Sam Carter/Jack O'Neill Ship Discussion Thread

[josiane]

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Synopsis

SG1 take their shiny new mothership to Vorash to help the Tok'ra move to a new super secret lair. In the spirit of new beginnings, the Tok'ra decide to let Tanith in on the fact that they know he is Apophis's not-so-secret spy, and bang him up in custody. However he manages to escape and alert Apophis, who starts heading their way, entire fleet in tow. Sam and Jacob take this opportunity to come up with the wonderfully wacky plan of blowing up the sun by siphoning bits of it off to the black hole SG1 discovered in A Matter of Time, thereby wiping out Apophis and his fleet in a fiery supernova, once the Tok'ra and they have all left the system, that is. All goes according to plan until Tanith turns up in an alkesh and starts attacking their mothership, prompting Teal'c to take matters into his own hands ('It's a Jaffa revenge thing'). Teal'c and Jack follow Tanith and crash on Vorash, where Tanith captures Teal'c and takes him to Apophis. Sam, Jacob and Daniel rescue Jack with minutes to spare, and then the sun goes boom. Unfortunately the shockwave knocks them into another galaxy, far from everything they know except, of course, Apophis, who gets sent there too. To be continued next time...

Analysis

Whenever I watch this episode, I have a little voice in my head (sounding much like a combination of Jack and Daniel) saying 'of course they do', 'of course it does', because it really does pile on the improbabilities and coincidences just to get them to that point where they are stranded with Apophis in another galaxy. I do like this episode a lot, but that always makes me smile

More specifically, I have to take a moment to express my love for Tanith. He is fabulous, in a complete 'living cliche' type way - the hammy bad-guy-ness, even complete with English accent (seriously, you guys over the other side of the pond, why are you so fond of English accents for your bad guys?? )

I'm not quite so keen on Teal'c in this episode though, I have to say. I know that he can get very single-minded, but somehow he seems rather extreme here, even for him. The way he completely takes over in the glider, utterly ignoring Jack and the rest of SG1, and almost killing both himself and Jack, does seem a bit out of character, IMO.

Jack on the other hand is pretty solidly in snarky and goofy mode throughout the whole episode, which I think can be put down to the fact he's with the Tok'ra, who he is never comfortable with. But I think it's also exacerbated by the fact he's with Jacob, and I think this episode really provides quite an insight into their relationship. Watching the two of them together (the long scene where they're walking round in circles through the corridors of the ship is a particularly striking example), there's an awful lot of tension bubbling underneath the snark. From Jack's point of view, we know he gets snarky when he's feeling slightly on the defensive, and I think he does feel that around Jacob. I'm trying to think how to say this without sounding critical of Jack, because that's not how I mean it, but he's very used to being in charge, and being the alpha male. He doesn't take well to other alpha males coming along onto his territory, and I think he does view Jacob as competition in some ways. I don't mean to say this is in any way conscious, or that Jack doesn't like Jacob, because I think he does, just that he's automatically a little bit on edge when Jacob is around. I think he feels that Jacob is both assessing him and seeing right through him (and for Jack, a man who likes to hide behind his masks, that must be uncomfortable), and not necessarily always liking what he sees. I think this is partly because of the military, with Jacob being a General, even if a be-Tok'ra'd one, partly because of Sam (more on that in a minute), and partly down to personality - Jacob is a pretty snarky guy and a bit of an alpha male himself, which is quite a contrast to Hammond whose relationship with Jack is competely different. I think, if I can use familial relationships to illustrate the kind of difference I mean here, Jacob and Jack are a bit like brothers (with Jacob the elder and Jack the younger), whereas Hammond and Jack are more like father and son. Jacob, for his part, I think is viewing Jack in a kind of sizing-up way - we see this right from their very first meeting in Secrets. Again I think Jacob does like Jack, but he also takes quite a bit of pleasure in throwing Jack off balance - probably a reaction to what he perceives as Jack's cockiness, and it's tempting to try and undermine that. I'm not sure I've entirely managed to explain that well, but I think the brothers analogy is a good one because it encompasses the liking and affection that's there, as well as the competitiveness and the winding-up-ness. The relationship is then further complicated by Sam, as she is at the bottom of a lot of their competitiveness. Jack's awareness of his feelings for Sam put him in what he perceives as a slightly inferior position to Jacob - like you're always going to feel in the presence of the 'father-in-law', and I think this contributes to Jack feeling like Jacob is sizing him up. And I think that's also an entirely justified perception on Jack's part, as I think Jacob is doing that very thing and largely because of Sam. Jacob can see how much Sam looks up to Jack, and how close they are, and can't help feeling a little bit concerned - is Sam going to get hurt, is Jack going to look after her (OK so he knows on one level she doesn't need looking after, but on another level she's still his little girl), and that's even without him realising there are more feelings involved. I'm never certain at this point quite how much Jacob knows about their feelings, but I certainly think he suspects, and frankly that's quite enough to explain his behaviour towards Jack.

