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    Originally posted by Skydiver
    HE DID NOT SNIFF HER HAIR!!!!!!!!!

    [*whispers*] yes he did. [/*whispers*]

    Comment


      Sky, with a thread overrun with Shippers, I think you might be fighting a losing battle.
      Yepp, it's blank down here.

      Comment


        Originally posted by stargate barbie
        <snippety> and even so, it doesn't bode well for sga's female characters IMO. and they are characters sorely in need of good development if you ask me. sorry, but i just don't find weir that interesting.
        I actually like Elizabeth and Teyla. It's probably because the women who play them seem to be really down-to-earth, which makes their characters likeable. Either way, the problem that even BW has been unable to shake is their collective desire to write the female characters in relation to the male leads, rather than writing them together. They lost that as soon as they killed off Janet, I guess.

        With Elizabeth, her screen time is centered around her friendship/conflict with Sheppard, McKay and Caldwell.

        With Teyla, her screen time is centered around her "are they or aren't they?" relationship with both Sheppard and Ronon.

        With Vala, her screen time was established from square one as centering around her bizarre relationship with Daniel.

        And Sam has always had Jack as a developmental talisman since... well... since shippers were born, I guess.

        Now, one could argue that this is because these women are in a male-dominated cast, but that excuse simply does not fly. It's been two years, and TPTB (yes, including BW) have been incapable of writing some sort of meaty, substantive relationship for Teyla and Weir - despite the requests of both the actors and the fans.

        You'd think they'd catch a hint, however they've proven that the witty banter between Sheppard/McKay (something they modeled after Jack/Daniel's, and have since attempted to duplicate with Daniel and Mitchell) is much more enjoyable for them. They've decided to continually play on the same Alpha Male friendship that Teal'c and Jack had with Ronon and Sheppard. They've decided to up the "geek" friendship with McKay and Zelenka like they did with Daniel and Ronson, and then with Bill Lee.

        Looking at this post, many will probably - wrongfully - assume that this is feminist whinging. If they do, so be it. I'm sorry. But I'm not some agitated fembot who expects to see women characters dominate the whole show at the expense of 9 other characters - far from it, in fact. I simply expect the female characters (and actors) to be given material that is at least on par with their male counterparts. I expect the women to interact with more than subtle nods and one-liners. Is that so much to ask?

        Because if they can't do it with two characters whom they've been developing for two years, and if Coop & Co. are still having issues with knowing "what to do" with a character they've developed for nine... It doesn't look like there's really much hope for that.

        Comment


          Originally posted by the dancer of spaz
          I actually like Elizabeth and Teyla. It's probably because the women who play them seem to be really down-to-earth, which makes their characters likeable. Either way, the problem that even BW has been unable to shake is their collective desire to write the female characters in relation to the male leads, rather than writing them together. They lost that as soon as they killed off Janet, I guess.

          With Elizabeth, her screen time is centered around her friendship/conflict with Sheppard, McKay and Caldwell.

          With Teyla, her screen time is centered around her "are they or aren't they?" relationship with both Sheppard and Ronon.

          With Vala, her screen time was established from square one as centering around her bizarre relationship with Daniel.

          And Sam has always had Jack as a developmental talisman since... well... since shippers were born, I guess.

          Now, one could argue that this is because these women are in a male-dominated cast, but that excuse simply does not fly. It's been two years, and TPTB (yes, including BW) have been incapable of writing some sort of meaty, substantive relationship for Teyla and Weir - despite the requests of both the actors and the fans.

          You'd think they'd catch a hint, however they've proven that the witty banter between Sheppard/McKay (something they modeled after Jack/Daniel's, and have since attempted to duplicate with Daniel and Mitchell) is much more enjoyable for them. They've decided to continually play on the same Alpha Male friendship that Teal'c and Jack had with Ronon and Sheppard. They've decided to up the "geek" friendship with McKay and Zelenka like they did with Daniel and Ronson, and then with Bill Lee.

