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    Originally posted by Skydiver
    one aspect of sam's personality that bts brought out, and i don't know if it's good or bad, is her need to please.

    sam seems to have this need to do good, to prove herself, to gain recognition.

    she has ideas but doesn't keep them to herself, she has to tell someone, to spread them around. she's got this need to prove herself and be listened to

    now i do think that we all do. we all crave attention and gratitude/appreciation

    i think sam's not just a 'i want to fix it' person, i think she's a 'i need to fix it' person

    if you want to think back on her childhood, i wonder just how much teenaged sam tried to fill her mother's shoes? i wonder how much of her tried to fix things. (and we see this too with jonas, she tried to 'fix' hanson
    I think you're dead on with that analysis, Sky. Can you also see the girl who wanted to get an "A" in every subject at school and always stay at the top of her classes? Her personality is probably classic for the "Teacher's Pet" stereotype. That need to please is a great character flaw. I wish they'd exploit it a bit more with her these days (I wish they'd do more with her character period this season).

    One of the reasons I think Sam Carter needed fleshing out with character-centric stories perhaps even more than the others on SG-1 throughout the years is because of her almost supernatural intelligence and abilities otherwise. Couple that with the fact that she represses a lot and you have a character that seems almost perfect on the outside, but really closets all of her flaws internally. We could see Jack's defense mechanism(s); Daniel's always worn his heart on his sleeve and Teal'c is - what you see is what you get, most of the time (though I think he could use some fleshing out too, frankly). But Sam? She's got issues. And they're not the standard kind that can be handed a visible emotional handicap such as trouble with anger-management (stereotypical for hollywood stories with 'broken soldiers') and/or egomania (ie-> McKay). Her flaws are subtler, so they need subtler dealing-with all around.

    mini



    .

    Live On Stage in Toronto - August 8,9,10 2008
    ~all proceeds to benefit charity~

    Comment


      Originally posted by minigeek
      I think you're dead on with that analysis, Sky. Can you also see the girl who wanted to get an "A" in every subject at school and always stay at the top of her classes? Her personality is probably classic for the "Teacher's Pet" stereotype. That need to please is a great character flaw. I wish they'd exploit it a bit more with her these days (I wish they'd do more with her character period this season).

      One of the reasons I think Sam Carter needed fleshing out with character-centric stories perhaps even more than the others on SG-1 throughout the years is because of her almost supernatural intelligence and abilities otherwise. Couple that with the fact that she represses a lot and you have a character that seems almost perfect on the outside, but really closets all of her flaws internally. We could see Jack's defense mechanism(s); Daniel's always worn his heart on his sleeve and Teal'c is - what you see is what you get, most of the time (though I think he could use some fleshing out too, frankly). But Sam? She's got issues. And they're not the standard kind that can be handed a visible emotional handicap such as trouble with anger-management (stereotypical for hollywood stories with 'broken soldiers') and/or egomania (ie-> McKay). Her flaws are subtler, so they need subtler dealing-with all around.

      mini



      .

      Great points, mini and skydiver! Spoilers for season 9 below:














      I see this "flaw" in Sam in season 9 as well, when she wonders if Landry really buys her idea--didn't she say something like, He didn't seem too impressed.

      And then her conversation (or lack there of ) with Dr. Lee in The Fourth Horseman. He as much says that she needs to impress. And she stays up all night, just like she has in the past, to find a cure. As Sky said, she "needs to fix it." She is totally driven, both by others' needs and by her own needs. So this theme of Sam's insecurities continues, and I actually like it too. It makes her much more human---she's incredibly brilliant, yet still has the need to impress on top of the need to fix the problem for the other(s).

      Comment


        Skydiver hit the nail on the head. Sam does have a need to please, to fix things.

        With Jonas, Sam said she had a thing for the "lunatic fringe". This implies that she's attracted to guys with "problems" that she can fix. This may be why she stuck with Pete as long as she did - trying to please and also trying to fix him because let's face it, he definitely needed fixing. I certainly think that part of that "need to fix" is what attracts her to Jack. What did Jonas call her "healer of the emotionally wonded". And a lot of that probably did come from trying to "fix" things when her mother died.

        And when she was free of the "military restrictions" that need came to the fore. She was almost overwhelmed with her need to fix things, anything that was wrong.

        Sam's also very intelligent, and is usually right. This in turn tends to foster a need to be right, to be viewed as having the answer or being able to find it. And when she isn't or can't, then she's out of her element and unsure of herself.

        Not necessisarily bad things, but part of what makes Sam Carter tick.
        sigpic

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          Originally posted by KatG
          This in turn tends to foster a need to be right, to be viewed as having the answer or being able to find it. And when she isn't or can't, then she's out of her element and unsure of herself.
          Yeah, I'd definitely say Sam is a perfectionist. She doesn't give herself a chance to take a break most of the time!

