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conrad's clones didn't have naq in them. however, i would imagine that sam has a hell of alot of scar tissue at the back of her neck. two symbiotes absorbing has to have some effect
Oh, how could I forget about the naquada thinger! *shakes head at decreasing memory.... what was I saying?*
What about her having some of that Goauld's memories, though?
I think someone already mentioned this, but I really appreciated AT's performance in the torture scenes in New Order. It was very dramatic and you could really feel Sam's anguish.
What I also liked in these scenes is that I think Sam used an effective strategy against Fifth under these horrible conditions (and considerable pain). She tried to appeal to Fifth's human emotions---what there was of them. There was no way Sam was going to get out of this situation with physical force. There was nothing Fifth wanted but to torture her because he felt she betrayed her (and from his point of view she really did). So, a resourceful tactic is to appeal to his "compassion" and possible ability to "forgive." In the end, Sam's strategy was effective because he let her go.
I loved this performance and Sam's resourcefulness.
Originally posted by majorsal
I recorded New Order to keep. And I only did that because of Sam/Amanda. Amanda was incredible in the torture scenes!
Chopingal, you’re right, this does seem to be developing into a sisterhood of sorts. It’s sooo good after all these years to finally see a female character in scifi who seems real, and maybe that’s one of the reasons that she’s struck a chord with us.
I’m really hopeful that in the ninth season TPTB treat the character with the respect she’s earned over the last 8 years, but I keep remembering the scene in Fragile Balance when Sam was briefing the pilots and was shown complete disrespect. Then young Jack comes in and he’s accepted with very little hesitation. I just cringe when I see that scene. I know it was a way of making it clear that Jack was still Jack and still held the esteem of the pilots, but I felt it was at Sam’s expense. Astrog, I love your fanfic, Come Fly With Me, which addresses that scene.
By the way, I just finished the third of the Fandemonium books, A Matter of Honor, and as a Sam fan, I really enjoyed it. It’s a good team-based book, much better written than those original paperbacks. You can tell that these 3 books have been written by authors that actually know and like the show.
TGate - a good point re Ascention and Entity issues, I think the writers leave a whole lot to be assumed - as of course they can't fill a show full of explanations. But I was really surprised the chaps didn't belive her - it didn't run right for me. I liked Daniels reply to O'Neill when he said "How's Sam?" O'Neill replies - absolutley no sign at all of her alien visitor" (or something like that) Daniel replies witha surprised and slightly narked look on his face "How's Sam?!!
I didn't like it either that they didn't believe her, and if I were Sam I'd have been very hurt by their reaction, but I do understand why they might have had serious doubts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydiver
they have dropped the ball on a ton of fall out. sam did get some from itlod, but then jolinar becomes a bit of a plot device, a 'secret weapon' to save the day
she's kidnapped in desp meas and, in the end, the focus is on jack with nearly no mention of the trauma
in nightwalker she gets a second snake and there's nary a mention, same with new order
it is great for fic fodder, but if you don't read fic, then you don't get much of a closure fix
Originally posted by majorsal
Yes! Desperate Measures and New Order had pretty big things happen to Sam, and have shown no fall out from such harrowing ordeals. Sam's not a machine, so where's the reactions? But like I said before, they've done it with the guys as well (Jack and Abyss anyone?).
I'm wondering with this whole trend they've been doing having Sam acting on her emotions whether it be making poor decisions
Spoiler:
in her love life (accepting Pete after the way he treated her) or in being so gullible with Replicarter if they are somehow addressing these issues. Maybe the accumulation of all these things that happened to her are finally getting to her and that's why they've taken a bit of the edge off Sam.
However this could only work if in one of the upcoming episodes, they make it clear that she is reacting to all that's happened and is tired and in need of some emotional support. We all go thru moments of weakness (I think), but the trick is to pick ourselves up again. That's what our Sam has to do, and we here all know she can do it!
I hate the fact so many people are losing respect for Sam because of her behavior in the last year. I hope tptb did had a plan in mind when they started this trend and that they have every intention of addressing it and fixing it.