Hmm, that got rather longer than I intended, but it really is one of the most fascinating relationships on the show I think. I've also strayed a bit into the next section of the review, so maybe I should just move along there now!

Implications for Sam and Jack

Nothing hugely implication-y, but there are a few telling moments. Sam's reactions to Jack's jokes in this episode are great. There's quite a bit of 'oh no he didn't' creeping into the amusement here - take a look at Sam's expressions right at the beginning when he makes the red zone crack, and again after he jumps into Cronus's throne and calls shotgun.

Sam is almost apologetic when she looks at Jack while telling him about the black hole, which I think is a really nice call-back to A Matter of Time and the way he chastised her there for focusing on the science and forgetting about the people. The apologetic look she gives him seems to say 'I remember, and I know', and is a nice example of their communicating without words thing.

The scene where Sam and Jack are down in the cargo hold and sending the gate off to do its matter sucky thing on the sun is interesting, I think. Jack's line ("Well they say the first one's always the hardest") is delivered very uncertainly, like he's not sure that he should be saying it at all, and Sam's reaction is along the same slightly incredulous lines as her reactions to his other jokes in this episode, but it does settle her down. I think really that this scene is an illustration of what we see in Grace and Threads (*looks around for Jenn*), that this is what Sam needs from Jack - just to be there with her and for her. It doesn't matter what he says, it's enough that she knows he's there.

The last thing I can think of to mention is how vehement Sam is about not leaving people behind - even more so than Jack at the end when it's Teal'c that's lost. I don't think this is purely shippy - her concern the first time is clearly for both Jack and Teal'c, and the second time of course it's only Teal'c that is missing - but I think it shows how of all of SG1 it's Sam who has taken on board what we think of as Jack's philosophy of never leaving anyone behind the most. Daniel and Teal'c are both more inclined to accept the idea of sacrificing people for the greater good, but on this Sam is every bit as hardline as Jack.

[AstraPerAspera]

Well, in my continued "day late/dollar short" tradition, I'll just say something briefly about Double Jeopardy.

Umm...

Yeah.

Not one of my favorites. In fact, it probably ranks fairly close to the bottom of the list of all 200+ episodes for me. Quite possibly Wormhole Extreme alone ranks lower.

There are some interesting aspects to it...a case study, if you will, of what happens to the team...and as our focus here is S/J...what happens to *them*...when they fail to experience what *our* S/J experience. Because even w/o the strictures of military regulations, the android Sam and Jack don't seem to have paired up at all, and you would think that this would be the perfect situation for them to have been able to be together without sanction.

Except, they're not.

Which sort of points to where S/J were at the point they were cloned (or androided?) back in S1...before their shared experiences created an environment where those feelings for each other began to germinate. In fact, if anything, we see an increased reliance here on a sort of para-military structure, as if neither Android!Sam or Android!Jack can get much beyond that point with each other in their relationship and so, as far as the two of them are concerned, its strictly business. It's another sort of S/J AU, if you will...but one where the outcome is dramatically different than we saw in either PoV or TbftGoG.

If, however, anyone is inclined to enjoy this particular episode and these types of what-if situations, then I'd suggest reading the Fandamonium SG-1 novel, Hydra. It builds off this episode completely and we see not only one but multiple iterations of SG-1 who've been created for more nefarious purposes than this and who don't always live up to the ethics and ideals of the original people off of whom they are based. No surprise, I suppose, if I were to say its not one of my favorite Fandamonium books, although, IIRC, it's been highly acclaimed.

And finally...because I really can't let symbolism go...the image of Jack beating himself up is rather priceless and very telling, because that's exactly what he's doing post-Entity as he continues his withdrawal from Sam.

[mara-anni]

Soundtracks are meant to enhance the story, not dictate it. If the PTB are telling me that an episode is a key turning point for the ship simply because they hit us over the head with the shippy music hammer, well, that just offends me. Most of us did fine shipping merrily along during the first three seasons without any music telling us when and how.

