Sam Carter/Jack O'Neill Ship Discussion Thread

[banlu]

I'm always irked when fanfic writers place Jack's cabin an afternoon's drive away. Use Google maps, for cryin' out loud! You'll see the middle of Minnesotta is a 17 hour drive from Colorado Springs. Yes, flying is faster, with the flight from Colorado Springs to Minneapolis at just over three hours, but then you have to drive a couple of hours to the lake county. Add on the pre-flight waiting time, and you can see it's still not a quick trip. Even taking Air Force planes and landing closer dosn't improve it by much, Seems the writers on the show forgot it for this ep, also.

As for Jack not using the cabin as often - I'm guessing that the two of them rarely got enough time off at the same time to meet up at the cabin. The weekends he used to use spending time alone at the cabin he was now spending wherever Sam was. (But I imagine he'd still go to the cabin alone if Sam was off-world when he needed a break from DC)

Oh, I dipped my toe into the first few pages of the "not a ship" thread, to see what exactly it was about. No comment on how I percieved the relative likes and dislikes of different characters seemed to effect their opinions, but otherwise they seemed to fall into four camps.

1) - do see some attraction between Jack and Sam, but think any attempt at shippyness is totally inapropriate.

2) - can't see any attraction between Jack and Sam and don't see any evidence of the ship in any way shape or form.

3) - can't see any attraction between Jack and Sam, but see the ship being forced on the viewers.

4) - can't see any attraction between Jack and Sam, but see the ship being forced on the viewers with every look between them, every instance of Jack worrying about Sam while ignoring other characters, and vice-versa - basically just about every time they are in a scene together. I swear, this group has stronger ship goggles than the shippers! Researching their posts may turn up new moments of shippyness here-to-fore undiscovered!

But I'm not volunteering to do it.

banlu

[SaraBahama]

Sam and Jack aren't together so no point in going "fishing"

I'm going to assume you mean
1) that they are not "together" as in they are not physically in the same place at the same time during this ep...so no point in going fishing
and that you do not mean
2)they are not "together" as a couple (whether dating, "complicated", or married)

...because you ARE on the S/J ship thread and stating #2 would lead to a little conflict with the thread regulars.

The next day Teal'c, Vala, Carter, and Mitchell play poker in O'Neill's cabin. Carter admits that she is not a gambler, but Teal'c agrees, evoking her competitiveness. The others drop out. Teal'c eventually folds, much to Carter's delight. Mitchell commits his final faux pas by laughing about Landry thinking the second creature's attack was a joke. Pleased to see them relaxing, Landry joins the game.

Sam & Jack

Landry mentions at the beginning of the episode that Jack doesn’t use the cabin much these days. What do you think of that?

What about Sam being at the cabin without Jack?

Do you think Jack stopped by for a visit later?

It has been pointed out by other shippers that Sam looks awfully comfortable in the cabin . I think that
1) Jack's been awfully busy in Washington and WISHES he had more time to hole up in the cabin with Sam, but can't get away from the office.
2) Sam's probably missing Jack and everything in the cabin reminds her of him (it is his favorite place to be...the decor is totally him)...she's probably pulling his jacket out of the closet at night when she's in her room by herself and inhaling his scent... but that's just me. I think that being in the cabin wouldn't necessarily make her sad...she would feel close to him there.
3) Oh! I never thought about him flying out to meet her after everybody else left, but that is such a good thought! I LIKE IT. I definitely think it would have been on their minds, if he could have gotten away from the office.

[SaraBahama]

I disagree, too. By this time, Sam had already mentioned that she "Wasn't exactly" single, and I believe that this is a sign that she is involved with Jack. I believe that they got married--because they would have wanted to, but also because if they were married, then the frat regulations wouldn't be an issue if they were ever to be transferred into the same command chain again.

Thanks AKA.

[siles]

You're welcome to think that, but I strongly disagree.

However, they are very busy saving the world from the Ori invasion; so spending time together could be difficult.

Personally, I think there are so many inconsistencies and errors in this episode that I have a hard time taking any of it seriously. I think it was all Vala's dream.