I wish I had enough faith in tptb to believe this would be the case. Unfortunately I don't think they have it in them to have thought that far ahead. We can only hope.
I think, despite their somewhat clumsy handling of Sam's character at times, that TPTB have been faithful to Sam's core personality.
In COTG we learn that she believed that she deserved to go through the Gate on the first(Movie) mission. She was dammed if a mere Colonel was gonna stop her, this time. Sam - an irresistible force of nature.
In First Commandment, she shows that she is attracted to men who want control -why? Is it because they are the only ones who can challenge her, emotionally? What do you folks think?
Jonah tells us that Sam is a "healer of the emotionally wounded." He was her one failure. "The bird with the broken wing that wouldn't heal." Sam - the controlling personality; she couldn't "fix" Jonah so she left him.
I know it's more complicated than that, but, at its essence, I think this is part of who Sam is, that darker side to her personality that Replicarter was talking about.
Of course, the monumental fiasco that resulted from the Replicarter incident really let us see deeply into Sam's controlling side. Great episode for AT despite the apparent military FUBAR. (And I absolutely love the bit where repSam and realSam remember the wind in the willow tree sounding "exactly like rain." )
On to Pete. Story Pete. Sulky Pete. Stalker Pete.
He sounds like another Jonah to me. I thought him quite charming. I really do like Pete and Sam together - and I'm a dedicated fence-sitter when it comes to ship.
Sam's brother sold her on meeting Pete because "he had a story," so he had the requisite darkness of the soul resulting from his detective work, and he had - talk about a broken wing(or is that a broken record? ) - a wife that couldn't take living with a man married to his dangerous job. (Also somewhat related to Jack not being able to keep his wife.... Makes me wonder if Jonah was also a divorcee....)
He controls her through sulking, and she doesn't find it that off-putting that he stalked her. (They obviously discussed this, as Pete uses that very word in Affinity.)
Yup. Pete, for better or for worse, seems right up Sam's alley, if you ask me.
So what I'm trying to say is that Sam has been consistent in playing, however subtely, her darker side, the one that will lead her into making the wrong decisions. Now that Replicarter has forced her to acknowledge that darker side, it should be interesting to see what Sam does with it.
Gracie
A Cherokee elder sitting with his grandchildren told them,
"In every life there is a terrible fight – a fight between two wolves.
One is evil: he is fear, anger, envy, greed, arrogance, self-pity,
resentment, and deceit. The other is good: joy, serenity, humility,
confidence, generosity, truth, gentleness, and compassion."
A child asked, "Grandfather, which wolf will win?"
The elder looked the child in the eye. "The one you feed."
i think a lot of the stuff with sam's dark side is that she's never faced it. she's never hit her nadir. Jack and teal'c have. both of them have faced imprisonment or duties that pushed them to the brink of sanity and the point of suicide.
gemini spoilage
Spoiler:
sam, for all she's done, has never been pushed that far. she's never found out just how desperate she can be or how far she'll go. she's never embraced her 'dark side' and, to me, this is why replicarter got around her
Replicarter HAS faced her desperation. she was made/created/learned to not give a damn about morals or right or wrong. her sole motivation is her own survival and growth. she doesn't care about anything else and will let nothing else get in her way. she'll use whatever she can to get her goals.
sam still clings to her humanity. she still puts duty to earth before her own preferences. Sam doen'st realize just how far she's capable of going.
although, she just might now. I think gemini gave her a glimpse into how bad of a b**** she can be
teal'c knows, and i think jack knows, but, maybe it's romantic of me, i think both of those guys would be perfectly happy if she never found her nadir. I think they like being able to keep her as 'innocent' as possible.
and by that i mean, those two guys willingly do the dirty work so that sam and daniel (and even jonas) don't have to.
Jack and teal'c protect the other two members of their team. I think that's why J&T have a bond that the others just can't get. They both know just how 'bad' they can be....and both, consciously or not, try to keep others from experiencing that very same thing
pete may control sam through sulking, but in another way, he seems to be too nice for her. in that i mean....he waited THREE weeks for an answer.