I would just like to add here, that the Sam/Jack theme is not meant to imply simply that they love each other. That's why you don't hear until POV. The S/J theme only happens when something is keeping them apart; when 1 of them, or both of them are yearning for each other but uable to have each other for whatever reason.

[Rachel500]

Exodus

Nice review, Josi! And some great observations about Jacob and Jack.

Generally

In many ways, I agree that the entire episode is the build up to the cliffhanger for the S4 finale with them stranded in another galaxy facing off against Apophis's mothership, with the added what if of "is Teal'c really dead?"

Tanith was a great bad guy and it's a shame more isn't made of him after his escape in S5 really. I don't think Teal'c ignoring all else for revenge is out of character so much as events push him into an extreme reaction. He had been denied his revenge in order to let the Tok'ra use Tanith; he had accepted the Tok'ra extracting Tanith to save the host - and then Tanith escapes. Teal'c searches for him but can't find him and thinks he's lost his opportunity to avenge Shau'nac's death and failed her. And I think Teal'c just literally flips out - he even signals that in the discussion with Daniel. So, he becomes focused on that to the detriment of good sense and places both himself and Jack in danger. I don't mind Teal'c ignoring Jack for the most part either because Teal'c has always followed Jack more because he respects Jack not because he has to, and I think there is a part of Teal'c who does view Jack as a young brother. Moreover, I think Teal'c here just doesn't want to listen to calls to stop his revenge again - he'd done that twice already and allowed Tanith to escape - he wasn't going to risk it again. For me, Teal'c's behaviour here is underscoring the lesson: you can't let personal feelings interfere because it leads to bad things.

Sam and Jack

Much of the interaction is professional for me in Exodus. And again I see a slight exasperation in her reaction to Jack's behaviour which before Entity would have been indulgence (primary example being when he leaps into the throne).

The scene where they are proposing the plan to use the sun to destroy Apophis and his fleet, I see as Sam being incredibly professionally nervous about what is a completely insane and ambitious idea that she and her father/Selmak have come up with. But it's interesting to note that it is when Sam presses him rather than Jacob that's when Jack agrees with the plan - because he really does believe in her.

And I think we see this nervousness reappear when they go to release the Stargate. It is a nice moment with the two of them. But again, for me it feels awkward. Sam is clearly nervous and lets out a breath actually prompting Jack to ask if something is wrong (and I interpret this as "is there something wrong which is going to compromise the mission?" not "is there something wrong with you?"). What's interesting for me is Sam responds on a personal level admitting in a round about way that it's nerves with "No [which is clearly denial of her nerves]. I've just never blown up a star before [which is clearly admission of the same]." - and Jack really has no clue how to respond to her on that personal level and his attempt at levity falls flat (as it has done ever since Entity) and seems almost dismissive of her feelings - as though he's shied away from a more personal response, but can't quite bring himself to give a purely professional one, gone for the humour to cover his struggle and ends up with something that just doesn't come out right.

Yet, despite that, I think Jack's underlying confidence in her and presence does give her that "you can do this" vibe that she needs to feel (and which appears again in Grace). And I do think this is an example of what POV Sam told Jack once - she knows he doesn't know what to say but she just needs him to be there for her - and here, Sam is indulgent of him as though she knows he struggled with what to say but is grateful for the attempt anyway.

[JenniferJF]

Josi, lovely analysis of Exodus.

I will say I adore this episode, contrived circumstances or not (and lets face it, it's Stargate so you sorta have to accept coincidences ultimately). But I'm a sucker for Jack/Jacob scenes.

OK.

Now, see my sig? Right now? That, IMHO, is at the center of the issues Jack and Jacob have not only in this episode, but it rather summarizes the complexity of their relationship overall. I think from the get-go in Secrets, a part of Jacob, at least, senses that in quite a few ways, Jack is his replacement. And I think Jack, Jacob and Sam's relationship has been leading to that moment there (in my sig) the entire time. Ever since Mom died, Jacob has been the one 'there' for Sam... whether she knew it or even wanted it, at least from his point-of-view. That's been, as her sole surviving parent, his *job*. And Jack, as the man I think Jacob senses early on Sam is falling in love with, becomes in a very real way Jacob's potential replacement for that job. Because I think he sees what you comment on here:

The scene where Sam and Jack are down in the cargo hold and sending the gate off to do its matter sucky thing on the sun is interesting, I think. Jack's line ("Well they say the first one's always the hardest") is delivered very uncertainly, like he's not sure that he should be saying it at all, and Sam's reaction is along the same slightly incredulous lines as her reactions to his other jokes in this episode, but it does settle her down. I think really that this scene is an illustration of what we see in Grace and Threads (*looks around for Jenn*), that this is what Sam needs from Jack - just to be there with her and for her. It doesn't matter what he says, it's enough that she knows he's there.

