Sam Carter/Jack O'Neill Ship Discussion Thread

[hedwig]

Jack was doing pottery because RDA had just taken up pottery as a hobby, so they used it in the episode.

Because his girlfriend (at the time - Wylie's Mom) wanted him to learn about pottery.

[SamJackShipper93]

Forgive me if this was talked about at all, but I just watched "Beneath the Surface" and was wondering about something: Has anyone (PTB or AT, probably) ever said why Sam's hair was cut in this episode? I know that they wanted to change AT's longer hair, but I'm curious as to why it was written into this episode.

I have read some fanfics where Caulder and his goons cut Sam's hair in order to give her the memory stamp and another where Sam and Jack cut her hair off when the other men start taking too much notice.

What do other people think? Any other theories?

[IamDKScully]

Forgive me if this was talked about at all, but I just watched "Beneath the Surface" and was wondering about something: Has anyone (PTB or AT, probably) ever said why Sam's hair was cut in this episode? I know that they wanted to change AT's longer hair, but I'm curious as to why it was written into this episode.

I have read some fanfics where Caulder and his goons cut Sam's hair in order to give her the memory stamp and another where Sam and Jack cut her hair off when the other men start taking too much notice.

What do other people think? Any other theories?

Apparently AT got a bad haircut and in order to fix it her hair ended up much shorter than anticipated.

[hlndncr]

I'm always asking everyone to post their reviews on time and then I end up late with my own. I apologize. I got caught up in some things this evening and didn't get my review of Tangent finished. I'll post it tomorrow morning, promise.

[iiradned]

The WoO kiss is awesome. It's such an over the top romantic gesture. Compared with Sam's idea of a forbidden kiss, which is pretty steamy. Of course, I think Jack's smirk at the end may suggest a few additional kisses that we didn't see.

That's the way it happened in my head canon!

[ErikaMariia]

Divide and Conquer: I read somewhere that the episode was written to get the "do they or don't they" out. The zatarc story felt like it was written only for that purpose and it showed. So many unanswered questions. The look he gives her when walking to have the procedure that could kill him is just heart breaking.


Window of Opportunity: Great episode. Golfing through the Stargate: hilarious. A cherry on top: The kiss. I wonder if Sam and Daniel did anything crazy, or were they afraid. Maybe they couldn't quite believe they were in a time loop.
Watergate: Daniel's line about Swiss watches was a bit out of character. I guess it would have been more natural if Jack had been in the sub but they didn't expect any problems. And then it would have been Daniel who'd find Mayborne. And Jack and Mayborne are always fun to watch together. It is also pretty clear that NID has their hands on Russian Stargate program. How else could the time their gate travels so SGC wouldn't notice. It was odd thought that they didn't notice any seismic actions, or perhaps they had no reason to check.

Scorched Earth: Once again Jack and Daniel were the opposite sides. I really didn't understand why Jack felt so strongly for the Enkarans that he was willing to destroy another civilization. Sam was in the middle, she didn't say anything and obeyed his order to make the bomb. The solution was kind of convenient. Again.

[hlndncr]

Watergate: Daniel's line about Swiss watches was a bit out of character. I guess it would have been more natural if Jack had been in the sub but they didn't expect any problems. And then it would have been Daniel who'd find Mayborne. And Jack and Mayborne are always fun to watch together. It is also pretty clear that NID has their hands on Russian Stargate program. How else could the time their gate travels so SGC wouldn't notice. It was odd thought that they didn't notice any seismic actions, or perhaps they had no reason to check.

Jack should have replaced Sam in the sub, not Daniel. Sam and Teal'c could have handled Mayborne. Plus we rarely get to see Sam and Teal'c work together. It would have been a nice change. In fact, a lot of season four, especially in the first half, had the team split Jack/Teal'c and Sam/Daniel. (SV: J/T in sub, D watching outside, S with Thor; TOS: J/T in aerowing fighters S/D at SGC; Crossroads: J/T dealing with Tok'ra, S/D doing nothing much; WoO: J/T in time loop, S/D not; Watergate: J/T on base, S/D on sub; PoNR: J/T with Martin, S/D captured in warehouse; Tangent: J/T in X-301, S/D on ground; Curse: J/T fishing, S/D in Egypt.) They should have mixed things up a bit more.

Scorched Earth: Once again Jack and Daniel were the opposite sides. I really didn't understand why Jack felt so strongly for the Enkarans that he was willing to destroy another civilization. Sam was in the middle, she didn't say anything and obeyed his order to make the bomb. The solution was kind of convenient. Again.

Jack was willing to protect and save a living, breathing society that was right there verses the potential for the rebirth of a society that had been destroyed long ago. That seems very in character to me and has a defensible logic to it.

[AmberLM]

And if you see a baby bear - DO.NOT.TOUCH. Mama bear may be nearby ...

Lol I'm not sure I'd go near any bear at all, however small it was! As you said, mum would either eat me or the baby would probably be strong enough to give me a good bite! The bear I saw from the Rocky Mountaineer train was close enough, thanks

[XFchemist]

I just remembered I made a vid for BTS...kinda

[IamDKScully]

Awesome Chemmy!

[hlndncr]

Tangent

Summary
You've seen SG-1 does Groundhog's Day. You've seen SG-1 does Metropollis. Now we get SG-1 does Apollo 13. Jack and Teal'c are trapped in a malfunctioning glider heading into deep space thanks to our good ol' buddy Apophis. Can Sam and Daniel find a way to rescue them before their oxygen runs out? Can Jack O'Neill really do math? Can the great and powerful Oz get Daniel out of an interstellar speeding ticket? You'll laugh. You'll cry. You'll throw papers all over the room and cheer. It's TANGENT!