          By the way, about my ranting before, I decided to just see what happens. Maybe things won't be that bad, and if they are, well it's no use getting upset until I know for sure.

          Also, I'm sorry I'm so busy and don't get a chance to stop by that often

          Edit: Just wanted to say I picked up the SG-1 mag with Amanda on the front a couple of days ago. I'm assuming most of you have seen this. Anyway, I haven't had a chance to read everything, but there is a great pic of Amanda on the front and in the mag, and a cool interview too! If there is anyone who hasn't seen it, you should check it out!
          Last edited by Gatergeek257; 16 November 2005, 07:42 AM.
          Felger: At least my heroes exist. If this was a Trek convention you'd be all dressed up like a Klingon.
          Coombs: Vulcan, Felger, Vulcan.

          Comment


            Question: Does anyone have the Amanda/Samantha coin?

            I had a choice between Sam and Daniel. For some reason I wanted the Sam one more.......

            oh yeah....I take it everywhere with me.....always in my purse too.....
            Stargate Pants Girl
            (a.k.a. Teryl's Pants Girl)
            Mak tal shree! Lo tak meta satak Oz!

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              there's also how charactes look at things

              jack tends to look long term. he's thinking 10 years down teh line where as daniel tends to get caught up with the 'here and now'

              take Need for example. daniel saw shyla about to take a swan dive and he jsut had to save her. which, in one way, was a good thing. but jack was looking at the bigger picture, is saving one stranger worth exposing yourself on covert recon? it's not that jack didn't care, just that jack looks at teh bigger picture while daniel - especially early daniel - gets caught up in the immediate stuff

              teal'c...teal'c's big failing is that he's stubborn as all get out. he nearly got jack killed to satisify his jaffa revenge. teal'c gets tunnel vision and is also too used to absolute trust/belief. like when he and bratac fell for g'tano while jack was more skeptical.

              when tea'c was captured in serpents venom, he apparantly didn't think that he'd ever have to worry about any jaffa betraying him...while i'm sure jack would expect that
              Where in the World is George Hammond?


              sigpic

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                Originally posted by ForeverSg1
                She's a closet Jonah/Thera shipper.
                Well, it *was* a sweet moment.

                Comment


                  Originally posted by Skydiver
                  one aspect of sam's personality that bts brought out, and i don't know if it's good or bad, is her need to please.

                  sam seems to have this need to do good, to prove herself, to gain recognition.

                  she has ideas but doesn't keep them to herself, she has to tell someone, to spread them around. she's got this need to prove herself and be listened to

                  now i do think that we all do. we all crave attention and gratitude/appreciation

                  i think sam's not just a 'i want to fix it' person, i think she's a 'i need to fix it' person

                  if you want to think back on her childhood, i wonder just how much teenaged sam tried to fill her mother's shoes? i wonder how much of her tried to fix things. (and we see this too with jonas, she tried to 'fix' hanson
                  Good post. Can't rep you again.
                  I think Jacob had to be very difficult to please. She may have only felt his love and approval when she was excelling at school and in her desire to go into the Air Force. I got the feeling that the moment in "The Tokra" might have been the first time he ever said he was proud of her. And with her dad and her brother having such a difficult relationship, I bet she tried to be the mediator and peacemaker.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by jckfan55
                    Good post. Can't rep you again.
                    I think Jacob had to be very difficult to please. She may have only felt his love and approval when she was excelling at school and in her desire to go into the Air Force. I got the feeling that the moment in "The Tokra" might have been the first time he ever said he was proud of her. And with her dad and her brother having such a difficult relationship, I bet she tried to be the mediator and peacemaker.
                    I completely agree. I think Jacob had his own issues about letting his kids know he was proud of them. Especially Sam, I think *because* of the fact that she was so gifted. And Jacob has his own genetic need to always be right. Remember the line where he and Jack are talking about the fact that he (mis) called their imminent demise, and Jack says something to the effect of maybe he'll be more optimistic next time, Jacob replies: "And miss my last chance to be right?" - Sam rolls her eyes and says: "Welcome to my life!". Yup, a bit of genetics there too, me thinks.

                    Live On Stage in Toronto - August 8,9,10 2008
                    ~all proceeds to benefit charity~

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                      Another reason Sam may be a perfectionist is the military. Especially a woman in the military. She probably had to be a little bit better than the boys to be accepted or respected among her fellow soldiers. That feeling she still needs to prove herself is still there from basic training.

                      Comment


                        especially the female child of a high ranking officer (no idea when jacob made general)

                        i'm willing to bet that that's why sam never told jack who her dad was. easier to keep out of daddy's shadow when no one knows who daddy is
                        Where in the World is George Hammond?