          Looking at this post, many will probably - wrongfully - assume that this is feminist whinging. If they do, so be it. I'm sorry. But I'm not some agitated fembot who expects to see women characters dominate the whole show at the expense of 9 other characters - far from it, in fact. I simply expect the female characters (and actors) to be given material that is at least on par with their male counterparts. I expect the women to interact with more than subtle nods and one-liners. Is that so much to ask?

          Because if they can't do it with two characters whom they've been developing for two years, and if Coop & Co. are still having issues with knowing "what to do" with a character they've developed for nine... It doesn't look like there's really much hope for that.

          Great points. You know, they did write Sam well for a very long time--and actually Sam of season 9 is not too bad compared to many female characters on scifi (there was just not enough of her!!!). that is why this is so painful. they wrote Sam so well for so long---why not continue to do this? I don't know why, but I think AT will do everything she can to try to get TPTB to continue to write Sam as a very strong female character in season 10 (at least as much as she can). Very few female characters are so accomplished at so many things---there really is only one Sam Carter and she is unique, to say the least.

          I agree with you that Weir and Teyla need much more character development. I'm tired and bored of the Sheppard and Mckay show. Weir had more to do by the end of season 2 which is good, but I find myself, like others, not really caring about these characters like I want to. everything seems so formulaic. I've cared about Sam, Daniel, Jack and Teal'c (and Janet, Hammond, and Jacob!), and I still do, but the SGA characters? They are okay, but they don't have that same magic as the original SG-1 characters.

          Comment


            Originally posted by the dancer of spaz
            I actually like Elizabeth and Teyla. It's probably because the women who play them seem to be really down-to-earth, which makes their characters likeable. Either way, the problem that even BW has been unable to shake is their collective desire to write the female characters in relation to the male leads, rather than writing them together. They lost that as soon as they killed off Janet, I guess.

            With Elizabeth, her screen time is centered around her friendship/conflict with Sheppard, McKay and Caldwell.

            With Teyla, her screen time is centered around her "are they or aren't they?" relationship with both Sheppard and Ronon.

            With Vala, her screen time was established from square one as centering around her bizarre relationship with Daniel.

            And Sam has always had Jack as a developmental talisman since... well... since shippers were born, I guess.

            Now, one could argue that this is because these women are in a male-dominated cast, but that excuse simply does not fly. It's been two years, and TPTB (yes, including BW) have been incapable of writing some sort of meaty, substantive relationship for Teyla and Weir - despite the requests of both the actors and the fans.

            You'd think they'd catch a hint, however they've proven that the witty banter between Sheppard/McKay (something they modeled after Jack/Daniel's, and have since attempted to duplicate with Daniel and Mitchell) is much more enjoyable for them. They've decided to continually play on the same Alpha Male friendship that Teal'c and Jack had with Ronon and Sheppard. They've decided to up the "geek" friendship with McKay and Zelenka like they did with Daniel and Ronson, and then with Bill Lee.

            Looking at this post, many will probably - wrongfully - assume that this is feminist whinging. If they do, so be it. I'm sorry. But I'm not some agitated fembot who expects to see women characters dominate the whole show at the expense of 9 other characters - far from it, in fact. I simply expect the female characters (and actors) to be given material that is at least on par with their male counterparts. I expect the women to interact with more than subtle nods and one-liners. Is that so much to ask?

            Because if they can't do it with two characters whom they've been developing for two years, and if Coop & Co. are still having issues with knowing "what to do" with a character they've developed for nine... It doesn't look like there's really much hope for that.
            tried to green ya but i can't. you bring up some very good points. nobody's asking for superior development for the female characters, just equal treatment.

            now, the male characters do have the thing of being treated of half of a pair too, but at least they give them enough aspects and arcs for their character that it doesn't seem to dominate the character. however, and i don't want this to sound like feminist whining either, there will always be people out there, both male and female who will see a female character as being to cold and unbelievable if they focus too much on the professional, and as being incompitent or slutty or whatever when they focus on the personal and the perception of what is too much lies for the most part with the viewer.