I disagree, too. By this time, Sam had already mentioned that she "Wasn't exactly" single, and I believe that this is a sign that she is involved with Jack. I believe that they got married--because they would have wanted to, but also because if they were married, then the frat regulations wouldn't be an issue if they were ever to be transferred into the same command chain again.

My musing about Sam being at the cabin is whether she takes the master bedroom (since, after all, I would imagine that she's got her stuff there already), or if she depersonalizes it and lets Landry have it because he's the General.

My interpretation of her "not exactly single", "fishing", Trio conversation is that after "Threads" Sam and Jack had a mature conversation about their feelings for each other and decided they will get together once their work is done and one of them retires - so they have "promised" each other, but I don't think they've started a relationship becuase Jack is still in Sam's chain of command somewhat + the gossip about Sam's sleeping her way up would be detrimental to her career and Jack would want to protect her from that (Remember what Kerry said : he should retire! He didn't so that's why I think they didn't get together post "Threads" and decided to wait - Sadly I think they mgiht have waited too long )

[siles]

I'm going to assume you mean
1) that they are not "together" as in they are not physically in the same place at the same time during this ep...so no point in going fishing
and that you do not mean
2)they are not "together" as a couple (whether dating, "complicated", or married)
............

I'm a shipper too and waited for S/J to get together forever. Sadly, I don't think they did because it was not shown explicitly on the show...

[hlndncr]

I'm a shipper too and waited for S/J to get together forever. Sadly, I don't think they did because it was not shown explicitly on the show...

For me I saw more than enough on the show to believe they are together. In fact, it seems contrary to all that was presented for me to conclude that they wouldn't be together and could go and be happy with that.

I can see, especially after Season 9, how one could believe otherwise because the PTB couldn't seem to make up their minds. But if I believed it, that would totally ruin the show for me. I prefer to take the positive approach.

Of course I wish we would have gotten our ironclad, on-screen confirmation, but I can still see a happy ending for Sam and Jack without it.

[hlndncr]

My interpretation of her "not exactly single", "fishing", Trio conversation is that after "Threads" Sam and Jack had a mature conversation about their feelings for each other and decided they will get together once their work is done and one of them retires - so they have "promised" each other, but I don't think they've started a relationship becuase Jack is still in Sam's chain of command somewhat + the gossip about Sam's sleeping her way up would be detrimental to her career and Jack would want to protect her from that (Remember what Kerry said : he should retire! He didn't so that's why I think they didn't get together post "Threads" and decided to wait - Sadly I think they mgiht have waited too long )

As I've said before, I don't think Sam was in Jack's chain of command after season 8. (Merely retiring and continuing to run the SGC wouldn't have done it, because the Air Force regulations don't permit relationships with civilians in the same reporting chain either. So Kerry doesn't know what she's talking about.) Then they married right away and the regulations couldn't be a problem for them again. I think by this time Sam knew who she was; knew what she wanted; and was respected enough that others' opinions of her career (which I think would be largely positive anyway) didn't concern her.

The one advantage to not having anything concrete on screen is that this is one of many perfectly plausible explanations, and I'm happy with it.

[siles]

As I've said before, I don't think Sam was in Jack's chain of command after season 8. (Merely retiring and continuing to run the SGC wouldn't have done it, because the Air Force regulations don't permit relationships with civilians in the same reporting chain either. So Kerry doesn't know what she's talking about.) Then they married right away and the regulations couldn't be a problem for them again. I think by this time Sam knew who she was; knew what she wanted; and was respected enough that others' opinions of her career (which I think would be largely positive anyway) didn't concern her.

The one advantage to not having anything concrete on screen is that this is one of many perfectly plausible explanations, and I'm happy with it.

