Browder's character should OUTRANK Carter

[Uber]

Not sure what niche on an SG team stunts fill but anyway.

No one's asked you to go through it again. Did you ever think that maybe, if you mentionin things ad nauseum and people are still disagreeing with you, that your the only one who thinks either 1)carter can/should command
2)Fans actually want to see Carter command(with the exception of Sam fans, of course)
3)Your the only one who thinks she's done a 'great' job in the role.
I think Sam has pretty consistently made major mistakes when in command.
Paradise Lost is a great example. You don't keep your people working 24/7 round the clock. It's just not smart.

IT's becuase I care about her character that I DON"t want to see her command.
But I've listed MY reasons for that ad nauseum as well.

I agreed to disagree with you ages ago. You kept posting, so I responded., and other have contributed. If you thinkthe discussion is usless, stop posting, but please don't blame me if your arguments go round in circles.

Okay...here it is...my official LAST post on this stupid thread.

For the record, so far most of the people on this thread lean toward Carter leading SG-1 permanently...and you and a few others are leaning toward Cam. And with statements like CAMERON'S THE PERMANENT SG-1 TEAM LEADER...LIVE WITH IT, you're only highlighting you're immaturity and insecurity. Neither of us knows what exactly TPTB are going to do. Spoilers point toward Cam being a temp...but maybe that's changed. I don't know and neither do you.

I've done what I think has been a pretty good job at expressing why I think Sam should regain her position as SG-1 team leader. I stand by it.

GO SAM GO!!!

Take care and have fun arguing with yourself as I am way off of this merry-go-round.

[Lightsabre]

Okay...here it is...my official LAST post on this stupid thread.

For the record, so far most of the people on this thread lean toward Carter leading SG-1 permanently...and you and a few others are leaning toward Cam. And with statements like CAMERON'S THE PERMANENT SG-1 TEAM LEADER...LIVE WITH IT, you're only highlighting you're immaturity and insecurity. Neither of us knows what exactly TPTB are going to do. Spoilers point toward Cam being a temp...but maybe that's changed. I don't know and neither do you.

I've done what I think has been a pretty good job at expressing why I think Sam should regain her position as SG-1 team leader. I stand by it.

Take care and have fun arguing with yourself as I am way off of this merry-go-round.

My god, don't think much of yourself, do you.
I'm not immature or insecure(Where the hell did insecure come from??)
The TPTB have said, many times, the Cam is the new lead, he's not a temp, he's not a fill in, he's the lead.
SO, people STILL saying 'he's walking and taking Carters' job' either haven't been reading this thread or are simply trying to start trouble.
He is the permement lead and you DO have to live with it.
The spoilers DO NOT point to Cam being a temp, maybe some of the early ones did, but all the later ones DON'T.
As to your case, stand by it if you want. I think there are holes big enough to drive a Mac truck through in it, but whatever.
I'm not sure why you wrote a 'last post' then made it an attack on me. You ahd to know I'd respond.
But hey, your the one who seems immature and insecure. I can't disagree with you without the personal shots?? I'm insecure cause I don't want Carter to lead?
you know, those of us who are adults have things called discussions.
It's where you air your opinion and discuss the reasoning for it.
Now, if someone has a differing opinion, sometimes you switch to discuss that.
BUt all that can be done without attacking the other person. When you can do that, hey, welcome to adulthood.

[Tucker Case]

It isn't a matter of Carter not being enough as a decorated officer yadda yadda, it's more a matter of we got to see this side of her...the leadership side...that we want to have explored further...

Again, then, it isn't enough that she has enough on her plate to keep six heroines busy, there's this one more thing you must see explored in order to be satisfied, regardless of where that leaves the other characters.

And with Amanda maybe not as willing to do the daredevil stuff because of her new mommy status (pure speculation) it seems like a neat idea for Cam to fill those shoes and do even more insane stunts than she might be willing to right now...

And that's what the show is lacking all these years? A daredevil? Since when have "insane stunts" been a requirement? This is supposed to be enough to keep one character occupied while another holds down at least four other roles?

Ben Browder is an actor, not a stuntman.