Good grief, three weeks????
he's almost a doormat.
sam has a rather forceful personality and, i think, she needs someone who pushes back. someone who challenges her. Pete's not taht much of a challenge.
that's why i just dont' see it lasting
i think, eventaully, there would be too many conflicts. who's in charge? who thinks he should be in charge, sam 'bossing' him around. him getting tired of 'her wearing the pants'...him intimidated by her stature and, if teh stargate ever becomes public, fame
I think it would sorta be like Chuck and Di in a way. the wife's stature adn fame would rankle with the husband and lead to discontent
pete may control sam through sulking, but in another way, he seems to be too nice for her. in that i mean....he waited THREE weeks for an answer.
Good grief, three weeks????
he's almost a doormat.
sam has a rather forceful personality and, i think, she needs someone who pushes back. someone who challenges her. Pete's not taht much of a challenge.
that's why i just dont' see it lasting
i think, eventaully, there would be too many conflicts. who's in charge? who thinks he should be in charge, sam 'bossing' him around. him getting tired of 'her wearing the pants'...him intimidated by her stature and, if teh stargate ever becomes public, fame
I think it would sorta be like Chuck and Di in a way. the wife's stature adn fame would rankle with the husband and lead to discontent
Wow that's a very interesting take on Sam and Pete, i always thought of Sam taking to Pete solely because he showed her that side of her that she thought was missing in her, her soft "girly" side.
Chopingal - some nice comments re Sam and female leads. Not seen much Sci Fi, but was pleased when Janeway was captain in Voyager. Not many people seemed to like Voyager - but I did. Mainly because they were travelling. I didn't much go for DS9 as it was a stationary base (probably only makes sense to me). Anyway I thought she made a good Captain, but the writers didn't give her any depth at all really. I think this is where Stargate has got me captivated, layers are being added to the characters all the time.
Astrogeologist I know you think Sam carter is the strongest female lead you have seen in your viewing of sci fi - which other character comes the closest. Has anyone else made you sit up - or is it just Carter?
I know it has been said numerous times on the thread, but I think the strength of Carter really comes from AT. I think she is such a strong actor that the writers roll with it. (and roll with it very well I hasten to add)
She can do all the physical stuff - that in itself is a great inspiration to women over 35 - you can still be fit and active - though it takes work.
Her movements in the fight scenes - hand to hand - are very well done - she must practice the moves a lot.
She carries her weapons and moves just like military personnel. Look at the piccis posted by atrogeologist re the cannon - what a star
Yet she can switch from all action non nonsense Captain/Major/Colonel to being an actractive feminine woman - in Chimera. A caring compassionate individual - Singularity. An emotional Sam in POV.
She then switches to all the complicated scientific dialogue - which she not only delivers with precision - but she also understands.
She shows compassion in the field at appropriate times with just the right expressions - never overdone.
She's shown anger and frustration on a number of occasions.
Her timing in delivering lines is impeccable.
I don't know about Sam being the US's National Treasure - AT must surley be MGM's biggest treasure?
I'm totally blown away by her - pardon the pun.
I just hope the writers continue to do the actor justice.
Is anyone else on the thread amazed she hasn't been picked up for a major movie. Is she just too good? She'd knock spots off most of the hollywood actors!!
Just a question re the fanfic. I'm almost too embarrased to ask. Do I just click on the link? Then what? Do I read it online? Am I allowed to copy it to my desktop? How do I give feedback? How do I find all the Carter positive fanfic (apart from the ones mentioned in this thread)?
Do the Stargate writers ever read the fanfic and has any fanfic been turned into an episode?
How come it is mainly older women that feel an admiration for Sam and Amanda. Do you think any chaps think she's an amazing actor, but they tend not to post on topics such as acting ability - unless it is negative? I've tended to find in life (in my very small pond I may add) that men in general are not very good at seeing others strengths and passing comment on them. Could this be a valid reason? Or do you think there is a general resistence to having a female in charge in a military capacity? Any thoughts anyone? Is posting a thought like this out of order in the forum?
I watched Menace last night. There was a great little scene with Daniel Sam and O'Neill just outside the lab when they were discussing the robot which had just been reactivated. It was a wonderful scene. O'Neill kept saying "It's a machine!"