For me Sam/Jack together after "Threads" only work in they've got married between S8 and S9 so that the pesky regs wouldn't apply no matter what their future positions might be in AF. Sadly, here's not a single shred of evidence they're married...
This is probably the reason we would never have gotten iron-clad confirmation on S/J; most shippers seem to be satisfied with ambiguous "confirmation" and I probably would have been if not for
1. Sam/Martouf almost kiss in Ripple Effect
2. Sam/Teal'c in Unending - Sam never mentions Jack (I think she would have mentioned her husband and I don't think Teal'c would have betrayed Jack had Sam and Jack been an item)
3. Sam/Cam more than friendly interaction especially in Ark or Truth with cookies and kiss
4. Line in the Sand - Sam needs to tell Cam her password - seriously? doesn't her husband know her password? My SO knows password for all my gadgets and we've been together less than a year...

All in all yes I do think Sam and Jack had a serious talk about their feelings and decided to wait until one of them retires.
And for people who don't think Sam's in Jack's chain of command watch their scenes together in SGU - it's been perfectly clear 304 commanders answer to Jack - look at The Return on SGA - Caldwell answers to Jack/ Weir answers to Jack and the IOA.

[Akamaimom]

For me Sam/Jack together after "Threads" only work in they've got married between S8 and S9 so that the pesky regs wouldn't apply no matter what their future positions might be in AF. Sadly, here's not a single shred of evidence they're married...
This is probably the reason we would never have gotten iron-clad confirmation on S/J; most shippers seem to be satisfied with ambiguous "confirmation" and I probably would have been if not for
1. Sam/Martouf almost kiss in Ripple Effect
2. Sam/Teal'c in Unending - Sam never mentions Jack (I think she would have mentioned her husband and I don't think Teal'c would have betrayed Jack had Sam and Jack been an item)
3. Sam/Cam more than friendly interaction especially in Ark or Truth with cookies and kiss
4. Line in the Sand - Sam needs to tell Cam her password - seriously? doesn't her husband know her password? My SO knows password for all my gadgets and we've been together less than a year...

All in all yes I do think Sam and Jack had a serious talk about their feelings and decided to wait until one of them retires.
And for people who don't think Sam's in Jack's chain of command watch their scenes together in SGU - it's been perfectly clear 304 commanders answer to Jack - look at The Return on SGA - Caldwell answers to Jack/ Weir answers to Jack and the IOA.

My husband doesn't know all my passwords, and we've been married for fifteen years. But the actual password is the clue there. The fact that Sam, who didn't ever take Jack up on his offers to go fishing with him for the first 7 1/2 years, now uses "fishing" as her password, is a clue that it holds some significance for her.

I never saw anything at all other than friendship between Teal'c and Sam in Unending. Since the only indication that they were playing anything up between them is what was said on the DVD extras, then there is as much credence for that theory as there is for the Sam/Jack married theory, and there is more evidence for the married theory on the DVD extras.

I never saw anything between Sam and Cam. I always got the impression that Sam sees Cam as a somewhat impulsive and slightly irritating younger brother.

The Sam/Martouf almost kiss was, I believe, initiated by the remnants of Jolinar left in Sam's system, and by Martouf's fascination with the fact that Sam had, at one point, carried Jolinar. Honestly, that entire relationship grossed me out--Sam wasn't either Jolinar or her host, and Martouf, by virtue of seeing Sam as the only vestige left of his lover, preyed on her to the point of supreme ickiness. I think that Martouf is a needy, presumptuous man who needed to grieve his loss without transferring his affection to someone who was an unwilling host to a pushy Tok'ra who, quite frankly, acted more like a Goa'uld in suppressing her hosts in order to save her own life. Anything that passed between Sam and Martouf was NOT a real relationship. It was a mixture of memories and nostalgia, and some fairly strong Tok'ra hormones.

[hedwig]

And for people who don't think Sam's in Jack's chain of command watch their scenes together in SGU - it's been perfectly clear 304 commanders answer to Jack - look at The Return on SGA - Caldwell answers to Jack/ Weir answers to Jack and the IOA.

If they were married (and I'm of the opinion they were), as a 304 commander she would likely still report to Jack.

And if you recall, Jack specifically addressed her as "Sam" in one of those episodes; not "Carter". How long has it been since he actually called her "Sam"? I don't think he would have done that if they were not in a personal relationship. He doesn't, after all, call Caldwell "Steven".