                        sigpic

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                          I think Sam has grown a lot since the first episode. Back than it was a kinda "yes sir", "Your really are going to like me". A lil' while later it was, Captain, can you do this. And than: Ok Carter you do this and I'll do that (Calling her Carter was, better cause (personally) always calling someone by their rank, a bit annoying, also I think calling people in your team by their first name is, a sign of trust and respect, my personal opion here). From OK, Carter, you do this and I do that, to; So, Carter, how's the mission going (When Jack was a Base Commander). I mean, when she said in the first episode I'm a female Air Force Officer just like you are Colonel ... or do we need to armwrestle (personally I'd think she'd won LOL) I saw it as a "I gotta prove myself, show I'm a good Officer, that I deserve to go through the gate.And yes, Jack really likes her, thank God (I like her, now only if she REALLY existed. I'd also trust Sam with my heart, wether she'd be part of a military team, 2IC (Second in Command) or be a commander herself. Carter in command is Great! Hope y'all understand what I wanted to say.

                          Note: I've got nothing against Jack, I mis him too. But I'm glad Jack shows his trust in her and his fellow teammembers, and friends. Cause I bet some CO's wanna be a CO type of: I call you by your rank, if there is something wrong come to my office, they are just to strict, they don't see their fellow team members as friends, don't show their human part, are 1 block, unmovable. Jack is movable, bendable, example, he'd ask his fellow team members if they'll go out to dinner (why some CO's are gettin' asked say, yes thank you), He also shows his human side very much. OK I admit, I think Jack's the Best Col in the world, and Sam the best Female one, or the best neighbor, they're both great. BTW I hope I don't hurt those CO's who don't show their human side (also I'm sorry incase those "Non human showing CO's" (see the rest I said about 'em). Should be members of this forum

                          Sorry if this is 2 complicated or 2 diffrent to understand, than it is my fault, I'm the one who explained it wrong.


                          Thank you Ambermoon for the sigs!

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by jckfan55
                            Good post. Can't rep you again.
                            I think Jacob had to be very difficult to please. She may have only felt his love and approval when she was excelling at school and in her desire to go into the Air Force. I got the feeling that the moment in "The Tokra" might have been the first time he ever said he was proud of her. And with her dad and her brother having such a difficult relationship, I bet she tried to be the mediator and peacemaker.
                            Good point but how about:
                            Jacob's issue were in voicing his feelings to his kids. Jacob always reminded me of my Dad. I found myself striving to excell just to please him and I never knew how he really felt until my Mom's passing when my Dad opened up. Dad would say he was proud of my accomplishments when I was growing up which was the only way I knew I was pleasing him so perhaps Sam had similiar experience. Oh I can definately see Sam taking the role of mediator and peacemaker! I sure miss Jacob!


                            Cheers,

                            Jan
                            sigpic

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                              'nother Carter sketch.
                              Enhanced with Photoshop.
                              Click it to get to the 'honkin huge version.
                              And I do mean honkin' huge!



                              Huge version looks like this (more of the sketch is visible):
                              Last edited by minigeek; 16 November 2005, 01:04 PM.

                              Live On Stage in Toronto - August 8,9,10 2008
                              ~all proceeds to benefit charity~

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by JanSam
                                Good point but how about: Jacob's issue were in voicing his feelings to his kids. Jacob always reminded me of my Dad. I found myself striving to excell just to please him and I never knew how he really felt until my Mom's passing when my Dad opened up. Dad would say he was proud of my accomplishments when I was growing up which was the only way I knew I was pleasing him so perhaps Sam had similiar experience. Oh I can definately see Sam taking the role of mediator and peacemaker! I sure miss Jacob!

                                Cheers,
                                Jan
                                I agree with all of you. You guys have some good points. I actually like that part of Sam a lot, and not only because it adds depth to her character, but because I can so much identify with her.

                                I had a similar experience as Jan did. When I grew up my dad never told me that he was proud of me. I was expected to bring home good grades and always excel in everything, it was so to speak normal. Now, when I "failed" in something, that was a totally different story and I had to listen to long lectures and what have you. In the end, it was not only that I wanted to please my dad but also that I wanted to please myself. I don't know whether that makes sense or not, but I could not accept failing myself. And, I would also try to please everybody else first and put myself last, even though it is not possible to please everybody at all times. I actually had to learn this the hard way and I am slowly getting away from it.
                                When my dad died he finally told me how proud he was and how happy I had made him. I will never forget this moment.

                                Anyways, what I wanted to say is, yes, Sam clearly is trying really hard to always please everybody and not to fail because she is afraid of failing herself and of disappointing others. At least that is what she thinks and expects, that others will be disappointed and somehow think less of her because she herself would be disappointed. And that, I think, is a result of growing up and never being able to please the ones that mean the most to you, you develop this behavior that entails to always please everybody and to always impress everybody.

                                Just my 2 cents on the subject.
                                Last edited by Dani76; 16 November 2005, 04:48 PM.

                                Thank you, Skydiver

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