And I think, because of this, Jacob tends to be harder on Jack than he would be on anyone else, not necessarily because he doesn't think he's good enough for his daughter, but because he wants Jack to be the absolute best he can be (and because, frankly, no one is ever going to be good enough for her). And I think Jack senses Jacob doesn't feel he's good enough, and is more critical of his faults than anyone else's, and since neither will even subconsciously recognize their relationship for the typical father/potential son-in-law relationship it is, Jack somewhat resents what he sees as Jacob being overly critical of him.

Of course, this entire thing is further complicated by the idea that Jack is - in a purely professional way as Sam's commander - quite literally the one whose job it is to be there for Sam, looking out for her physical and professional well-being in a way Jacob really can't. So Jacob's desire for Jack to be the best *officer* he can be, and the feeling that Jack can never be as good at being there for Sam as he himself would be, is further compounded not simply by the personal level but by the purely professional as well - Jacob wishes *he* could be the one there watching out for Sam and her career on a daily basis the way Jack is.

Finally, I think part of this is caused by Jack and Jacob's relationship alone, because I think Jacob, even apart from Sam, does like Jack and thinks he's a good officer (or has the potential to be ) and a good man and for that reason alone wants him to be the best officer he can be, and so is critical of him as a sort of mentor while, at the same time, Jacob is rather threatened by the young pup coming up as a threat to his own alpha maleness as Josi points out.

And that's why I think the moment in my sig is not simply the culmination of Sam and Jack's relationship, or Sam and Jacob's, but of Jacob and Jack's as well. Jacob uses his dying moments with Sam to try to push her away from Pete and to Jack, and in the end, the last thing Jacob sees (because I think Jacob does see it), is Jack finally really being there for Sam, at her side when he himself can no longer be. Because as much as he might have critiqued Jack - as competitive as their relationship at times could be, in the end, the most important thing is that, because Sam loves him, only Jack can take Jacob's place at Sam's side and really be there for her after Jacob himself is gone. So, ultimately, when it really mattered, Jack was 'good enough'.

And... on a lighter note...:

More specifically, I have to take a moment to express my love for Tanith. He is fabulous, in a complete 'living cliche' type way - the hammy bad-guy-ness, even complete with English accent (seriously, you guys over the other side of the pond, why are you so fond of English accents for your bad guys?? )

Possibly it's because, no matter what crazy things come out of their mouths, villains always sound slightly less like Batman villains when they're speaking with English accents? (IOW, no clue )

[josiane]

Thanks Rachel and Jenn

And I think we see this nervousness reappear when they go to release the Stargate. It is a nice moment with the two of them. But again, for me it feels awkward. Sam is clearly nervous and lets out a breath actually prompting Jack to ask if something is wrong (and I interpret this as "is there something wrong which is going to compromise the mission?" not "is there something wrong with you?"). What's interesting for me is Sam responds on a personal level admitting in a round about way that it's nerves with "No [which is clearly denial of her nerves]. I've just never blown up a star before [which is clearly admission of the same]." - and Jack really has no clue how to respond to her on that personal level and his attempt at levity falls flat (as it has done ever since Entity) and seems almost dismissive of her feelings - as though he's shied away from a more personal response, but can't quite bring himself to give a purely professional one, gone for the humour to cover his struggle and ends up with something that just doesn't come out right.

Yet, despite that, I think Jack's underlying confidence in her and presence does give her that "you can do this" vibe that she needs to feel (and which appears again in Grace). And I do think this is an example of what POV Sam told Jack once - she knows he doesn't know what to say but she just needs him to be there for her - and here, Sam is indulgent of him as though she knows he struggled with what to say but is grateful for the attempt anyway.

Great analysis of this scene - I was struggling with how to put this but I think you've managed to capture it there.

Josi, lovely analysis of Exodus.

I will say I adore this episode, contrived circumstances or not (and lets face it, it's Stargate so you sorta have to accept coincidences ultimately). But I'm a sucker for Jack/Jacob scenes.