He's a parent, too, and should has just as much right to decline to do anything he considers dangerous on the same grounds - which is why they have stunt doubles, making it just as feasible for Carter to be the daredevil as anyone else, if it's so important that we have one.

Tell me you'd be happy if Carter were nothing but a "daredevil" and it might be reasonable to suggest Browder's fans should be happy to see him in such a role. Me, I wouldn't suggest anyone be happy to see an actor or character they love relegated to that role alone.

Tucker

[Tucker Case]

That's the sticking point with me. I can't see them bringing in a heavy-hitter like Ben Browder (in sci-fi circles anyway) and have him be "SG-1's answer to Lt. Ford."

Neither can I. If they wanted SG-1's answer to Ford - even though it's pretty evident they realise the "mistake" they made in creating a character like that for themselves (since they never had a clue what to do with him) - they'd have hired a young actor of comparable credit and clout to RSF, they would not have gone after one of the most popular, most critically acclaimed and iconic actors in the genre.

They wouldn't have hired a Lead Actor to play the sort of character they themselves have bumped down to recurring status on a different show.

Tucker

[Tucker Case]

That's the sticking point with me. I can't see them bringing in a heavy-hitter like Ben Browder (in sci-fi circles anyway) and have him be "SG-1's answer to Lt. Ford."

Neither can I. If they wanted SG-1's answer to Ford - even though it's pretty evident they realise the "mistake" they made in creating a character like that for themselves (since they never had a clue what to do with him) - they'd have hired a young actor of comparable credit and clout to RSF, they would not have gone after one of the most popular, most critically acclaimed and iconic actors in the genre.

They wouldn't have hired a Lead Actor to play the sort of character they themselves have bumped down to recurring status on a different show.

If circumstances dictated, as they did, that an interim replacement for Carter be introduced, they still wouldn't have hired a heavy-hitter of Browder's ilk for a full season when they only needed that character for five episodes. They'd have signed him - or someone like him - for just those five episodes.

Kind of like they're doing with Claudia Black...

Tucker

[Lightsabre]

Again, then, it isn't enough that she has enough on her plate to keep six heroines busy, there's this one more thing you must see explored in order to be satisfied, regardless of where that leaves the other characters.

This is a good point and goes to what I've been saying.
Overdeveloping Carter is not good for the show.

And that's what the show is lacking all these years? A daredevil? Since when have "insane stunts" been a requirement? This is supposed to be enough to keep one character occupied while another holds down at least four other roles?

Ben Browder is an actor, not a stuntman.

He's a parent, too, and should has just as much right to decline to do anything he considers dangerous on the same grounds - which is why they have stunt doubles, making it just as feasible for Carter to be the daredevil as anyone else, if it's so important that we have one.

Tell me you'd be happy if Carter were nothing but a "daredevil" and it might be reasonable to suggest Browder's fans should be happy to see him in such a role. Me, I wouldn't suggest anyone be happy to see an actor or character they love relegated to that role alone.

Tucker

If Carter was to be just the leader, no one would care. But she'd be science officer/leader/fighter/pilot.
Teal'c is mainly muscle and Daniel's specific skills haven't been used in ages.
I'd rather see some Teal'c/Daniel development than Carter, who's been aquiring more skills and specialities over the last 8 years than someone 3 times her age.
I think the main argument for putting Browder in the background is those fans like Carter, but don't like Mitchell or don't know him. And people are sure BB was only brought in to bring in Farscape fans(which is also bull if you ask me. I've only seen about 3 farscape eps, and while I didn't like the show, I thought the actors were awesome).
So, they want to see him take a backseat.

[david2708]

As the original starter of the thread, no way I'm gonna plough through all these posts!
Safe to say that Browder has been brought in to basically take over the lead man role in the show.
It's all politics. There's not a snowflakes chance in hell that Carter will lead the team.
It's all about boys with their toys.
They'll want a male lead to head the show and that's why a heavy hitter (SciFi wise) that Browder is there.
Carter supporters will just have to deal with it indeed.
It all sounds like a feminist arguement is going on rather than dealing with the reality of network television and the dominance and desire for the so-called male lead.
Most female viewers will want a goodlooking male lead to drool over and Browder fits the bill. There'll be cries of outrage at that and accusation of sexism, but thats what the majority female viewers will want in Stargate.
Why do you think RDA was popular and the show's lead? Carter was only ever really 3rd or forth in the pecking order.