            and even if a balance if found, there will still be arguments made that the character is unbelievable, because thats not how some people see women, or at least how women should be.

            in a way you really have to admire jody foster, she gets a script to produce or direct and star in, that was written for a man, and she makes virtually no changes and plays the part herself. (and still people make comments and complaints, so there really is no pleasing some people )

            so anyway... um... yeah, so with an all male writting team, there will never really be a entirely well written woman. i still maintain my belief that sam carter is one of the best, if not the best written female character in sci fi (until BSG came along anyway). and its about 60% (maybe 70 in previous seasons) to do with the producers, directors and writers, and about 40% to do with the actress.

            now i've mostly forgotten what i was talking about, and what my point was, if i even had one. so i'll stop now.
            (lets face it, the majority of female characters in star trek were clich&#233;s)

            Comment


              I'm sorry to go off thread, but I didn't know where else to go. I don't think I'll be able to go to Vancouver. I just had to rush my dog to the Vet, he's bleeding internally. I can't believe this is happening. I lose my mother last week and now my dog? We don't have any children....Mac is my baby. I feel so lost and alone right now, and I know I'm babbling, but I don't have anyone to talk to anymore. I have to go, crying too much.

              I'm sorry.
              On fighting:
              Farrah: "A swordsman does not fear death, if he dies with honor."
              Dr. Who: "Then he's an idiot."

              Comment


                Originally posted by Lida
                I'm sorry to go off thread, but I didn't know where else to go. I don't think I'll be able to go to Vancouver. I just had to rush my dog to the Vet, he's bleeding internally. I can't believe this is happening. I lose my mother last week and now my dog? We don't have any children....Mac is my baby. I feel so lost and alone right now, and I know I'm babbling, but I don't have anyone to talk to anymore. I have to go, crying too much.

                I'm sorry.
                Lida - do not apologize for sharing your grief, ever! (((((((((((Lida)))))))))))) Hope all goes well with your dog.
                sigpic
                I prefer to be called Sunny, Sun or SK. Thanks.

                Comment


                  Originally posted by Lida
                  I'm sorry to go off thread, but I didn't know where else to go. I don't think I'll be able to go to Vancouver. I just had to rush my dog to the Vet, he's bleeding internally. I can't believe this is happening. I lose my mother last week and now my dog? We don't have any children....Mac is my baby. I feel so lost and alone right now, and I know I'm babbling, but I don't have anyone to talk to anymore. I have to go, crying too much.

                  I'm sorry.
                  Lida, sweetie, don't apologise for going off topic. We're all here to support you, and I'm sure all those going to Vancouver understand. You'll get to see them all another time, I'm sure. I hope your dog pulls through, and I'm sure the vet will do whatever possible. I know how attatched we get to our pets, and how often we're closer to them than to people. There's no come back from animals, you can say what you like without being judged.

                  I hope that your dog makes it through, and I hope you do too.
                  Yepp, it's blank down here.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by SunKrux
                    Lida - do not apologize for sharing your grief, ever! (((((((((((Lida)))))))))))) Hope all goes well with your dog.

                    Same here, Lida. I'm so sorry to hear about your dog and how badly you feel. I hope things turn out well.

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by chocdoc
                      Great points. You know, they did write Sam well for a very long time--and actually Sam of season 9 is not too bad compared to many female characters on scifi (there was just not enough of her!!!). that is why this is so painful. they wrote Sam so well for so long---why not continue to do this? I don't know why, but I think AT will do everything she can to try to get TPTB to continue to write Sam as a very strong female character in season 10 (at least as much as she can). Very few female characters are so accomplished at so many things---there really is only one Sam Carter and she is unique, to say the least.