That's just another indication to me that there is far more to their relationship than friends.

As for the cookies and kiss scene in "Ark of Truth", I see that as merely an indication of Sam and Cam being good friends; there were quite a few instances before that indicating they were simply good friends (her giving him the Medal in his hospital room being one; it's my impression someone with a higher rank than Lt. Colonel would have been the one to give him that, unless she asked if she could do it). I've had a few men friends in my life that I would kiss on the cheek. It didn't mean we were involved in an intimate relationship. And I think if they had been, that kiss would not have been on his cheek. In fact, I saw that as more of a brotherly/sisterly sort of kiss than anything else; their whole relationship seemed like that to me.

In "Unending", nobody mentions Jack, and one would think that Daniel would at least have since he and Jack were such good friends. The fact that Sam never mentioned his name in the episode doesn't mean she didn't do it at other times. It was actually the writers and producers who chose not to mention him, which many people were offended by since he should have been given his history with the series. I realize many people think if it isn't shown/said on screen, it isn't canon. However, there were 50 years they went through. I'm sure his name came up at some point during those times we didn't see; probably when Sam was alone and thinking about him.

I saw nothing whatsoever in Sam/Teal'c's interaction to indicate anything happening between them. Just because AT said she and CJ had talked about that possibility doesn't make it canon. I've had hugs like they shared with men friends of mine, and again it just meant we cared a lot about each other. Plus, they had just lost Landry, and Teal'c was comforting her, as he was in "Paradise Lost" while Jack was missing.

Phew! Sorry. Didn't mean to go on and on, but I get carried away sometimes.

The Sam/Martouf almost kiss was, I believe, initiated by the remnants of Jolinar left in Sam's system, and by Martouf's fascination with the fact that Sam had, at one point, carried Jolinar. Honestly, that entire relationship grossed me out--Sam wasn't either Jolinar or her host, and Martouf, by virtue of seeing Sam as the only vestige left of his lover, preyed on her to the point of supreme ickiness. I think that Martouf is a needy, presumptuous man who needed to grieve his loss without transferring his affection to someone who was an unwilling host to a pushy Tok'ra who, quite frankly, acted more like a Goa'uld in suppressing her hosts in order to save her own life. Anything that passed between Sam and Martouf was NOT a real relationship. It was a mixture of memories and nostalgia, and some fairly strong Tok'ra hormones.

Absolutely agree with this.

Oh, and your comment about Jolinar acting more like a Goa'uld suppressing the host made me instantly think of Kanan and Jack in Abyss, because Kanan did the same thing to Jack.

[hlndncr]

1. Sam/Martouf almost kiss in Ripple Effect
2. Sam/Teal'c in Unending - Sam never mentions Jack (I think she would have mentioned her husband and I don't think Teal'c would have betrayed Jack had Sam and Jack been an item)
3. Sam/Cam more than friendly interaction especially in Ark or Truth with cookies and kiss
4. Line in the Sand - Sam needs to tell Cam her password - seriously? doesn't her husband know her password? My SO knows password for all my gadgets and we've been together less than a year...

All in all yes I do think Sam and Jack had a serious talk about their feelings and decided to wait until one of them retires.
And for people who don't think Sam's in Jack's chain of command watch their scenes together in SGU - it's been perfectly clear 304 commanders answer to Jack - look at The Return on SGA - Caldwell answers to Jack/ Weir answers to Jack and the IOA.

This is how I see it:

1. I agree with Aka; Martouf was needy and manipulative. Sam always had a hard time supressing Jolinar's feelings around him and I think he took advantage of that. And it looked to me like she was glad not to have kissed him.

2. I never saw anything b/w Sam and Teal'c in Unending but deep caring and friendship. I would not have even imagined a different scenario if someone else hadn't have put it to me. As for not mentioning Jack, as hedwig pointed out no one did, which was an inexcuseable oversight by the PTB IMO (just one of the many things I hate about that episode). Even if S/J weren't married these were his closest and dearest friends. And Jack was Thor's favorite human. I choose to believe he was talked about by all of them frequently off screen; otherwise it ruins the integrity of the characters for me.

