becoming less and less of a successful character because of her full time inclusion into the show. Vala was meant to be a recurring character, period. She's Mayborne, she's Kinsey, she's an every-so-often type of character. As orignally concieved as such, the writers gifted themselves a wide, supergate-sized amount of freedom when they first wrote Vala. She could say and do anything that the plot or each individual writer required. That character could have been (and some would argue was) very successful. However, since being shoe-horned into the story every single week, Vala has lost almost all of the vim that made her a unique entity. Strangely enough, the writers have toned Vala down by amping up the childish, emotionally infantile aspects of Vala's personality. She's become so "soft" of a character, for lack of a better term, that there's very little thrill left to actually having her around. Removing the armor of Vala's zaniness has left exposed the character's lack of purpose in almost all of the episodes. That's where I perceive her weakness to be.

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                          Originally posted by majorsal
                          when you get a shipper excited with speculations like that, we spontaneously vomit from excitement.

                          cleans up computer screen





                          sally
                          So, are you saying that us shippers are like Stan from SouthPark who threw up anytime Wendy Testeburger spoke to him???
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                            Originally posted by ÜberSG-1Fan
                            I don't have any friends yet.
                            Awesome. Please share your secret.


                            /(the antisocial) golfbooy

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                              pretty much every character but shep and rod are summarily ignored.

                              now ronon got his time in sateda. we got a glimpse of carson in phantoms. but, over all, everyone but shep and rod are ignored. weir and teyla among them

                              weir did get a couple of eps. before i sleep and the real world...but there was no real meat in them for me. real world was ok butl...compare it to sateda and it lacks.

                              what i'd love to see is weir taken out of her comfort zone. no talking or negotiating. let her be on the team and have to fight her way out.

                              let's get inside teyla's head. let her be more than ronon's partner and the 'oh john' for shep

                              i want to like them, i really do. in many ways, atlantis is a better show than sg1. but while the stories can be better, the characters aren't
                              Where in the World is George Hammond?


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                                i never voted. i don't trust anyone but darrin, or maybe someone that he totally recommends. suffice it to say, the site makes me... untrusting.




                                sally

                                Originally posted by DEM
                                Holy Cow! Someone made a comment about this but didn't give enough explanation, so I had no idea what the person meant. Surely they recoded all else to missing when a person selected "I don't watch Atlantis", right? Please....

                                Or it may give a general idea about the opinions of those fans who didn't bail out. At best, it gives a general idea about relative standing of various elements. That's at best.

                                Nevertheless, I'm still irked that Carter placed so low. (And I don't recall "Team" even being an option for favourite character. )

                                When I commented on the results, I came thisclose to handing them a virtual card.
                                Last edited by majorsal; 03 October 2006, 08:14 PM.
                                sally

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