Sam Carter/Amanda Tapping Discussion/Appreciation

[crazedturkey]

This is well said. I don't consider myself a virulent shipper, but if the producers just drop this longtime storyline I'll be sorely disappointed. And, for the record, I always hated the fact that the Sam/Jack storyline was ever influenced by online fandom at all. In my book, it started being about doing right by the characters around season seven. Both the Sam and Jack characters have too much invested in that storyline to act as if it never existed. And just to throw my two cents in, I wouldn't put too much stock into any interviews that have come out lately. Every single bit of info let out for the past few months has been remarkably "on message". The PR department is certainly controlling most of what gets asked and how it is answered, though the message they're sending is definitely questionable.

The thing that bugs me about the scary virulant anti-shippers is that it's always the Sam character that gets attacked. She's pathetic, she's weak, she's pining after an unrequited love...

Well first of all, it's canon, not fanon that the love is requited, and the evidence for that is everywhere, Crossroads, D&C, Beneath the Surface, Death Knell, Chimera, Threads etc.

Secondly, it was Sam that moved on with her life and got herself a boyfriend. Jack just spent a lot of his time pining, and it was so obvious that he was pining that his new girlfriend went and dumped him over it.

Thirdly, although Heros always gets quoted as someone being sillyover the ship (even if it is ludicrous), I quote D&C back at them. Jack should have left Sam if he was going to get caught himself. And he wouldn't.

So why is it that Sam is the one that always gets targeted over the ship and not Jack? It's changed his character as well, and many decisions he has made have been made in that context???

[majorsal]

The first word out of her mouth was, "Janet?"

A happy moment for the Sam/Jan shipper in me.

i'll give that to you, strix. *hugs*

did sam say anything else in that scene?


sally

[majorsal]

This is a shippy post ... so please move on if you're not of the S/J persuasion. Every once in awhile in Samanda, we toss the Sam-and-her-men thing around.

My gal, Sal, these are all excellent points but you broke my heart with the last one! Yes, the "unrequited" may evoke a response from AT that some of us will find painful, I agree. I share your concern. We know Amanda waxes and wanes on this whole ship issue. At times, she almost contradicts herself.

Here's a pro-Jack quote from The Illustrated Companion, S7-8: "...Amanda Tapping has almost total recall as far as 'Lost City' is concerned. 'Do you remember the bit where Sam comes round to visit Jack and they sit on the sofa together? There was almost a kiss', she reveals. 'We were going to go for it, but the doorbell rang and then, of course, the guys arrived and the moment was lost and well ... I had to wait a bit longer for the snog', she sighs."

But, later in the book, regarding Threads, Amanda says: "Carter dumps Pete before they get to the altar. She dumps him because it suddenly dawns on her that she is about to commit, perhaps unfairly, and inevitably going to break his heart. It's the baby, the dog, the house in the country scenario, and here's the crazy thing: a huge part of Carter wants to give in to that kind of life, but there's an even bigger part of Carter where that is just not her life ... I don't think it's completely incumbent on her feelings about O'Neill, either ... It's incumbent upon her feelings for her whole life, and I think there is also a fear that she has. When finally you have a fully functioning adult relationship, there is also a sneaking feeling of, 'Is that it? Am I capable of more? Have I given enough?' It's just so awkward for Carter, because she's like a teenager when it comes to love. She feels awkward about it."

These are AT's own words. Each one of us will read into them what we want or need to see. Personally, I have trouble with the fact that Amanda seems to think that the Sam/Pete arc displayed a "fully functioning adult relationship" and was asking "Am I capable of more? Have I given enough?" The way Pete was written did not do her character justice yet she seems content with the way it portrayed her.

Regarding the relationship with Jack: Why did the S4 D&C "Because I care about her ... much more than I'm supposed to" by Jack get disregarded as Seasons 7-8 revisited this arc and canon? To me, the writers introduced the idea to us in the early seasons with those words and Jack's actions in Apophis's ship. Those words don't equate with "unrequited". If they had written Jack more carefully in the latter seasons regarding his hidden feelings for Sam then a fair resolution could have happened.

And now, Sam is, for us, floating somewhere in between whatever did happen between her and Jack after they went fishing and her lost command of SG1. This didn't have to happen.

i hated the s7-8 illustrated companion book, and i don't use that word lightly. i hated it so much that i returned it and wrote a letter to titan to complain.

i'm not 100 percent sure that those 'were' amanda's real thoughts/words, since the author is a very strong anti s/j shipper and (coincidently?) and strong s/p shipper.

i've *never* read that there was supposed to be a kiss in 'that' part of the ep. i've read more than once (and it was stated by ptb) that the kiss was supposed to be in the engine room on the ship when jack gave command to sam.

there's other bits of that book that bothered me so that... well, the book's gone now.

to me, the way i'm reading things, sam/jack has been devalued and sam/pete given precedence.

how'd that happen?



sally

[majorsal]

Yes, we very often have asked ourselves here and on the S/J Ship Family thread how people's perceptions of the dynamics between the characters can be so different. I realize this next comment is more suited to the ship thread, but I beg the indulgence of my fellow Samandans because these examples prove Sam is not delusional, silly or a stalker.