3. Sam was unusually bouncy and I think somewhat out of character at the end of AoT. I choose to believe she was happy to have everyone safe, the galaxy free again, and on her way to see Jack. To accept there might have been an inappropriate relationship between Sam and Mitchell completely destroys the integrity of Sam's character. I can't accept that. (Moreover, AT refused to allow that ship to sail so I don't believe in her mind that was what she was playing.)

4. Sam was in pain, drugged up and dying. I'm sure she just wanted to make sure her last goodbyes to those she loved would be found and delivered. If I was in that situation I wouldn't be thinking, "Oh well, Jack will know how to find them."

As for Jack's command, it was always very murky. His position was never specified in Season 9. (I haven't gone back through season 10 yet, but it was still obscure.) There were times when Jack seemed to be giving the orders, times when Landry was in charge. At no time did Jack have authority over the IOA (there entire purpose was as a civilian oversight administration. In SGU we suddenly have Homeworld Command (I won't get into all the ways SGU ignored cannon and undermined established characters), which had to have been a newly created joint command. It's possible that Jack did come back into Sam's chain of command, but I see no evidence that convinces me that they couldn't have been married by then. So I choose to believe they were.

If you want an unhappy ending to the ship, that's your perogative. Many choose to believe S/J never got together (including some former shippers, the antis and several non-shippers), but if I accepted that I would walk away from Stargate fandom right now. I would consider it a disappointment and a waste. But this ship is worth more than that, IMHO.

[iiradned]

I agree with Aka, hedwig and hlndncr about the interaction between a post-Jolinar Sam and Martouf/Lantash. In fact fics which pair a post-Jolinar Sam and Martouf squick me out.

I like I wrote earlier in this thread, I believe that one of the things Jack and Sam did early in their time up at the cabin was to a have a heart-to-heart talk about the future of their relationship and that they are both in it for the long haul. By the time that Sam moves to Area 51 they are least lovers and most hopefully married, after all Vegas is nearby.

They are keeping their relationship low-key in order to avoid scurrilous gossip and when one of them retires (most likely Jack first) they will bring their relationship into the open.

[SaraBahama]

I agree with Aka, hedwig and hlndncr about the interaction between a post-Jolinar Sam and Martouf/Lantash. In fact fics which pair a post-Jolinar Sam and Martouf squick me out.

I like I wrote earlier in this thread, I believe that one of the things Jack and Sam did early in their time up at the cabin was to a have a heart-to-heart talk about the future of their relationship and that they are both in it for the long haul. By the time that Sam moves to Area 51 they are least lovers and most hopefully married, after all Vegas is nearby.

They are keeping their relationship low-key in order to avoid scurrilous gossip and when one of them retires (most likely Jack first) they will bring their relationship into the open.

Nicely said.

Now, on the discussion at hand:

1) Sam has forged the various team members into an extended family of choice.

-Teal'c -like a brother.
I had never heard that implication about Sam and him in 'Unending' & I was blindedsided by the implication of something going on between them...I just never saw it, and when it was mentioned above I immediately thought "what the...?".

-Cam -like a brother.
I think it is significant that in 'Unending', Daniel and Vala hook up, but Sam remains single for 50 YEARS. If she and Cam had become an item, why not follow Daniel and Vala's lead?

Martouf
Ok. I don't dislike the guy *covers head for the expected lashing I know is coming*. He seems nice and sincere, and hey! he's lost his soulmate and Sam is the last place she was. I think he meant Sam no harm, but could not help himself because he was dealing with his loss. This idea may make him a tad selfish, but not evil. As to the almost-kiss in Ripple Effect... please note that Sam did NOT actually kiss him... and looked relieved. If she were unattached, there would be no reason to resist the temptation/curiosity.