                      I agree with you that Weir and Teyla need much more character development. I'm tired and bored of the Sheppard and Mckay show. Weir had more to do by the end of season 2 which is good, but I find myself, like others, not really caring about these characters like I want to. everything seems so formulaic. I've cared about Sam, Daniel, Jack and Teal'c (and Janet, Hammond, and Jacob!), and I still do, but the SGA characters? They are okay, but they don't have that same magic as the original SG-1 characters.
                      My issues with Season Nine, I guess on top of the severe lack of Sam, all stem from the fact that much of Sam's involvement was like a whacked out romance version of Sam Carter, This Is Your Life, where long-buried "lurve" interests came back from the dead to haunt us all - every interest but the most controversial, yet canon of them all, of course.

                      I could've done with zero Sam/Jack references if it hadn't been for the constant Barrett (cute guy, but he was the first), Orlin, Martouf, and yes even the McKay bits, delusion or no. I'm still waiting for Narim to come back with ol' Shroe 2 in tow with important news about the Ori. Or for Faxon to send some kind of message from the future, warning her of the dangers of gate travel to their future children. And, hey, Nefreyu's of age now. It's about time we heard from the Nox again.

                      It's like they replaced the very characteristics that set Sam apart and added identifiable depth this season (command of SG-1, and semblance of Soldier Sam) with snippets of all of the little puppy dogs who've ever been instantly smitten by her. And not only that, but they also managed to snub the J/S shippers as well.

                      Long story short, they haven't utilized her properly. I could've done with minimized Sam, because I'm sure there are logical reasons behind that minimization. It's just that it seemed like everywhere TPTB turned, they found more and more reasons to utilize her in a way that was a gigantic step backwards for the character.

                      On a positive note? I think things are actually going to change by next season. Despite my complaints, I must ironically admit that AT and CB seem to have pull, and are far more likely to get what they want from the Powers. Yet I still have a bit of hope left for some Teyla/Weir friendship next season.
                      Last edited by the dancer of spaz; 24 March 2006, 10:25 AM.

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by Skydiver
                        HE DID NOT SNIFF HER HAIR!!!!!!!!!

                        I'll add an AMEN to that - you tell 'em Sky

                        My View From The Peanut Gallery

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by Simhavaktra
                          Multi-purpose post:

                          First, upward nudge for the thread.

                          Second, I suspect Sam will be 'beamed out' of her predicament by Kvasir - and, er, he, and Sam will come up with a way to make the transparent slice of acrylic break toast the super gate, at least temporarily.

                          Yep

                          Third, I suspect a weapon against the Ori will be found and used, but be only partly effective - leaving the Ori present, but, unable to channel the same massive amounts of power through the Priors. This will necessitate the Ori and Originals taking up the evil Alteran science/technology to continue their crusade against the Milky Way, causing ideological strife amongst the Originals, and making them, incidentally, much easier to fight.

                          Yep

                          Fourth, I suspect that any appearance by RDA in ep 200 will be used as a setup to explain the absense of Carter from the series if there's a season 11. With the Ori 'defanged' she'll go off to make babies with Jack. If RDA doesn't appear in ep 200, she'll go off to command science-station something or another - thus fulfilling the 'old maid scientist de-sexed by hypertrophy of the intellectual organs' cliche, and ticking the series one further toward its cliche quota.
                          Hope NOT

                          Fifth, I miss the human form Replicators

                          ME TOO!

                          Sixth, do we need to add any of these to the wager roll?
                          My View From The Peanut Gallery

                          Comment


                            which sniff is this? Chimera or Out of Mind (or something else)?
                            sigpic
                            "Out of the Abyss" (SJ Angst)....................Best New Author.................."Else Close the Wall Up" (Sam)
                            Hic Comitas Regit. Welcome to Samanda.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by SunKrux
                              Lida - do not apologize for sharing your grief, ever! (((((((((((Lida)))))))))))) Hope all goes well with your dog.
                              I also hope all goes well for your dog Lida.
                              sigpic

                              my fanfic

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by ParadoxRealities
                                which sniff is this? Chimera or Out of Mind (or something else)?
                                See. Just proves the existance of MULTIPLE sniffing.
                                Yepp, it's blank down here.

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