Yep - I love it too, but even for Stargate it is rather contrived, IMO

Now, see my sig? Right now? That, IMHO, is at the center of the issues Jack and Jacob have not only in this episode, but it rather summarizes the complexity of their relationship overall. I think from the get-go in Secrets, a part of Jacob, at least, senses that in quite a few ways, Jack is his replacement. And I think Jack, Jacob and Sam's relationship has been leading to that moment there (in my sig) the entire time. Ever since Mom died, Jacob has been the one 'there' for Sam... whether she knew it or even wanted it, at least from his point-of-view. That's been, as her sole surviving parent, his *job*. And Jack, as the man I think Jacob senses early on Sam is falling in love with, becomes in a very real way Jacob's potential replacement for that job. Because I think he sees what you comment on here:
And I think, because of this, Jacob tends to be harder on Jack than he would be on anyone else, not necessarily because he doesn't think he's good enough for his daughter, but because he wants Jack to be the absolute best he can be (and because, frankly, no one is ever going to be good enough for her). And I think Jack senses Jacob doesn't feel he's good enough, and is more critical of his faults than anyone else's, and since neither will even subconsciously recognize their relationship for the typical father/potential son-in-law relationship it is, Jack somewhat resents what he sees as Jacob being overly critical of him.

Of course, this entire thing is further complicated by the idea that Jack is - in a purely professional way as Sam's commander - quite literally the one whose job it is to be there for Sam, looking out for her physical and professional well-being in a way Jacob really can't. So Jacob's desire for Jack to be the best *officer* he can be, and the feeling that Jack can never be as good at being there for Sam as he himself would be, is further compounded not simply by the personal level but by the purely professional as well - Jacob wishes *he* could be the one there watching out for Sam and her career on a daily basis the way Jack is.

Finally, I think part of this is caused by Jack and Jacob's relationship alone, because I think Jacob, even apart from Sam, does like Jack and thinks he's a good officer (or has the potential to be ) and a good man and for that reason alone wants him to be the best officer he can be, and so is critical of him as a sort of mentor while, at the same time, Jacob is rather threatened by the young pup coming up as a threat to his own alpha maleness as Josi points out.

And that's why I think the moment in my sig is not simply the culmination of Sam and Jack's relationship, or Sam and Jacob's, but of Jacob and Jack's as well. Jacob uses his dying moments with Sam to try to push her away from Pete and to Jack, and in the end, the last thing Jacob sees (because I think Jacob does see it), is Jack finally really being there for Sam, at her side when he himself can no longer be. Because as much as he might have critiqued Jack - as competitive as their relationship at times could be, in the end, the most important thing is that, because Sam loves him, only Jack can take Jacob's place at Sam's side and really be there for her after Jacob himself is gone. So, ultimately, when it really mattered, Jack was 'good enough'.

Great analysis here too - I think this is why the Jack/Jacob relationship is so fascinating, because there are just so many different layers of subtext to it, and Sam is absolutely central to that.

And... on a lighter note...:
Possibly it's because, no matter what crazy things come out of their mouths, villains always sound slightly less like Batman villains when they're speaking with English accents? (IOW, no clue )

It just always amuses me, this thing of the English villains It's the only time I'm ever conscious of an English accent

[JenniferJF]

Yep - I love it too, but even for Stargate it is rather contrived, IMO

Not arguing at all, pretty much just agreeing Just pointing out I don't care lol.

[Mac Jackson]

I was just watching the episode Evolution Pt 2 and that scene where Jack goes and tells Sam "I'm going after Daniel" struck me in a new way. I noticed how sensual they are talking to each other with their eyes and tone of their voices. I never picked up on that before. It's like they are saying. "I'm going after our family/brother and I won't be here to protect you but I know you'll be fine. Becareful and remember that I love you and can't wait to see you when we both return".

[UhSir]

I'm going to try and keep up with the discussions but Spring has sprung here by me and I'd much rather be outside than in and I already struggle to keep with the three shows a week. But I am going to try.

Exodus

Sam and Jack stuff

Jack's remark about the red zone makes Sam giggle. His comment about the first time being the hardest amazes her that he can calmly and quickly put what they are doing into an ordinary, everyday light. When Jack goes off with Teal'c to the gliders I see concern from Sam that they might not come back. I don't know if there's any more concern than if it was just Teal'c. My shippy heart says of course there is! And when Jack tells Sam to relax he can hear that she's worried and he tries to calm her down. He didn't have to say anything at all. Or he could have just said something simple as confirmation about the time crunch. Sam starts showing that she's very concerned when she tells Jacob "We're not leaving them behind," and a little later "We have to do something." Then when she see's Jack back on the ship there's a tremendous amount of relief coming from her when she says "Sir!"