The REGS -

Siles -

I'm not going to squabble with you. I think the world is big enough for all of our different views (guess that makes me a shippy hippy...right?). I stringently argued this point with Pol, Rachel500, and others. I believed after reading the regs myself that there was no loophole for them and that the writers had doomed them to an unfullfilled life by not having him retire (which they should have done at the end of S8!!! Darned writers!). Then Pol showed me an old post she had on the Family 'ship appreciation thread about the regs. She noted that when Jack went to Washington and Sam went to Area 51, the two assignments were under different oversight and not directly in chain of command...also when Sam went to Atlantis, that technically made her under IOA...a civilian agency, and again not in Jack's direct chain of command (you need to see her argument -she did such a great job). She stated that if they had married in either period, it would have been permissable...and when she was later back under his chain of command (SGU -on the Hammond), they were already married and frat regs don't apply to married people.

But I understand if you are not convinced...I wasn't for a long time.

I don't know that we will EVER get confirmation...and it ticks me off that S9 & 10 writers enjoyed messing with our heads so much.

Personal opinion? They married between S8 & 9, and kept it low-key but not 'secret'. I enjoy thinking of them in a happily ever after -it fuels my fanfic.

[hlndncr]

Thoughts on the first episodes of season 10:

Flesh & Blood
Now that Vala's back she once again dominates the storytelling. At the same time they never used the Orici or Vala's connection to her to much advantage storywise; even though that's the whole rationale for bringing her into the SGC. I do, however, continue to love Tomin. He as an enemy soldier with a hearth he is both an interesting and sypathetic character.

I don't get why the Ori attack Chulak and I don't think a good reason was ever given.

I think Sam's concern for Teal'c and Daniel shows the close family ties she has to them. I really enjoyed AT's sincere yet understated portrayal.

No ship, but we do learn that the fleet is out of touch with earth for some time after the battle. Jack I'm sure was going crazy smoothing political and IOA feathers, while worried sick about Sam and the rest of his family out on the frontlines.

Morpheus
As an intitial concept I don't think this episode is half bad. The team goes off-world. We have some weaving in of the Arthurian myth. But it really falls apart for me on two fronts.

First, I can live without the Vala slapstick show. Although the Woolsey gambit was interesting. I would have been much happier if the B-Story focused more on that aspect. In fact, it might have been interesting if Vala did become an IOA spy. It would have given her character more interest and depth instead of her just being the SGC's resident court jester.

Second, there was no climax. In the end, the team did nothing. In fact, the conclusion makes no sense. They are all trying to find answer to their problem before they fall asleep and die. Then out of nowhere, for no reason, and without a solution in mind SGC personnel come and rescue everyone and everything's fine.

And does Sam ever work with tech anymore? I'm beginning to think she actually got a medical degree while at Area 51. Couldn't they have made the solution something technological instead of biomedical? I mean really, a giant lizard?

Pegasus Project

This episode once again shows what a great storyteller Brad Wright is. It is a very enjoyable and satisfying episode for me.

I like that Daniel finally gets to Atlantis, but it's a shame he is stuck in the hallo room the whole time. I don't understand, however, why they brought Vala along. She's not a member of SG1 at this point and she doesn't have any expertise to offer. She's just there to hang on Daniel and annoy him (and ME). Personally, I would have preferred to see more Daniel/Weir interaction. I always liked those two together.

At one point Cam steps in and stops McKay from basically sexually harassing Sam. That may be because he has a chivalrous protective streak (he stopped another SG Team from speaking disrespectfully about Dr. Lam at one point). But I like to think that Cam also knows the score between her and Jack and he's not going to let anyone mess with the General's wife/girl.

Insiders
I hate that the gou'ald controlled Trust (likely headed by Baal) is brushed aside and not being that important in the new era of the Ori threat. It seems symbolic of the show's direction in general. There's the old Stargate and then there's are shiney new version that is far more important. And doesn't it just seem like Baal isn't as scary anymore? He used to be chilling. I miss that.

I think Mitchell's admission to Landry that he has no real authority over the team should give his commanding officer real pause, but Landry just brushes it off with a quip. Just one more reason Sam should have been in charge. She has the respect of her teammates and authority to lead. (Yes, I'm going to keep beating this drum!)