Favorite Lines
Let me do the math.

Mak'tel Oz Kree!

Favorite Scene
Jacob yells at Sam and Daniel like a couple of kids caught sneaking in after curfew.

Analysis
One of the things I love about this episode is that here we have a story that just couldn't be told in later seasons. This is the first attempt by earth to create an advanced space craft and it all goes horribly wrong. We don't have Asgard beams or reliable allies or really much in the way of alien tech to get us out of this jam. It was all about SG-1 taking risks to push the limits of human progress and being their for each other when everything goes to hell. We get great character moments from our team and fabulous supporting characters to buoy them up.

I'm going to start with the music because once again Joel Goldsmith delivers a memorable score that pushes all the right emotional buttons. I love the flying music as we are introduced to this amazing powerful craft. It's soaring and heroic. It plays again when our heroes are saved. Emphasizing that it's not really the technology that should impress us but the courage and determination of the human spirit. It's beautiful music.

The visual effects are also stunning. From the first fly by of the X-301 blowing out all the car windows to the last escape via the rings from the damaged craft it was all believably put together.

We also have a great cast of supporting characters: General Vidrine, Major Davis, Jacob/Selmak and the ever present rock General Hammond.

General Vidrine: I have to admit I don't get the point of his character. It seems like they are introducing him with the plan to make him a recurring part of the show, but other than a brief cameo in Daniel's megalomaniacal dream in Absolute Power we never see or hear from him again. I think the character had some potential. He was a good foil for Jack's irreverence ("In all seriousness, if that's all right with you, Colonel?"). But he didn't really do much in the episode other than knock Jack on his heels a couple of times (which was entertaining).

Major Davis: I confess a strong fondness for Major Davis. He could have been some pencil pushing bureaucrat pin head, but instead he's really quite fond of SG-1, respects General Hammond and the SGC and is a good ally for the program. I like that because it goes against type for these kind of characters. And I also think Colin Cunningham is adorable. In this episode he also shows his competence. He is the one who is given the job to reprogram the missiles to stay locked in place. He says that's the easy part. He knows his stuff and he and Sam work well together. They respect each other. Later on they'll bring him along as a computer expert in Descent.

Jacob/Selmak: I always love Jacob, but this episode is a special favorite of mine. He is Dad to the max. When he first catches Sam and Daniel sneaking through the gate he rings them on board his ship and chews them out like two teenagers caught breaking curfew. Then like any good parent he learns his kids friends are in trouble and he drops everything to go bail them out. (I'm sure he had words to say to Bray'tac and Hammond later about giving the kids too much latitude.) He lectures Sam about being young and stupid with technology they don't understand. And when they pull over in a bad part of town and Daniel can't handle the space cops he just rolls his eyes. His concern for Jack and Teal'c is sincere and though he makes light of the situation (What the hell? I was in the neighborhood!) he is genuinely relieved to get them back safe.

General Hammond: As usual General Hammond is the rock of compassion and good sense. Always willing to make the tough calls and always waiting for his teams to come home. Love that man!

The Team: The team is never better than when they are fighting for one another. We get some great moments between Jack and Teal'c as they face their own mortality. Sam and Daniel also show their ingenuity and strength as they are willing to face any peril to get their teammates home. I love that they can play drama just as well as comedy. This episode has a few well placed light moments, but it is for the most part very serious and everyone, even the irrepressible RDA, embraces those poignant dramatic moments that reveal the depth of these characters love and commitment toward one another.

Sam and Jack
There are no singular shippy moments to point to in this episode. Sam is obviously just as concerned for Teal'c's life as she is for Jack's. But once again there's just this undercurrent of love and devotion that has a special intensity when Jack and Sam are interacting. At the end when Jack is oxygen deprived and Sam is trying to get him to focus I get the feeling Jack in his loopy state believes he might just be hallucinating Sam, because who else would he want or expect to save him?

When Jack reaches out at the end for help getting up from the floor of the cargo ship the scene cuts to the SGC and we don't see what happens, but in my mind it's Sam who takes his hand and there's a hug (with the pretense of being steadied on his feet of course because Dad is watching).

Rating: I give this episode an overall 8/10 (Inspirational) and for shippiness 6/10 (solid: not overt, but clearly present).

[hedwig]

General Vidrine showed up again (briefly) in "Absolute Power" and "Enemy Mine".

[hlndncr]

General Vidrine showed up again (briefly) in "Absolute Power".

Right. That's what I meant instead of 2010. Thanks for the correction.

[fems]

I would have liked to see more of Vidrine later on, perhaps have him be in command of Earth's spaceships department or something. That would fit with his assignment in this episode, except by the time Earth actually has working spaceships he has probably already retired considering he was a three-star general here and promoted to a four star in his next appearance. I don't know if TPTB didn't like the character, the actor was unavailable later on or if the AF recommended against using him considering his rank/retirement but I think it's a shame he only did two episodes. It might have been better if they'd made him a brigadier general or of equal rank to Hammond, but that might have defeated the purpose if they wanted him to be one of Hammond's superiors at the Pentagon.

[hlndncr]

General Vidrine showed up again (briefly) in "Absolute Power" and "Enemy Mine".

Oh, that's right. He is in Enemy Mine. Totally forgot about that one. Of course that's an Unas episode so I can be forgiven for trying to forget, right?