[hedwig]

The Light
The second scene is the one at the beach where in comparison to the opening scene of flirting here we have them effectively sniping at each other. Now, even considering that they are in withdrawal, the emotions that rise to the surface when they lose their inhibitions are quite revealing.

When Sam complains that it would give Jack an excuse to do nothing for a while, I think it’s in part her own resentment at not having a life that seeps through; that she can’t go fishing with him – and probably an inner fear/resentment that he goes without her and enjoys himself anyway; that he doesn’t need her to be part of his personal downtime.

She’s quick to point out that she’s not going to continue calling him sir/Colonel if they’re stuck there for life (my favourite lines), and yet Jack insists contrarily on the protocol. Now I don’t think for one moment if they truly had been stuck for life Jack would have insisted she call him sir/Colonel for the rest of their lives but that he does pull her up has to smart a little; has to feel a little bit like he’s rejecting the possibility of a personal relationship with her.

So the next lines as they grab each other are the most revealing; Sam wondering if she’s just supposed to accept that and Jack pointing out that it’s the situation right then – because that’s the raw truth of where they are in terms of status quo for Jack. Again, this has to suggest to Sam that Jack values their professional relationship more than any chance of a personal one; it’s an underscoring to her that he’s for the status quo.

What is done beautifully in this scene is the racheting up of the UST. Because as they grab each other and get physical with one another, there is just that beautifully judged moment after the yelling when it looks like they’re gazing at each other like they gaze at the light as though addicted, and it feels for a long moment (which is actually less than a second) that they might even kiss...

And then Teal’c interrupts them.

And just the look on their faces as they turn to him is classic.

A random thought occurred to me (which other people have undoubtedly thought of before me) about this scene and Sam's comment "that it would give Jack an excuse to do nothing for a while". And my thought is that in her own way she was referring to how he had settled into the life on Edora and didn't seem to want to come back to earth, and how he had given up on being rescued, and would have enjoyed the serene (if a bit hard) life that living on Edora would have given him.

(*wanders back out ... *)

[UhSir]

A random thought occurred to me (which other people have undoubtedly thought of before me) about this scene and Sam's comment "that it would give Jack an excuse to do nothing for a while". And my thought is that in her own way she was referring to how he had settled into the life on Edora and didn't seem to want to come back to earth, and how he had given up on being rescued, and would have enjoyed the serene (if a bit hard) life that living on Edora would have given him.

(*wanders back out ... *)

So then she's harboring jealousy over another woman? Sam? Jealous? Ah go on!!

[hedwig]

So then she's harboring jealousy over another woman? Sam? Jealous? Ah go on!!

Erm ... maybe?

Or maybe because he preferred a nice, quiet, serene life to all the danger, life threatening, nasty varmints always threatening the SGC and earth?

[JenniferJF]

Erm ... maybe?

Or maybe because he preferred a nice, quiet, serene life to all the danger, life threatening, nasty varmints always threatening the SGC and earth?

That was the point I was trying to make, so yeah, I agree. But no WAY am I starting that debate again....

[sg-1fanintn]

That was the point I was trying to make, so yeah, I agree. But no WAY am I starting that debate again....

Well...not to get in a big discussion (so why did you come to the discussion thread, Melissa?), but he was pretty anxious to go home once he found out his radio had sounded. He was eager, in fact.

I think Jack is a practical man who doesn't expect perfection. In fact, I think he expects things to go wrong more times than not. So, he deals with what comes his way and resigns himself to work with any circumstance he doesn't think he can change.

IMHO, he had just come to terms with being stuck on Edora when he found out he could go home. I don't think he was reluctant to leave. I think he just felt guilty for having given up and having given in to Laira...so he did the honorable thing and asked her to come with him.

Her refusal relieved him of any obligation, and once he was able to be with Sam again, those developing feelings for her continued to develop.

IMHO.

[hedwig]

That was the point I was trying to make, so yeah, I agree. But no WAY am I starting that debate again....

Actually,... what I was trying to say was that perhaps Sam hadn't dealt with her feelings over the way Jack behaved at being rescued, and since she always pretty much keeps her feelings to herself, but since she was now under the influence of "withdrawal", a little bit of how she felt over the whole Edora incident came out in her snapping at him with the "giving him an excuse to do nothing" crack. It was more about what Sam's "stuffed" feelings were rather than how Jack felt about staying or not staying on Edora.

Sorry if that makes no sense. Especially considering I usually make no sense. Okay, then, carry on!

(*So maybe we're agreeing with each other and just stating it in different ways.*)