[Madeleine]

Carter was only ever really 3rd or forth in the pecking order.

Not in s7; she was effectively treated as the lead. And in s8 she was hardly 'third or fourth'. If it wasn't for AT's maternity leave Carter might have been kept in charge of SG-1, who knows.

If TPTB don't want her leading the team it's *possibly* because "most females want a hunky man to drool over" (although I always thought most females wanted what most males want - good stories, good acting...) but more likely it's cos AT was only ever pencilled in for 75% of the season and contingency would have had to be in place for her to be even less available than that.

As the original starter of the thread, no way I'm gonna plough through all these posts!
...
It all sounds like a feminist arguement is going on rather than dealing with the reality of network television and the dominance and desire for the so-called male lead.

Once you've read the thread, then feel free to criticise the type of discussion people are having. Of course you don't have to read anything, but if you don't, you're hardly in a position to decide what sort of reality we're dealing with

[david2708]

Fandom wise, Tapping is well behind RDA and Shanks.

[Agent_Dark]

Most female viewers will want a goodlooking male lead to drool over and Browder fits the bill.

I wouldn't mind a female lead to drool over, and Amanda Tapping fits the bill...

Fandom wise, Tapping is well behind RDA and Shanks.

Hmmm, I dunno about that...
I know she gets a hell of a lot of fan mail and support...

[Lightsabre]

Not in s7; she was effectively treated as the lead. And in s8 she was hardly 'third or fourth'. If it wasn't for AT's maternity leave Carter might have been kept in charge of SG-1, who knows.

No one. But, I suspect if Carter kept lead, BB would be the new genius who knows more about the gate than anyone. Carter simply couldn't juggle all those roles. One would have to slide.

If TPTB don't want her leading the team it's *possibly* because "most females want a hunky man to drool over" (although I always thought most females wanted what most males want - good stories, good acting...) but more likely it's cos AT was only ever pencilled in for 75% of the season and contingency would have had to be in place for her to be even less available than that.

I think it's far more likely to be your explanation on that one Madeline. There's also the point that AT maybe considering 'retireing' like RDA did. SHe is a new mother after all.

Once you've read the thread, then feel free to criticise the type of discussion people are having. Of course you don't have to read anything, but if you don't, you're hardly in a position to decide what sort of reality we're dealing with

I think that the feminist argument is being made. Several people have advocated that they want Carter in command cuase they want to see a strong woman. Personally, I don't see how her being in command makes her stronger than she is now, but anyway.
Others have also said Carter got 'screwed' in teh command race cause she's a woman. THat is also bringing gender into it.
So I think the comment on a 'feminist' argument is justified. However, by no means is everyone who wants carter in command a feminist or making a feminist argument.

[Lightsabre]

I wouldn't mind a female lead to drool over, and Amanda Tapping fits the bill...

Agreed on that one. Teryl Rothery did as well!!!

Hmmm, I dunno about that...
I know she gets a hell of a lot of fan mail and support...

That's the great thing about the show.
All of them are the 'stars'. It's not about RDA and his 3 sidekicks. THere are episodes that focus on Teal'c, Daniel and Carter as well.

[chocdoc]

I know she gets a hell of a lot of fan mail and support...

Yup, Tapping has an incredible amount of fan support. And that is quite impressive, given that Sam Carter is not one of the original characters in the Stargate saga (i.e., Jack and Daniel).

[Madeleine]

Fandom wise, Tapping is well behind RDA and Shanks.

If you say so, i wouldn't know. But the fandom isn't what makes the decisions, TPTB are. And they were happy to treat her as the lead in s7. which is why I think that she'd have had a good chance of being the lead if she'd not had to have maternity leave.

[Tucker Case]

I know she gets a hell of a lot of fan mail and support...

From women, at that (whether or not they're given to drooling, over Ben Browder or any other male).

Tucker Case