Just a comment on Pete. I have only seen him in Chimera.
I didn't see him as a stalker - that has certain connotations. I think he just really wanted to be sure of what she did. I assumed he thought she was lying to him about her job and he wanted to find out why. Then when he found out what she may be into, wanted to confirm exactly what it was she did. We all love to hate the NID don't we because we know what they are capable of. I assumed Pete wanted to make sure she wasn't mixed up with something like that, rather than wanting to stalk or control her. Whether it was wrong of him to check up on her is a different thing - but then again she was lying about what she did for a living - which although she had no chioce - isn't exactly a great basis for a relationship. I think it was a quite complex issue. At least he cared enough to try and find out the truth????
Having said that I rather wished she had gone out dating a few chaps (not at the same time) (does anyone find Mr Right that quickly at our age?), had a nice time, gained some confidence before admitting that it is really O'Neill that grabs her - and of course they hopefully get together in season 9!! They must surley get together?
Oh yes I agree with that scene re the briefing. I just couldn't believe that. That wouldn't really happen, I'm sure they would be more disciplined than that. A boob by the writers I think. One of a few in season 7!!!
Have they ever thought of getting a female writer on the team?
Keep posting everyone. Lots of new ideas and points keep cropping up - all of which are interesting!!
Just a question re the fanfic. I'm almost too embarrased to ask. Do I just click on the link?
sure. link should take you right there
Then what? Do I read it online? Am I allowed to copy it to my desktop?
from my pov, i don't care if you save it to your harddrive. be pretty hypocritical of me if i did, considering that i have about 150 meg of other peoples fic
you can do whatever works for you. some like to read it online, others like to save it to their desktop so they don't have to be online
How do I give feedback?
click on the link and e-mail.
How do I find all the Carter positive fanfic (apart from the ones mentioned in this thread)?
Positive fic is a subjective term
some see sam involved with jack as positive, others think that 'gen' fic is positive.
I would just suggest that you look around, find folks who concentrate on sam and who interpret her the way you do, then look for more of thier stuff
Lots of other archives also take sam fic, it's just a matter of taste and finding someone you like
Do the Stargate writers ever read the fanfic and has any fanfic been turned into an episode?
no. they're not allowed to.
imagine this, Joe happens to read a fanfic, he likes the idea, turns it into an episode without crediting the source....all of a sudden he's plagarized adn we have a whole issue because there are legalities and money involved.
The writers of the show are not allowed to read fanfic that belongs to a show they write for
Wow that's a very interesting take on Sam and Pete, i always thought of Sam taking to Pete solely because he showed her that side of her that she thought was missing in her, her soft "girly" side.
there is probably part of that. she doesn't have to be major or colonel carter with him and i have no doubt taht she enjoys that
but there is also the interpretation that sam took to pete because she came out of grace bound and determined that she was going to have a life and dang anything that dares to get in the way
sam can be rather single minded when she sets herself to it, and i think she's set herself to having a 'real life'
teal'c knows, and i think jack knows, but, maybe it's romantic of me, i think both of those guys would be perfectly happy if she never found her nadir. I think they like being able to keep her as 'innocent' as possible.
and by that i mean, those two guys willingly do the dirty work so that sam and daniel (and even jonas) don't have to.
Jack and teal'c protect the other two members of their team. I think that's why J&T have a bond that the others just can't get. They both know just how 'bad' they can be....and both, consciously or not, try to keep others from experiencing that very same thing
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydiver
they have dropped the ball on a ton of fall out. sam did get some from itlod, but then jolinar becomes a bit of a plot device, a 'secret weapon' to save the day
she's kidnapped in desp meas and, in the end, the focus is on jack with nearly no mention of the trauma
in nightwalker she gets a second snake and there's nary a mention, same with new order
Toni
I also thought there should be some mention of fallout. They don't have to dedicate a whole episode to the consequences of New ORder, for example, but it would be nice to get a mention like "how are the nightmares?" Of course, now that we don't have Janet there isn't as good an opportunity. I'm guessing she might not tell the guys. Of course I haven't seen the rest of season 8.
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