I don't like how passive Sam is when she is captured by Baal. And she gives in so easily. I would understand her caving quickly to Baal's threat to kill the hostages if this episode came after Company of Thieves (where she watches a Lucian Allience terrorist shoot Emerson before her eyes for refusing to help). I just think she could have resisted more. And although she slowed the download of the data, why couldn't she have corrupted or scrambled it? She's come up with more complex programing on shorter notice in the past.

And what's with the difficulty delivering the symbiote poison? Elliot basically broke a little vile in his hand and killed hundreds of Jaffa in one fell swoop at the end of Last Stand.

As to Barrett, although he has long been interested in Sam she's never shown any interest in him. In fact, I think she was stretching when she said he was her friend and she cared about him. But she then immediately put their relationship in perspective by telling him not to push it. He may not know who she is seeing, but after there last brief discussion on the subject and this encounter he has to know she's taken.

OK, way past my bedtime. I'll try and share a few more thoughts on Uninvited tomorrow.

[EvenstarSRV]

I heard about that awhile back, and it amazes me that PDL wasn't up to date or current on whatever the story lines were; in other words, where the heck did he get a notion like that? If he had been, how could he possibly have done that, given there had been no hint of it prior to that in our own reality. He'd directed/written/produced enough episodes to know that wasn't necessary.

Well, it was an AU SG-1 team, so theoretically Sam/Cam is a possibility in their reality, esp since they seemed less concerned with rules and regs compared to the SGC in our reality.

Not that I like the idea of it as a non-shipper, just pointing out that Sam/Jack as a couple (or as good as one) in our reality doesn't rule out other relationships in other realities.

Personally, I think there are so many inconsistencies and errors in this episode that I have a hard time taking any of it seriously. I think it was all Vala's dream.

Not the least of which was moving Jack's cabin to Colorado.

Martouf
Ok. I don't dislike the guy *covers head for the expected lashing I know is coming*. He seems nice and sincere, and hey! he's lost his soulmate and Sam is the last place she was. I think he meant Sam no harm, but could not help himself because he was dealing with his loss. This idea may make him a tad selfish, but not evil. As to the almost-kiss in Ripple Effect... please note that Sam did NOT actually kiss him... and looked relieved. If she were unattached, there would be no reason to resist the temptation/curiosity.

Yay, someone else here who doesn't dislike Martouf!

I actually think Martouf's focus on Sam because of Jolinar's memories makes sense. As a Tok'ra, he (and Jolinar) have likely switched hosts in the decades they were together, so he's probably used to transferring his affections to the Jolinar's new hosts. Personally, aside from his initial push in the Tok'ra, I thought he showed great restraint regarding his feelings and didn't push Sam about them, in fact he usually seemed apologetic to me about how uncomfortable his relationship with Jolinar made Sam.

This is getting a bit ahead of ourselves, but I wanted to comment on the mentions of a possible Sam/Teal'c in Unending, since it's not something I would find out of character for either character even if Sam and Jack were together, it was 50 years after all.

Jack went from being happily married to Sara to falling in love with Sam in about 5-6 years (before the movie to D&C), and together, Sam and Jack went from being complete strangers to being in love in just over 3 years (COTG to D&C). Plus I'm guessing many shippers believe they fell in love at some point earlier, after Solitudes, POV, 100 days, etc.

So is it really so hard to believe that Sam and Teal'c, close friends of 10 years, could have possibly gotten together in the 50 years they were stuck on the ship in Unending? I'm sure she would have mourned for Jack and I'm sure that it's not something that would have happened overnight. But I can't see how their relationship would mean that she had to stay single or that a possible Sam/Teal'c relationship would be a betrayal of Jack.

If Sam and Jack can go from being complete strangers to falling in love in 3 years and becoming a couple in 8-10 years, why is it so impossible for Sam and Teal'c to go from being close friends to being in a relationship in 50 years, esp in the close quarters of that ship?