To me, it's been obvious since Day 1 that Sam and Jack were attracted to each other.

100 Days proved that Sam had real feelings for Jack.
By Crossroads, we knew Jack had real feelings for Sam.
Divide & Conquer brought it out into the open.

I don't see how anyone who has watched the same show I have for eight years can see it any differently. Sam is one of the greatest female characters in TV history! But then again, I don't understand why some people vote the way they do either.......

sam's feelings for jack aren't unrequited. period. (ignoring what amanda said), the only ppl i've ever heard say something like that hate her guts, so they'll use any colorful expressions to dispute something they abhor.

i detest pete, and what the sam/pete relay did to my beloved ship. in my anger and hurt, i've come close to crossing the line a time or two, so i know about balancing that part of me to not go from hurt fan to jerk fan.

sam didn't stalk jack. sam didn't cheat on jack. sam didn't use pete. sam isn't a whore. jack isn't retarded. jack shares the same feelings for sam. pete isn't a stalker. pete isn't an abuser. sam doesn't sleep around. jack doesn't disrespect sam. jack doesn't crush sam's spirit. sam doesn't abandon posts and get ppl killed. sam cares about her friends. jack cares, period. etc, etc, etc.

point of the story? when we dislike something, we might blow things out of proportion.

sam's feelings for jack aren't unrequited.




sally

[majorsal]

Nah, your vision is fine. I can't find the thread either. I suppose it was deleted, but I have to say that I'm disappointed to have missed the final salvo. I'm not sure what was said to finally warrant killing the whole thread, but it must have been pretty damn entertaining. Guess I'll have to find somewhere else to get a laugh now.

oh, man, i wanted to see what horrible stuff finally shut it down too!

i guess i could always watch 'the man show' to get that warm, fuzzy feeling again.



sally

[majorsal]

I've thought about it...but how do I communicate this to them without being perceived as a nutcase Sam junkie desperate for ship? (which okay, I guess I am...but that's beside the point )

I mean I believe it's a reasonable point of view that could help them clear this perceived hurdle from last season and make everyone look good...especially Sam and TPTB...and it would make the fans not feel deceived by how last season ended.

i'd send them those two posts, without edit. but i'd start them with 'how do i communicate this to you without being perceived as a nutcase sam junkie desperate for ship?'

just be honest and real. you're posts were perfect to me, mary beth.



sally

[majorsal]

Oooohhhh... You guys must be talking about CHIMERA and AFFINITY.

I see...

*ducks behind Sky*

sacrilege!



sally

[Uber]

i'd send them those two posts, without edit. but i'd start them with 'how do i communicate this to you without being perceived as a nutcase sam junkie desperate for ship?'

just be honest and real. you're posts were perfect to me, mary beth.



sally

Are we talking letter here? Email? Singing telegram???

And to whom should I address the singing telegram anyway???

[the dancer of spaz]

sacrilege!



sally

I knew you'd respond eventually.

[majorsal]

Are we talking letter here? Email? Singing telegram???

And to whom should I address the singing telegram anyway???

a letter. to robert c. cooper, mr show runner.


sally

[crazedturkey]

a letter. to robert c. cooper, mr show runner.


sally

oh please can't we do the singing telegram? It'd be so much fun!

[Uber]

oh please can't we do the singing telegram? It'd be so much fun!

Well it'd def get his attention...

I believe the notion has merit and should be honestly considered by those who create the stories and arcs...to hold their feet to the fire and make them be accountable...and to make everyone look good by validating her emotional journey last year.

I just want to be considered for the opinion and not pigeonholed as a shipper/Sam freak.

[majorsal]

oh please can't we do the singing telegram? It'd be so much fun!

okay!

we'd need to find a good singer, though, and someone that could sing 'really' fast (mary beth's two posts together might be a mouthful for him/her).


sally


(edited to add - this is my 4600th post. i'm glad it came out happy, instead of my woe-is-me babbling i've been doing lately )

[the dancer of spaz]

a letter. to robert c. cooper, mr show runner.


sally

Because he's so. dang. brilliant.

[Uber]

Because he's so. dang. brilliant.

Wow. With posts like this, I'm going to need to keep a fresh roll of paper towels next to my monitor to soak up all the dripping sarcasm spilling onto my desk.